Would Axl Even Want It?

[uzi your illusion]

For years we always see all these topics about Axl and his lack of promotion/interivews and the like. Now currently we have the thread about bad ticket sales and wondering why Axl won't get out there and pump up the press to get the word going. Am I the only one who thinks that the way he has acted over the last 18 plus years would lead you the believe that he has absolutely ZERO interest in being in the biggest band in the world again. Or to a larger degree, being the biggest rock star in the world again?

From almost everything we've read over the years and heard from him , you know he likes to chill out and not be hassled. He seems happier with a close circle of people who he is 100% certain have no hidden agenda and have his best interests at heart. Far different from the vultures that circle when your at the top. Axl was on top of the world for quite a few years, heights that none of us could possibly imagine. I think he has probably had his fill, once your at that level you can't be the person you were before, and you have to do everything in your power to stay on that level because there is always someone in your rear view waiting for the chance to knock you off. The level Axl is at now (where he has his album out, the songs he wants heard up to this point are being heard, he can tour venues that are smaller but still profitable, and he can walk around with a hat and glasses on and probably for the most part go unnoticed) is entirely of his own doing. Overall a lot less pressure then how it was back in the day.

If he wanted to hit the gym for hours every day, and record songs to put out albums every couple of years, and do all the press in the world then he could do it. And for that matter he would probably have the Guns N' Roses brand considerably larger then what it is today. Maybe not where they were in the "Live Era" but with the rock scene as thin as it is now, If he did those things I could see the band definitely getting a bigger following. But he chooses not to, and that is entirely his right. One that he has earned, he has given everyone who comes to this or other message boards a lot of enjoyment/entertainment over the years. As much as we all would love to see the GNR name and his name held in the same regard as it once was, maybe to relive a piece of our childhood, or maybe just to stuff it down all the doubters throats, it's not up to us. It's also not fair for us to criticize or get angry with him because he doesn't share that same dream. He's been there, done that, and lived that dream already. That would be enough for most, but he's still out there giving us more material to pour over. Not as much as before , some would argue not as good as before (I wouldn't) , but it's still something.

So next time you get mad at Axl for not being at the level you think he should be, just stop. Take a breath , and realize at least he's here at some level and at least you still get the chance/choice to buy one of his albums or see one of his concerts. There are a ton of musicians who had their moments on top and then went away, how many of them came back to reach that same pinnacle? Very few, and to expect them to do this is unrealistic. I would love to get more material as much if not more then anyone, but it's not for me to decide. It's not for anyone to decide, he doesn't owe us anything. I think some of us forget that sometimes, and were all kinda lucky to get anything at all. This guy had his fair share and it seems like the only thing that keeps him going is that he has an artistic vision that he wants to get out. It comes out at his own pace, but when it does were lucky to have it!

In closing I think these lyrics from Thin Lizzy seem fitting

"People that despise you will analyze then criticize you

They'll scandalize and tell lies until they realize

You are someone they should have apologized to

Don't let these people compromise you

Be wise too

You can do anything you want to do

It's not wrong what I sing it's true

You can do anything you want to do

Do what you want to"

[Funkadelic]

Good stuff.

[VillageGorillaHead]

tl;dr

[uzi your illusion]

'preciate it man, been thinking about it for a while. Not to sure why I felt like sitting down and writing it now but just felt better getting it out.

[Changes]

The only thing that I don't get is why you book an arena and put a certain amount of tickets out for sale, if you don't want to sell all the tickets. It doesn't make any sense.

[Snoopy72]

Great post!

[Liquor & Whores]

I have a lot of respect for Axl 'cos he does stuff he wants, whenever he wants, the way he wants and no one can force him to do anything. And money isn't his main goal.

Sebastian Bach:

“Another thing that I don’t know you’ll ever see is a Axl Rose reality show. When I see that shit, I laugh. Here’s the only other time that he got mad at me. I had just finished shooting Supergroup for VH1. It was on TV in America while we were gallivanting across Europe. We had a beautiful dinner at some incredible Italian restaurant. We are sitting there and I go, ‘Dude, I just shot this reality show for VH1 and they paid me this amount of money, man. It was fucking easy. It was only like two weeks. It was hilarious. Axl, if they paid me this amount of money, they’d pay you like a million bucks for 10 days of some shit.’ He’s looking at me with this look on his face and he’s all quiet and he goes,

‘Sebastian, you don’t understand.’ I go, ‘What?’ He goes, ‘I will pay VH1 $2 million to leave me the fuck alone! (Rolling Stone,[bach & Axl hanging out in 2006],

http://idolator.com/396801/sebastian-bach-is-happy-to-talk-about-axl-rose

Edited October 24, 2011 by DrDrei

[SunnyDRE]

disagree

everyone wants to be the best at what they do...don't care if your a janitor, you want to be the best janitor. axl's problem is at some point in his life he was the best at what he did, but personally, i feel like he thought it mostly to all him (my opinion) and decided he didn't need any of the other ingredients.

[Val22]

I agree with you about Axl being allowed to do and say what he wants to do even if alot of people don't agree with it.

It seems whenever Axl fucks up somehow whether it be on stage or in his personal life, that's what they report. They don't say how he's been great on tour and how GNR are doing a 2 and a half hour show.

For the fan who posted that Entertainment Weekly ariticle, it pisses me off with that guy saying how dare Axl and GNR continue to tour even though they don't sound like they did 25 years ago and you'll be disappointed. What a crock of shit!

There are bands and musicians from the 50's and 60's and 70's still performing for their fans and their fans love it! Now some of these artisits sound the same and some don't, but the fans still love them. Why should bands and musicians stop performing because they get older. Fans get older too and if they perform we will come.

I think that so called critic is a dummy because I for one I'm so glad that many of the bands I grew up with are still rockin and the older fans are now bringing their kids with them.

I think that's fuckin awesome!

[omg1999]

To the original poster, finally someone who truly gets it. Great post.

[uzi your illusion]

That "2 million dollars to leave me alone" is probably my favorite Axl story.

Sunny, I think your spot on about everyone wanting to be the best at what they do. Interviews with Axl and the band from when they were breaking in back up this observation as you can hear them talking about conquering the world. But I think you would agree that people get content after sitting on top for a while, and whereas at a regular job if you are off your game a bit you can get fired. If Axl is "off his game" he sells 5,000 tickets instead of 10,000. That still sells enough tickets to make it profitable and worth his while. If Axl could just record music when he wanted and release albums when he felt like it , without having to tour he probably would. I think he tours to fund his lifestyle and pay the band so he can have them ready when ever he's inspired. And it's not like hes always phoning it in or anything , I mean they do almost 3 hour sets. Even though the set list isn't what some would like, and Axl isn't a carbon copy of when he left off in '93, it's still pretty good and a majority of the people at most of these concerts will go home happy.

[Liquor & Whores]

I think he tours to fund his lifestyle and pay the band so he can have them ready when ever he's inspired.

That's what I also figured when I was thinking why is he still touring... I would name it: to pay the bills...

He must like it, though, as we see him happy on stage many times (for example, the longest GNR show was in 2009, not in the 90s !). He's not always having fun, of course.

Edited October 24, 2011 by DrDrei

[angrybananapeel]

Fine then, but why not just do smaller shows. Don't put on a big fucking production and fail with it. If ya wanna be fuckin' low key. Do low key shit. Wanna do a bunch of ACDC covers, tour as Axl Rose and co. doing ACDC covers. The Biggest flaw in your whole theory is that Axl is doing this all under the name of what was at one time the biggest fucking band in the world.

Nobody is stopping him from that. Problem is he went out there and said he wanted to make Guns 'n Roses something more! Nobody made him do that. If he wants to be more low key, nobody is stopping him. Don't get me wrong, I was rooting for him (now I'm just kinda hoping I'll be surprised without actually rooting).

I don't know the ins and outs of it all by any means. Legalities aside, because for those issues, all we can do is guess. I'm just saying, Axl is trying to have it both ways... He wants to say that he is the last man standing for GnR, but clearly, and sadly, and nothing to do with anyone other than Axl himself (so far as I know, it's not like he has provided some counter-argument), current or past members aside, he is basically the only thing holding guns n roses down. Which is sad. Because he really could have been, and may still could be, the only thing to bring it back up. I'm at a loss as to how at this point so where I know where the OP was trying to go, I think he is mistaken. Yes, not everyone was going to accept the new GnR, but it still could have been something. It didn't happen. The new new GnR while fucking awesome, do not hold a candle to what GnR was. It has little to do with the new members. Is Axl content with this? Fuckin' maybe. He seems to be. Are we as fans? I'm not. I'm still fucking waiting for Axl to make it happen again. I was all there with CD. I was ready for the new direction.

Do I believe Axl was the dude who fucking drove GnR to the top? Fuck yeah!!! No where have I ever seen Axl say that GnR was too fucking big and he didn't want to deal with the pressure of being a huge success. His fans are still fucking waiting to be able to proclaim that Axl is still the fucking last real rock star. Perhaps we can still say that. But that was old Axl. If he don't wanna be, just fuckin' say it. "We're taking it low key now. Here's the new band, here are our new songs, here are some classics you might remember." Don't try to pull off huge fucking tours if you don't really feel like it.

Hey, weather sucks? Shit not going right? Don't get all pissy like a bitch, just fuckin' tell the fans... " hey, shit ain't fucking going like we planned, but we gonna make do biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch!!!!!"

There are two fucking types of fans , er , three i guess. Three...

1. The Axl can do no wrong and this is clearly what guns n roses was meant to be ....people
   
2. The "Axl needs slash and duff and either the original lineup or use your illusion lineup" people
   
3. Or the people like me who are pretty much ok with Axl being the last man standing because he says he can fucking do it....people. (cd great fine, still waiting n shit cuz these aint the guys who made it with ya)
   

I still think he could, but I'm not really seeing it yet. I'm not seeing anything groundbreaking or anything worth not working with other members of the band. I don't doubt he was the driving force. Both to the top, and to wherever the fuck it is going now. I'm still fucking waiting. Luckily, I have other shit to keep me occupied, as does Axl apparently

Edited October 24, 2011 by angrybananapeel

[uzi your illusion]

Angry, I'm going to see if I can provide some logical answers to a few of the questions you posed, let me know how I do. This is what the board is for, a debate where we don't have to rip each others heads off.

"Fine then, but why not just do smaller shows. Don't put on a big fucking production and fail with it. If ya wanna be fuckin' low key. Do low key shit."

There are still enough fans that wanna see GNR perform their hits that there able to fill up medium size venues in bigger markets, and do decent numbers in the smaller cities. GNR don't dictate what size venues they play, the market does. The last North American tour showed them that it was still financially viable to do these type of markets and until its' not anymore, then they will keep raking in the cash.

"The Biggest flaw in your whole theory is that Axl is doing this all under the name of what was at one time the biggest fucking band in the world."

My theory is that he doesn't want this to be the biggest band in the world anymore, and that he enjoys being a rock star to a lesser degree then when the band was at their heyday. It's been beat to death, but he came in the band with that name. They rose to prominence with that name, and you even wrote that you think he is responsible for them hitting the top with that name. So just because he doesn't want to put in every bit of his time and energy into it , he can't use the name anymore? It's still his and if he wants to use it to a lesser degree, then that is his choice. Thats what my whole OP was about.

"Problem is he went out there and said he wanted to make Guns 'n Roses something more! "

I'm pretty sure he meant musically. And I think that he truly sees the music on Chinese as superior to what he was a part of on previous Guns albums. Regardless of popular opinion.

"he is basically the only thing holding guns n roses down. Which is sad. Because he really could have been, and may still could be, the only thing to bring it back up"

I guess your referring to him not wanting to do the reunion? I contend that he is happy where Guns is and doesn't want to "bring it back up" any further then he has already. I think even if Chinese did crazy numbers, he still would be reluctant to get out there and do press and promos.

"Is Axl content with this? Fuckin' maybe. He seems to be. Are we as fans? I'm not. I'm still fucking waiting for Axl to make it happen again."

This is the meat of my argument, I think he is content with releasing HIS style of music and touring when HE decides to. If your digging what he's doing then cool and if you wanna see the concerts then enjoy the show, but I don't think he shares your same dream of seeing him on top of the music industry again. If he did then I think he would of done many things differently over the last 18 years.

[Apollo]

Fine then, but why not just do smaller shows. Don't put on a big fucking production and fail with it. If ya wanna be fuckin' low key. Do low key shit. Wanna do a bunch of ACDC covers, tour as Axl Rose and co. doing ACDC covers. The Biggest flaw in your whole theory is that Axl is doing this all under the name of what was at one time the biggest fucking band in the world.

Nobody is stopping him from that. Problem is he went out there and said he wanted to make Guns 'n Roses something more! Nobody made him do that. If he wants to be more low key, nobody is stopping him. Don't get me wrong, I was rooting for him (now I'm just kinda hoping I'll be surprised without actually rooting).

I don't know the ins and outs of it all by any means. Legalities aside, because for those issues, all we can do is guess. I'm just saying, Axl is trying to have it both ways... He wants to say that he is the last man standing for GnR, but clearly, and sadly, and nothing to do with anyone other than Axl himself (so far as I know, it's not like he has provided some counter-argument), current or past members aside, he is basically the only thing holding guns n roses down. Which is sad. Because he really could have been, and may still could be, the only thing to bring it back up. I'm at a loss as to how at this point so where I know where the OP was trying to go, I think he is mistaken. Yes, not everyone was going to accept the new GnR, but it still could have been something. It didn't happen. The new new GnR while fucking awesome, do not hold a candle to what GnR was. It has little to do with the new members. Is Axl content with this? Fuckin' maybe. He seems to be. Are we as fans? I'm not. I'm still fucking waiting for Axl to make it happen again. I was all there with CD. I was ready for the new direction.

Do I believe Axl was the dude who fucking drove GnR to the top? Fuck yeah!!! No where have I ever seen Axl say that GnR was too fucking big and he didn't want to deal with the pressure of being a huge success. His fans are still fucking waiting to be able to proclaim that Axl is still the fucking last real rock star. Perhaps we can still say that. But that was old Axl. If he don't wanna be, just fuckin' say it. "We're taking it low key now. Here's the new band, here are our new songs, here are some classics you might remember." Don't try to pull off huge fucking tours if you don't really feel like it.

Hey, weather sucks? Shit not going right? Don't get all pissy like a bitch, just fuckin' tell the fans... " hey, shit ain't fucking going like we planned, but we gonna make do biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch!!!!!"

There are two fucking types of fans , er , three i guess. Three...

1. The Axl can do no wrong and this is clearly what guns n roses was meant to be ....people
   
2. The "Axl needs slash and duff and either the original lineup or use your illusion lineup" people
   
3. Or the people like me who are pretty much ok with Axl being the last man standing because he says he can fucking do it....people. (cd great fine, still waiting n shit cuz these aint the guys who made it with ya)
   

I still think he could, but I'm not really seeing it yet. I'm not seeing anything groundbreaking or anything worth not working with other members of the band. I don't doubt he was the driving force. Both to the top, and to wherever the fuck it is going now. I'm still fucking waiting. Luckily, I have other shit to keep me occupied, as does Axl apparently

You really like the f-word.

[uzi your illusion]

lol Groghan, did you read my response to Angry's post? Where do you land on this whole debate?

[w6a6x6l6]

Fine then, but why not just do smaller shows. Don't put on a big fucking production and fail with it. If ya wanna be fuckin' low key. Do low key shit. Wanna do a bunch of ACDC covers, tour as Axl Rose and co. doing ACDC covers. The Biggest flaw in your whole theory is that Axl is doing this all under the name of what was at one time the biggest fucking band in the world.

Nobody is stopping him from that. Problem is he went out there and said he wanted to make Guns 'n Roses something more! Nobody made him do that. If he wants to be more low key, nobody is stopping him. Don't get me wrong, I was rooting for him (now I'm just kinda hoping I'll be surprised without actually rooting).

I don't know the ins and outs of it all by any means. Legalities aside, because for those issues, all we can do is guess. I'm just saying, Axl is trying to have it both ways... He wants to say that he is the last man standing for GnR, but clearly, and sadly, and nothing to do with anyone other than Axl himself (so far as I know, it's not like he has provided some counter-argument), current or past members aside, he is basically the only thing holding guns n roses down. Which is sad. Because he really could have been, and may still could be, the only thing to bring it back up. I'm at a loss as to how at this point so where I know where the OP was trying to go, I think he is mistaken. Yes, not everyone was going to accept the new GnR, but it still could have been something. It didn't happen. The new new GnR while fucking awesome, do not hold a candle to what GnR was. It has little to do with the new members. Is Axl content with this? Fuckin' maybe. He seems to be. Are we as fans? I'm not. I'm still fucking waiting for Axl to make it happen again. I was all there with CD. I was ready for the new direction.

Do I believe Axl was the dude who fucking drove GnR to the top? Fuck yeah!!! No where have I ever seen Axl say that GnR was too fucking big and he didn't want to deal with the pressure of being a huge success. His fans are still fucking waiting to be able to proclaim that Axl is still the fucking last real rock star. Perhaps we can still say that. But that was old Axl. If he don't wanna be, just fuckin' say it. "We're taking it low key now. Here's the new band, here are our new songs, here are some classics you might remember." Don't try to pull off huge fucking tours if you don't really feel like it.

Hey, weather sucks? Shit not going right? Don't get all pissy like a bitch, just fuckin' tell the fans... " hey, shit ain't fucking going like we planned, but we gonna make do biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitch!!!!!"

There are two fucking types of fans , er , three i guess. Three...

1. The Axl can do no wrong and this is clearly what guns n roses was meant to be ....people
2. The "Axl needs slash and duff and either the original lineup or use your illusion lineup" people
3. Or the people like me who are pretty much ok with Axl being the last man standing because he says he can fucking do it....people. (cd great fine, still waiting n shit cuz these aint the guys who made it with ya)

I still think he could, but I'm not really seeing it yet. I'm not seeing anything groundbreaking or anything worth not working with other members of the band. I don't doubt he was the driving force. Both to the top, and to wherever the fuck it is going now. I'm still fucking waiting. Luckily, I have other shit to keep me occupied, as does Axl apparently

You really like the f-word.

fuck can be a noun,pro-noun,adjective,predicate and a verb

[Kill Devil Hill]

I agree with all the uzi your illusion posts.

[uzi your illusion]

Thanks KillDevil, I'm kinda surprised to see so many people agreeing with my OP. I thought I was going to have a ton of people ripping on it, but so far only 2 disagreeing and it's been a cool exchange. Still waiting on Sunny and Angry to post back, but it seems like I got my point across for the most part.

[wasted]

failure to compromise.

[uzi your illusion]

Wasted, you think in any way the failure to compromise aspect of his personality is a sort of self-sabotage type of thing in order to make sure the band remains at it's current level?

[uzi your illusion]

I'd love for Sunny, or Angry to respond. I tried giving my point of view to their arguments and am curious to hear what they thought.

[wasted]

Wasted, you think in any way the failure to compromise aspect of his personality is a sort of self-sabotage type of thing in order to make sure the band remains at it's current level?

money is no object and success is subjective.

[wasted]

maybe overexposure is to be avoided.

[angrybananapeel]

Ok, my response to your post OP and my response to my post...

It certainly does seem that Axl is doing exactly what you say so in that aspect I agree, however, Axl could have done all of this without basically disbanding the biggest band in the world and taking it upon himself as the last man standing to make GnR progress. It has not happened, and that is solely at Axl's feet. Axl claimed that Slash was content to keep doing what the band was doing, seems like Duff and everyone else was too. Axl was the one who was not content, it seems. He wanted more! (in a good way, is how I took it). The way I see it is he can either let the band totally fade away and admit defeat, and be ok with that (of course, he'd never admit defeat, so the OP is kinda, in my opinion, giving him an out that he hasn't asked for) which is what seems to be happening, or he can bring it back to the top. With the state of music as it is nowadays, the naysayers and the hopefuls are still waiting. We haven't given up. Axl has three legit choices at this point, in my opinion of course, because that's all this stuff really is:

1. Do something really awesome as GnR that proves he was right all along>
   
2. Big fat reunion tour (pretty much admit defeat)
   
3. Fade further away into obscurity
   

There is a fourth option that almost everyone else besides Axl would be fine with, aside from him of course, and that is an original Axl band.

Right now, even for the ChiDem fans this all seems like a nostalgia act. Is Axl putting on good shows? Yeah, aside from some early missteps I guess, but is anything being blown outta the park really? I mean, the most exciting new things are playing an "Old Gnr" (his words) song, and a second AC/DC cover. The new band is stepping up, but is Axl? You decide.

I don't know how the legal setbacks come into play. It's all conjecture. I Like at least half of Chinese Democracy. I liked the musical direction. I don't want a reunion. I don't want to see GnR/Axl fade away. And I don't wanna see a cover band. However, if what we have seen so far is Axl's vision... I'm a little disappointed.

Edited October 26, 2011 by angrybananapeel