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Our enemies, Islamic State, attack Syrian Kurds, refugees flood Turkish border


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Turkey should so something, because there have been videos of high ranking members talking about how they plan on taking Istanbul.

If they mess with Turkey, that would be the end of them. I doubt they're that stupid.

Turkey is weak dude. The only strong powers in the region are Israel and Iran. Oh and maybe the Houthi Rebels if they re-arm.

Turkey has an organized military that is willing to fight to defend their country (290,000 Ground Troops alone, plus Air Force, Navy, Special Forces, etc)....that's something ISIS has yet to come across. No way 10-30k ISIS fighters stand a chance against the Turkish military...it wouldn't even be close.

They're not my enemies. They never did anything to me or mine as far as I know.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

Edited by Kasanova King
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They're not my enemies. They never did anything to me or mine as far as I know.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

That's kind of the problem. We believe we have the moral high ground to just go "walking" around their parts whenever we feel the need. I try not to be so arrogant. I'm not their enemy.

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They're not my enemies. They never did anything to me or mine as far as I know.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

That's kind of the problem. We believe we have the moral high ground to just go "walking" around their parts whenever we feel the need. I try not to be so arrogant. I'm not their enemy.

That's the funny thing. They could easily come over here and walk around as tourists and no one would blink an eye. Yet, an American is as good as dead on their turf.

As far as you saying you're not their enemy....I'm willing to bet James Foley said the same exact thing to them.

Edited by Kasanova King
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That's the funny thing. They could easily come over here and walk around as tourists and no one would blink an eye. Yet, an American is as good as dead on their turf.

As far as you saying you're not their enemy....I'm willing to bet James Foley said the same exact thing to them.

Depends on where you go in the US. Also, these guys live in fear of drones every single day:

Since 1776 the US has had Pearl Harbor and 9/11. They are both undoubtedly tragedies and should never ever be trivialised, but a lot people in these regions have seen foreign invaders on their soil for decades on end.

It has become clear to me over the past couple years that Americans' main failure when it comes to this type of thing is their complete inability to see the world from anything but an Americo-centric perspective.

You can't really blame Americans, though. Up until the Internet age the US was so geographically removed from the rest of the world that it's easy to understand why. Here in Europe I can get on a cheap flight and visit another country with a different culture and worldview in an instant. The US is not a homogenous nation to be sure, but the difference between NY and Alabama isn't as stark as the difference between London and Marrakech.

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It has become clear to me over the past couple years that Americans' main failure when it comes to this type of thing is their complete inability to see the world from anything but an Americo-centric perspective.

Yes, Mags, you are the only American who has the capacity to see the world from other's perspectives. Not like anyone else has ever traveled abroad, has family and friends in other countries, or even dozens, if not hundreds of Arab, Muslim friends here in the U.S. that they can speak to on a daily basis to see their perspective. Just you Mags, and you alone.

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And who are the aggressors?

The ones who fly and float miles across the ocean to bomb people into the stone age for oil.

One could argue the US and it's allies have been the aggressors to an evil terrorist organisation...for the greater good.

One could also say that the US and it's Allies have been flying across the world engaging in imperialism and profiteering on the back of strife and unrest around the world, you could also say they're war mongers, you could also say they kill a lot of people, a helluva lot of people to keep your fridges cool back home, you could say a lot of things.

I do wonder where ISIS will hide when the raids come. Most likely in a densely populated civilian area, making any air strike a mass homicide of innocent people..

And y'know what, they'll bomb the shit out of it anyway, what does that say about them? I mean lets get this right here, hiding men don't kill, the bombs being dropped on the hiding men kill. I mean the sheer nerve of that perspective, like they're up there in helicopters, sobbing into their palms as they carpet bomb the fuck out of miles of land, yeah, course.

They don't give a flying fuck and y'know why? Cuz they're poor people, cuz there's no money in em. They're 'collateral damage'. But when a plane flies into a skyscrapers and kills thousands thats not collateral damage, when a bomb goes off in a bus in London that ain't collateral damage. What collateral damage really means is people that aren't worthy of your mercy. Iraqi babies have a price you see.

It's all for oil then is it!? :lol: you sound like an American yourself.

And those who sever heads of journalists?or line up and put bullets in thousands of peoples heads for being the wrong religion? Or threaten nations with terrorism?

Some people will only see the US as the enemy. :shrugs:

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No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

And then stole your oil.
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No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

Yes, because all the U.S. does is bomb innocent civilians in the middle east. Get the fuck out of here with that garbage.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

And then stole your oil.

They should be pissed at China and Russia then....because that's who got their oil.....while the U.S. taxpayer gets stuck with the trillion-dollar bill.

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No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

Yes, because all the U.S. does is bomb innocent civilians in the middle east. Get the fuck out of here with that garbage.

For someone in Bumfuckabad, Waziristan, this might as well be the case. They don't hear about any humanitarian efforts, or consider the contributions in science, technology, the arts, etc. that the US makes. They just know that last week their home got bombed and they lost their relatives/friends. That's why ISIS recruitment has gone up in the wake of the recent bombing campaign. They're not considering the wider implication of the US trying to prevent the spread of a barbaric medieval theocracy, they're just pissed at what's happening to them right there right now.

In that John Oliver video I posted, you can see the testimony of a kid who grew up in an American school with American friends who has tough time now trusting the US after he lost loved ones to drone attacks.

I think it was you who pointed out that the US is damned if it does, damned if it doesn't when it comes to intervention.

"When trouble comes up anywhere in the world, they don't call Beijing, they don't call Moscow. They call us. That's the deal."

http://www.businessinsider.com/obama-they-dont-call-moscow-when-theres-trouble-in-the-world-2014-9#ixzz3Ekz3oZBi

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They don't give a flying fuck and y'know why? Cuz they're poor people, cuz there's no money in em. They're 'collateral damage'. But when a plane flies into a skyscrapers and kills thousands thats not collateral damage, when a bomb goes off in a bus in London that ain't collateral damage. What collateral damage really means is people that aren't worthy of your mercy. Iraqi babies have a price you see.

Len, no offense, but do you even know the definition of "collateral damage"? As in unintended damage. When the UN uses a smart bomb on a military target, sometimes there is collateral damage, a civilian may be killed, etc. That's an unintended consequence of the bomb.

When those idiots flew the planes into the WTC, they hit their target.....it was their intention to kill as many American civilians as possible. Not collateral damage.

If you can't see the difference between the two, then you might as well join ISIS, because that's exactly how those morons think.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

Yes, because all the U.S. does is bomb innocent civilians in the middle east. Get the fuck out of here with that garbage.

It's not garbage and you should take your own advice and get the fuck out of all the countries that you have invaded. If you cant see this shit for what it is at least you can do is shut the fuck up.

No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

And then stole your oil.

And the oil lol why not include the petrodollar status into the mix as well. :lol:

You talk so much gibberish with little to no knowledge of the actual events.,how they took place, the results, etc. Your generalizations are as ignorant as they come....same thought process as Hitler himself. Congratulations.

Edited by Kasanova King
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They don't give a flying fuck and y'know why? Cuz they're poor people, cuz there's no money in em. They're 'collateral damage'. But when a plane flies into a skyscrapers and kills thousands thats not collateral damage, when a bomb goes off in a bus in London that ain't collateral damage. What collateral damage really means is people that aren't worthy of your mercy. Iraqi babies have a price you see.

Len, no offense, but do you even know the definition of "collateral damage"? As in unintended damage. When the UN uses a smart bomb on a military target, sometimes there is collateral damage, a civilian may be killed, etc. That's an unintended consequence of the bomb.

When those idiots flew the planes into the WTC, they hit their target.....it was their intention to kill as many American civilians as possible. Not collateral damage.

If you can't see the difference between the two, then you might as well join ISIS, because that's exactly how those morons think.

The question is, though, who are the targets? Again, I refer to the John Oliver video on drones I posted above: often the targets are not even clear in these drone attacks. Collateral damage doesn't even include males above the age of 18 in the targeted regions any more, since they could all potentially be ISIS/Al-Qaeda/Whoever the Islamist flavour of the month is. As Oliver points out, it'd be like him as 30-something white guy from London being considered a member of Coldplay :P

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No, but you certainly are their's. You wouldn't last 5 minutes walking around their parts.

And if we put the shoe on the other foot for a moment and let me ask you a question.

If they had bombed the shit out of your neighborhood for years on end how would you feel about them when they came over for a cup of tea? You'd be ok with that? Would you be all inviting or would you still be a bit pissed off that their bombs had killed your Mother, Father, Brother, Sister, Son, Daughter and the rest of most of the people you hold dear?

Yes, because all the U.S. does is bomb innocent civilians in the middle east. Get the fuck out of here with that garbage.

For someone in Bumfuckabad, Waziristan, this might as well be the case. They don't hear about any humanitarian efforts, or consider the contributions in science, technology, the arts, etc. that the US makes. They just know that last week their home got bombed and they lost their relatives/friends. That's why ISIS recruitment has gone up in the wake of the recent bombing campaign. They're not considering the wider implication of the US trying to prevent the spread of a barbaric medieval theocracy, they're just pissed at what's happening to them right there right now.

In that John Oliver video I posted, you can see the testimony of a kid who grew up in an American school with American friends who has tough time now trusting the US after he lost loved ones to drone attacks.

I think it was you who pointed out that the US is damned if it does, damned if it doesn't when it comes to intervention.

"When trouble comes up anywhere in the world, they don't call Beijing, they don't call Moscow. They call us. That's the deal."

http://www.businessinsider.com/obama-they-dont-call-moscow-when-theres-trouble-in-the-world-2014-9#ixzz3Ekz3oZBi

See, your thought process is an enlightened one and one in which a logical person can have a discussion with. Mr. Captain America, on the other hand, doesn't know his butt from a hole in the ground....but acts as if he does.

Anyway, I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying. The fact of the matter is, an innocent person that was actually affected by a US Airstrike in the middle east has to be less than 1% of the population. The false propaganda created by ISIS and extremist groups is what really draws these people in, whether they were ever personally affected by the US or not.

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They don't give a flying fuck and y'know why? Cuz they're poor people, cuz there's no money in em. They're 'collateral damage'. But when a plane flies into a skyscrapers and kills thousands thats not collateral damage, when a bomb goes off in a bus in London that ain't collateral damage. What collateral damage really means is people that aren't worthy of your mercy. Iraqi babies have a price you see.

Len, no offense, but do you even know the definition of "collateral damage"? As in unintended damage. When the UN uses a smart bomb on a military target, sometimes there is collateral damage, a civilian may be killed, etc. That's an unintended consequence of the bomb.

When those idiots flew the planes into the WTC, they hit their target.....it was their intention to kill as many American civilians as possible. Not collateral damage.

If you can't see the difference between the two, then you might as well join ISIS, because that's exactly how those morons think.

The question is, though, who are the targets? Again, I refer to the John Oliver video on drones I posted above: often the targets are not even clear in these drone attacks. Collateral damage doesn't even include males above the age of 18 in the targeted regions any more, since they could all potentially be ISIS/Al-Qaeda/Whoever the Islamist flavour of the month is. As Oliver points out, it'd be like him as 30-something white guy from London being considered a member of Coldplay :P

There will always be collateral damage during times of war. I seriously doubt the U.S. spends a million dollars on a missile to have it kill some innocent young adult who happens to "look" like a terrorist. These smart weapons are designed to hit specific targets....targets that are given to them by military intelligence on the ground, CIA, etc, etc, etc.....are they wrong sometimes? I'm sure they are.....but I'm willing to wager they are right the vast majority of the time. They go through a painstaking and very expensive process to assure of it.

Think about it like this for a second.....if the U.S. wanted to annihilate people in the middle east, they could do it with a handful of nukes, much cheaper, and it would be done within minutes.

They don't and never will. That's the difference between us and them. If they had a nuke, they would launch it the second they got it. So when people state that the U.S. is bombing innocent civilians, they need to take a step back and realize how silly some of those statements sound.

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I'm no expert but you've got to wonder. An air strike simply can't say for certain no civilians won't be caught in the attack on ISIS. It's not like they're going to have a ruled out area where only terrorists roam. For this reason - air strikes are ruled out. How does America intervene without killing civilians? It seems impossible.

Will ISIS stop it's killings of innocent people as well as journalists from America and the UK if the troops were to withdraw completely? Nope. It's a dammed if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Edited by ColdHeartBreaker
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I'm no expert but you've got to wonder. An air strike simply can't say for certain no civilians won't be caught in the attack on ISIS. It's not like they're going to have a ruled out area where only terrorists roam. For this reason - air strikes are ruled out. How does America intervene without killing civilians? It seems imposable.

Will ISIS stop it's killings of innocent people as well as journalists from America and the UK if the troops were to withdraw completely? Nope. It's a dammed if you do, damned if you don't situation.

In a sense, you're right. That's why the U.S. is currently only targeting known ISIS hotspots. Like you said, ISIS will probably move to more densely populated areas,and yes...they will most likely use human shields as well. That's what those cowards do.

This time, the U.S. won't put boots on the ground....that's why they are arming certain sects/rebels, etc and hopefully that, combined with air support, will weed them out. No chance Obama starts another war over there with US. military on the ground.

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I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying. The fact of the matter is, an innocent person that was actually affected by a US Airstrike in the middle east has to be less than 1% of the population. The false propaganda created by ISIS and extremist groups is what really draws these people in, whether they were ever personally affected by the US or not.

The US has 300-400 million people So if somebody killed off 1% thats 3,000,000 to 4,000,000. you would be ok with that, its just collateral damage according to you. Then if you are Ok with that tell me why you got so bent out of shape when you lost 3000 on 9/11. 3000 is .0001 %

Apply your own logic to yourself and you come up wanting every time.

:takethat:

Nice math, there, Shirlock. At most 1% would be affected...not killed....meaning, someone they know may have been affected, or something in their town may have been bombed, etc.....and realistically, it's probably a fraction of 1%.

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It has become clear to me over the past couple years that Americans' main failure when it comes to this type of thing is their complete inability to see the world from anything but an Americo-centric perspective.

Yes, Mags, you are the only American who has the capacity to see the world from other's perspectives. Not like anyone else has ever traveled abroad, has family and friends in other countries, or even dozens, if not hundreds of Arab, Muslim friends here in the U.S. that they can speak to on a daily basis to see their perspective. Just you Mags, and you alone.

No, there are others, just not that many.

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Can i ask a broad question of the Americans here, as a matter of curiosity? Do you feel a greater attachment to America or to whatever your heritage might be, if it's like Irish or Scotish or a mix of stuff or...how does it work for you?

I'm American. If I identified with the Irish or the English (my primary bloodlines) I'd spend more time talking about how their leaders are imbeciles, but I'm American so I fuck with mine.

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