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A dictator or forced into a position?


gnfnrs1972

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No doubt. But the money and the fame amplify the crazy. Duff and Slash pretty much got the same amount of drunk and stoned as always. :lol:

Sorry to butt in & I hope Marc comes on to answer the original question.

Maybe he could also answer why Steven was outed from the band due to his addiction to drugs when Duff & Slash were equally addicted to their alcohol/drugs? It's ironic they made him sign a contract saying he'd not get stoned & if he did he'd be out which of course ended up in the court case.

Yet the others were just as bad, why was it only Steven kicked out?

They could play fucked up, and he couldn't. They were more functional in life, in general, even when completely fucked up, than Steven was. Steven, in my opinion, got broken as a teenager through no fault of his own. He was a sweet, naive, not extremely intelligent kid with a pretty face in a dangerous city. A good drummer who never could've handled success in a normal bad, much less a band like GnR.

He does have his asshole aspects. Some of the things he's said about women--recently, as an older man--were just stupid. But, as I said, he's not a smart guy.

Thanks for that. I don't know what he said about women but I could argue with him till the cows come home by the sounds of it.

Difference is that all the men in my life have been lovely, not had a problem with any friends or family. So guess I'd be on the loser side of a debate there.

He was on Howard Stern recently - last couple of years - talking about one of the times he and Izzy and one of the others were fucking a groupie. Stern says he's surprised that all those years of groupie fucking didn't result in any babies, and Steven says "that's what the face is for!"

And he's painted rather unflatteringly in The Last Living Slut, the book by the groupie who got pregnant w/Dizzy Reed's kid. If a woman admits to sleeping - and falling in love - with Dizzy Reed, I'm inclined to take her word for other stuff b/c that's some painful honesty right there.

(In several places she talks about how unattractive Izzy is, which might explain why she ended up with Dizzy.)

Ok so I'm confused, am I reading this right that a groupie got pregnant with Dizzy's kid? Is this the woman he's married to now, I saw a photo of him with 2 beautiful daughters.

He didn't marry her. He turned on her, called her a slut, told her to fuck off and get an abortion - and she did. I never finished her book - didn't get much past the point where she met him, but she tells you beforehand that that's how it ended.

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No doubt. But the money and the fame amplify the crazy. Duff and Slash pretty much got the same amount of drunk and stoned as always. :lol:

Sorry to butt in & I hope Marc comes on to answer the original question.

Maybe he could also answer why Steven was outed from the band due to his addiction to drugs when Duff & Slash were equally addicted to their alcohol/drugs? It's ironic they made him sign a contract saying he'd not get stoned & if he did he'd be out which of course ended up in the court case.

Yet the others were just as bad, why was it only Steven kicked out?

They could play fucked up, and he couldn't. They were more functional in life, in general, even when completely fucked up, than Steven was. Steven, in my opinion, got broken as a teenager through no fault of his own. He was a sweet, naive, not extremely intelligent kid with a pretty face in a dangerous city. A good drummer who never could've handled success in a normal bad, much less a band like GnR.

He does have his asshole aspects. Some of the things he's said about women--recently, as an older man--were just stupid. But, as I said, he's not a smart guy.

Thanks for that. I don't know what he said about women but I could argue with him till the cows come home by the sounds of it.

Difference is that all the men in my life have been lovely, not had a problem with any friends or family. So guess I'd be on the loser side of a debate there.

He was on Howard Stern recently - last couple of years - talking about one of the times he and Izzy and one of the others were fucking a groupie. Stern says he's surprised that all those years of groupie fucking didn't result in any babies, and Steven says "that's what the face is for!"

And he's painted rather unflatteringly in The Last Living Slut, the book by the groupie who got pregnant w/Dizzy Reed's kid. If a woman admits to sleeping - and falling in love - with Dizzy Reed, I'm inclined to take her word for other stuff b/c that's some painful honesty right there.

(In several places she talks about how unattractive Izzy is, which might explain why she ended up with Dizzy.)

Ok so I'm confused, am I reading this right that a groupie got pregnant with Dizzy's kid? Is this the woman he's married to now, I saw a photo of him with 2 beautiful daughters.

He didn't marry her. He turned on her, called her a slut, told her to fuck off and get an abortion - and she did. I never finished her book - didn't get much past the point where she met him, but she tells you beforehand that that's how it ended.

Ok thanks, just googled her. Not a book I'd read, it might shock me. :o;)

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I suspect Axl wasn't pushed into the role, he seems like he prefers being the one who controls decisions, but I do think their drug habits etc. probably reinforced his belief of self-entitlement to control the band

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I suspect Axl wasn't pushed into the role, he seems like he prefers being the one who controls decisions, but I do think their drug habits etc. probably reinforced his belief of self-entitlement to control the band

The fucker wanted to cut Izzy's salary by half or some shit. There are many other examples that point to him being a control freak.

Nothing has changed in that department. Why do you think that the few interviews Axl does give, like 2 to 3 a year, all contain questions the Gn'R camp approved beforehand? he tries to control as much as he can cause he's insecure and prefers to do it his way.

It's basically his way or the highway most of the time imo. (if not all of it)

Axl is not the only one responsible for the destruction of old Guns, but it's clear as day he was a big part of the problem. His overblown reactions, tendency for drama and diva behavior all contributed to the multiple shit storms this band have seen and I include every incarnation of it.

The way Axl's band operates since Slash, Duff, and Izzy quit proves he was a big part of the problem. Look what happened after he gained total control over Guns: almost nothing. One album in 23 years. Minimal interaction with the fans, and sometimes minimal interaction with band members that want to write a fresh Guns album with him! (Bumble)

The situation only reflects Axl's defects as a human being and it fucks up what is left of the potential of this line up and what it can do.

Edited by Rovim
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I suspect Axl wasn't pushed into the role, he seems like he prefers being the one who controls decisions, but I do think their drug habits etc. probably reinforced his belief of self-entitlement to control the band

The fucker wanted to cut Izzy's salary by half or some shit. There are many other examples that point to him being a control freak.

Nothing has changed in that department. Why do you think that the few interviews Axl does give, like 2 to 3 a year, all contain questions the Gn'R camp approved beforehand? he tries to control as much as he can cause he's insecure and prefers to do it his way.

It's basically his way or the highway most of the time imo. (if not all of it)

Axl is not the only one responsible for the destruction of old Guns, but it's clear as day he was a big part of the problem. His overblown reactions, tendency for drama and diva behavior all contributed to the multiple shit storms this band have seen and I include every incarnation of it.

The way Axl's band operates since Slash, Duff, and Izzy quit proves he was a big part of the problem. Look what happened after he gained total control over Guns: almost nothing. One album in 23 years. Minimal interaction with the band.

The situation only reflects Axl's defects as a human being and it fucks up what is left of the potential of this line up and what it can do.

I'm not sure why you are arguing with me, I haven't said that Axl doesn't prefer to control things. I was merely making the point that some of the behaviour (such as drug abuse) by the other members probably reinforced his belief that he should control the band and he is the best person to make decisions.

Their behaviour probably legitimized his controlling nature in his mind.

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I suspect Axl wasn't pushed into the role, he seems like he prefers being the one who controls decisions, but I do think their drug habits etc. probably reinforced his belief of self-entitlement to control the band

The fucker wanted to cut Izzy's salary by half or some shit. There are many other examples that point to him being a control freak.

Nothing has changed in that department. Why do you think that the few interviews Axl does give, like 2 to 3 a year, all contain questions the Gn'R camp approved beforehand? he tries to control as much as he can cause he's insecure and prefers to do it his way.

It's basically his way or the highway most of the time imo. (if not all of it)

Axl is not the only one responsible for the destruction of old Guns, but it's clear as day he was a big part of the problem. His overblown reactions, tendency for drama and diva behavior all contributed to the multiple shit storms this band have seen and I include every incarnation of it.

The way Axl's band operates since Slash, Duff, and Izzy quit proves he was a big part of the problem. Look what happened after he gained total control over Guns: almost nothing. One album in 23 years. Minimal interaction with the band.

The situation only reflects Axl's defects as a human being and it fucks up what is left of the potential of this line up and what it can do.

I'm not sure why you are arguing with me, I haven't said that Axl doesn't prefer to control things. I was merely making the point that some of the behaviour (such as drug abuse) by the other members probably reinforced his belief that he should control the band and he is the best person to make decisions.

Their behaviour probably legitimized his controlling nature in his mind.

Agreed. And I wasn't arguing with you, sorry if it seemed like I was. :)

Yeah... I think he didn't trust them with the future of the band, but some of his actions can't be excused by that imo.

He said that after Appetite he thought the rest of them would try to keep and respect the musical bond they had cause it worked!

But as the leader of his band he separated himself from the rest of the band and yes, became a dictator. What about democracy? was Slash also an asshole? Slash admitted he wasn't perfect.

Did Izzy leave just because of Axl? probably not, there were more problems with drugs and what not, but he didn't even respect his old friend and musical partner enough to not try to cut his salary by half.

They were all young and on drugs or ego trips or both, but in the end Axl could have done more I think. Or at least less. Less horseshit and egotistical thinking. The leader is supposed to keep it together. He said he tried, but some of his actions really damaged what they had and it was over cause there was no one there to make rational decisions that could have helped maybe.

And then like I said with new Guns, he only showed how limited he was as a frontman. Not artistically, but in almost every other way. It wasn't just because Slash, Duff, or Izzy were just difficult to get along with as people and musicians.

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I suspect Axl wasn't pushed into the role, he seems like he prefers being the one who controls decisions, but I do think their drug habits etc. probably reinforced his belief of self-entitlement to control the band

Seems likely. Reminds me of some familys - which is of course essentially how a band functions anyway - there's usually a power struggle but if the one most keen on seizing control can look at the others and see they're wasted it's always gonna reenforce their ego. It's not "I should be running things" to them at that point, it can be a noble mission: "Well, I guess it's up to me".

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Yeah, they were wasted and horrible junkies blah blah blah, but on this same thread, here's what Marc has told us:

Slash did take care of a lot of the things it took to keep the band on tour. Slash was always a hard working member of the band. He was also the one who did most of the press stuff.

I'm sure their addiction was a main problem but they were functional. Maybe more than Axl and his demons?

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