downzy Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 Rather than starting a new thread for every time something develops in the Middle East, I figured it's best to have just one thread.To kick things off, I came across this article about the upcoming Iraq/U.S. offensive to retake the Iraqi city of Mosul from ISIS. From the opinion of Keating, the article's author, it seems like a lose-lose proposition for Iraqi-American forces, whether they retake the town or not.Blind Into Mosul?Joshua Keatinghttp://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2015/02/23/blind_into_mosul.htmlThen again, I've read elsewhere (can't find the article right now), that any notion of defeating ISIS without U.S. assistance or involvement is futile. While we've seen countries like Egypt, Turkey, and Jordan step up recently, it's unlikely that an only Arab-force could turn back the ISIS tide. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lithium Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amir Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazey Posted February 24, 2015 Share Posted February 24, 2015 What's a levant and why should I care? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted February 25, 2015 Author Share Posted February 25, 2015 What's a levant and why should I care? It's a land mass that incorporates Syria, Lebanon, Israel, Jordan, and arguably parts of Iraq. You know, the fun zone. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luciusfunk Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 What's a levant and why should I care? http://lmgtfy.com/?q=What+is+the+levant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgy Zhukov Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Iraqi-Kurdish forces are going to attempt to retake Mosul, while Syrian-Kurdish forces are working on cutting off supply lines from eastern Syria to Iraq. http://www.vox.com/2015/2/24/8091913/mosul-offensive-explainedISIL is aware of the plan (they do get internet out there) so they are going to throw in everything they've got against the offensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 We should invade their lands exactly as much as we would like them to invade ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgy Zhukov Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Taking Mosul would be a huge blow to ISIL and the first step to a Kurdish state. Pushing them out of Iraq and back into Syria, but will Syria allow Iraqi forces cross over? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 What's a levant? A tricky away fixture in La Liga? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazey Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 So what's a "Geo Politics" when it's at home then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) So what's a "Geo Politics" when it's at home then?A convoluted way of describing we shag poor people basically. Edited February 26, 2015 by Len B'stard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted February 26, 2015 Author Share Posted February 26, 2015 Taking Mosul would be a huge blow to ISIL and the first step to a Kurdish state. Pushing them out of Iraq and back into Syria, but will Syria allow Iraqi forces cross over? I'm not sure how successful such a push would be, at least in the immediate future. As the article i posted above reminds everyone, it only took a couple hundred ISIS fighters to drive out 30k Iraqi troops from Mosul a year ago. Now there's several thousand ISIS forces within Mosul. Perhaps this new Iraqi/Kurd force will be a bit more effective, but we'll see.And I'm not sure Syria is in any position to prevent Iraqi/Kurdish forces from crossing into it's border. It can't do much about ISIS, so not sure what they'd do against state-backed forces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgy Zhukov Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Supposedly Mosul fell so quickly is because the Shiite leaders thought their own Kurdish/Sunni soldiers were going to turn on them and join ISIL. Their unites were poorly armed, had little ammunition and there was no communications between the Kurds and the Shiites. This time since they will be teaming up and hopefully the Iraqi army has learned its lesson they will be able to take back Mosul. During that whole offensive, Mosul was being abandoned by Iraqi troops so when they actually got there, they were not facing 30,000 troops as reported. More likely those numbers probably starting around 10,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.wa.T Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 (edited) Taking Mosul would be a huge blow to ISIL and the first step to a Kurdish state. Pushing them out of Iraq and back into Syria, but will Syria allow Iraqi forces cross over? I'm not sure how successful such a push would be, at least in the immediate future. As the article i posted above reminds everyone, it only took a couple hundred ISIS fighters to drive out 30k Iraqi troops from Mosul a year ago. Now there's several thousand ISIS forces within Mosul. Perhaps this new Iraqi/Kurd force will be a bit more effective, but we'll see.And I'm not sure Syria is in any position to prevent Iraqi/Kurdish forces from crossing into it's border. It can't do much about ISIS, so not sure what they'd do against state-backed forces.Fortunatly, they won't be going alone. The US will be directing the offensive. That said, because everyone has to be politically correct nowadays, the army will be fighting with one hand behind their backs. The now typical, don't shoot until fired upon crap, doesn't work with people like them. The new video of ISIS members destroying ancient artifacts and statues with sledge hammers must make their followers and believers proud. They slaughter the weak and destroy inanimate objects, real tough guys. Wait until a real army presents itself. Id bet most drop their weapons on the spot and try to leave like the cowards they are. Edited February 27, 2015 by T.wa.T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgy Zhukov Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Taking Mosul would be a huge blow to ISIL and the first step to a Kurdish state. Pushing them out of Iraq and back into Syria, but will Syria allow Iraqi forces cross over? I'm not sure how successful such a push would be, at least in the immediate future. As the article i posted above reminds everyone, it only took a couple hundred ISIS fighters to drive out 30k Iraqi troops from Mosul a year ago. Now there's several thousand ISIS forces within Mosul. Perhaps this new Iraqi/Kurd force will be a bit more effective, but we'll see.And I'm not sure Syria is in any position to prevent Iraqi/Kurdish forces from crossing into it's border. It can't do much about ISIS, so not sure what they'd do against state-backed forces.Fortunatly, they won't be going alone. The US will be directing the offensive. That said, because everyone has to be politically correct nowadays, the army will be fighting with one hand behind their backs. The now typical, don't shoot until fired upon crap, doesn't work with people like them.The new video of ISIS members destroying ancient artifacts and statues with sledge hammers must make their followers and believers proud.They slaughter the weak and destroy inanimate objects, real tough guys. Wait until a real army presents itself. Id bet most drop their weapons on the spot and try to leave like the cowards they are.Well the logistics should be better now. It was poor logistics and communications that caused Mosul to fall. ISIL will not give up Mosul without a fight. They need to cut off ISIL in Iraq from Syria. That is very important. They are stronger in Syria for reasons that it is so divided there between opposition and government. But if they take Mosul and cut off the rest of ISIL from Syria they can be mopped up. Egypt has been working on helping the Libyans expel ISIL from Sirte, Libya. Basically a war on multiple fronts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Discussion like this makes me disgusted to be an American. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Drama Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 So many reasons. Can't go into great detail right now. The dispassionate strategizing, as if entire countries and populations are nothing more than pieces of a board game created for comfortable middle class American thought experiments, or as if we're debating whether the coach of our favorite sports team is calling the right plays. It's abhorrent. Imagine the roles reversed. We can't even imagine it, can we? That's how deep seated our imperial privilege and racism is. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Its so refreshing to hear someone share your opinion once in a while. I dont generally give a fuck but after a while you start to wonder if you're the crazy one. Which begs the question i suppose that how does company make one less insane? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I have the same experience with many of your posts, Len. Perhaps you and I are just a closed loop of self-reinforcing crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lithium Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Get a room, you two. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magisme Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 You know I'm gay for you too, Lith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T.wa.T Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Taking Mosul would be a huge blow to ISIL and the first step to a Kurdish state. Pushing them out of Iraq and back into Syria, but will Syria allow Iraqi forces cross over? I'm not sure how successful such a push would be, at least in the immediate future. As the article i posted above reminds everyone, it only took a couple hundred ISIS fighters to drive out 30k Iraqi troops from Mosul a year ago. Now there's several thousand ISIS forces within Mosul. Perhaps this new Iraqi/Kurd force will be a bit more effective, but we'll see.And I'm not sure Syria is in any position to prevent Iraqi/Kurdish forces from crossing into it's border. It can't do much about ISIS, so not sure what they'd do against state-backed forces.Fortunatly, they won't be going alone. The US will be directing the offensive. That said, because everyone has to be politically correct nowadays, the army will be fighting with one hand behind their backs. The now typical, don't shoot until fired upon crap, doesn't work with people like them.The new video of ISIS members destroying ancient artifacts and statues with sledge hammers must make their followers and believers proud.They slaughter the weak and destroy inanimate objects, real tough guys. Wait until a real army presents itself. Id bet most drop their weapons on the spot and try to leave like the cowards they are. Well the logistics should be better now. It was poor logistics and communications that caused Mosul to fall. ISIL will not give up Mosul without a fight. They need to cut off ISIL in Iraq from Syria. That is very important. They are stronger in Syria for reasons that it is so divided there between opposition and government. But if they take Mosul and cut off the rest of ISIL from Syria they can be mopped up. Egypt has been working on helping the Libyans expel ISIL from Sirte, Libya. Basically a war on multiple fronts.Good for Egypt, its great that a Muslim country recognizes what is happening instead of sleeping at the wheel. Their president was the first to stand up and renounce the Muslim extremists and call them what they are. The surrounding Arab nations should follow their lead and be proactive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lithium Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 You know I'm gay for you too, Lith.I don't like it when you talk to other boys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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