1999 album?

[Rovim]

I think he was trying to respect Brian as well.

Maybe someday he'll release the version with Brian as a bonus or as a part of an Alternate Chinese. The upside is that we got to hear 2 different versions.

The Catcher leak is the only leak that actually was a good thing imo cause that version was never released and is markedly different then the official one. Different production and guitars and the original Pitman solo.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Rovim

[wasted]

I used to play it while playing GTA San An. When Bought that mansion on the hill I thought I was going to find the album version.

[CoBrA2168]

You can hear clips of pre-2002 studio versions of Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, and The Blues in this video:

The Blues is the one that really intrigues me as it has a completely different solo. Loving that old school Chinese Democracy intro too.

[wasted]

I've got a live version of Chidem in Boston. It has much more keyboard.

[BreakDown2014]

If CD had been released back then Pitman would be the star. That'd be fun to see

You can hear clips of pre-2002 studio versions of Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, and The Blues in this video:

The Blues is the one that really intrigues me as it has a completely different solo. Loving that old school Chinese Democracy intro too.

That solo intrigues me as well. Sounds great!!

[dando]

If CD had been released back then Pitman would be the star. That'd be fun to see

You can hear clips of pre-2002 studio versions of Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, and The Blues in this video:

The Blues is the one that really intrigues me as it has a completely different solo. Loving that old school Chinese Democracy intro too.

That solo intrigues me as well. Sounds great!!

Pitman getting praise cool , yeah it sounds great

[EvH]

I think Protools existing was the biggest burden to this album - Axl editing Brian May's solo to the point where Brian didn't even recognize it was absolutely inexcusable.

I wonder if the demo that leaked of Catcher was Brian's solo as he played it, or one of Axl's edits?

The solo on the leaked Catcher demo is Axl and his engineer taking a throwaway take of Brian as Axl called it and rebuilding it really. That's the version that was unrecognized to Brian when he first heard it according to Axl.

And it is excusable imo: the solo on the demo is great.

You don't "rebuild" a solo by Brian May. As another great guitarist once said, "don't touch it".

Why not try everything? why limit yourself. I guess I'm not a purist when it comes to how to get results in the studio. The outcome is what matters in the end, even if I understand why it would seem shitty to fuck with Brian's work. But maybe Axl wanted a very specific thing out of him to not use.

It has nothing to do with being a purist or limiting yourself. A good guitarist -and Brian is truly one of the best and most gifted ever -has a sound, a touch, and melodic skills. What's the point of having great musicians playing on an album if you're going to chop and edit everything they recorded? If you want musicians of such high caliber (and brian is of a much higher caliber than Axl will ever be) you have to give them trust, and to let them well, express themselves musically. If you're playing it dictator style, chopping everything not perfectly fitting with you arbitrary idea of a structured musical passage and basically (consciously or not) despising their own creation, well, use synthetic instruments if you're going that way. Shorten certain passages or make fades/punch in/outs, yeah, sure. But editing stuff to the point of it being impossible to recognize? Gimme a break.

Not to mention I trust Brian in terms of composing a solo fitting the song, more than Axl in that regard. I've yet to hear a studio track featuring Brian with a meh or bad solo.

[Mr. Dude]

If CD had been released back then Pitman would be the star. That'd be fun to see

You can hear clips of pre-2002 studio versions of Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, and The Blues in this video:

The Blues is the one that really intrigues me as it has a completely different solo. Loving that old school Chinese Democracy intro too.

That solo intrigues me as well. Sounds great!!

Pitman getting praise cool , yeah it sounds great

Pitman is one of the great techno-industrial keyboardists of all time in my opinion.

Edited April 14, 2015 by Mr. Dude

[BreakDown2014]

If CD had been released back then Pitman would be the star. That'd be fun to see

You can hear clips of pre-2002 studio versions of Chinese Democracy, Madagascar, and The Blues in this video:

The Blues is the one that really intrigues me as it has a completely different solo. Loving that old school Chinese Democracy intro too.

That solo intrigues me as well. Sounds great!!

Pitman getting praise cool , yeah it sounds great

Pitman is one of the great industrial keyboardists of all time in my opinion.

Yeah, at least what I've heard (Tool stuff and Lusk) is amazing, completely amazing. It's such a shame how you can't even listen to him anymore in a GN'R show, he added a lot to the songs during the 2001-2002 shows

[D..]

What an interesting story.

I get that most people here will side with Ezrin rather than Axl on that one. But... As touching and down to earth as Ezrin may seem... he had nothing to do with the project. He is a regular down to earth guy who had to leave at 8.30pm to attend his wife's party... wow... thrilling...

Axl lost his will to enjoy a regular happy wife/husband relationship the day he lost Stephanie. Pretty sure he would have settled for a normal life like Ezrin and put GN'R to the grave had their relationship worked out.

You have to admire his determination and patience while making Chinese Democracy.

As for the songs, I'm not surprised that Ezrin didn't like most songs. You have to be in a state of suffering to admire the fine art in CD. It's not an album that was made with joy. It's driven by pain and suffering. The most valuable pieces of arts are driven by pain and suffering.

I don't mind the "overproduction". It's not overproduced to me. It reminds me of a video where you see Picasso painting something, then painting something over, then over again. But through all the paintings, there is still a global meaning to it, and there are all the layers to be discovered underneath. I love that. I don't mind when it's stripped down either, that's just not the matter here.

The only time when Axl needs to meet the real world expectations is when doing live gigs. Other than that he can do whatever he wants, I don't care. Yeah he shows up a bit late, but I never minded it. Makes the wait worth it, and when he goes on stage, he gives 100% (although his voice was atrocious in 2011, 12, 13 and most of 14).

The world need more people like Axl. It's so dull when everyone shows up at the right time, living their perfectly minuted life, like it will change anything... you will die anyway.

[jbhutto]

The problem is Axl kind of took what Ezrin said to heart?

Oh my God

Silkworms

Chinese Democracy

The Blues

There was a Time

Catcher in the Rye

Riad n the Bedouins

IRS

Madagascar

Atlas Shrugged

Prostitute

Must have been the 13 track album that was sited really early.

Too bad Axl didn't go with his gut (I'm going to put up a preemptive joke block here) and go ahead with mixing it.

[wasted]

I think Protools existing was the biggest burden to this album - Axl editing Brian May's solo to the point where Brian didn't even recognize it was absolutely inexcusable.

I wonder if the demo that leaked of Catcher was Brian's solo as he played it, or one of Axl's edits?

The solo on the leaked Catcher demo is Axl and his engineer taking a throwaway take of Brian as Axl called it and rebuilding it really. That's the version that was unrecognized to Brian when he first heard it according to Axl.

And it is excusable imo: the solo on the demo is great.

You don't "rebuild" a solo by Brian May. As another great guitarist once said, "don't touch it".

Why not try everything? why limit yourself. I guess I'm not a purist when it comes to how to get results in the studio. The outcome is what matters in the end, even if I understand why it would seem shitty to fuck with Brian's work. But maybe Axl wanted a very specific thing out of him to not use.

It has nothing to do with being a purist or limiting yourself. A good guitarist -and Brian is truly one of the best and most gifted ever -has a sound, a touch, and melodic skills. What's the point of having great musicians playing on an album if you're going to chop and edit everything they recorded? If you want musicians of such high caliber (and brian is of a much higher caliber than Axl will ever be) you have to give them trust, and to let them well, express themselves musically. If you're playing it dictator style, chopping everything not perfectly fitting with you arbitrary idea of a structured musical passage and basically (consciously or not) despising their own creation, well, use synthetic instruments if you're going that way. Shorten certain passages or make fades/punch in/outs, yeah, sure. But editing stuff to the point of it being impossible to recognize? Gimme a break.

Not to mention I trust Brian in terms of composing a solo fitting the song, more than Axl in that regard. I've yet to hear a studio track featuring Brian with a meh or bad solo.

The point was Brian worked on a few songs, for Catcher he did a few solos and none of them fit. I think the demo solo is the solo Axl built? Brian didn't really like it or recognise it. So they had nothing to use. So it's not a question of respect. Brian does a solo on Atlas too.

[wasted]

The problem is Axl kind of took what Ezrin said to heart?

Oh my God

Silkworms

Chinese Democracy

The Blues

There was a Time

Catcher in the Rye

Riad n the Bedouins

IRS

Madagascar

Atlas Shrugged

Prostitute

Must have been the 13 track album that was sited really early.

Too bad Axl didn't go with his gut (I'm going to put up a preemptive joke block here) and go ahead with mixing it.

Pure speculation but maybe he didn't get label support and it was a one shot deal. So it not being a hit would end his career. Maybe reaction to Oh my God had an effect.

But say there was support for a second record. Maybe by 2004:

This I Love

Better

Shacklers

If the World

Scraped

Sorry

Seven

The General

Zodiac

Thyme

[Nosaj Thing]

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

[DR DOOM]

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

It's the fifth part of the trilogy.

I think Atlas Shrugged is what handstands are to peanut butter, it's like being punched in the cow by a truck with no arms.

[Iron MikeyJ]

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

Why don't you share it with us sir? I for one would love to hear it.

[DieselDaisy]

1/ You get Brian May, one of the all time greatest unique sounding guitarists ever.

2/ You butcher his solo for the, 'demo', with pro-tools

3/ You do not use him at all for the released version

Talk about an insult. May thankfully is far too nice and grown up about things to make a big deal of it. More evidence that Axl is a complete wanker.

[wasted]

The General is the sequel to Estranged.

Riad was the sequel to Civil War so it's hard to know what to expect.

1/ You get Brian May, one of the all time greatest unique sounding guitarists ever.

2/ You butcher his solo for the, 'demo', with pro-tools

3/ You do not use him at all for the released version

Talk about an insult. May thankfully is far too nice and grown up about things to make a big deal of it. More evidence that Axl is a complete wanker.

There was no May solo that fit. The only option was to build one.

[DieselDaisy]

The General is the sequel to Estranged.

Riad was the sequel to Civil War so it's hard to know what to expect.

1/ You get Brian May, one of the all time greatest unique sounding guitarists ever.

2/ You butcher his solo for the, 'demo', with pro-tools

3/ You do not use him at all for the released version

Talk about an insult. May thankfully is far too nice and grown up about things to make a big deal of it. More evidence that Axl is a complete wanker.

There was no May solo that fit. The only option was to build one.

I bet Brian thought his solo 'fit'.

[wasted]

The General is the sequel to Estranged.

Riad was the sequel to Civil War so it's hard to know what to expect.

1/ You get Brian May, one of the all time greatest unique sounding guitarists ever.

2/ You butcher his solo for the, 'demo', with pro-tools

3/ You do not use him at all for the released version

Talk about an insult. May thankfully is far too nice and grown up about things to make a big deal of it. More evidence that Axl is a complete wanker.

There was no May solo that fit. The only option was to build one.

I bet Brian thought his solo 'fit'.

If it fit they would have used it?

It was just a demo and Axl didn't have May at his beck and call. I think they just had one session. They patched together a solo for the demo. Then it leaked.

[DieselDaisy]

Why are you defending this? Axl specifically hired May for a guest appearance then proceeded to insult the guy by showing a total disrespect for his work.

[Nosaj Thing]

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

It's the fifth part of the trilogy.

I think Atlas Shrugged is what handstands are to peanut butter, it's like being punched in the cow by a truck with no arms.

Once Atlas Shrugged is released, magisme will automatically ask for his account to be permanently banned, ashamed for mocking Axl for so long. And I? I would probably write a letter to Axl, Goldstein style.

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

Why don't you share it with us sir? I for one would love to hear it.

Trust me, buddy, your ears are not ready for that type of music.

[wasted]

May didn't like the solo on the demo everyone loves. So he wasn't happy with it. So it was out of respect that it wasn't used.

I think if RTB had remained on the project Brian may have come back to do another solo.

Edited April 15, 2015 by wasted

[Apollo]

What an interesting story.

I get that most people here will side with Ezrin rather than Axl on that one. But... As touching and down to earth as Ezrin may seem... he had nothing to do with the project. He is a regular down to earth guy who had to leave at 8.30pm to attend his wife's party... wow... thrilling...

Axl lost his will to enjoy a regular happy wife/husband relationship the day he lost Stephanie. Pretty sure he would have settled for a normal life like Ezrin and put GN'R to the grave had their relationship worked out.

You have to admire his determination and patience while making Chinese Democracy.

As for the songs, I'm not surprised that Ezrin didn't like most songs. You have to be in a state of suffering to admire the fine art in CD. It's not an album that was made with joy. It's driven by pain and suffering. The most valuable pieces of arts are driven by pain and suffering.

I don't mind the "overproduction". It's not overproduced to me. It reminds me of a video where you see Picasso painting something, then painting something over, then over again. But through all the paintings, there is still a global meaning to it, and there are all the layers to be discovered underneath. I love that. I don't mind when it's stripped down either, that's just not the matter here.

The only time when Axl needs to meet the real world expectations is when doing live gigs. Other than that he can do whatever he wants, I don't care. Yeah he shows up a bit late, but I never minded it. Makes the wait worth it, and when he goes on stage, he gives 100% (although his voice was atrocious in 2011, 12, 13 and most of 14).

The world need more people like Axl. It's so dull when everyone shows up at the right time, living their perfectly minuted life, like it will change anything... you will die anyway.

You might find Axl's lifestyle interesting and think the world needs more people like him. I respectfully disagree. I think 5 more GnR albums would be "better" for the world than a rocker with an attitude who doesn't release music.

[Iron MikeyJ]

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

It's the fifth part of the trilogy.

I think Atlas Shrugged is what handstands are to peanut butter, it's like being punched in the cow by a truck with no arms.

Once Atlas Shrugged is released, magisme will automatically ask for his account to be permanently banned, ashamed for mocking Axl for so long. And I? I would probably write a letter to Axl, Goldstein style.

The General is simply a masterpiece. The best song Axl has ever written. It will bring tears to people's eyes when they hear it and it will turn Maynard, the biggest Axl hater, into his greatest supporter.

Why don't you share it with us sir? I for one would love to hear it.

Trust me, buddy, your ears are not ready for that type of music.

I want to be ready. ?