What the hell is up with song temps?

[Kosonen]

Have noticed this. the worst thing is the songs speed up during the songs, thats just weird from pro musicians. In a lot of songs theres just confusion between them. Drummer is the most important thing in a band.

bring back anyone

[SWINGTRADER]

Just now, Kosonen said:

Have noticed this. the worst thing is the songs speed up during the songs, thats just weird from pro musicians. In a lot of songs theres just confusion between them. Drummer is the most important thing in a band.

bring back anyone

Maybe we can eliminate the drummer all together and just use old Steven Adler and Matt Sorum recordings for the shows. Anything would be better than Frank.

[Ant]

39 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

The times were all over the place in the old days. That is called rock n' roll. I just watched the coachella clips and I'm fairly impressed. The only song that sounded like shit was Nightrain which is my favourite Guns song; it just lacked something somehow; it sounded mechanical, lacking groove, and yes, played a bit too fast.

Did you like the April 9th Nightrain?

[bigpoop]

3 minutes ago, Kosonen said:

Have noticed this. the worst thing is the songs speed up during the songs, thats just weird from pro musicians. In a lot of songs theres just confusion between them. Drummer is the most important thing in a band.

bring back anyone

Yes exactly they speed up. This is how you know it's not a click track issue. It's Frank.

[SWINGTRADER]

If I were in the band I would rip Frank Ferrer a new one. To the point of a fist fight. I can't imagine anything worse for a guitarist than to have the drummer fuck up your performance during a concert. I would be pissed.

Unfortunately for GNR, The boss (Axl) likes this guy. I have no idea why.

[BOSSY78]

Whatever the reason for speeding it up in my opinion you would think vocally Axl would prefer either the normal or slowed down versions. Speeding it up would put more of a strain on Axl vocally you'd think.

So some scenarios because besides what others have mentioned maybe it's Slash who likes it speeded up. He hasn't played with Axl in years and yes I'm aware he still does some of the songs with his other band in the past but maybe he likes it faster.

 

When I watched Axl do November Rain his face said it all. He was pushing. We know he sounded great and vocally did better last week perhaps they are trying to get back into what works for them all. Idk.

 

I think he sounded good overall from what I have seen last night but there was a few he was tired on.

[Kosonen]

21 minutes ago, bigpoop said:

Yes exactly they speed up. This is how you know it's not a click track issue. It's Frank.

Yes. Its weird I always thought Frank is decent because he is reliable, boring as hell, but reliable. Now hes boring and cant do the job anymore, what the fuck? No more click? Really, cant keep the rhythm without a click....another one with the same issue is Axl, he just cant count to 4 sometimes lol. But hes god so i dont care.

this is not Dream Theater or something though. 

Edited April 18, 2016 by Kosonen

[pomponio]

I've been noticing Slash's tempo problems for a few years now. He has been flying through the PC intro. He's naturally a really nervous person. Back in day he used to be on dope during every show. That slowed him down and made him play slower and more relaxed. The sad truth is that his being sober has a negative influence in his playing and tempo sense. They have to be telling Frank to push the songs. Don't get me wrong, I don't like Frank's playing. He's too busy and gets in the middle of the vocals and guitar solos. But, I don't think the tempo is solely his fault.

He's not fully innocent either. There's a difference between playing fast and rushing the hits. He sounds anxious and nervous. He's hitting ahead of time and struggling to keep a steady tempo without speeding up the songs. 

A third party, they trust and respect, needs to sit down with them and make them understand something is wrong. They are all pushing too much. The adrenaline, nerves and pressure of the situation is playing against them. 

Now, I rather see a rushed GnR than no GnR at all. I've been waiting for this moment since I was 13 years old. I get goose bumps every time I see those two in stage together. I'm not gonna let some tempo problems spoil the moment. But it still needs to be addressed. 

 

P.s. Before anyone starts bashing me, I'm a professional musician who has been earning a living playing live for more than 20 years. If there's something I know is that when playing live, even though the drummer is the most capable of affecting the speed, the tempo is every band member's responsibility. 

[StoneTempleRoses]

You people are so dumb they're playing at the speed they want to play at, Frank isn't fucking it up, thats so dumb. You don't think during rehearsals they would have told him to slow down if they wanted him to??? I want Matt or Steven to but come on Frank is 100% capable of playing these songs at any speed they want him to.

[bigpoop]

Maybe so but I don't know how they could listen back these performances and not notice it's a problem. It really ruins some of the songs.

[SWINGTRADER]

3 minutes ago, pomponio said:

I've been noticing Slash's tempo problems for a few years now. He has been flying through the PC intro. He's naturally a really nervous person. Back in day he used to be on dope during every show. That slowed him down and made him play slower and more relaxed. The sad truth is that his being sober has a negative influence in his playing and tempo sense. They have to be telling Frank to push the songs. Don't get me wrong, I don't like Frank's playing. He's too busy and gets in the middle of the vocals and guitar solos. But, I don't think the tempo is solely his fault.

He's not fully innocent either. There's a difference between playing fast and rushing the hits. He sounds anxious and nervous. He's hitting ahead of time and struggling to keep a steady tempo without speeding up the songs. 

A third party, they trust and respect, needs to sit down with them and make them understand something is wrong. They are all pushing too much. The adrenaline, nerves and pressure of the situation is playing against them. 

Now, I rather see a rushed GnR than no GnR at all. I've been waiting for this moment since I was 13 years old. I get goose bumps every time I see those two in stage together. I'm not gonna let some tempo problems spoil the moment. But it still needs to be addressed. 

 

P.s. Before anyone starts bashing me, I'm a professional musician who has been earning a living playing live for more than 20 years. If there's something I know is that when playing live, even though the drummer is the most capable of affecting the speed, the tempo is every band member's responsibility. 

 

Unfortunately, there is no third party when it comes to Axl. He is all the parties in GNR lol 

The only time Axl will be forced to put his ego aside ,and do what he is told, is when he joins AC/DC. This is one of the reasons I am happy about his involvement with AC. It is about time Axl learned to listen.

[pomponio]

2 minutes ago, SWINGTRADER said:

 

Unfortunately, there is no third party when it comes to Axl. He is all the parties in GNR lol 

The only time Axl will be forced to put his ego aside ,and do what he is told, is when he joins AC/DC. This is one of the reasons I am happy about his involvement with AC. It is about time Axl learned to listen.

Angus young is exactly the third party I was thinking about. Let's hope for the Ac/Dc thing to be a positive influence on him. 

Edited April 18, 2016 by pomponio

[Kosonen]

8 minutes ago, pomponio said:

I've been noticing Slash's tempo problems for a few years now. He has been flying through the PC intro. He's naturally a really nervous person. Back in day he used to be on dope during every show. That slowed him down and made him play slower and more relaxed. The sad truth is that his being sober has a negative influence in his playing and tempo sense. They have to be telling Frank to push the songs. Don't get me wrong, I don't like Frank's playing. He's too busy and gets in the middle of the vocals and guitar solos. But, I don't think the tempo is solely his fault.

He's not fully innocent either. There's a difference between playing fast and rushing the hits. He sounds anxious and nervous. He's hitting ahead of time and struggling to keep a steady tempo without speeding up the songs. 

A third party, they trust and respect, needs to sit down with them and make them understand something is wrong. They are all pushing too much. The adrenaline, nerves and pressure of the situation is playing against them. 

Now, I rather see a rushed GnR than no GnR at all. I've been waiting for this moment since I was 13 years old. I get goose bumps every time I see those two in stage together. I'm not gonna let some tempo problems spoil the moment. But it still needs to be addressed. 

 

P.s. Before anyone starts bashing me, I'm a professional musician who has been earning a living playing live for more than 20 years. If there's something I know is that when playing live, even though the drummer is the most capable of affecting the speed, the tempo is every band member's responsibility. 

Great post! Maybe it really is the nerves. And no its not that bad it would ruin anything, but just cant ignore it on couple of songs. Anyone noticed how much Duff goes to frank during the songs, he is really trying to keep it together. 

[bigpoop]

I think that's just sort of part of Duff's stage routine. He does it all the time in any band I've seen him in.

[SWINGTRADER]

12 minutes ago, pomponio said:

Angus young is exactly the third party I was thinking about. Let's hope for the Ac/Dc thing to be a positive influence on him. 

There is no way Angus Young would stick his nose in GNR business unless Axl asked him for his input, and we all know that is not happening.

 

[ludurigan]

3 hours ago, xBrownstonex said:

What "shit" you talking about?

 

i am talking about the shitty speedy versions of guns n roses songs that we are listening on this threeunion tour

i know a lot of people find it "fresh ad exciting"

i know a lot of people think "guns n roses is back"

i know a lot of people say that "frank and richard are doing a great job"

i know a lot of people believe that "richard and slash are a great combo"

you got to be kidding

...

yeah, its nice to see axl, slash and duff together

its nice that they seem to be in good terms

its awesome that they are playing coma, that axl voice seems to be better etc etc etc 

i can understand everyone being really excited at the shows

but these speedy versions sounds like shit

and i am 100%% sure that if izzy and steven were in the band this would never happen because it would sound like guns n roses

[Kosonen]

14 minutes ago, bigpoop said:

I think that's just sort of part of Duff's stage routine. He does it all the time in any band I've seen him in.

Yeah, must be. Kinda hes job. Drummer bassist thing. Maybe over thinking here...

Edited April 18, 2016 by Kosonen

[SWINGTRADER]

9 minutes ago, ludurigan said:

 

i am talking about the shitty speedy versions of guns n roses songs that we are listening on this threeunion tour

i know a lot of people find it "fresh ad exciting"

i know a lot of people think "guns n roses is back"

i know a lot of people say that "frank and richard are doing a great job"

i know a lot of people believe that "richard and slash are a great combo"

you got to be kidding

...

yeah, its nice to see axl, slash and duff together

its nice that they seem to be in good terms

its awesome that they are playing coma, that axl voice seems to be better etc etc etc 

i can understand everyone being really excited at the shows

but these speedy versions sounds like shit

and i am 100%% sure that if izzy and steven were in the band this would never happen because it would sound like guns n roses

Exactly.

What is the point of having a reunited GNR if they are not going to perform like Guns n'Roses. This is why having Steven Adler was so important. Even having Matt Sorum would have avoided this. I was afraid something like this would happen, and that is one of the main reason why so many people wanted Adler to be a part this. We wanted to listen to these songs the way they were originally played. I have also noticed Slash's guitar tone is different. That doesn't bother me as much as the drumming, but it is noticeable.

[ludurigan]

1 hour ago, SmellThePoppies said:

You people are insane. You finally have Slash , Duff and Axl on the same stage and need to nitpick everything. There is just no winning.

oh yes there is

there is winning when axl, slash and duff get their shit together with izzy

and when they get rid of all axl solo-era hired musicians and make new guns n roses music

thats winning and you will know when it happens

the threeunion is step one, its all right

we can all wait a little longer since we been waiting for TWENTY FIVE YEARS now

(yeah, 25 years, not 23)

hopefully they are smart enough to do some winning in the next couple of years

[Smokin' Cigarettes]

I'm constantly asking myself if the tempo is faster or if the band is just tighter than we're used to it being over the years.

AFD is a pretty fast paced record.  I always kinda thought the bands over the years played them a little slow.

[PirateRadio]

There was a point in Vegas 4/8 when I stood there and thought... "The drums are too fast!!" I wanted to run somewhere like a guy scrambling to put out a fire.

 

It was a weird night.  I hear the bassline in ISE, and I swear that Slash's guitar was not ready to be played when that song started. Does any one have video of this? If I remember correctly, Slash wasn't even on stage when the song started, and it didn't seem like one of those "special entry" type things either. He walked out with no guitar, and then turned around, and the tech put the strap over his shoulder.

 

Then Axl completely skips the second verse on Brownstone. Didn't even raise the mike. And he just sitting there on that high throne, and Duff and Slash look at him like, wtf? At that point, I thought the whole show was going to hell in a slingshot. Don't forget that very few people knew Axl would be rolled out on that guitar throne. For the rest of us, it was a real circus watching him be pushed out straight across from stage right and spun to face center. THEN, the throne completely blocks out the entire drum set for at least the first 5 songs hahaha. Crazy.

 

DTJ was jammin. But then Rocket Queen was drummed by a guy on too much crystal meth. A guy on a regular dose of crystal meth would probably have been just fine.

 

Well, Frank must have passed the cheese to Slash because he played SCOM at a lightening speed, and I thought the song would be over in three minutes.

 

As they say in golf, the three most important words are tempo, tempo, tempo.

Edited April 18, 2016 by PirateRadio

[uncivil war]

Um...to all the people blaming Frank, you do realise that the rest of the band can communicate with him while the show is going on. 

Its not like they are there, praying for the show to finish so they can tell him to slow down next show. 

If they thought he was getting carried away, they would deal with it on the spot, during the song.  Duff would pull him into time, as he did with Steve during his final days with the band.

[PirateRadio]

9 minutes ago, uncivil war said:

Um...to all the people blaming Frank, you do realise that the rest of the band can communicate with him while the show is going on. 

Its not like they are there, praying for the show to finish so they can tell him to slow down next show. 

If they thought he was getting carried away, they would deal with it on the spot, during the song.  Duff would pull him into time, as he did with Steve during his final days with the band.

 

I noticed Axl having long extended conversations with the band throughout the night. He was doing a lot of talking, and band members were looking back at him acknowledging what he was saying. There's not doubt he was trying to get things under control.

Edited April 18, 2016 by PirateRadio

[Nosaj Thing]

As much as I think Frank is a mediocre drummer who has no business playing with Slash and Duff, I can't blame him for the speed of the songs.  I had the same issue with Slash's band.  If you analyze how fast he's been playing the songs at his recent shows with Conspirators, you will see that they're almost the same.  Paradise City being the most obvious one, but you can notice that in Welcome to the Jungle, too.  Hell, his Serial Killer song from Snakepit II used to be around 7 minutes, he made it a 5-minute-long song when performed with Myles.  He destroyed the song for me - in a bad way.

I hate to say it but it is Slash the one who has issues with tempo.  I have noticed this during November Rain and Estranged, he's rushing the solos because it's easier for him to noddle, rather than keeping the melody on point.  I would like to think that it's not an issue and they are rushing the songs deliberately, but anyone can tell that faster versions are shit compared to originals.  I find hard to believe that somehow, they are the only ones who think the songs sound better that way?

The problem with Frank is, that being the absolutely awful drummer that he is, he doesn't know how to keep his drumming clean in a faster version of a song, making it seem that he's all over the place.  It is what happens during Rocket Queen, for example.  A far superior drummer, Brent Fitz, knows how to - that's why people who attended Slash's shows didn't complain about this until now.  I guess.

[SidneyWish]

I think the drummer probably won't last long with this new line up, he's kinda the weak link.

Adler won't come back though, he's too damaged. He was already 26 years ago that's why he had to go.

They won't get Topper Headon obviously, so it leaves either a new guy, or Sorum to be back.

Edited April 18, 2016 by SidneyWish