GNR Women's discussion

[MillionsOfSpiders]

The big 3 can't sit together and do an interview. It's pretty sad!! 

I can't see where Axl's personal trainer is in Japan yet ??? Slash's bodyguard is though. 

[Frey]

27 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

... yeah but my mind again goes back to the CBGB video in which both Izzy and Duff can be seen laughing a singing along to the song. You can't see Slash's reaction cuz he's turned away. In fact Steven was the only one that looked a little bummed out (though that could have been due to him not having much to do other than shaking that tambourine). Their body language and the looks on their faces read to me as, "I can't believe we're getting away with it!"

Idk, I have really mixed feeling on the matter...

Yeah, it's been a long time since I watched that video, but I know what you mean. I have mixed feelings too.

 

14 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

I can't cope with people who think anyone from fake GnR is better than anyone from real GnR. It blows my mind that those fans exist 

Yeah, I mean I like CD and everything and would want to hear the rest of the material, but Jesus H. Christ, why would anyone want Buckethead, Finck or Bumble when you can have Slash. Or Fortus when you could have Izzy.

They aren't GNR and never will be. I feel zero connection to them as musicians or people and don't really give a fuck about them.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 19, 2017 by Frey

[killuridols]

1 hour ago, Frey said:

?????

Axl thought MJ was a pedophile (and he probably really was).

If my close friend whom I'd told all about my life and traumas went and knowingly supported or worked with a guy like that, I'd be hurt and disappointed too. And I'm in no way a sensitive little flower like Axl.

It's just a really shitty move to pull on a friend. Especially if all you get out of it is a TV or something. Wasn't that another thing Axl apparently couldn't understand according to Goldstein? That Slash went to play with MJ and all he got for it was a flatscreen TV. In Axl's dramatic mind, this is bound to look like "A fucking flatscreen TV is more important to him than all my pain and suffering."

But at that point was Slash a real good friend of Axl?

Not sure how close they were in 1991 or 1992.... By that time, the band was imploding, even if on the outside it looked like they were the kings of the universe.

I don't buy the MJ thing THAT much.... To me, it is also jealousy from Axl.

Why are people talking about MJ as some piece of shit musician? He was on the top of the world in 1992 TOO. He was really popular back then, why Slash wouldn't collaborate with the number one pop artist of the 80's and 90's??

I'm sorry for Axl but an opportunity like that I wouldn't let go if I was a musician and even though I DO THINK MJ was indeed a pedophile, without proof and shit I'm not sure why Slash would have to go those lengths to refuse working with him, just because of Axl.

Axl is a fucking idiot because he could have collaborated with a lot of more important artists when he was on his prime, but he did NOTHING but sit on his ass to whine about women and people he pushed away from himself by his own shitty actions.

 

45 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

I wish he would talk more about it as well. But at the same time I think... what would be the point of talking now? In the past 20 years whenever Axl has spoken about it, his words were ridiculed. Even after last year's resurgence, Axl is thought of as a bit of a joke (even by his fans). Besides, there are too many people that have come forward with their accounts of what happened back then and a lot of them corroborate each other. So I feel that now it's got the point that unless Axl comes out and agrees to all the stuff everyone else has said, if his account of that time deviates even a little bit, he will be mocked and brushed aside as a delusional egomaniac.

I've always thought that jealousy was a big part of it. But if I give Axl the benefit of doubt, maybe rather than jealousy Axl thought Slash was working with people that Axl didn't respect and thought were beneath their station...

"I never said that I was bitter," Rose explains, characteristically concerned with making fine distinctions. "Hurt, yeah. Disappointed. I mean, with Slash, I remember crying about all kinds of things in my life, but I had never felt hot, burning tears … hot, burning tears of anger. Basically, to me, it was because I am watching this guy and I don't understand it. Playing with everyone from Space Ghost to Michael Jackson. I don't get it. I wanted the world to love and respect him. I just watched him throw it away." - Axl Speaks (Rolling Stone, Jan 2000)

 

"watched him throw it away"

what fucking drugs did he take when he said those things??

 

Does he realize what Slash has become?? He's more famous and respected than Axl himself.

Does Axl HEAR the audience from the NITL tour??? Does he actually hear how much recognition, chanting and applause Slash gets?

It makes me cringe when I read those kind of things from Axl.

Shows how out of touch he was and he's been all this time. Like the guy doesn't live in this world

[Zoot]

31 minutes ago, Jane M. said:

That Fortus thread is getting better and better, if you like trainwrecks as much as I do. 

The one about Tommy is second close. Great competition.

They're pretty lit!

 

[Fansince88]

1 minute ago, Kris_1989 said:

They're pretty lit!

 

LOL...

[KiraMPD]

2 minutes ago, killuridols said:

"watched him throw it away"

what fucking drugs did he take when he said those things??

 

Does he realize what Slash has become?? He's more famous and respected than Axl himself.

Does Axl HEAR the audience from the NITL tour??? Does he actually hear how much recognition, chanting and applause Slash gets?

It makes me cringe when I read those kind of things from Axl.

Shows how out of touch he was and he's been all this time. Like the guy doesn't live in this world

See this is precisely why an autobiography from Axl would serve no purpose! His P.O.V is wildly different from that of everyone else and any future statements he makes, any autobiography he releases would likely be more of the same and would be just as difficult to take seriously... 

[Frey]

16 minutes ago, killuridols said:

But at that point was Slash a real good friend of Axl?

Not sure how close they were in 1991 or 1992.... By that time, the band was imploding, even if on the outside it looked like they were the kings of the universe.

I don't buy the MJ thing THAT much.... To me, it is also jealousy from Axl.

Why are people talking about MJ as some piece of shit musician? He was on the top of the world in 1992 TOO. He was really popular back then, why Slash wouldn't collaborate with the number one pop artist of the 80's and 90's??

I'm sorry for Axl but an opportunity like that I wouldn't let go if I was a musician and even though I DO THINK MJ was indeed a pedophile, without proof and shit I'm not sure why Slash would have to go those lengths to refuse working with him, just because of Axl.

Axl is a fucking idiot because he could have collaborated with a lot of more important artists when he was on his prime, but he did NOTHING but sit on his ass to whine about women and people he pushed away from himself by his own shitty actions.

 

"watched him throw it away"

what fucking drugs did he take when he said those things??

 

Does he realize what Slash has become?? He's more famous and respected than Axl himself.

Does Axl HEAR the audience from the NITL tour??? Does he actually hear how much recognition, chanting and applause Slash gets?

It makes me cringe when I read those kind of things from Axl.

Shows how out of touch he was and he's been all this time. Like the guy doesn't live in this world

 

I wouldn't say Slash was a really good friend of Axl's in the classic sense of the word by that point, but they used to be close and there was a lot of emotional tension between them (especially from Axl's side). I mean they definitely weren't really "friends" anymore by the time Slash left, and Axl was still deeply affected by Slash leaving him. The crying, the suicide attmepts,...

I don't see the jealousy thing. Axl has a very screwed up unique view of the world (as he has frequently demonstrated) and in his mind Slash probably was throwing "something" away (whatever that may have been in Axl's mind). And Axl's always lived in a different world, even before GNR. I don't expect that to change anytime soon

 

8 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

See this is precisely why an autobiography from Axl would serve no purpose! His P.O.V is wildly different from that of everyone else and any future statements he makes, any autobiography he releases would likely be more of the same and would be just as difficult to take seriously... 

I disagree. That's exactly why I want his autobiography. I'm sure it would be a fascinating read.

I don't really care if other people will take it seriously or not, I prefer to draw my own conclusions anyway.

 

 

Edited January 19, 2017 by Frey

[Tori72]

Oh yeah, the MJ collaboration brought Slash attention from outside the rock n roll world. Popmusic and Rock were more like opponents back then than anything else. I am sure that a lot of people got to know Slash in 92 through MJ. 

The OIAM discussion. I always felt dissapointed with GnR guys that they let the song happend. I don't believe at all, that the others really tried to convince Axl to leave it. Those were the 80ies. There was no pc, everyday racism was everywhere. People talked like that. Only Axl had to go and make it even more blunt, more aggressive, more exeggerated, more more. Maybe he tried to be "funny" and sarcastic but it is just not. So long comment short: I dislike OIAM lyricwise.

10 minutes ago, killuridols said:

I'm sorry for Axl but an opportunity like that I wouldn't let go if I was a musician and even though I DO THINK MJ was indeed a pedophile, without proof and shit I'm not sure why Slash would have to go those lengths to refuse working with him, just because of Axl.

Axl is a fucking idiot because he could have collaborated with a lot of more important artists when he was on his prime, but he did NOTHING but sit on his ass to whine about women and people he pushed away from himself by his own shitty actions.

And the collaboration of Axl and other artists that did not happen. I would have loved to see Axl bringing his creativity together with other artists, make himself a name as musician, songwriter etc. But no, he was way to simple minded (in lack of another word) for that. Simple minded not in terms of intelligent  but in terms like long-term thinking. But he obviously could not see how important it would have been to stick his head outside the GnR world and get connected creatively. His voice is so volatile as is or was his lyric-writing. Missed chances, so many of them.

[Rocketqueen76]

8 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

See this is precisely why an autobiography from Axl would serve no purpose! His P.O.V is wildly different from that of everyone else and any future statements he makes, any autobiography he releases would likely be more of the same and would be just as difficult to take seriously... 

And we wonder why the man is still a virtual recluse. You're right that whatever he says won't be taken seriously because he's been the public's favorite asshole to ridicule, and no matter what is said he'll come of as being bitter, jealous and a liar.

[Jane M.]

19 minutes ago, Kris_1989 said:

They're pretty lit!

 

They're on fleek.

[MillionsOfSpiders]

8 minutes ago, Rocketqueen76 said:

And we wonder why the man is still a virtual recluse. You're right that whatever he says won't be taken seriously because he's been the public's favorite asshole to ridicule, and no matter what is said he'll come of as being bitter, jealous and a liar.

It would help Axl a whole lot if he admitted to being wrong or doing wrong, ever. Not all the damn time, but y'know, for things he did wrong  

I think most people would give him a fair chance, we do when he does interviews. The reactions from the China Exchange were mostly positive and I can't recall anyone accusing him of lying or ridiculing him. 

The Duff and Axl one though...bullshit  

Edited January 19, 2017 by MillionsOfSpiders

[killuridols]

15 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

See this is precisely why an autobiography from Axl would serve no purpose! His P.O.V is wildly different from that of everyone else and any future statements he makes, any autobiography he releases would likely be more of the same and would be just as difficult to take seriously... 

It's still his word and his POV, which is important I think, even if its all a delusion.

I'd love to read it and then I can think if he's being ridiculous or what but I don't think he's all the time ridiculous.

His view is limited and ignorant, but it is interesting because that's what makes him who he is.

[Tori72]

Ah, i wanted to ask, who said it? Why cant the big 3 not be seated in an interview together? So Slash and Axl still can't talk?

[Padme]

42 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

I can't cope with people who think anyone from fake GnR is better than anyone from real GnR. It blows my mind that those fans exist 

Maybe because they missed those shows. They were either babies or were not even born. They didn't experience in their hey day. And they also grew up during a different time. When the music turned to Rap, pop divas and pseudo rock bands.

Or they just can't deal with the fact that things with that experiment of a band didn't turn up well at all. What I don't understand is why they spend a lot of money in this current tour when they don't like the current line up that much. And why they are here? Maybe they should be in a Finck, Tommy or Buckethead forum.

[Jane M.]

8 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

It would help Axl a whole lot if he admitted to being wrong or doing wrong, ever. Not all the damn time, but y'know, for things he did wrong  

That would be very nice. Not happening. LOL

6 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

Ah, i wanted to ask, who said it? Why cant the big 3 not be seated in an interview together? So Slash and Axl still can't talk?

Do you want the NITL miracle to be over?

Edited January 19, 2017 by Jane M.

[Rocketqueen76]

About OIAM from a black woman's POV....the first time I heard it I was like whoa! Are they serious with this song? I mean, I love this band and they are calling their black fans like me the N word? At first I thought they were trying to be funny or sarcastic, even though it wasn't at all. But over time I realized that the song was being told from a third person POV. Those issues were real in the Reagan era and free base and crack were just really starting to hit the streets hard so people were hustling all types of shit to get their fix. Lots of people were fleeing other countries to come to America and many didn't like it. With that being said, I am in no way condoning the use of the prejudice and racial slurs he chose to use to make up the lyrics of the song. I don't care for the song because I feel that by releasing that song, they alienated a part of their fan base that they didn't even truly know existed. Maybe if the 80's had been more PC, that song would not have made on Lies...or at the very least some of the content of the song would have been changed.

[killuridols]

5 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

It would help Axl a whole lot if he admitted to being wrong or doing wrong, ever. Not all the damn time, but y'know, for things he did wrong  

I think most people would give him a fair chance, we do when he does interviews. The reactions from the China Exchange were mostly positive and I can't recall anyone accusing him of lying or ridiculing him. 

The Duff and Axl one though...bullshit  

Exactly.

Axl has never shown ANY sign of being humbled by anything. He's never humble or admitted wrong to anything and that's why people dislike him.

For getting late to shows, he's always had an excuse. A stupid one. He's even blamed it on the audience and made people feel like idiots for having normal jobs or having to get up early the next day or not having a car and having to depend on public transportation to get back home.

So he deserves what he gets when he's being a jerk.

If he'd shown another side of himself to the world I'm sure lots of people would forgive him or be less demanding of him.

Look at what he's done with AC/DC. He did his job and not only once he pulled his BS. Most people loved him and the shows went great.

[Rocketqueen76]

I guess I'm in the minority on this, because I don't think anyone deserves to be treated so badly. Should he own up to his mistakes....Hell yeah he should. Should he humble himself....damn right. Do we as fans make it difficult for him to do these things....maybe. Honestly how many would call bullshit on an Axl Rose apology? The answer is plenty because it wouldn't be viewed as sincere....only placating.

[KiraMPD]

1 hour ago, Frey said:

I disagree. That's exactly why I want his autobiography. I'm sure it would be a fascinating read.

I don't really care if other people will take it seriously or not, I prefer to draw my own conclusions anyway.

I would love to read his autobiography as well for those exact reasons but my point is that it would not be taken seriously by most fans. During the CD-years there were certain fans that would say that they would like to hear things from his perspective but the rare times he did do a interview, those same fans would dismiss it as ridiculous. 

So I wonder, why would he even bother releasing a book from his P.O.V? Just to sate our sick curiosity...? We may think it's "interesting" but would we believe any of it? Why would he publish it if he thinks no one will believe him? This is the sort of feeling I get when I try to put myself in Axl's shoes.

 

1 hour ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

It would help Axl a whole lot if he admitted to being wrong or doing wrong, ever. Not all the damn time, but y'know, for things he did wrong  

I think most people would give him a fair chance, we do when he does interviews. The reactions from the China Exchange were mostly positive and I can't recall anyone accusing him of lying or ridiculing him. 

The Duff and Axl one though...bullshit  

But it doesn't seem like Axl feels that he did wrong (though he does admit to being an asshole), so I doubt fans would be satisfied by what Axl has to say. Unless he has a had a drastic epiphany, I doubt his POV will ever change. As far as the CE interview, I could pull up about a dozen or more posts calling it bullshit if I could be bothered. In fact I think the only reason people weren't harsher on him for that interview was because the interviewer came across as a bigger asshole (which is quite a feat ).

 

1 hour ago, Rocketqueen76 said:

And we wonder why the man is still a virtual recluse. You're right that whatever he says won't be taken seriously because he's been the public's favorite asshole to ridicule, and no matter what is said he'll come of as being bitter, jealous and a liar.

Pretty much. 

Edited January 19, 2017 by KiraMPD

[killuridols]

7 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

I would love to read his autobiography as well for those exact reasons but my point is that it would not be taken seriously by most fans. During the CD-years there were certain fans that would say that they would like to hear things from his perspective but the rare times he did do a interview, those same fans would dismiss it as ridiculous. 

So I wonder, why would he even bother releasing a book from his P.O.V? Just to sate our sick curiosity...? We may think it's "interesting" but would be believe any of it? Why would he publish it if he thinks no one will believe him? This is the sort of feeling I get when I try to put myself in Axl's shoes.

But it's doesn't seem like Axl feels that he did wrong (though he does admit to being an asshole), so I doubt fans would be satisfied by what Axl has to say. Unless he has a had a drastic epiphany, I doubt his POV will ever change. As far as the CE interview, I could pull up about a dozen or more posts calling it bullshit if I could be bothered. In fact I think the only reason people weren't harsher on him for that interview was because the interviewer came across as a bigger asshole (which is quite a feat ).

Who cares about the fans?

There are a lot of stuff written by fans and non fans out there. We already know what that opinion is about. Now I want to read what he has to say and I dont care what it is.

If people or artists are going to shut down just becasue someone reacts to their output then what will this world become into?

I see no logic in him not writting an autobiography because of those reasons. At this point in his life, and not only him, it happens to a regular Joe too, that people will always talk about what you do or say. Have an opinion on your life but what are you gonna do? Stop going out because of that? Grown up people face whatever and move on. Adult people do not care about these things. Mature people say "ok, I'm sorry, LOL" and keep on doing what they were doing.

Being a coward is the worst you can be. Running away and isolating just because people say shit about you is the behavior of a child.

Why can't he stop being a child for once and face the world, the fans or whoever.... After all, he's just a fucking singer, not a serial killer or a politician who's started a war or left people in total poverty.

Maybe that's the problem with Axl. He thinks he's too much and that he's more important than he really is.

 

[BlueJean Baby]

47 minutes ago, Frey said:

 

 

I disagree. That's exactly why I want his autobiography. I'm sure it would be a fascinating read.

I don't really care if other people will take it seriously or not, I prefer to draw my own conclusions anyway.

 

 

I really wish he would write one. I would take it seriously because it would be from his point of view. He was going through some rough shit back then on top of the band imploding, can't blame him for being more sensitive to everything going on. I have always truly felt that he is terribly misunderstood by most people...like the old saying goes you don't understand things until you have walked a mile in the person's shoes.   

 

[Nightrain92]

28 minutes ago, Padme said:

Maybe because they missed those shows. They were either babies or were not even born. They didn't experience in their hey day. And they also grew up during a different time. When the music turned to Rap, pop divas and pseudo rock bands.

Or they just can't deal with the fact that things with that experiment of a band didn't turn up well at all. What I don't understand is why they spend a lot of money in this current tour when they don't like the current line up that much. And why they are here? Maybe they should be in a Finck, Tommy or Buckethead forum.

I wasn't even born when Guns were in their prime but I would NEVER ever say that the hired hands of the CD lineups are better than the original members that created this band! I stopped reading fortus thread cause it was really cringeworthy as I said on it... But I respect your point of view ?

Your questions are also mine..l! Why they continue to go to a lot of shows?? Why they keep posting here most of the times whining about everything?!?

A year ago no one could imagine what we witnessed last year and I'm so happy about the reunion and that slash and a duff are back in the band even if with Izzy and Steven the whole thing would be perfect!!!

 but really can't believe people prefer fink or bucket over slash doing solos that slash created not them.!!! Can understand for CD's songs (even if I think with slash are better) but for guns's songs 

[Frey]

23 minutes ago, Rocketqueen76 said:

I guess I'm in the minority on this, because I don't think anyone deserves to be treated so badly. Should he own up to his mistakes....Hell yeah he should. Should he humble himself....damn right. Do we as fans make it difficult for him to do these things....maybe. Honestly how many would call bullshit on an Axl Rose apology? The answer is plenty because it wouldn't be viewed as sincere....only placating.

Nah, you're not in the minority. A lot of the people I remember as having a lot more patience and empathy for Axl (regular posters like @Andy14, @Lumikki, @stella etc.) are just not here right now, so this thread is full of people with pretty harsh opinions. I used to be one of these people, but the more I read and learn (and the more time I spend on this forum), the more I think that a lot of people are being unnecessarily harsh towards Axl and also pretty unfair and biased in their assessments.

 

 

23 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

I would love to read his autobiography as well for those exact reasons but my point is that it would not be taken seriously by most fans. During the CD-years there were certain fans that would say that they would like to hear things from his perspective but the rare times he did do a interview, those same fans would dismiss it as ridiculous. 

So I wonder, why would he even bother releasing a book from his P.O.V? Just to sate our sick curiosity...? We may think it's "interesting" but would be believe any of it? Why would he publish it if he thinks no one will believe him? This is the sort of feeling I get when I try to put myself in Ax's shoes.

Probably true, unfortunately. Axl does get very upset about people not really listening to him. I remember he was still upset in 2012 (or 2014?) about how people reacted to his Rolling Stone interview (the 1992 one). I was surprised to see him bring that issue up again after so many years. It obviously affected him a lot.

At the same time, Axl is someone who loves to talk and share his thoughts and opinions, so I'm sure a part of him is just itching to present his POV of everything. And I really hope he will one day.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 19, 2017 by Frey

[Tori72]

I agree, I would also like to read it. I always took his interviews as account of his pov. No matter how screwed up that may be. It gives insight into how he sees the world and to what went down.

We will never know "the truth", because the truth hardly exists at all. It is a concept. Even if something just occured recently and everyone remembers correctly, things have different meanings for everyone. Thus situations, actions, reactions, interactions are interpreted differently and so whe have 3 or 5 people and at least 5 very different POVs and interpretations. Especially when drugs, overblown egos and complicated childhood traumas come into play.

I would like to know Axls POV, what he remembers and what it felt like for him. 

[Blackstar]

2 hours ago, Padme said:

How so? Slash has made guest apearences. But he wasn't with MJ 24/7. Slash has collaborated with tons of people. Sounds more like Axl was butthurt because he wasn't getting the same kind of appreciation from other artists

I don't think that Axl was jealous of Slash for this reason then. There's this quote of him:

It’s like the first time I met Slash, I said, “The world’s gotta see this guy.” That’s why when he plays with other people or does solo things it totally gets me off and makes me happy. It secures his place in rock history as a guitarist. [Hit Parader, 1993]

I doesn't seem to me that he was lying here or that he would lie about this thing. He brought it up spontaneously in the interview, he wasn't asked.

Maybe he got jealous later (I mean after the break up), because Slash played with people Axl liked or wanted to collaborate with:

It’s a trip for me to witness as so many of the people he performs with etc he hated then, them, their bands and their music where the others or I were the fans. [Axl Chat, 2008]

2 hours ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

I don't know, he did do some really cool guest appearances back in the day, right up until about 94ish? 

I could see him being jealous of Slash too. Although definitely not with MJ.

Guess we will never know unless like @killuridols says he releases his own book, can't see him doing that though. What's he going to do about all the stories we know about that he'd rather we didn't? 

I think that IF Axl ever releases his book, there won't be any personal and sensitive stuff in there, even things that he has talked about in the past (I doubt he would want to talk about his childhood again), let alone things he has never talked about (Yoda for example).

2 hours ago, Frey said:

Yeah, Izzy is the only one who seemed legitimately upset and against the song being on the album in interviews.

Duff has always presented a very PC version of the song's origin and meaning to the public (whether he really believed/believes that or not is a different matter).

Steven's frankly too dumb and probably was too high to really have had a meaningful opinion on the matter. And it's not like his opinion would have been taken seriously by the rest of the band anyway.

Duff was in the room when OIAM was written, with West Arkeen, possibly Del, etc. Axl has said that they were all laughing and joking about it. So maybe either this is really Duff's account of the meaning of the song or he came up with this interpretation because later he was ashamed for being there. Regardless of whether he believes it or not, Duff's version contradicts, at least to some extent, what Axl himself said; even as a 'character study' song, it's driven from Axl's own experiences. I do believe though, judging from the CBGB's performance, that it was initially written as a joke as Axl said, kind of like Used To Love Her.

Edited January 19, 2017 by Blackstar