Axls_Moustache_Rules Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 (edited) There's a choir hidden underneath the guitar solo on TIL Prostitute sounds awesome stripped back...Definitely can hear the "fire and ice" description a bit more. The stripped back versions of the songs from the Rockland files are very good if not better than what's on the album. Edited August 1, 2016 by Axls_Moustache_Rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjlgnr Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 2 hours ago, Jw224 said: I'm afraid it is a subjective matter, just because you don't like that people have a different opinion than you doesn't mean you can just try and act like yours is fact, you seem like someone who can't fathom the idea of people not thinking like you do. I don't mind that CD songs are on the set list, although I wish they'd stop doing better, he can't sing that song well live anymore. I do think CD is a masterpiece honestly, I can listen to it all the way through and enjoy every moment. I agree a lot of people think differently but that doesn't mean that my opinion is wrong, it is just that, an opinion, not fact. You seem to think that just because you're in the majority it makes the minority's opinion irrelevant or somehow conclusively wrong, that's not how it works. It is not subjective. Were it subjective, I could confidently announce that I just released my "masterpiece" albums "Fart Volume I" and "Fart Volume II" as I read your post. My opinion that my "Fart" albums were "masterpieces" would be as valid as your opinion about Chinese Democracy, or, an actual valid opinion: "Appetite for Destruction" IS a masterpiece. You can't have it both ways: Either my "Farts" are just as much a masterpiece as Chinese Democracy, or this is an objective question & CD isn't a masterpiece. P.S. I can listen to my farts all the way through and enjoy every moment.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhazUp Posted August 1, 2016 Share Posted August 1, 2016 (edited) 17 minutes ago, sjlgnr said: It is not subjective. Were it subjective, I could confidently announce that I just released my "masterpiece" albums "Fart Volume I" and "Fart Volume II" as I read your post. My opinion that my "Fart" albums were "masterpieces" would be as valid as your opinion about Chinese Democracy, or, an actual valid opinion: "Appetite for Destruction" IS a masterpiece. You can't have it both ways: Either my "Farts" are just as much a masterpiece as Chinese Democracy, or this is an objective question & CD isn't a masterpiece. P.S. I can listen to my farts all the way through and enjoy every moment.... The only thing thing that isn't subjective is that people's use of the term "masterpiece" is subjective. "a work of outstanding artistry, skill, or workmanship" is the formal definition of the term, and artistry is inherently subjective. I don't even consider CD to be a masterpiece personally, I just have never seen someone so against people thinking it is Edited August 1, 2016 by WhazUp 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sosso Posted August 2, 2016 Share Posted August 2, 2016 Has anyone else noticed the rustle of waves at the end of Prostitute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6lake sa66ath Posted August 3, 2016 Share Posted August 3, 2016 Man, the whole process is so fucking maddening and I'm only up to reading halfway through '99! I just can't believe Axl got away with it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjlgnr Posted August 4, 2016 Share Posted August 4, 2016 In response to: WhazUp's statement: " The only thing thing that isn't subjective is that people's use of the term "masterpiece" is subjective. "a work of outstanding artistry, skill, or workmanship" is the formal definition of the term, and artistry is inherently subjective." You have the definition wrong: The historical definition of Masterpiece is "A piece of work by a craftsman accepted as qualification for membership of a guild as an acknowledged master." http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/masterpiece From that, the modern usage of "an artist or craftsman's best piece of work" and "work of outstanding artistry, skill, or workmanship" is derived. Chinese Democracy is not an accepted masterpiece by Rock N' Roll peers or by respected critics. Not even close. So it doesn't meet the historical test of masterpiece. Also, your reasoning is circular: You're claiming that Masterpiece is subjective because it is art, which you assume is subjective. Just not true. Beethoven's Fifth is a masterpiece, period. You can argue all you want and never change that. End of Story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhazUp Posted August 4, 2016 Share Posted August 4, 2016 12 minutes ago, sjlgnr said: In response to: WhazUp's statement: " The only thing thing that isn't subjective is that people's use of the term "masterpiece" is subjective. "a work of outstanding artistry, skill, or workmanship" is the formal definition of the term, and artistry is inherently subjective." You have the definition wrong: The historical definition of Masterpiece is "A piece of work by a craftsman accepted as qualification for membership of a guild as an acknowledged master." http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/masterpiece From that, the modern usage of "an artist or craftsman's best piece of work" and "work of outstanding artistry, skill, or workmanship" is derived. Chinese Democracy is not an accepted masterpiece by Rock N' Roll peers or by respected critics. Not even close. So it doesn't meet the historical test of masterpiece. Also, your reasoning is circular: You're claiming that Masterpiece is subjective because it is art, which you assume is subjective. Just not true. Beethoven's Fifth is a masterpiece, period. You can argue all you want and never change that. End of Story. You must be very fun at dinner parties Like holy shit dude this is the most trite argument I have ever seen, people use the term masterpiece to describe things and if you can't deal with that I don't know what to tell ya 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxpax Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) On 1.8.2016 at 4:00 AM, eggers said: Something having a lot of layers does not make it a "masterpiece". Chinese is for the most part a jumbled unfinished mess, there are some good (a couple of great) songs in there but they are buried deep under a lot of unnecessary shit. I like the album and each time I listen it's better than I remember but a masterpiece it is not. One should never confuse complexity with brilliance. AFD and a couple of UYI songs are musically perfect. Just on the edge to 'overproduced'. I can hear little moments of perfection in CD too, but not even one single song is perfect or even very good. Its, as you said correctly, a mess of interesting ideas. Is the guy who made this vid a member of this board? I would love to hear two versions of sympathy for the devil. One with only Slash on it. And one with only Tobias on it. But I don't know if it's even possible to filter slash and Tobias. Edited August 6, 2016 by maxpax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex789 Posted September 7, 2016 Share Posted September 7, 2016 On August 6, 2016 at 10:47 AM, maxpax said: AFD and a couple of UYI songs are musically perfect. Just on the edge to 'overproduced'. I can hear little moments of perfection in CD too, but not even one single song is perfect or even very good. Its, as you said correctly, a mess of interesting ideas. Is the guy who made this vid a member of this board? I would love to hear two versions of sympathy for the devil. One with only Slash on it. And one with only Tobias on it. But I don't know if it's even possible to filter slash and Tobias. I second this! Let's hear a Filtered version of Sympathy For The Devil... Would love to hear Axl's vocals isolated as well.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good, Fuck'n, Night. Posted September 7, 2016 Share Posted September 7, 2016 On 01/08/2016 at 2:04 PM, sjlgnr said: It is not subjective. Were it subjective, I could confidently announce that I just released my "masterpiece" albums "Fart Volume I" and "Fart Volume II" as I read your post. My opinion that my "Fart" albums were "masterpieces" would be as valid as your opinion about Chinese Democracy, or, an actual valid opinion: "Appetite for Destruction" IS a masterpiece. You can't have it both ways: Either my "Farts" are just as much a masterpiece as Chinese Democracy, or this is an objective question & CD isn't a masterpiece. P.S. I can listen to my farts all the way through and enjoy every moment.... That, all fucking day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melonhead87 Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 (edited) The thing is if he peeled back some of these layers to let some of the song breath, it could have been a much more encapsulating album. The potential was there. As is, CD is definitely a grower, but I could see Axl getting lost on not knowing where to end the whole production and it resulting in a muddled album(hence the perfectionist Axl is known as). I still have a soft spot for some of the songs, but songs like Scraped, Riad, IRS I would probably never listen to again. Street of Dreams, Catcher, This I Love, Prostitute, Madagascar (different version), Better, There Was a Time are all staples though IMO Edited September 8, 2016 by melonhead87 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Holographic Universe Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 1 hour ago, melonhead87 said: The thing is if he peeled back some of these layers to let some of the song breath, it could have been a much more encapsulating album. The potential was there. As is, CD is definitely a grower, but I could see Axl getting lost on not knowing where to end the whole production and it resulting in a muddled album(hence the perfectionist Axl is known as). I still have a soft spot for some of the songs, but songs like Scraped, Riad, IRS I would probably never listen to again. Street of Dreams, Catcher, This I Love, Prostitute, Madagascar (different version), Better, There Was a Time are all staples though IMO Scraped could have been a good song. That opening vocal thing is horrible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timoteo Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 the part where axl clears his throat is LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auad Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 very good topic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyryan Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 On 7/7/2016 at 3:55 PM, Sosso said: I prefer the album version. Probably because Finck and Buckethead are my favourite GN'R guitarists. But Bumble's remix is way better than the one from DJ. Anyone have a link to this version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyryan Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Actually im gonna ask a big one here, any links to any if not all different versions of CD songs would be so appreciated. Ive seen some fan remixes of songs like Better and Street of Dreams and id love to see more alike just with the band actually making the changes. I bought appetite as a 10 yr old and have been hookes since. When CD came out my local radio station played the first three tracks live on air. Axls voice coming through the speakers gave me chills man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hudsonsaul Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 (edited) On 7/5/2016 at 7:24 AM, xBrownstonex said: Just started watching this, and only a few seconds in......is that auto tune I hear on Bach's vocals w/ Sorry? EDIT: Ignore my comment - i see someone mentioned this on page one. My bad. Edited September 9, 2016 by hudsonsaul Comment already made by other member / removed youtube clip in quote msg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modano09 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Literally nobody in the world liked Chinese Democracy. Not one single person. Anyone who claims they do is just doing it to be different or because they're mindless Axl sheep. Chinese Democracy is pure evil and to blame for everything that's wrong with GNR today. They didn't play Yesterday's at the show you went to? Because they had to play those Chinese Democracy songs! Adler's not the full time drummer? Chinese Democracy is so bad having to hear those songs live might drive him to drink! Izzy's not around? Chinese Democracy is so horrid that if he's going to humiliate himself playing it he deserves as much money as he wants. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoSoRose Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 3 minutes ago, Modano09 said: Literally nobody in the world liked Chinese Democracy. Not one single person. Anyone who claims they do is just doing it to be different or because they're mindless Axl sheep. Chinese Democracy is pure evil and to blame for everything that's wrong with GNR today. They didn't play Yesterday's at the show you went to? Because they had to play those Chinese Democracy songs! Adler's not the full time drummer? Chinese Democracy is so bad having to hear those songs live might drive him to drink! Izzy's not around? Chinese Democracy is so horrid that if he's going to humiliate himself playing it he deserves as much money as he wants. What the fuck 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modano09 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Just now, ZoSoRose said: What the fuck Every time a song isn't played or someone who people want in the band isn't there I hear how it's because of those Chinese Democracy songs Axl "makes" everyone play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caught_in_a_Coma Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 12 minutes ago, Modano09 said: Literally nobody in the world liked Chinese Democracy. Not one single person. Anyone who claims they do is just doing it to be different or because they're mindless Axl sheep. Chinese Democracy is pure evil and to blame for everything that's wrong with GNR today. They didn't play Yesterday's at the show you went to? Because they had to play those Chinese Democracy songs! Adler's not the full time drummer? Chinese Democracy is so bad having to hear those songs live might drive him to drink! Izzy's not around? Chinese Democracy is so horrid that if he's going to humiliate himself playing it he deserves as much money as he wants. You know, I like Yesterdays. I think it's an objectively great song, I should love it. But I don't. Maybe it will grow on me but if you cut out the songs considered filler AND bad on UYI 2 (Get In The Ring, Shutgun Blues and My World), I think I would place it at the bottom of every other song Estranged You Could Be Mine (I don't care if it was old news by the time the album released, it's still a total classic rock n' roll jam) Civil War Locomotive KOHD Don't Cry Alt Breakdown 14 Years So Fine (guilty pleasure, Duff, Axl and Slash just jam out on this song) Yesterdays/Pretty Tied Up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanity_lost Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 6 minutes ago, Modano09 said: Every time a song isn't played or someone who people want in the band isn't there I hear how it's because of those Chinese Democracy songs Axl "makes" everyone play. I am not sure being overdramatic about it is going to change anyone's mind? I think it will simply make others who are not completely stubborn about their own point of view/opinion even less likely to consider any points you may make even if they are good ones. From what I can tell, heavy sarcasm and over-exaggerating may make you feel better, but it doesn't really do much for discourse. It will just get others' backs up and make them take a harder stance against whatever your position is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Reclamation Project Posted September 9, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted September 9, 2016 23 minutes ago, Modano09 said: Literally nobody in the world liked Chinese Democracy. Not one single person. Anyone who claims they do is just doing it to be different or because they're mindless Axl sheep. Chinese Democracy is pure evil and to blame for everything that's wrong with GNR today. They didn't play Yesterday's at the show you went to? Because they had to play those Chinese Democracy songs! Adler's not the full time drummer? Chinese Democracy is so bad having to hear those songs live might drive him to drink! Izzy's not around? Chinese Democracy is so horrid that if he's going to humiliate himself playing it he deserves as much money as he wants. Did Chinese Democracy bang your girlfriend and steal your car? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caught_in_a_Coma Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 15 minutes ago, Reclamation Project said: Did Chinese Democracy bang your girlfriend and steal your car? I think he was being facetious and trying to show how silly it is that CD is blamed for everything bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 5 hours ago, Reclamation Project said: Did Chinese Democracy bang your girlfriend and steal your car? He was being sarcastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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