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the steven appreciation thread


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1 minute ago, sanity_lost said:

What can I say? I am an optimist at heart.

Can you stretch that interpretation's credibility further if Adler's role is reduced again, playing one half of ''My Michelle'' at concert number one, and the second half of ''My Michelle'' at concert number two? ''Instead of putting the whole song in the same show...they split it between the two shows''?

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Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Can you stretch that interpretation's credibility further if Adler's role is reduced again, playing one half of ''My Michelle'' at concert number one, and the second half of ''My Michelle'' at concert number two? ''Instead of putting the whole song in the same show...they split it between the two shows''?

No. I am going by # of songs. Otherwise it is only one song and two appearances. Two completely separate things. And to clarify, if they played "My Michelle" then turned around and played it again in the same show that would count as two songs as well.

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steven got to play two times in two shows. that's good, no? baby steps, but at this point everything is a bonus.

Axl is losing enthusiam, if his vocals are any indication.

somehow it feels like this thing may implode at any minute now. anyone thinks i'm seeing ghosts?

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Just now, sanity_lost said:

No. I am going by # of songs. Otherwise it is only one song and two appearances. Two completely separate things. And to clarify, if they played "My Michelle" then turned around and played it again in the same show that would count as two songs as well.

Now I am wondering which is better. More appearances or more songs? Which would be better? One song in every show or two songs in every other show Half a song in every show or two songs in every 4th show? (not that he is going to get either, but as in a hypothetical philosophical question.)

1/2 a song every city or two songs every 4th city?

 

 

 

 

 

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If they are insisting on Adler getting scraps, maybe they should vary the song they give him: ''Brownstone'' one night, ''Nightrain'' the next and so forth. Then, through the ingenuity of bootlegging, we can string the Adler performances together and produce a seamless live album by 4/5s of Guns N' Roses - which, is pretty close to bona fide.

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5 hours ago, Asia said:

Seriously, honestly, I don't think that either Slash or Duff ever were or ever will be fighting for Steven, I think they hardly care about him being there and maybe even would rather not have him anywhere round (judging for example by how Slash kept refusing to meet with him and shit like that). I think the only reason why he even is allowed to play this one song is because they knew he would probably commit suicide if they didn't let him which wpuldn't look good image wise and even if not, he would never shut up about it and would be making some horrible marketing for them. So they threw him a little bone just to shut him up and keep him alive, that's it. I don't know if I blame them for that because they had their history with Steven that only they know and I guess it wasn't always pleasant and that we know little of how much unpleasant it would be at times, so I won't be the first to judge them in this respect, but one thing is for sure: since they already threw him that bone and gave him that opportunity, it really wouldn't hurt them or anyone to let him play 3 songs instead of one. All appetite songs are out of the question, the band has a drummer and Steven can't play half of the show but three songs? Really wouldn't hurt nobody.

This is exactly what I'm thinking.

Slash and Duff didn't give a shit about Steven for over two decades (see Steven whining about Slash ignoring him, always being "too busy" to see him and never replying to his messages, etc.), so why would they start now?

Throwing him a small bone like that ensures that Steven is happy and keeps his mouth shut and also doesn't kill himself.

Therefore ensuring that this reunion doesn't get tarnished by Steven running his mouth again and saying unfortunate things or even worse, killing himself. That would be a PR disaster of epic proportions after all.

Cynical view? Yes. But probably true.

 

4 hours ago, Slash787 said:

and what was Duff's problem with Matt? 

Same as Steven. They don't give a fuck about Sorum. Duff even said as much in his book- that he finds Sorum hard to deal with and exhausting or something like that. For Duff, that's practically admitting he can't stand the guy. Slash supposedly hates Sorum too (if that late night visit to Axl's house actually happened the way it was described).

Though in this case I can't blame them. Sorum's a douchebag with an ego way exceeding his importance and he would cause nothing but trouble.

With this whole thing being as tentative as it is, not getting a shit stirrer like Sorum involved who would potentially endanger band relations again is a wise move by Slash and Duff imo.

 

 

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7 minutes ago, Frey said:

This is exactly what I'm thinking.

Slash and Duff didn't give a shit about Steven for over two decades (see Steven whining about Slash ignoring him, always being "too busy" to see him and never replying to his messages, etc.), so why would they start now?

Throwing him a small bone like that ensures that Steven is happy and keeps his mouth shut and also doesn't kill himself.

Therefore ensuring that this reunion doesn't get tarnished by Steven running his mouth again and saying unfortunate things or even worse, killing himself. That would be a PR disaster of epic proportions after all.

Cynical view? Yes. But probably true.

 

Same as Steven. They don't give a fuck about Sorum. Duff even said as much in his book- that he finds Sorum hard to deal with and exhausting or something like that. For Duff, that's practically admitting he can't stand the guy. Slash supposedly hates Sorum too (if that late night visit to Axl's house actually happened the way it was described).

Though in this case I can't blame them. Sorum's a douchebag with an ego way exceeding his importance and he would cause nothing but trouble.

With this whole thing being as tentative as it is, not getting a shit stirrer like Sorum involved who would potentially endanger band relations again is a wise move by Slash and Duff imo.

 

 

Slash was the one who recruited Matt Sorum for Guns N' Roses' drum stool in 1990, and chose to continue working with him for Snakepit #1 (1994 - 5) as well as played with him in Velvet Revolver (2002 - 2008) alongside McKagan. Their musical relationship existed in three different bands! In other words, Slash has spent fifteen active years playing with Matt Sorum. That does not strike me as a man who hates Matt!

 

Edited by DieselDaisy
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Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Slash was the one who recruited Matt Sorum for Guns N' Roses' drum stool in 1990, and chose to continue working with him for Snakepit #1 (1994 - 6) as well as played with him in Velvet Revolver (2002 - 2008) alongside McKagan. Their musical relationship existed in three different bands! In other words, Slash has spent sixteen active years playing with Matt Sorum. That does not strike me as a man who hates Matt!

 

But it's been 8 years since he chose not to work with him anymore. Good chance it's because he was sick of this collaboration and that he still isn't interested in that.

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3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Slash was the one who recruited Matt Sorum for Guns N' Roses' drum stool in 1990, and chose to continue working with him for Snakepit #1 (1994 - 5) as well as played with him in Velvet Revolver (2002 - 2008) alongside McKagan. Their musical relationship existed in three different bands! In other words, Slash has spent fifteen active years playing with Matt Sorum. That does not strike me as a man who hates Matt!

Maybe he just appreciates Sorum as a competent drummer. I certainly have worked with people on multiple projects because I appreciated their skills and competence, even if I didn't like them on a personal level.

Or what @Asia said.

It all comes down to whether you believe that whole late night incident happened as described or not. As I said in another thread, I could see Axl or Beta making the whole thing up, but I could also see Slash drunkenly talking shit about his band mates. Both seem perfectly plausible to me.

 

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1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

If they are insisting on Adler getting scraps, maybe they should vary the song they give him: ''Brownstone'' one night, ''Nightrain'' the next and so forth. Then, through the ingenuity of bootlegging, we can string the Adler performances together and produce a seamless live album by 4/5s of Guns N' Roses - which, is pretty close to bona fide.

That would be awesome. I'd be particularly appreciative if they let him play Mr. Brownstone.

 

 

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Slash played with Matt in Kings of Chaos as recently as a couple years ago, and Duff was still in KOC this time last year . Honestly,  Sorum seems like one of the few people in the GNR universe that isn't  a douchebag. I'm not really  a fan of his drumming but he's an alright guy as far as I can tell. He wouldn't work as much as he does if he were really that much of a dick.

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Sorum's a smug, arrogant, egomaniac prick, but with none of the redeeming qualities that other egomaniac douchebags in the GNR camp (like Slash or Axl) have. And while certainly skilled, also a boring as fuck drummer.

Edited by Frey
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19 minutes ago, bigpoop said:

Slash played with Matt in Kings of Chaos as recently as a couple years ago, and Duff was still in KOC this time last year . Honestly,  Sorum seems like one of the few people in the GNR universe that isn't  a douchebag. I'm not really  a fan of his drumming but he's an alright guy as far as I can tell. He wouldn't work as much as he does if he were really that much of a dick.

I forgot Kings of Chaos. I also forgot Neurotic Outsiders for Duff. That makes it GN'R, Neurotic Outsiders, Snakepit #1, Velvet Revolver and Kings of Chaos, i.e. five separate bands in which either Slash and/or Duff played alongside Matt Sorum - and that is not including one offs like the Hall of Fame. The idea that the first two dislike the latter is clearly preposterous when confronted with facts like this.

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2 minutes ago, Frey said:

Sorum's a smug, arrogant, egomaniac prick, but with none of the redeeming qualities that other egomaniac douchebags in the GNR camp (like Slash or Axl) have. And while certainly skilled, also a boring as fuck drummer.

I'm not actually a keen admirer of his percussion work, but I see no evidence to warrant this onslaught of insults you have unleashed against him. He seems like a fairly reasonable chap to me, albeit his dolphin tweets are rather annoying.

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50 minutes ago, Asia said:

But it's been 8 years since he chose not to work with him anymore. Good chance it's because he was sick of this collaboration and that he still isn't interested in that.

I wouldn't necessarily just assume Slash was literally sick of Matt Sorum's presence lol.  I mean Slash and Duff performed with him in Kings of Chaos, the VR reunion in 2012, the RNRHOF, and many more times since 8 years ago when VR dissolved.  

Plus just because Slash plays with other drummers for example in his solo band that just means he is a musician - musicians don't stick exclusively to the same musicians for their entire lives.  Speaking as a musician, I play with many different drummers for many different projects because variety is good, it has no bearings on my personal opinions of any of their skills or personalities

Edited by WhazUp
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Maybe because he's familiar and they know him well already. If finding a new drummer would have caused them even a fraction of the hassle finding singers for VR caused them, I'd stick with Sorum too.

I don't necessarily view them working together in multiple bands and projects as an indicator of their personal feelings for each other. Izzy supposedly was pissed about Axl following him to L.A. and having to deal with him as well, and yet he kept forming band after band with Axl and continued to write songs with him, with both ultimately ending up in Guns N Roses. Seems his negative feelings towards Axl didn't stop him from being profesionally involved with him either.

9 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I'm not actually a keen admirer of his percussion work, but I see no evidence to warrant this onslaught of insults you have unleashed against him. He seems like a fairly reasonable chap to me, albeit his dolphin tweets are rather annoying.

While he may strike you as a fairly reasonable chap, he strikes me as what I described above. Just rubs me the wrong way.

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I don't know if he's a dick but he's definitely a difficult charcter with an attitude and millions of opinions of whom he likes and who he won't work with, this and other shit. Him constantly lashing out at Axl was crazy - it is not the drummer's role, especially not a drummer who joined the band a fucking year ago. He should shut up and do his thing or leave if he didn't like it instead of stirring shit between Slash, Duff and Axl.

And it wasn't only Axl, Weiland also complained of him, don't remeber who else he didn't want to play with but there was another story like this too, also Duff himself described him as difficult, so obviosuly he's not a cool, easy to be with guy some of you portray him as.

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1 minute ago, Asia said:

I don't know if he's a dick but he's definitely a difficult charcter with an attitude and millions of opinions of whom he likes and who he won't work with, this and other shit. Him constantly lashing out at Axl was crazy - it is not the drummer's role, especially not a drummer who joined the band a fucking year ago. He should shut up and do his thing or leave if he didn't like it instead of stirring shit between Slash, Duff and Axl.

And it wasn't only Axl, Weiland also complained of him, don't remeber who else he didn't want to play with but there was another story like this too, also Duff himself described him as difficult, so obviosuly he's not a cool, easy to be with guy some of you portray him as.

This too, yes.

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4 minutes ago, Asia said:

I don't know if he's a dick but he's definitely a difficult charcter with an attitude and millions of opinions of whom he likes and who he won't work with, this and other shit. Him constantly lashing out at Axl was crazy - it is not the drummer's role, especially not a drummer who joined the band a fucking year ago. He should shut up and do his thing or leave if he didn't like it instead of stirring shit between Slash, Duff and Axl.

And it wasn't only Axl, Weiland also complained of him, don't remeber who else he didn't want to play with but there was another story like this too, also Duff himself described him as difficult, so obviosuly he's not a cool, easy to be with guy some of you portray him as.

I think Weiland said something like Matt was the toughest to work with. And that he was at odds with Slash for some things, but for the most part their professional relationship was mostly good. I forgot what he said about Duff

Edited by Mendez
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8 minutes ago, Frey said:

Maybe because he's familiar and they know him well already. If finding a new drummer would have caused them even a fraction of the hassle finding singers for VR caused them, I'd stick with Sorum too.

I don't necessarily view them working together in multiple bands and projects as an indicator of their personal feelings for each other. Izzy supposedly was pissed about Axl following him to L.A. and having to deal with him as well, and yet he kept forming band after band with Axl and continued to write songs with him, with both ultimately ending up in Guns N Roses. Seems his negative feelings towards Axl didn't stop him from being profesionally involved with him either.

While he may strike you as a fairly reasonable chap, he strikes me as what I described above. Just rubs me the wrong way.

Then alot of what your spewing comes from a personal dislike of the man. Nothing to do with what Duff or Slash think and feel about him, because there is simply no way of knowing that just because he isnt involved in this reunion. 

Most of the time, when people have personal issues with someone, they dont collaborate as frequently as Slash and Duff have with Matt. Thats not how it works. They may find him hard to deal with at times, that I find very reasonable from the Rise of Velvet Revolver Documentary, where there was an actual scene with Duff and Matt arguing. But they dont hate him or anything like that. 

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2 minutes ago, Mendez said:

I think Weiland said something like Matt was the toughest to work with. And that he was at odds with Slash for some things, but for the most part their professional relationship was mostly good. I forgot what he said about Duff

"The relationship I had with Matt became horrendous. He and I had come close to fist-fights so many times that it’s ridiculous. He has an attitude with lead singers. It’s a problem he had before Revolver – in Guns N’ Roses and The Cult. And, who knows, maybe even before that."

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Just now, NicDwolfwood said:

Then alot of what your spewing comes from a personal dislike of the man. Nothing to do with what Duff or Slash think and feel about him, because there is simply no way of knowing that just because he isnt involved in this reunion.

Obviously my personal feelings towards the man color my perception (as it does everyone's), but my statements are based on actual things Duff, Weiland, Axl and Slash (allegedly in his case) have said.

If multiple people (even ones as easy-going and friendly as Duff) struggle to deal with him, than obviously something's going on here and he probably isn't the inoffensive, chill guy some people here like to think he is.

But anyway, this is getting way off-topic. So here's something on topic: Steven, I'm not your biggest fan, but I'd rather have you as a drummer than Sorum.

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