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METALLICA's KIRK HAMMETT Says GUNS N' ROSES Has 'Turned Into Somewhat Of A Nostalgia Act'


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4 hours ago, Rovim said:

^^^

Proves exactly jack shit. Robin wasn't there all the time, no one was there all the time. Putting it out of context doesn't work cause Axl completed vocals on Oh My God, released that in 1999, worked on Catcher and Atlas Shrugged with may! a tune with quite a lot of lyrics. (Catcher)

And There Was A Time, I.R.S? how in the hell did Axl finish those and other vocals for tunes in 1999, much of which we and people close to the band have heard? including producers! including the AUDIO RECORDING of Brian May saying there are 2 albums full of tunes with vocals in 1999.

Axl played songs to Classic Rock, May said 2 albums worth of vocals, Oh My God released in 1999, and the 1999 versions of I.R.S,Catcher, and There Was A Time leaked.

And in 2001, it becomes irrelevant anyway cause by then we know he had:

Madagascar

The Blues

Oh My God

Silkworks

Riad

Atlas Shrugged

I.R.S

This I Love

Catcher

Chinese Democracy

So even if he was in a rut, and I believe there was a short time when he was, he still listen to me: still recorded and finished vocals in 1999 for a number of tunes, and by 2001, 4 years since work has started, he has completed an album worth of vocals.

You can't dispute any of it. You choose to support your claims from a collection of quotes, and it is a great one, but I support mine with facts in context to what we have heard. What leaked, what got released, and what people that have worked with Axl with no reason to lie have said.

 

Just about everybody who worked on that album says he had a billion songs with no vocals, and that it was like pulling teeth getting him to sing. But alright, believe what you want. I'll concede defeat because I am not actually that bothered: it is a terrible album with a perplexing creation. I certainly do not want to be drawn into you and Wasted's conversations about 'Atlas Shrugged'.

3 hours ago, EvanG said:

I don't know... I think it's normal for most bands in the autumn of their career to return back to their roots, or at least kinda. You can see that with most bands... after a few albums they start experimenting and trying something new, flirting with different genres, and after that period they slowly return to their original sound with maybe still some of the influences from their ''experimenting'' days. Same goes for Metallica. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are being nostalgic. It's a natural evolution, I think.

This is a good point. During a long career, having experimented widely, it is only natural that you would be curious at returning to your roots at some stage. Look at Neil Young, the turning point of the 80s and 90s, Freedom and Ragged Glory, after he had spent the majority of the 1980s producing 'genre' albums. Look at the way The Stones returned to their roots on Beggars Banquet, after experimenting in Beatles-esque psychedelia and music hall whimsy. The result was a leaner and meaner Stones. Didn't Zeppelin return to their roots on Presence

 

1 hour ago, Mr. Dude said:

And his favorite group of all time is the Stones who are the biggest and longest running pure nostalgia act in the history of history. 

What, Kirk's favourite group?

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2 hours ago, wasted said:

It's easier to see it as nostalgia. And that's okay. Nostalgia is natural, it happens for a reason. The main reason seems to be to sell GNR bowling jackets. We like nostalgia.

Whole point is this guy is kind of talking down on GNR for being a nostalgia act WHEN METALLICA Do The same shit. Sorry I got caps fatigue. 

I am listening to Hardwired right now, and I can assure you that it is not solely a ''thrash rehash''. The singles rather put forth this conceit. It is actually much more Loady and melodic.

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22 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Just about everybody who worked on that album says he had a billion songs with no vocals, and that it was like pulling teeth getting him to sing. But alright, believe what you want. I'll concede defeat because I am not actually that bothered: it is a terrible album with a perplexing creation. I certainly do not want to be drawn into you and Wasted's conversations about 'Atlas Shrugged'.

This is a good point. During a long career, having experimented widely, it is only natural that you would be curious at returning to your roots at some stage. Look at Neil Young, the turning point of the 80s and 90s, Freedom and Ragged Glory, after he had spent the majority of the 1980s producing 'genre' albums. Look at the way The Stones returned to their roots on Beggars Banquet, after experimenting in Beatles-esque psychedelia and music hall whimsy. The result was a leaner and meaner Stones. Didn't Zeppelin return to their roots on Presence

 

What, Kirk's favourite group?

Yours

you really can't comparice Metallica and gnr. Even in their prime Metallica  was opening for gnr.

Edited by Mr. Dude
Randy savage
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2 hours ago, Estranged Reality said:

 Let's stop bitching and appreciate the fact that these guys are even playing together again.

Why should I appreciate it? Axl's not doing this as a favour to the fans, he's making a mint. I would appreciate a new album. The people who have stuck by GNR 01-14 and supported Chinese Democracy would also appreciate new material.

But Axl chooses the option of more touring with no new music, because it's more profitable and requires less effort on his part. And you think I should be thankful for that???

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I'm sure many were willing to view this as a reunion, but to many it feels like Slash and Duff sitting in the with nuGuns and special guest "who's the chick?".

To that end, what Kirk said resonates to many as quite true, (not to all).

It is what one sees it as. :shrugs:

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9 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Well, it is not always as simple as outtakes being the 'throwaways' from a project - as The Basement Tapes  and the 'Lifehouse' (The Who) attest. And without outtakes we would be denying ourselves some of music's greatest moments, such as prime time Mick Taylor era Stones outtake, '' Jiving Sister Fanny'' and the entirety of Hendrix's First Rays of the New Rising Sun material, e.g. ''Dolly Dagger'' and ''Freedom''. You yourself even say later,

 

They were performing circa four-six new songs per show on the World Magnetic Tour, the tour in support of Death Magnetic. Here is an average setlist,

http://www.setlist.fm/stats/average-setlist/metallica-3bd680c8.html?tour=World+Magnetic

That would place the percentage of old material at circa 67% - 77%. As I mentioned to Wasted, material from that album was played 878 times on that tour from Death Magnetic, considerably more than any other album (in second place, The Black Album, provided 655 songs). Every song was played from that album; here is the breakdown, the number of times played in brackets,

That Was Just Your Life (165)

The End of the Line (144)

Broken, Beat & Scarred (142)

The Day That Never Comes (136)

Cyanide (129)

All Nightmare Long (88)

My Apocalypse (36)

The Judas Kiss (30)

The Unforgiven III (7)

Suicide & Redemption (1)

The notion that a Metallica setlist is comprised of mostly nostalgia cannot be sustained in light of facts like this.

 

 

Dude, the World Magnetic Tour ended 6 years ago. The stuff they have done since like the Big 4 tour, Orion Music Fest, and all of that has consisted of a heavy Old music setlists. Since 2012, they have just been on tour after tour, going to new places playing OLD material.  Just go look at some of the setlist from this year and last year as an example that most, if not all the DM material has disappeared from their live setlist. 

The major difference between Metallica and GNR is that Metallica has more material to choose from, so of course its much easier for them to change things up than Guns can with only 5 albums of Original material and 1 Covers album, whereas  Metallica now has 10 Studio albums, 5 Eps and 1 Cover album worth of material to rotate, which is what they have done the past couple years.

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2 minutes ago, NicDwolfwood said:

Dude, the World Magnetic Tour ended 6 years ago. The stuff they have done since like the Big 4 tour, Orion Music Fest, and all of that has consisted of a heavy Old music setlists. Just go look at some of the setlist from this year and last year as an example that most, if not all the DM material has disappeared from their live setlist.

Yes, and I am critical of the touring they did during that period. (Apparently much of it can be attributed to the fact that they were trying to recoup millions lost on that film.) In their defense, they introduced one new song (''Lords of Summer'', played thirty-three times 2014 -15) and 'fan friendly' deep cuts like ''Orion'', ''Ktulu'', and ''Fight Fire With Fire''.

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5 hours ago, wasted said:

It's easier to see it as nostalgia. And that's okay. Nostalgia is natural, it happens for a reason. The main reason seems to be to sell GNR bowling jackets. We like nostalgia.

Whole point is this guy is kind of talking down on GNR for being a nostalgia act WHEN METALLICA Do The same shit. Sorry I got caps fatigue. 

I agree, there's nothing wrong with nostalgia. But I disagree that when a band returns to their early sound, it should be described as nostalgia. (not saying this is the case with Metallica, I haven't heard their new album yet)

There was some talk once that Axl wanted to re-record AFD with the nu-GnR lineup... perhaps that was a bullshit rumour, but to prove my point... THAT is what I would call a nostalgia album, not a band releasing an album with all new songs.

Edited by EvanG
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7 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Yes, and I am critical of the touring they did during that period. (Apparently much of it can be attributed to the fact that they were trying to recoup millions lost on that film.) In their defense, they introduced one new song (''Lords of Summer'', played thirty-three times 2014 -15) and 'fan friendly' deep cuts like ''Orion'', ''Ktulu'', and ''Fight Fire With Fire''.

Correctamundo. 

 

So with all this info we have, can't we come to the conclusion that Metallica has been a mostly Nostalgia act these past few years. going around the world like 5 times over, playing the old stuff, to recoup money lost on shitty dvd project.? So doesnt this now seem more hypocritical when Kirk calls GNR a nostalgia act(even though he is right to a degree) when his band has been doing that these past 5 years or so. 

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1 hour ago, NicDwolfwood said:

Correctamundo. 

 

So with all this info we have, can't we come to the conclusion that Metallica has been a mostly Nostalgia act these past few years. going around the world like 5 times over, playing the old stuff, to recoup money lost on shitty dvd project.? So doesnt this now seem more hypocritical when Kirk calls GNR a nostalgia act(even though he is right to a degree) when his band has been doing that these past 5 years or so. 

I'd almost agree with you with the caveat that they are releasing a new album in a week, and that some of those peripheral releases had new material (Beyond Magnetic, Lulu - its awfulness is besides the point, ''Lords of Summer'' digital single). That, combined with the live/film releases kept things interesting enough, and ticking over, for the consumer-fans. As I said earlier, Metallica are notorious plodders, yet what does this say about Axl, that Metallica are even outpacing him?

Perhaps it is best to say both bands have been nostalgic for the last five - six years, Metallica less so.

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7 hours ago, Estranged Reality said:

Two years ago all anyone wanted was a reunion with Slash. We thought there was a good chance Axl could go back into hiding for another decade. Not only did we get the reunion, we got a massive tour, we got Axl fronting AC/DC, and we got consistently good behavior from the guy (no late shows, riots, etc.).

Not everyone was dreaming of a reunion and not everyone thought Axl would go back into hiding. Two years ago many people were hoping that we'd FINALLY get new music soon.

Other than that I agree. I do understand why some people are sick of the touring, but the reunion is still such a new thing, that it's understandable that they haven't released new music yet. It's a miracle that Slash and Axl are back together. The AC/DC thing is pretty incredible too. It feels a little unreasonable to complain at this point.

I do agree that GNR is a nostalgia act at the moment, but surely that will change at some point in the future.

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Basically with that logic, any 'older' band with a bunch of greatest hits, and who chooses to keep on playing them, will be called a nostalgia act. Even if they also play newer songs. Doesn't really make sense to me. For me nostalgia is when bands go out and do this LP tour where they play an entire album from decades ago or only play the greatest hits without any new songs. And that is not what Metallica is doing as far as I know of. GnR is different because the current line-up hasn't released anything in so very long and about 90% of their setlist consists of songs from 25-30 years ago, so you will automatically be called a nostalgia act. 

Edited by EvanG
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6 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

I am listening to Hardwired right now, and I can assure you that it is not solely a ''thrash rehash''. The singles rather put forth this conceit. It is actually much more Loady and melodic.

Double rehash. Half selling out, half nostalgia. Seems about right. I have no problem, Load is almost my favorite Metallica album. But acting like they aren't a nostalgia act trading off commercial hard rock for accessibility is delusional. 

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3 hours ago, EvanG said:

I agree, there's nothing wrong with nostalgia. But I disagree that when a band returns to their early sound, it should be described as nostalgia. (not saying this is the case with Metallica, I haven't heard their new album yet)

There was some talk once that Axl wanted to re-record AFD with the nu-GnR lineup... perhaps that was a bullshit rumour, but to prove my point... THAT is what I would call a nostalgia album, not a band releasing an album with all new songs.

New material that trades off the successful old music has a nostalgia to it. It's not the end of the world. But when you're swinging your dick around like you are pioneers when you're just repeating the past. That arouses me. 

To be fair James' lyrics have developed through St Anger therapy to mortality with DM. 

Reality is most of us want nostalgia but we use it as a dirty word. Especially in rock where we revere dead guys more than anything. Debuts and dead bodies. We love that. 

Metallica with St Anger and GNR with CD both did something forward looking but we shit on it. So can't blame them for just doling out the rehash for the masses. 

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11 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

They're dammed if they do, dammed if the don't, eh? It is a pity they did not add a load of beeps and farts to those albums. Then they could have passed them off as 'progressive'!

I'd settle for moderately creative instead of falling back on what's been done before and what's best commercially. CD is worth a thousand rehashes. 

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Just now, wasted said:

I'd settle for moderately creative instead of falling back on what's been done before and what's best commercially. CD is worth a thousand rehashes. 

 The thing is, you are making out that St Anger was this 'experimental album'. It was just a hardcore punk/nu metal influenced mess. I think they were attempting a garage punk/demo like thing. The Loads, from where Metallica were coming from, were far more experimental.

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I may be bias but I don't see ACDC as a nostalgia act. It might be because I feel ACDC/Angus is very serious still about the music and quality. I don't get the same vide from GnR, I get that they feel "that will do" type motto. Still what we have is better then no GnR/ACDC 

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46 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

 The thing is, you are making out that St Anger was this 'experimental album'. It was just a hardcore punk/nu metal influenced mess. I think they were attempting a garage punk/demo like thing. The Loads, from where Metallica were coming from, were far more experimental.

I felt it was a fresh take. Lars' drumming or precussion was interesting. They were taking some risks. I don't remember a turgid ballad. But everyone shit on it. So back to the formula. 

Whereas Load is just earnest rock, I've heard it all before. Very safe. 

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27 minutes ago, Mark1989 said:

I may be bias but I don't see ACDC as a nostalgia act. It might be because I feel ACDC/Angus is very serious still about the music and quality. I don't get the same vide from GnR, I get that they feel "that will do" type motto. Still what we have is better then no GnR/ACDC 

They are but they don't call the Stones out for being a nostalgia act. 

Like someone said that's just how rock works. Fans revere the past and criticize any deviation really. A new album should be nod of respect to what the fans love. They just want the same product again. 

I'm sure the GNR guys would like to put out a new album. 

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