New Mick Wall book, "Last Of The Giants"

[Liquor & Whores]

1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

 books I see as something sacred.

me too, just love the smell of the paper and that I can put it on my shelf

besides, just hate reading longer text from any kind of screen

hope, paper books would never die... but afraid they will, some day - like newspapers tend to die these days

Edited November 30, 2016 by Liquor & Whores

[BOSSY78]

58 minutes ago, Liquor & Whores said:

me too, just love the smell of the paper and that I can put it on my shelf

besides, just hate reading longer text from any kind of screen

hope, paper books would never die... but afraid they will, some day - like newspapers tend to die these days

Though I don't mind ebooks I do prefer actual books. However, I only buy actual books of certain authors or books I enjoy a lot. I own tons of ebooks though as well

As far as this new book by Mick Wall I am curious but doubt I'd ever buy it. As a writer myself I can't buy a book from a guy who admitted the things he has.

"Though I was a complete arse hole and tried to profit off Guns members issues and write a biased angry story about Axl, I learned my lesson now" type mentality just does it for me. As a journalist he discredited himself.

I'm sure there's some interesting tidbits in it though who would know what's biased or lies anymore.

Edited November 30, 2016 by BOSSY78
Add

[BOSSY78]

On 11/25/2016 at 7:51 PM, wasted said:

I guess people who took sides in the reunion have to back pedal to save their careers.

Maybe Mick thought he was helping Slash and Duff? No one stands up to Axl, I'll be the guy to do that. But when you take such a stance if they kiss and make up, you're left with your dick in the wind.

He probably thought that was the end of Axl. But some how Axl survived and now he's back on top. Why he wanted to bury Axl so bad I don't know. 

Playing with Slash and Duff totally renders WAR irelevant. People say CD had  epic label support but if you look at the CD release, a botched booklet, no video release, it doesn't look like it. There's evidence contrary. Wall's WAR is like a prime example where the media were out to get Axl. This is the hatchet job and character assassination everyone believed about Axl. 

So I can see why he withdrew it when he wants to write a more kiss ass book. There's a whole new chapter to write and he wrote himself out of it. 

Now I'm going to amazon to buy the kindle version. After all it's only rock n roll. 

Exactly. I mean people latched onto the bands issues, everyone had a story to tell and Axl was always painted in the bad light.

Fans fed on that setting the Axl vs Slash divide even more.

No one wanted to hear about how Axl was the only one to sit bed side at the hospital when they overdosed, or how he wasn't a "junkie" like the others.

They didn't want to hear how being the only one not as hooked and dependant on drugs might isolate him even more or wish to gain more control over things afraid they'd fall apart.

Hell even when he tried to come on the forums and set things straight from his perspective people didn't care.

The media and books were filled with all the negatives about him. Mick Wall did just that feeding on the frenzy and now that things has changed he wishes to retract and write another story? Lmao. 

I've always known there are two sides to every story.

I do believe there will be interesting things in his book but I have no respect for him as a writer.

It wasn't hard for him to see that divide and cash in on it just as he's doing now with the Reunion.

It's not to say his book will be filled with lies because I'm sure he has some knowledge in things but his hatred ans bias and recant and admission of it is a turn off

[wasted]

1 hour ago, BOSSY78 said:

Exactly. I mean people latched onto the bands issues, everyone had a story to tell and Axl was always painted in the bad light.

Fans fed on that setting the Axl vs Slash divide even more.

No one wanted to hear about how Axl was the only one to sit bed side at the hospital when they overdosed, or how he wasn't a "junkie" like the others.

They didn't want to hear how being the only one not as hooked and dependant on drugs might isolate him even more or wish to gain more control over things afraid they'd fall apart.

Hell even when he tried to come on the forums and set things straight from his perspective people didn't care.

The media and books were filled with all the negatives about him. Mick Wall did just that feeding on the frenzy and now that things has changed he wishes to retract and write another story? Lmao. 

I've always known there are two sides to every story.

I do believe there will be interesting things in his book but I have no respect for him as a writer.

It wasn't hard for him to see that divide and cash in on it just as he's doing now with the Reunion.

It's not to say his book will be filled with lies because I'm sure he has some knowledge in things but his hatred ans bias and recant and admission of it is a turn off

I think this has the same retelling of Axl/Vince thing but it's in the context of more detailed debauchery and craziness of the rest of the band. Niven and Doug give you a better picture of Slash, Izzy and Steven. Slash is a junkie crawling around puking, Izzy a paranoid skitzo. But there's always this glorification of the rock n roll lifestyle as the get out card. But generally Axl is cast as the asshole. But Doug has a great quote after Axl asks him if he's turned into an asshole. There's more balance. 

In the biography the focus was just Axl and it's probably a close enough portrait. An interesting take. Axl has said the same about himself in terms of why he is like he is. But there was no other side of the story, especially in terms of the split. As a journalist writer he didn't take a step back. Definitely he pushed it's not GNR and it's all Axl's fault to far. There's a lot of bands without original line ups. There were reasons why certain things happened which were glossed over for Axl is a nut job etc. This kind of stuff happens in rock all the time. But Axl gets treated worse than a mass murderer. 

This new one of course is cashing in, but there's enough from Niven and Doug. It compiles a lot of info and adds detail that I don't remember reading about. And he's a good writer. It redresses the balance. There's less general scorn poured on everything Axl does just for the sake of it. 

Edited December 1, 2016 by wasted

[wasted]

I just read Niven says what made the reunion happen is Slash getting with Erin's best friend Meegan. Axl and Erin start talking and she convinces Axl to do the reunion. 

[Billsfan]

6 hours ago, wasted said:

I just read Niven says what made the reunion happen is Slash getting with Erin's best friend Meegan. Axl and Erin start talking and she convinces Axl to do the reunion. 

Niven tells excellent fiction my wasted friend  

[ludurigan]

On 03/12/2016 at 11:14 PM, wasted said:

I just read Niven says what made the reunion happen is Slash getting with Erin's best friend Meegan. Axl and Erin start talking and she convinces Axl to do the reunion. 

when/where did niven say that?

[6lake sa66ath]

11 hours ago, ludurigan said:

when/where did niven say that?

Presumably in Mick Wall's new book

[wasted]

9 hours ago, Blake Sabbath said:

Presumably in Mick Wall's new book

Yes. In the new book. Niven and Doug are the main sources of interest in the book. 

What is more important is Doug says Axl told him to tell them sign or he wouldn't go on. But Doug says being smart he knew that would be durress. So he worded it different. But the point of it was to cover Axl if they died. 

Which is way different from him saying he wasn't even there, he was in hawaii getting married. 

Doug also says he often didn't tell Axl the truth to keep things going. Axl didn't know Slash, Duff and Izzy were so angry with him half the time. 

Also Doug says Zutuat didn't think Snakepit was good and refused to release it as a Slash record. So to me that suggests there's no way it was going to be a Guns record as it was. 

[wasted]

On 24 November 2016 at 8:18 PM, KiraMPD said:

Also from the women's thread...

 

 

I take this with a big fucking grain of salt. Does Mick Wall even have any access to the band to be making such claims? 

 

 

It could have come from Niven who was saying Izzy is writing with Duff again. 

[sanity_lost]

1 hour ago, wasted said:

It could have come from Niven who was saying Izzy is writing with Duff again. 

So Slash or Axl tells Duff who tells Izzy who then tells Niven?

... I think I would keep that grain of salt handy.

[wasted]

52 minutes ago, sanity_lost said:

So Slash or Axl tells Duff who tells Izzy who then tells Niven?

... I think I would keep that grain of salt handy.

No. I think Niven mistook Izzy and Duff writing together as being or meaning new Guns songs. But it was that Izzy/Duff solo stuff that came out. How to be a Man EP. 

In another interview Niven was saying I heard Izzy/Duff were writing together again. This was before the reunion. 

So the dots are there but...hopefully they know something we don't. 

Grain of salt, different shaker. 

Also what Axl said at CE could be intrepreted as NEW songs. I doubt Slash and Duff will want to do an album of nu GNR songs for the reunion record. They have to do some new songs. So its a good guess. 

Edited December 5, 2016 by wasted

[Free Bird]

4 hours ago, wasted said:

Yes. In the new book. Niven and Doug are the main sources of interest in the book. 

What is more important is Doug says Axl told him to tell them sign or he wouldn't go on. But Doug says being smart he knew that would be durress. So he worded it different. But the point of it was to cover Axl if they died. 

Which is way different from him saying he wasn't even there, he was in hawaii getting married. 

Doug also says he often didn't tell Axl the truth to keep things going. Axl didn't know Slash, Duff and Izzy were so angry with him half the time. 

Also Doug says Zutuat didn't think Snakepit was good and refused to release it as a Slash record. So to me that suggests there's no way it was going to be a Guns record as it was. 

So basically what Slash says in his book. Doug was the middleman between them and he manipulated them by don't telling the truth. Fuckhead.

Slash never brought a Guns record "as it was". Could it be good enough if Axl snd Duff worked on it? I think so.

[wasted]

2 hours ago, Free Bird said:

So basically what Slash says in his book. Doug was the middleman between them and he manipulated them by don't telling the truth. Fuckhead.

Slash never brought a Guns record "as it was". Could it be good enough if Axl snd Duff worked on it? I think so.

You understand that Doug changed his story though. So that jumped out at me. 

Slash is quoted as saying he thought it would be great as a Guns record. Axl and Duff both didn't think so. I think it would be okay for 1 record maybe add a ballad. 

[SteveAJones]

On 11/30/2016 at 7:21 AM, BOSSY78 said:

It's not to say his book will be filled with lies because I'm sure he has some knowledge in things but his hatred and bias and recant and admission of it is a turn off

Fortunately for Mick Wall, the subject matter (Guns n' Roses) is of sufficient interest that most of us will overlook it's written by Mick Wall. I know for a fact he had a falling out with Jimmy Page for sharing things originally said off the record in his (Wall's) Led Zeppelin book. Unsure if there's any bad blood likewise on a personal level between Wall and Axl, or the band.

[BOSSY78]

On 12/1/2016 at 7:10 PM, wasted said:

6 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

Fortunately for Mick Wall, the subject matter (Guns n' Roses) is of sufficient interest that most of us will overlook it's written by Mick Wall. I know for a fact he had a falling out with Jimmy Page for sharing things originally said off the record in his (Wall's) Led Zeppelin book. Unsure if there's any bad blood likewise on a personal level between Wall and Axl, or the band.

@wasted for some reason I can't take the part out quoting you. I'm on my cell so not sure so sorry it quoted you here.

Axl called out Mick Wall on his reporting and misquoting and writing lies before a book was written.

My view on Mick Wall and anything he has written has always been to take it with a grain of salt. To be honest Ive never purchased any of his books because of it.

As far as Doug goes I mean be keeps lying changing his story and now after Axl told the fans on the forums it didn't go down like that and used the term under duress Doug wants to use it. I call bs.

I believe that maybe they were playing sides against each other and the part of Axl protecting the name in case of death and spouses. Axl has always stood by aa far as I remember doing it for the protection of the band not to be greedy.

He came up with the name and the name is a combo of his and Traci Guns so I've always stood by him keeping it. Of course I get why people thought it was wrong I mean you had a guy who was manipulating the band against each other. People pissed at Axl based off what he was telling them and Axl relying on him to tell the truth and be a friend.

Axl however we must remember wasn't a junkie and Axl had a right to be worried about what would happen if one of them were to die. 

It's sad that this misunderstanding was a huge rift between them and caused years of turmoil. It divided fans many not understanding why Axl wanted to protect the band and it's brand and name.

Slash and I believe Renee had a pre nup I believe but he didn't with Perla. Axl likely wanted to make sure if Slash overdosed again and didn't make it she or any other band members wife didn't have a share in the band. He had a right in my opinion to worry about it. He was the only one who was the others were too caught up in drugs at the time.

I am curious about the Erin tidbit because back when she had her Instagram she was supposedly from what Ive read from other posters on here making some posts that did seem like they were back in contact.

Interesting that Snake Pit wasn't seen as a guns record by some. Isn't that the album he took to Axl and claimed Axl didn't like any of it? Of course we know that from Axl he did indeed like some but still curious. 

Edited December 5, 2016 by BOSSY78
A

[6lake sa66ath]

New Mick Wall podcast with revelations from '87 and such!

http://mickwall.com/2016/12/last-of-the-giants-interview-xs-manchester/

[RONIN]

Paul Huge is often blamed for GnR breaking up but I think the real Yoko Ono of this band was Doug Goldstein. He's the fuckhead who engineered the break up of Guns N' Roses and deprived fans of 20+ years of new music. Double talking Jive is a perfect song for this asshole. I'm glad he's a complete pariah now with both the Axl camp and Duff/Slash/Izzy. 

Niven and Zutaut were the godfathers for GnR and imho the only management who actually were invested in their success. Doug Goldstein should have stayed a tour manager picking up the band's shit at 3 AM.

[Xedos]

I think this guy needs to make some money, thats all.

Only thing I can say is:

"Mick Wall at Kerrang, What you pissed off cuz your dad gets more pussy than you?

Get in the Ring, MF !"

Not worth paying attention to this moron.

 

Edited December 17, 2016 by Xedos

[6lake sa66ath]

If you actually listened to the podcast I posted, I think the most interesting revelation from it was that the band swapped instruments with Axl on bass during their first appearances in London

[ludurigan]

16 hours ago, RONIN said:

Paul Huge is often blamed for GnR breaking up but I think the real Yoko Ono of this band was Doug Goldstein. He's the fuckhead who engineered the break up of Guns N' Roses and deprived fans of 20+ years of new music. Double talking Jive is a perfect song for this asshole. I'm glad he's a complete pariah now with both the Axl camp and Duff/Slash/Izzy. 

Niven and Zutaut were the godfathers for GnR and imho the only management who actually were invested in their success. Doug Goldstein should have stayed a tour manager picking up the band's shit at 3 AM.

exactly, it seems that this Doug person was the ultimate axl lunacy-enabler yes-man

[double talkin jive mfkr]

9 hours ago, Blake Sabbath said:

If you actually listened to the podcast I posted, I think the most interesting revelation from it was that the band swapped instruments with Axl on bass during their first appearances in London

there should be a book alone on GNR invading London for the first time 

[Blackstar]

20 hours ago, RONIN said:

Paul Huge is often blamed for GnR breaking up but I think the real Yoko Ono of this band was Doug Goldstein. He's the fuckhead who engineered the break up of Guns N' Roses and deprived fans of 20+ years of new music. Double talking Jive is a perfect song for this asshole. I'm glad he's a complete pariah now with both the Axl camp and Duff/Slash/Izzy. 

Niven and Zutaut were the godfathers for GnR and imho the only management who actually were invested in their success. Doug Goldstein should have stayed a tour manager picking up the band's shit at 3 AM.

I agree about Doug Goldstein, but not about Alan Niven. Niven was as much an asshole as Goldstein was, if not a bigger one. GnR first had a manager who hated the lead singer (it's obvious from Niven's own words in Mick Wall's book and interviews) and then a manager who kissed the singer's ass. The difference is that Goldstein was smarter, in the sense that he understood what Axl's buttons were so he knew how to handle him; for example he didn't interfere with songwriting and recording (like Niven did), limiting himself to the business side, which made Axl trust him and gave Goldstein more power.

Edited December 18, 2016 by Blackstar

[Jane M.]

At least Alan Niven had the guts to manage them when nobody else wanted to.

[double talkin jive mfkr]

47 minutes ago, Jane M. said:

At least Alan Niven had the guts to manage them when nobody else wanted to.

axl mentioned him in the london china exchange about how they hung out in London