GNR Takes Swings at Donald Trump (the foam kind)

[slipnslider]

1 hour ago, SteveAJones said:

ANY political statements. One would think "leave politics out of their act" means I prefer they leave politics out of their act.

SO I guess they should stop playing Civil War, Knocking on Heavens Door, Jungle, Chinese Democracy , Out Ta Get Me...  Dozens of GnR songs have politics in them.

GnR fans complaining about GnR bashing trump is as ridiculous as when Paul Ryan said Rage Against the Machine was one of his favorite bands.

Do you even LISTEN to the music you claim to love?

 

Edited December 5, 2016 by slipnslider

[AxlsFavoriteRose]

18 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

You're welcome. It ain't easy being a real motherfuckin' OG.

#MakeAmericaGoatAgain

omg LOL @MakeAmericaGoatAgain! 

[sc_gunner]

9 minutes ago, sc_gunner said:

So what you are saying you can get behind someone bashing a political figure for generalizing a group of people.  However at the same you are generalizing and demoralizing  an entire region as "uneducated morons".  OK.  Sounds fair (sarcasm).  By the way I am highly educated, make a nice living (on my own as I don't know what this white privilege you liberals speak of is), live in red state, NOT racist, and voted for trump.  Sounds to me like you are the uneducated one.  You are welcome to come meet me in my red state so I can educate you though.

By the way I wasn't particularity thrilled with GnR on this, but this in no way discourages me from the excitement I have with my favorite band of all time.  I also have liberal family and friends.  No need to disown someone because you don't align with them politically.  That is even dumber than this stunt with the Trump pinata.  I am still just as excited about the GnR tour, and possibility of new music as I was before I saw the video.

[SteveAJones]

2 hours ago, slipnslider said:

SO I guess they should stop playing Civil War, Knocking on Heavens Door, Jungle, Chinese Democracy , Out Ta Get Me...  Dozens of GnR songs have politics in them. Do you even LISTEN to the music you claim to love?

Are those songs offering social commentary or making overtly political statements? There is a difference, and to my ears none of those songs are as overtly political as a Donald Trump pinata in the year 2016.

[slipnslider]

1 minute ago, SteveAJones said:

Are those songs offering social commentary or making overtly political statements? There is a difference, and to my ears none of those songs are as overtly political as a Donald Trump pinata in the year 2016.

Distinction without a difference.   Social commentary and political statements can be the same thing.

"I don't need your civil war.  It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.  The power hungry selling soldiers in a human grocery store."

Is that not political to you? 

[SteveAJones]

2 minutes ago, slipnslider said:

Distinction without a difference.   Social commentary and political statements can be the same thing.

"I don't need your civil war.  It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.  The power hungry selling soldiers in a human grocery store."

Is that not political to you? 

It's social commentary on the human condition, IMHO. If the lyrics were "I don't need your Iraqi War..." THAT'S political.

Edited December 5, 2016 by SteveAJones

[downzy]

Again, this is not a thread to discuss politics.  

I get that's hard to do considering the subject matter, but if you examine the posts that have not been removed you'll notice that they all discuss the situation as it relates to GNR and not specific to Donald Trump, his voter, and his critics.

We do have a lively political discussion in Anything Goes if that's more your speed.

Thanks!

[slipnslider]

2 hours ago, downzy said:

Again, this is not a thread to discuss politics.  

I get that's hard to do considering the subject matter, but if you examine the posts that have not been removed you'll notice that they all discuss the situation as it relates to GNR and not specific to Donald Trump, his voter, and his critics.

We do have a lively political discussion in Anything Goes if that's more your speed.

Thanks!

I get that.  Respectfully.  But that's kind of like discussing the weather without mentioning the temperature or precipitation isn't it? 

Or like discussing a murder without questioning the motive.  We're allowed to discuss what happened, but not WHY?  That seems a lot like the sort of censorship this band fought so hard against. 

The thread it titled "GNR takes Swings at Donald Trump"  Not "GnR takes swings at a certain politician who must remain unnamed for some reason."

Axl thinks this is important enough to address publicly.  I agree with him.

 

 

Edited December 5, 2016 by slipnslider

[downzy]

Just now, slipnslider said:

I get that.  Respectfully.  But that's kind of like discussing the weather without mentioning the temperature or precipitation doesn't it? 

Or like discussing a murder without questioning the motive.  We're allowed to discuss what happened, but not WHY?  That seems a lot like the sort of censorship this band fought so hard against. 

The thread it titled "GNR takes Swings at Donald Trump"  Not "GnR takes swings at a certain politician who must remain unnamed for some reason."

Axl thinks this is important enough to address publicly.  I agree with him.

 

I don't necessarily disagree, however, if we allow for any and all conversation it stops being about the band and starts being about Trump, conservatives and liberals.  We're not saying don't have that conversation, we're simply asking that people keep conversations that are strictly political to the non-GNR section of the site.  90 percent of the people who visit this forum do so because they're GNR fans.  We cater to them and hence respect the fact that the D&N section of this forum will stay largely apolitical and avoid nasty conversations on politics.  Again, there is a place on this forum to have that conversation. 

Trust me when I say that I would love to use this platform and conversation to litigate everything that's wrong with Trump and the reasons for why people voted and supported him make zero sense (if you're at all familiar with the political discussions in Anything Goes, you know i'm not shy on this).  But as I have to be respectful of the fact that a vast a majority of the fanbase and members aren't looking to have that discussion, so too does anyone who participates in this thread.  It's why I made it very clear in my OP what this discussion would and wouldn't be used for.  

There have been a lot of great discussion about the topic as it relates to the band.  It's not impossible to participating in engaging conversation about the Piñata Incident without it breaking down into another session of political mudslinging.  

[marlingrl03]

11 hours ago, SteveAJones said:

I agree there is a difference, but the problem is this can be misinterpreted outside of Mexico.

Can anyone confirm the pinata contained free t-shirts which were then distributed to the fans?

Yes I saw for myself as it was happening live.  The shirts were all rolled up and tossed to the crowd just a few minutes after the pinata broke apart.

[slipnslider]

2 hours ago, downzy said:

 

Trust me when I say that I would love to use this platform and conversation to litigate everything that's wrong with Trump and the reasons for why people voted and supported him make zero sense (if you're at all familiar with the political discussions in Anything Goes, you know i'm not shy on this).  But as I have to be respectful of the fact that a vast a majority of the fanbase and members aren't looking to have that discussion, so too does anyone who participates in this thread.  It's why I made it very clear in my OP what this discussion would and wouldn't be used for. 

Well you don't HAVE to be respectful of trump's fans' feelings, but you CHOOSE to.

And I don't think this is the time to start catering to the feelings of that kind of person.  If enough people start saying "let's not discuss trump because it's too inflamatory" then trump is going to be able to do a lot more damage than he could if people were calling him out more widely.

You have a little bit of authority in a tiny corner of the internet.  It's not a lot of power, but it's a little, and it can matter a little.  You get to choose how to use it.

[Magnus Cavalerra]

Chinese Democracy is very political tho, even those Communist Party said it "turns its spear point on China".

[downzy]

3 hours ago, slipnslider said:

Well you don't HAVE to be respectful of trump's fans' feelings, but you CHOOSE to.

And I don't think this is the time to start catering to the feelings of that kind of person.  If enough people start saying "let's not discuss trump because it's too inflamatory" then trump is going to be able to do a lot more damage than he could if people were calling him out more widely.

You have a little bit of authority in a tiny corner of the internet.  It's not a lot of power, but it's a little, and it can matter a little.  You get to choose how to use it.

No one is saying you can't discuss Trump and how terrible he was as a candidate and how he'll likely be terrible as President.  In fact, it's the argument I've been making for a year and a half.  My only request is that the discussion doesn't happen in this thread.  It's not about being respectful to Trump's supporters and voters, but respectful to GNR fans who want to discuss what happened as it relates to the band and not wade through the usual mud slinging found in political discussions.   

[Billsfan]

48 minutes ago, Magnus Cavalerra said:

Chinese Democracy is very political tho, even those Communist Party said it "turns its spear point on China".

Very true but hey, Axl Rose is a rebel and since people hate trump for being too honest well then suddenly Axl is a wonderful human being. Gotta love hypocrisy

[JeedBe]

This was in Mexico...it was of their artists that designed the "Trump" pinata and it was simply an expression of how the people in Mexico feel about him.  It has also been used elsewhere as a venting mechanism.  Mellow out.....

[Modano09]

40 minutes ago, Billsfan said:

Very true but hey, Axl Rose is a rebel and since people hate trump for being too honest well then suddenly Axl is a wonderful human being. Gotta love hypocrisy

"Too honest". That's certainly one way of rationalizing it.  

[Billsfan]

6 minutes ago, Modano09 said:

"Too honest". That's certainly one way of rationalizing it.  

Just being realistic. It's a shame words do such damage to so many in a politically correct society 

[JustanUrchin]

On 12/1/2016 at 3:31 AM, Apollo said:

It's disgusting. 

You people would be losing your minds if the situation was reversed. 

If Hillary had won the election and some random band brought a doll of her on stage and beat the shit out of it...nobody would be saying how awesome it was. 

There would be nothing but posts about how violent and evil republicans were. How classless it was. 

Or if an Obama doll was brought on stage and destroyed. Nobody would be saying how awesome it was. 

Applauding simulated violence against the president of the United States. While complaining that Trump and his followers are spreading hate and negativity. 

This is some sick stuff. 

Sixty-four likes.  That is three pages of likes.  I may now suffer from carpal tunnel.  

Did the photo of Axl busting ass up the riser in Cincy to shake Adler's hand gather that many likes?  Has any substantive, original post here garnered that many likes?

I'd say enough said, and probably should.  Except, of course, I suffered through the unwitting handmaiden and propagandist posts of Canadians and euphemists to get to your post.  And, unsurprisingly, said unwitting handmaidens threatened censorship by "cautioning" pragmatists not to offer their (overwhelmingly majority) views while they, the unwitting handmaidens, couched their propaganda in terms "related to" the original post.  Then again, lockstep liberals and socialists of all stripes (and those in third world countries) fear speech because, well, because they are told they should.

I'm hesitant to view the video, though.  I previously sold my Philly tickets this summer after it became apparent to me that S/D/A reformed their post-'92 p'ship and that any and all Adler and Izzy involvement would be for-hire.  I'd be much obliged if someone could tell me whether S/D/A engaged in this behavior or whether it was relegated to Axl's live-ins and his wholly unqualified, sycophants.  I doubt (and hope) that neither Slash nor Duff engaged in this delirium.

[Kira]

Honestly, if the band had come out in support of Donald Trump, I could no longer be a fan of theirs, I feel that strongly about it.  So, I'm glad it's the opposite.

[Kira]

15 minutes ago, JustanUrchin said:

Sixty-four likes.  That is three pages of likes.  I may now suffer from carpal tunnel.  

 

If it were possible to give "thumbs down" for posts, I wager there would be more than 64 of those for that (original) post.  jmo

[Silent Jay]

 

[Billsfan]

23 minutes ago, Modano09 said:

Labeling groups of people as rapists, criminals or terrorists can cause some damage. 

Reading too deep and overreacting to what would realistically change our lives... #Priceless. The way gnr have handled things may promote fear more since we're being reminded... but yeah let's all get offended 

[Ace Spade]

On 12/5/2016 at 11:06 PM, downzy said:

Some might have drank the Kool Aid with respect to Trump being anti-establishment, but it would appear that's one drink members of GNR don't have a taste for.

Welcome to disagree, but to me there's a bit of difference between a noose effigy of a hanging political figure and a piñata caricature.   Are we now saying that all piñatas be interpreted as mock hangings?   Keep in mind this took place in Mexico, where the piñata has a strong associations with Mexican culture.  

I agree that the setting softened the tone a little...

However, are we going to say that if that was a black president effigy on a rope, (pinata or not) people would not be screaming "RACIST" and "KKK" on the news, and social media all day?

 

[Blackstar]

10 hours ago, JustanUrchin said:

I'd say enough said, and probably should.  Except, of course, I suffered through the unwitting handmaiden and propagandist posts of Canadians and euphemists to get to your post.  And, unsurprisingly, said unwitting handmaidens threatened censorship by "cautioning" pragmatists not to offer their (overwhelmingly majority) views while they, the unwitting handmaidens, couched their propaganda in terms "related to" the original post.  Then again, lockstep liberals and socialists of all stripes (and those in third world countries) fear speech because, well, because they are told they should.

I'm hesitant to view the video, though.  I previously sold my Philly tickets this summer after it became apparent to me that S/D/A reformed their post-'92 p'ship and that any and all Adler and Izzy involvement would be for-hire.  I'd be much obliged if someone could tell me whether S/D/A engaged in this behavior or whether it was relegated to Axl's live-ins and his wholly unqualified, sycophants.  I doubt (and hope) that neither Slash nor Duff engaged in this delirium.

To make my post useful, Axl, Slash and Duff were all there.

[downzy]

5 hours ago, Ace Spade said:

I agree that the setting softened the tone a little...

However, are we going to say that if that was a black president effigy on a rope, (pinata or not) people would not be screaming "RACIST" and "KKK" on the news, and social media all day?

 

Maybe, but show me a history of white people being lynched in America akin to the African American historical experience.  Context matters.  Again, that's not even what we're talking about.  GNR used a cultural artifact associated with Mexican culture while in Mexico to "comment" on a man who launched his presidential campaign impugning the character of the Mexican people.  

People are allowed to respond however they wish.  It's just a little humorous to me that for almost two years now we've heard from one group of people that we've become too politically correct.  GNR acts politically incorrect towards Donald Trump and all of a sudden it's causing some to give up their support for the band.  

As I said in my post a few pages ago, I would have not agreed with their statement had it been a Hillary piñata.  But it still wouldn't have caused me to give up being a fan or shut down this forum.