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Alien: Covenant


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2 hours ago, Black Sabbath said:

I never understood all the hate for Prometheus. It's supposed to be the first movie in a trilogy of mythology prequels, so of course it was going to ask more questions than it was going to answer. People complained there wasn't enough ALIEN and I think Ridley changed his original sequel idea to it to please some more of the masses, but it doesn't seem like he's completely abandoning the original idea, so that's good.

Not to mention, Prometheus was amazingly shot.

I mean, I get the complaints some people have about characters' motivations/decisions - there are a number of totally illogical decisions made in the film. I'm also on board with the folks upset that it basically retconned the Space Jockey into a space suit (Not to say I don't enjoy the rest of the Engineer's story so far). But besides those, I love it. It's got fantastic production values, both visually and aurally, the cast is mostly good, and it expands the mythology of the Alien universe. Plus, dat C-section scene is among Ridley Scott's best. 

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I just want a movie that has Aliens AND engineers in it. 

I want to see the relation between the two. How do the engineers perceive the Aliens? Do they revere them? Do they hunt them? Were they a mutated experiment? 

I think its safe to say no screenwriter can lick that story, not yet.

Prometheus was a film with no Aliens and one lone engineer.

Covenant is a film with Aliens and no Engineers.

 

The problem is inherent in the idea of alien species. Unless they're strictly beastly like the xenomorphs, most filmmakers stay away from trying to characterize alien creatures, this includes Ridley Scott.

If they don't speak English, how does an audience understand them on an intellectual level?

Arrival overcame this obstical by making the communication of the aliens the prime storytelling device.  Ridley Scott doesn't want to get too cute. He doesn't want to resort to telepathy or subtitles so his prerogative is to avoid the whole thing altogether. Which is a shame. He wants to make movies about engineers but cannot get past the initial problem that he has no idea how to present them to an audience. So he avoids it.

Prometheus avoided it and undoubtedly, this film will avoid it.

 

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I know because people at Reddit who have seen it and have offered undisputed plot points have told us that outside of one scene that could be called a flashback, there are no engineers.

Even if I didn't know that, the plot synopsis for the film mentions that the covenant crew lands on a planet that is empty with the exception of David. 

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2 hours ago, appetite4illusions said:

I know because people at Reddit who have seen it and have offered undisputed plot points have told us that outside of one scene that could be called a flashback, there are no engineers.

Even if I didn't know that, the plot synopsis for the film mentions that the covenant crew lands on a planet that is empty with the exception of David. 

And yet, there's Xenomorphs in the trailer. So... :shrugs: 

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2 hours ago, appetite4illusions said:

I know because people at Reddit who have seen it and have offered undisputed plot points have told us that outside of one scene that could be called a flashback, there are no engineers.

Even if I didn't know that, the plot synopsis for the film mentions that the covenant crew lands on a planet that is empty with the exception of David. 

Holy fucking spoilers brah

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10 hours ago, Black Sabbath said:

I never understood all the hate for Prometheus. It's supposed to be the first movie in a trilogy of mythology prequels, so of course it was going to ask more questions than it was going to answer. People complained there wasn't enough ALIEN and I think Ridley changed his original sequel idea to it to please some more of the masses, but it doesn't seem like he's completely abandoning the original idea, so that's good.

Not to mention, Prometheus was amazingly shot.

I really enjoyed it. I mean its a flawed film no doubt, but it scores major points for trying something new, having impressive sets and visuals, and being an overall competent film in its pacing and execution.

A lot of the individual scenes are wonderful, but oftentimes it feels like they don't blend together to form something greater, and so the movie ends up feeling occasionally shallow and purposeless. 

Overall I'd say its worth a rewatch. 7/10

Edited by Dan H.
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  • 3 weeks later...
On 3/2/2017 at 5:21 PM, Black Sabbath said:

I never understood all the hate for Prometheus. It's supposed to be the first movie in a trilogy of mythology prequels, so of course it was going to ask more questions than it was going to answer. People complained there wasn't enough ALIEN and I think Ridley changed his original sequel idea to it to please some more of the masses, but it doesn't seem like he's completely abandoning the original idea, so that's good.

Not to mention, Prometheus was amazingly shot.

Apparently the next movie is going to be set between Prometheus and Covenant. Very clever move IMO. Get people back on board with a kickass Alien movie then tie it all together with the link between the two. 

Edited by Dazey
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  • 2 weeks later...

Ridley Scott is among the modern day greats, but he can't make those CGI Aliens anything but an eye-sore. I'm only seeing half-second flashes of them and even in that instant, they just look so fake.

The ironic thing is, in the original, the lack of mobility of the Alien was played up by the actor who compensated by twitching. They sacrificed any ability to given the alien agility in favor of having a guy in a suit that looked absolutely iconic in tight shots with a little bit of smoke and some slime dripping off it. 

 

Now that we can program our Aliens on computers, they can jump up and down and climb the walls, but they've sacrificed the terror that the physical thing had. The Alien was never more lethal than when it was still, because that was the moment before it attacked. It was the stillness of the real thing that was so unnerving.

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10 hours ago, appetite4illusions said:

Ridley Scott is among the modern day greats, but he can't make those CGI Aliens anything but an eye-sore. I'm only seeing half-second flashes of them and even in that instant, they just look so fake.

The ironic thing is, in the original, the lack of mobility of the Alien was played up by the actor who compensated by twitching. They sacrificed any ability to given the alien agility in favor of having a guy in a suit that looked absolutely iconic in tight shots with a little bit of smoke and some slime dripping off it. 

 

Now that we can program our Aliens on computers, they can jump up and down and climb the walls, but they've sacrificed the terror that the physical thing had. The Alien was never more lethal than when it was still, because that was the moment before it attacked. It was the stillness of the real thing that was so unnerving.

Keep in mind, this is also supposed to be more of a "less evolved" version of the Xenomorph - a Neomorph, actually. So it's likely going to be more "off-the-wall", if you will, and isn't going to act the same way as a Xeno.

Also, the CGI is still in pre-production and will likely look even better in the final film. They're already still doing adjustments:

giphy.gif

giphy.gif

The still with the darker sky is the most recent version.

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On ‎3‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 10:49 AM, Słash said:

Prometheus was BLAH

This seems a little better but still the trailer doesn't has that grip. 

I agree. I watched it to see the ending.

This movie looks good, but if it before Alien, I don't think anyone is going to survive this movie. Too bad.

Anyway, looks like plenty of action and scares with those damn alien pods again.

On ‎4‎/‎4‎/‎2017 at 7:36 AM, Black Sabbath said:

Keep in mind, this is also supposed to be more of a "less evolved" version of the Xenomorph - a Neomorph, actually. So it's likely going to be more "off-the-wall", if you will, and isn't going to act the same way as a Xeno.

Also, the CGI is still in pre-production and will likely look even better in the final film. They're already still doing adjustments:

giphy.gif

giphy.gif

The still with the darker sky is the most recent version.

Cool. I can see how they would change an earlier version of the alien. Everything evolves eventually.

On ‎3‎/‎24‎/‎2017 at 7:48 AM, maynard said:

I need one on my wall.

Wow! Creepy and cool at the same time.

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I have more than a feeling that David is going to be a full fledged villain in this film.

 

While he should make for a very formidable bad-guy, one of the things that I thought was so genius about the way Damon Lindelof wrote David was that he straddled the line between being heroic and being horrific. He did good things, he did bad things, but he was neither good nor bad. He was curious. You couldn't apply normal motivations to his character because he wasn't human, he didn't process thought the way humans do. He still had a touch of the sentimental in him. Remember how he loved to watch people dream?

More than anything else, Damon Lindelof hit it out of the park with David. He took a character that was just a stock-villain android in Jon Spaiht's script and turned him into one of the most fascinatingly ambiguous synthetics in all of sci-fi films.

 

Now that we're into the next movie, they may not be so careful as to keep David in a morally grey area. If he indeed created the Aliens as it seems like its shaping up to be, then he is the devil responsible for everything in the franchise. Like I said, while he will be an extremely formidable bad-guy, it kind of cheapens the great tightrope walking they did in Prometheus by not painting him with such a broad brush.

Edited by appetite4illusions
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We saw an alien in Prometheus. It was like a weird baby pointy head one, remember?

 

Idk, this is just one of those series where I can't be bothered by "continuity" when I really think about it. Alien and Aliens are GOAT, anything else is "if its cool-great!" and "if it sucks- whatever!" category.

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14 hours ago, appetite4illusions said:

I have more than a feeling that David is going to be a full fledged villain in this film.

 

While he should make for a very formidable bad-guy, one of the things that I thought was so genius about the way Damon Lindelof wrote David was that he straddled the line between being heroic and being horrific. He did good things, he did bad things, but he was neither good nor bad. He was curious. You couldn't apply normal motivations to his character because he wasn't human, he didn't process thought the way humans do. He still had a touch of the sentimental in him. Remember how he loved to watch people dream?

More than anything else, Damon Lindelof hit it out of the park with David. He took a character that was just a stock-villain android in Jon Spaiht's script and turned him into one of the most fascinatingly ambiguous synthetics in all of sci-fi films.

 

Now that we're into the next movie, they may not be so careful as to keep David in a morally grey area. If he indeed created the Aliens as it seems like its shaping up to be, then he is the devil responsible for everything in the franchise. Like I said, while he will be an extremely formidable bad-guy, it kind of cheapens the great tightrope walking they did in Prometheus by not painting him with such a broad brush.

Great post. It's a shame they had to scrape all the Engineers stuff and go back to Alien. I would LOVE to see David dealing with more Engineers in Paradise. Really wanted Prometheus 2 to happen with Shaw and David.

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4 hours ago, maynard said:

Great post. It's a shame they had to scrape all the Engineers stuff and go back to Alien. I would LOVE to see David dealing with more Engineers in Paradise. Really wanted Prometheus 2 to happen with Shaw and David.

The next movie is set between Covenant and Prometheus so you might yet get your wish. 

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