How bad do you want a vinyl box set in 2017 from GNR?

[willl]

I think the music industry has changed far too much to warrant a new studio release from GN'R. It would be great for us to hear some new tunes, but realistically they can just keep shitting money out on the road touring so why would they bother? How would the band benefit from releasing a new album, or re-release of any kind?

Streaming, download, vinyl and CD sales are a drop in the ocean compared to touring and merch.

They could "do it for the fans", but the huge majority of fans seem quite happy just seeing Axl, Slash and Duff play Sweet Child o Mine live instead of hearing new music.

I don't like it, you don't like it, none of us here like it. But we're the diehards posting on the forums, we account for less than 100,000 fans - GNR can draw that number of people paying $100+ each for a gig ticket over just 1 or 2 nights

I honestly do question why Izzy continues releasing his solo music at times. I have no idea how many copies he sells when he puts a new song on iTunes, but I'm guessing he would need to sell at least a couple of thousand downloads at $0.99 each just to cover his overheads (studio time, mixing, mastering, licensing for cover songs, paying his band members and guest musicians etc). In an interview back in 2006 he said he paid $800 per day just for the studio time alone. Izzy can knock out a killer album in a couple of weeks, but imagine the costs involved for GNR

If we do get anything at all new, or old stuff remastered/remixed, I'd be certain they're doing it purely for the fans and not for the paycheck

[AxlRoseCDII]

5 hours ago, JimmyPage said:

I don't need a vinyl box set of already released material.

As a Guns N' Roses fan what I want is new material.

Although, I do think a "Chinese Democracy" boxset would be interesting! I would love if they did something akin to the "Let It Be...Naked" project, some of the overdubs and mixing decisions on the released version of "Chinese Democracy" make me scratch my head sometimes. Why out of all the takes Axl must've done for the vocals of "Sorry" did he pick the take with the faux Jamaican accent? Why is there a random saloon piano in "Catcher in the Rye"? Why is there an audible bleep in "Chinese Democracy"? Why is there auto - tune on "Street Of Dreams"? I could go on and on, I love the album, it could be better though.

What bleep do you mean? I'm not denying but if someone can show me a Timecode with a video that would be great. As for Street of Dreams, I don't believe any auto tune was used. 

[JimmyPage]

13 minutes ago, AxlRoseCDII said:

What bleep do you mean? I'm not denying but if someone can show me a Timecode with a video that would be great. As for Street of Dreams, I don't believe any auto tune was used. 

1:37

The vocals on "Street Of Dreams" most certainly do have auto - tune on the effects chain, if you doubt me listen to this video.

3:00 and on is where the auto - tune is especially apparent

 

 

Edited January 3, 2017 by JimmyPage

[AxlRoseCDII]

14 minutes ago, JimmyPage said:

1:37

The vocals on "Street Of Dreams" most certainly do have auto - tune on the effects chain, if you doubt me listen to this video.

3:00 and on is where the auto - tune is especially apparent

 

 

I'm on the fence on this one. Some parts you can make that argument but we also have to remember that the vocals in the specific video do just have effects from the artist isolating the vocal tracks. Any of you alumni or major CD fans on this forum have a definite answer?

[JimmyPage]

1 minute ago, AxlRoseCDII said:

I'm on the fence on this one. Some parts you can make that argument but we also have to remember that the vocals in the specific video do just have effects from the artist isolating the vocal tracks. Any of you alumni or major CD fans on this forum have a definite answer?

I'm an audio engineer by profession, I know auto - tune/pitch correction/melodyne when I hear it. 

None of the other tracks suffer from auto - tune use to the same extant that this song does, however, "Scraped" has some pretty horendous vocal editing. 

[wasted]

There's no auto-tune production credits in the CD booklet. I think Beavan produced most of the vocals and he might have used NIN and MM production techniques which captured Axl's vocals cleaner or higher than Clink. 

[wasted]

16 minutes ago, Wagszilla said:

The Beavan album was rumored to be the most "raw".

Raw like sushi. 

[JimmyPage]

40 minutes ago, wasted said:

There's no auto-tune production credits in the CD booklet. I think Beavan produced most of the vocals and he might have used NIN and MM production techniques which captured Axl's vocals cleaner or higher than Clink. 

I just looked at the vinyl copy I have of "Chinese Democracy" and that's true, however, just because something is not credited does not mean it wasn't used.

I've worked with bands in the past that replaced key members half way during the recording process, and instead of the band crediting the previous members contributions they choose to credit the current member that didn't contribute anything! 

Bands/Artists don't have to be completely honest when issuing credits, and many times they aren't honest.

[wasted]

37 minutes ago, JimmyPage said:

I just looked at the vinyl copy I have of "Chinese Democracy" and that's true, however, just because something is not credited does not mean it wasn't used.

I've worked with bands in the past that replaced key members half way during the recording process, and instead of the band crediting the previous members contributions they choose to credit the current member that didn't contribute anything! 

Bands/Artists don't have to be completely honest when issuing credits, and many times they aren't honest.

True, I've heard stories like that too. Kiss might be one for their reunion record?

 

 

[ludurigan]

i want new songs by axl, izzy, slash, duff and a good drummer (hopefully steven)

i want that real bad

i also want real bad anything unreleased from 1985-1991

i couldnt care less about reissues or about anything 1992-2016

i also couldnt care less about anything that axl slash and duff do with the richard the guitar player and frank the drumer but if they release anything new with these aliens i will at least try and listen to it to see how it sounds

i also couldnt care less if any music comes out on vynil or mp3 or any other fornat as long as it gets released

but really i want new axl izzy slash duff GNR music 

[JimmyPage]

1 hour ago, wasted said:

True, I've heard stories like that too. Kiss might be one for their reunion record?

 

 

Yeah, "reunion record". That album was just Gene and Paul with session musicians. 

I've had a couple of bands that I've worked with pull those kinds of stunts on former band members and it's always deplorable, but I like getting paid. I'd rather go along with the action instead of potentially having the band work with another producer/audio engineer and have my months of work go down the drain.

Edited January 3, 2017 by JimmyPage

[wasted]

16 minutes ago, JimmyPage said:

Yeah, "reunion record". That album was just Gene and Paul with session musicians. 

I've had a couple of bands that I've worked with pull those kinds of stunts on former band members and it's always deplorable, but I like getting paid. I'd rather go along with the action instead of potentially having the band work with another producer/audio engineer and have my months of work go down the drain.

I just think someone like Axl who likes to be seen as real, isn't going to be lip synching much. I'm not really sure if I'm against auto-tune, but in rock would seem strange. If the World is inhumanly high on helium though. I read Axl did Sorry line by line. So now we know why CD took so long. 

[JimmyPage]

2 minutes ago, wasted said:

I just think someone like Axl who likes to be seen as real, isn't going to be lip synching much. I'm not really sure if I'm against auto-tune, but in rock would seem strange. If the World is inhumanly high on helium though. I read Axl did Sorry line by line. So now we know why CD took so long. 

Oh, I don't think Axl is lip - syncing. However, there are a few songs on CD where the auto - tune is palpable. You also have to consider that those tracks had auto - tune added to them probably in the early 2000's, back then auto - tune didn't have the same stigma that surrounds it now.

[wasted]

26 minutes ago, JimmyPage said:

Oh, I don't think Axl is lip - syncing. However, there are a few songs on CD where the auto - tune is palpable. You also have to consider that those tracks had auto - tune added to them probably in the early 2000's, back then auto - tune didn't have the same stigma that surrounds it now.

Definitely has that sound to some of the vocals. That's why I thought ITW was a single, maybe the only song with crossover potential. It seemed sort like an autotune RNB vibe song. 

Is auto tune something artists hide or is it just something common? In pop world it seems de rigueur. Every other song has comical robot vocals. 

But what songs on CD are autotune, Shackler's seems processed or something. But's more Korn production. The whole compressed productiion make the vocals less rock. 

Edited January 3, 2017 by wasted
Believe

[JimmyPage]

1 hour ago, wasted said:

Definitely has that sound to some of the vocals. That's why I thought ITW was a single, maybe the only song with crossover potential. It seemed sort like an autotune RNB vibe song. 

Is auto tune something artists hide or is it just something common? In pop world it seems de rigueur. Every other song has comical robot vocals. 

But what songs on CD are autotune, Shackler's seems processed or something. But's more Korn production. The whole compressed productiion make the vocals less rock. 

It really depends on the kind of artist. Some bands/artists use auto - tune as an artistic option, some bands/artists use auto - tune to hide their lack of talent.

CD songs that have auto - tune: Street Of Dreams, Scraped, If The World and possibly Shackler's Revenge.

 

[Iron MikeyJ]

Here are my 2 cents.

First and foremost a NEW album Or Some sort of NEW music needs to happen. It could be as simple as a "Best of" album with CD era tracks either rerecorded with Slash and Duff or just put live versions from the current tour. Either way works for me, just NOT the versions that are on CD, because those songs will feel "out of place" now imo. Also include 2 or 3 absolutely NEW unheard songs. NEW music plus Slash and Duff on CD era songs like Better and others would make a "Best of" worth buying for all of us diehards, as well as casuals. But of course a completely new album is the best option, but my idea for a Best of us a good plan B.

Then after a year or two, THEN release a box set of not only CD leftovers but really empty the vault. Give songs like Bring it back home and other Illusion leftovers a proper release. The early versions of November Rain or cool live versions of Jungle could be included as well, like the VMA Jungle from 88 or 89. A box set like this would be interesting as well, mixing ALL eras of the band and really empty the vault. That way the CD leftovers finally get their day, and the fans that want those songs can finally hear them. 

But a box set like this will only work after either a new album or best of happens first. Fans are excepting the current line up, so releasing Buckethead songs now will just confuse everything, as well as possibly pissing off slash. 

Again, my 2 cents.

Edited January 3, 2017 by Iron MikeyJ

[kever20]

On 1/2/2017 at 8:49 AM, username said:

I wish they'd just do an epic 6-disc CD boxset really. It would be interesting too what songs were created when and with who and how they've evolved over time. Fill it with demo's for released songs and also all the unreleased material. There's supposed to be 2 more albums worth of songs. They could include a little book covering the history of the songs. You could have it span 1998-2008.  

I also still feel it should be called Chinese Leftovers and be packaged as: 

 

Ha! I may or may not have named the leaks and demos I may or may not have CHINESE TAKEOUT. 

[wasted]

9 hours ago, JimmyPage said:

It really depends on the kind of artist. Some bands/artists use auto - tune as an artistic option, some bands/artists use auto - tune to hide their lack of talent.

CD songs that have auto - tune: Street Of Dreams, Scraped, If The World and possibly Shackler's Revenge.

 

It seems like the tighter the music is the harder it is to fit a human vocal in. I see SOD as in that category. It doesn't overtly sound like auto-tune but it's intense. The Blues seemed like a more natural rock treatment. If the World is insanely high, when I saw Axl do it live it was more of a rock vocal. I think Young Gods is the first band I noticed this on. The music was pretty smooth and perfect because they used sampled guitars I think. But the vocal was pretty natural. So there was a disconnect. ITW with rasp was strange, it came over more like Heaven's Door with extra synths. 

Does auto-tune come under digital production? I wouldn't be surprised if there's some vocal manipulation on CD, it's such a patch work of things.

In reality even a natural sounding recording isn't really how it sounds. A mic isn't real. Some thought electric wasn't real. There must be a line. Gorillaz are a cartoon band. When I found out Murdock wasn't real I had to take the day off work. I imagine somewhere in Japan there's 100% hologram pop star. 

All these tech things mean that the artist can push the music beyond what humans can do. That's not really what rock is known for. Maybe that's why rock is ashamed of it. It's all about authenticity of the soul. The voice as the scream of the soul. If you digital it then it's seen as not real. 

Korn, NIN are the only bands I listen to that use technology to that degree. Radiohead maybe. CD is walking that line between syntgetic and human, like any soundtrack to any fake Terminator movie should. Axl vs The Machines. 

Once the music enters this sort of synthetic arena, the vocals have to blend more. We know Axl could still do raspy type stuff as heard on Baz's solo record. So I guess his voice becomes like another instrument on CD. That's frustrating sometimes. I once heard a Piano and Vocals mix of Prostitute and it was cool just to hear Axl's vocals. CD is more a digital wall of sound Axl was cryogenically frozen in. 

Edited January 4, 2017 by wasted

[Apollo]

On January 2, 2017 at 10:49 AM, username said:

I wish they'd just do an epic 6-disc CD boxset really. It would be interesting too what songs were created when and with who and how they've evolved over time. Fill it with demo's for released songs and also all the unreleased material. There's supposed to be 2 more albums worth of songs. They could include a little book covering the history of the songs. You could have it span 1998-2008.  

I also still feel it should be called Chinese Leftovers and be packaged as: 

 

This is the most fan friendly thing that Axl could do. Just totally clear out the vault. 

That's a huge Thank You to the fans that have supported Axl since the 80s. 

And then allows Axl to move foreword with Slash/Duff without any baggage to carry with him. 

[Silent Jay]

4 minutes ago, Apollo said:

This is the most fan friendly thing that Axl could do. Just totally clear out the vault. 

That's a huge Thank You to the fans that have supported Axl since the 80s. 

And then allows Axl to move foreword with Slash/Duff without any baggage to carry with him. 

That's nonsense. People all over the world are expecting to hear Slash and Duff on the next potential new album. This will only bring more confusion into millions of fans as to where those songs stand and who's playing those. Imagine the madness Chinese Democracy gathered when released, and bring that to eleven. Almost suicidal.

You can't clear out the vault with forty songs out of nowhere and not even play them live. Those songs might be as important as any guns n' roses song in Axl's mind. That's a enormous baggage to carry. I'd rather wait a few more years and have a bunch of the vault properly delivered with or without Slash.

I'm expecting a new album and a new tour. Not a scrapped boxset unless Guns N' Roses has finally been put to rest. Axl is forging ahead with Slash and Duff and his mysterious vault in whole new horizon. Well I'm only hoping.

 

[Rovim]

17 hours ago, JimmyPage said:

It really depends on the kind of artist. Some bands/artists use auto - tune as an artistic option, some bands/artists use auto - tune to hide their lack of talent.

CD songs that have auto - tune: Street Of Dreams, Scraped, If The World and possibly Shackler's Revenge.

 

The last line of This I Love as well (I'll never say GOODBYYYYYYEEEEEEE) can't you hear it? listen closely.

Edited January 4, 2017 by Rovim

[Apollo]

16 hours ago, Silent Jay said:

That's nonsense. People all over the world are expecting to hear Slash and Duff on the next potential new album. This will only bring more confusion into millions of fans as to where those songs stand and who's playing those. Imagine the madness Chinese Democracy gathered when released, and bring that to eleven. Almost suicidal.

You can't clear out the vault with forty songs out of nowhere and not even play them live. Those songs might be as important as any guns n' roses song in Axl's mind. That's a enormous baggage to carry. I'd rather wait a few more years and have a bunch of the vault properly delivered with or without Slash.

I'm expecting a new album and a new tour. Not a scrapped boxset unless Guns N' Roses has finally been put to rest. Axl is forging ahead with Slash and Duff and his mysterious vault in whole new horizon. Well I'm only hoping.

 

We can agree to disagree. 

Those millions of fans have access to the Internet and within 39 seconds can see who played on what songs. Lol - suicidal? It's just a rock and roll record.

I would love for my favorite singer to clean out his vault and share music that he's been talking about for a decade. 

You would rather wait - and trust - Axl, with one album in the last 25 years, to write, record and release an album from scratch. 

Not sure why both are wishes wouldn't work though. You don't expect a new album for a couple years. Why not a box set tomorrow and a new album by the current band in two years?

[Silent Jay]

15 hours ago, Rovim said:

The last line of This I Love as well (I'll never say GOODBYYYYYYEEEEEEE) can't you hear it? listen closely.

It's unclear to me. It's plausible he's using some sort of autotune to enhance the precision of the notes or the length (see below 4:56-4:59 sounds fishy), but never to hide his capabilities.

He said in 2006 the auto-tune makes it easier but as far as I'm concern he nails that final part every time he sings it live, not like the 'I'd do anything for youuuuuuu' scream or 'it's such a crime you know it's truuuuue' scream.

 

That's easily why the first part of Madagascar is personally his best vocals on the album, and presumably his oldest on the record (between '98-'01?), authentic voice without any superficial effects.

0:24-1:35/1:17-1:30 scream

 

Edited January 5, 2017 by Silent Jay

[Silent Jay]

49 minutes ago, Apollo said:

We can agree to disagree. 

Those millions of fans have access to the Internet and within 39 seconds can see who played on what songs. Lol - suicidal? It's just a rock and roll record.

I would love for my favorite singer to clean out his vault and share music that he's been talking about for a decade. 

You would rather wait - and trust - Axl, with one album in the last 25 years, to write, record and release an album from scratch. 

Not sure why both are wishes wouldn't work though. You don't expect a new album for a couple years. Why not a box set tomorrow and a new album by the current band in two years?

The Sweet Child O' Mine fans don't have enough time to study the band. I tell you, there is still fans that believe Slash wrote a few Chinese songs and so on. The Sweet Child O' Mine fans don't have the time to learn Paul Huge Tobias and Ron Bumblefoot Thal were in the band. All they know Guns N' Roses today is Axl and Slash, and that's why I said it's suicidal for a marketing point of view.

I can also say with certainty that what's in the vault will be more valuable to us than anything Slash and Duff can bring in a span of two years. I don' think Axl would have scrapped November Rain or Estranged for that neither.

Fo a marketing point of view, the next thing that should be announced after that 'biggest reunion of the 21st century' that isn't live content or greatest hits content, real life memory erasing content of the monstrosity Chinese Democracy caused to those Sweet Child O' Mine fans on daily basis, should be a proper new album, or double album, or tri... not Chinese Democracy: The Leftovers. My two cents of course.

[Rovim]

14 hours ago, Silent Jay said:

It's unclear to me. It's plausible he's using some sort of autotune to enhance the precision of the notes or the length (see below 4:56-4:59 sounds fishy), but never to hide his capabilities.

He said in 2006 the auto-tune makes it easier but as far as I'm concern he nails that final part every time he sings it live, not like the 'I'd do anything for youuuuuuu' scream or 'it's such a crime you know it's truuuuue' scream.

 

 

I assure you, it's clear as day. He is using autotune in that "goodbye", on the last line of This I Love. I agree he nails that final part live, but it doesn't matter. In the final studio version he is 100% uses autotune.