Guns n' Roses "small catalogue" is a myth

[tsinindy]

2 hours ago, sonofnazareth said:

UFO's 1974-1982 catalogue blows GNR's away.

I don't think that's necessarily true. Did they release a lot of albums in that time frame?  Sure, what like 11?

But none of them were longer than 40 minutes.....and they are all good records.  I love UFO, but back in the 70s it was commonplace to pump out 30-40 minute records like it was candy.

But, no matter how you slice it I guess UFO still put out double the amount of music in just those 8 years or so that GnR have put out in total.   So yah, I guess maybe you are right thinking of it like that.

This whole thread is stupid anyway lol

Edited January 12, 2017 by tsinindy

[sibidy7]

How about we look at it not by albums but original compositions released.

GNR released 44 original songs totalling 207 minutes.

Spread that out over 2 albums, 10 albums, 100 albums, it's a pretty small body of original work.

Take it even a step further and the bulk of those songs were written in a very, very short period of time, maybe a couple of months.  GNR were really just a burst of energy between 5 people during a couple month span of time.

 

Of course a number of songs were written later but a ton of UYI was written when they were writing appetite.

BUT.... it's some of the best work ever recorded.

[Rovim]

4 minutes ago, sibidy7 said:

How about we look at it not by albums but original compositions released.

GNR released 44 original songs totalling 207 minutes.

Spread that out over 2 albums, 10 albums, 100 albums, it's a pretty small body of original work.

Take it even a step further and the bulk of those songs were written in a very, very short period of time, maybe a couple of months.  GNR were really just a burst of energy between 5 people during a couple month span of time.

 

Of course a number of songs were written later but a ton of UYI was written when they were writing appetite.

BUT.... it's some of the best work ever recorded.

I don't think you can really do that. Live And Let Die sounds like a Guns tune for example. KOHD sounds nothing like Dylan's version. These tunes were huge hits for the band, and a part of what makes Illusions what it is. (like it or hate it)

 

Edited January 12, 2017 by Rovim

[sibidy7]

@frontman

I just did it because its the truth.  I don't care what you think they sound like.  They are cover songs written by somebody else.

 

Get over it.

 

 

 

[Rovim]

@Newbie

Just because those are cover songs doesn't mean you can just discount them like that. They're part of the musical statement. It went through an artistic process and these tunes were made to sound like Guns tunes and managed to find a huge audience and become part of the albums.

The truth is they can't even do a show without KOHD and Live And Let Die for example. Or take other artists that really fuckin' nailed it like Jimi, would you not count All Along The Watchtower?

Mama Kin and Nice Boys are not original Gn'R tunes, but I count 4 Gn'R tunes on Live Like A Suicide cause they chose to feature it on their album. (with original material on it as well)

 

Edited January 13, 2017 by Rovim

[Free Bird]

4 minutes ago, Rovim said:

Just because those are cover songs doesn't mean you can just discount them like that. They're part of the musical statement. It went through an artistic process and these tunes were made to sound like Guns tunes and managed to find a huge audience and become a part of the albums.

The truth is they can't even do a show without KOHD and Live And Let Die for example. Or take for example other artists that really fuckin' nailed it like Jimi, would you not count All Along The Watchtower?

Mama Kin and Nice Boys are not original Gn'R tunes, but I count 4 Gn'R tunes on Live Like A Suicide cause they chose to feature it on their album. (with original material on it as well)

 

You can count them as released material, but not as their own songs. They aren't. Though I get what you are saying. They worked hard on those songs and took them to another level but they were written by somebody else and they wouldn't exist if it weren't for Dylan and McCartney. 

[Rovim]

5 minutes ago, Free Bird said:

You can count them as released material, but not as their own songs. They aren't. Though I get what you are saying. They worked hard on those songs and took them to another level but they were written by somebody else and they wouldn't exist if it weren't for Dylan and McCartney. 

30 tunes on Illusions... at least that's how I look at it. 4 tunes on Live Like A Suicide. It's not just Guns. I don't know... take Sweet Dreams that was covered by Marilyn Manson. It's not the same as a totally new tune, but it still counts.

Edited January 12, 2017 by Rovim

[Zurimor]

3 minutes ago, Free Bird said:

You can count them as released material, but not as their own songs. They aren't. Though I get what you are saying. They worked hard on those songs and took them to another level but they were written by somebody else and they wouldn't exist if it weren't for Dylan and McCartney. 

Cover versions actually are "own" songs, for any artist.

Edited January 12, 2017 by Zurimor

[Rovim]

Best example I can think of is Cash covering "Hurt" by Trent. Trent said he considers that tune a Cash tune ever since he heard Johnny's take on it.

Edit: or Life By The Drop by SRV. (and more than half of his catalog)

Edited January 12, 2017 by Rovim

[Padme]

44 minutes ago, sibidy7 said:

@frontman

I just did it because its the truth.  I don't care what you think they sound like.  They are cover songs written by somebody else.

 

Get over it.

 

 

 

It is true that songs like KOHD and LALD are covers. But the GN'R versions (in my opinion) are by far much better. And GN'R made them hits. I don't need them in every single show. But 40k out of 50k people attending shows right now whant to listen those songs

[tsinindy]

18 minutes ago, Padme said:

It is true that songs like KOHD and LALD are covers. But the GN'R versions (in my opinion) are by far much better. And GN'R made them hits. I don't need them in every single show. But 40k out of 50k people attending shows right now whant to listen those songs

Both songs were hits when they were relased by the original artist.  LALD reached number 2 for McCartney and Wings, KOHD peaked at 12 for Dylan.  Guns N Roses didn't "make the songs hits", but they were hits for Guns N Roses when they covered them as well.  I do agree the GnR versions are the most enjoyable versions of both songs.  

Edited January 12, 2017 by tsinindy

[Padme]

2 minutes ago, tsinindy said:

Both songs were hits when they were relased by the original artist.  LALD reached number 2 for McCartney and Wings, KOHD peaked at 12 for Dylan.  Guns N Roses didn't "make the songs hits", but they were hits for Guns N Roses when they covered them as well.  I do agree the GnR versions are the most enjoyable versions of both songs.  

Yeah but a lot of people were not even born when those songs became hits at the time the original artists release them. Both of them became MTV hits also thanks to GN'R. LALD, the video and KOHD, The Ritz show. In my case I bothered to listen to the originals. And I was like meh. That's not the case when I listen to the GN'R versions

[Zurimor]

3 hours ago, tsinindy said:

Both songs were hits when they were relased by the original artist.  LALD reached number 2 for McCartney and Wings, KOHD peaked at 12 for Dylan.  Guns N Roses didn't "make the songs hits", but they were hits for Guns N Roses when they covered them as well.  I do agree the GnR versions are the most enjoyable versions of both songs.  

I really like Dylan's version of Knocking on Heaven's Door. And Clapton's!

[Free Bird]

6 hours ago, Padme said:

It is true that songs like KOHD and LALD are covers. But the GN'R versions (in my opinion) are by far much better. And GN'R made them hits. I don't need them in every single show. But 40k out of 50k people attending shows right now whant to listen those songs

I have to disagree. GNRs studio version of KOHD has an amazing first half but right after the second solo it becomes a total mess. Unfortunately I can't think of anybody else in the band who could have come up with such ideas like that stupid phone call or that womens chor than Axl, that totally destroys the studio version for me. Like I said, it starts beautyful with an amazing Axl in a lower register and without Guns we would never have these amazing sounding guitar solos that makes this song their own in some way but they should have let fade it out with the second solo IMO.

LALD never did anything for me.

[Apollo]

Only on this forum do people praise and even say they prefer  their favorite band only to have a few albums.

You guys must have been really dissapointed when GnR released the Illusions. Two 70 minutes albums released at once....You complained to all your friends and wrote letter to Hit Parader bashing GnR for not being more selective. Right?

You are also insinuating that Axl isn't talented enough to create quality music without Izzy/Slash and Duff. That's a wild thing to say about your idol (quality over quantity argument) 

It really does just blow the mind. Rock fans saying it's better for their  favorite bands to not create and share their music on a regular basis. I guess you guys are glad you weren't alive in the 70s and 80s. Band use to share music with their fans on a yearly basis. Gasp - sometimes bands released two albums per year. Oddly enough - fans loved it and never complained. 

Its a weird world we live in today. Fans being happy their favorite band doesn't release music. I will never understand that way of thinking. 

Personally I would kill to own 15 GnR or Axl Rose albums. Even if only 4-5 of them were classics and the other 10 ranged from being average to really great. 

[Apollo]

6 hours ago, Padme said:

Yeah but a lot of people were not even born when those songs became hits at the time the original artists release them. Both of them became MTV hits also thanks to GN'R. LALD, the video and KOHD, The Ritz show. In my case I bothered to listen to the originals. And I was like meh. That's not the case when I listen to the GN'R versions

But that's just personal preference. Go to a Dylan board or a McCartney board and whose versions do they choose?

This is a GnR forum. So obviously most people here will pick the GnR cover versions. 

But that really has nothing - literally nothing - to do in terms of judging whether or not GnR has a small catalog or not.  

[wasted]

It was kind of my experience with UYI that made me think maybe just one double record of material at once is better. I was completely lost. While I was rewinding the tape to listen to RNDTH and DNB again I felt this pressure to listen to UYI II. I couldn't digest NR, Coma, Estranged, Breakdown, Locomotive. I made a tape of RNDTH, Perfect Crime, Garden of Eden and Shotgun blues and basically hardly listened to the albuns again In full. Once I got the cds I dipped into them one track at a time. It was a different experience and made GNR a different band to me. I put on little clusters of songs. Like the first 4 off each cd. Or Dead Horse and Coma. Breakdown is a stand alone song. 

I think what I learned was I like records of 9/10 tracks. Like Dylan albums or Stones albums are sometimes. 

I think I did listen to the UYI cds back to back a few years ago. It's a huge undertaking and a little tiring. The vinyl makes more sense: RNDTH, Dust, Live, Cry, Perfect - that's enough. 

[DieselDaisy]

1 hour ago, Apollo said:

Only on this forum do people praise and even say they prefer  their favorite band only to have a few albums.

Beaten up house wife syndrome. No matter how much he knocks her around, she returns and even finds things to praise about him.

[Padme]

2 hours ago, Free Bird said:

I have to disagree. GNRs studio version of KOHD has an amazing first half but right after the second solo it becomes a total mess. Unfortunately I can't think of anybody else in the band who could have come up with such ideas like that stupid phone call or that womens chor than Axl, that totally destroys the studio version for me. Like I said, it starts beautyful with an amazing Axl in a lower register and without Guns we would never have these amazing sounding guitar solos that makes this song their own in some way but they should have let fade it out with the second solo IMO.

LALD never did anything for me.

You don't like the GN'R album version? Fine, I don't like the current live version. I like The Ritz version. Still that doesn't changes the fact that most people attending the shows want to see the band play KOHD and LALD.  Do I need those songs every show? No, but besides me there are 50k people at the venue. And quite frankly I'd rather listen to KOHD and LALD than TIL, CD, Better or CITR

2 hours ago, Apollo said:

But that's just personal preference. Go to a Dylan board or a McCartney board and whose versions do they choose?

This is a GnR forum. So obviously most people here will pick the GnR cover versions. 

But that really has nothing - literally nothing - to do in terms of judging whether or not GnR has a small catalog or not.  

Well the debate made a turn to covers. I didn't start the covers debate. So don't blame me if the covers debate have nothing to do with their catalog

[Free Bird]

20 minutes ago, Padme said:

You don't like the GN'R album version? Fine, I don't like the current live version. I like The Ritz version. Still that doesn't changes the fact that most people attending the shows want to see the band play KOHD and LALD.  Do I need those songs every show? No, but besides me there are 50k people at the venue. And quite frankly I'd rather listen to KOHD and LALD than TIL, CD, Better or CITR.

The Ritz version is superb. As is the Marquee version. One of the reasons I became a Guns fan.

[wasted]

Heavens door and Live n let Die are GNR songs to me. 

[wasted]

3 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Beaten up house wife syndrome. No matter how much he knocks her around, she returns and even finds things to praise about him.

You really relate an album getting delayed to getting beaten up? 

 I mean I only really noticed it was a bit late in 2004. The only delay was 2006 for me. I had no idea Axl was beating me in 99, 2000, 2001. I wish I could go back and feel the pain. It's getting fight club up in here. 

I always thought Axl was just under a pile of models and couldn't get out to finish the record. I reapect that. If I felt he was delaying his record just to annoy me I'd be disappointed. 

[Rovim]

26 minutes ago, wasted said:

You really relate an album getting delayed to getting beaten up? 

 I mean I only really noticed it was a bit late in 2004. The only delay was 2006 for me. I had no idea Axl was beating me in 99, 2000, 2001. I wish I could go back and feel the pain. It's getting fight club up in here. 

I always thought Axl was just under a pile of models and couldn't get out to finish the record. I reapect that. If I felt he was delaying his record just to annoy me I'd be disappointed. 

I think you're in denial and should probably sue. who knows? maybe this abusive relationship has caused some of us to turn to booze and illegal substances as a way to escape the pain of having too small of a catalog to listen to. Think about it. Be honest with yourself. Axl owes us a public apology and punitive damages for letting his life get in the way.

Edited January 13, 2017 by Rovim

[DieselDaisy]

11 minutes ago, Rovim said:

I think you're in denial and should probably sue. Who knows? maybe this abusive relationship has caused some of us to turn to booze and illegal substances as a way to escape the pain of having too small of a catalog to listen to. Think about it. Be honest with yourself. Axl owes us a public apology and punitive damages for letting his life get in the way.

He must be in denial. He has conjured up about four more gnr albums out of thin air and added them to the discography.

[Rovim]

27 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

He must be in denial. He has conjured up about four more gnr albums out of thin air and added them to the discography.

Clearly he couldn't handle the truth and thought up an alternate reality in his head where Axl did not bully us to put up with his joke of a catalog. Classic case of Stockholm syndrome. Poor fella has developed a fucked up coping mechanism where he truly believes Axl has released enough albums to satisfy his musical needs. He should be banned for his own good. I'm worried for his mental stability. We should stage an intervention before it's too late.

Edited January 13, 2017 by Rovim