GNR Women's Discussion - Part 2

[killuridols]

25 minutes ago, Natty said:

Hi I dont know anything at all and you seem to have some inside knowledge..however I personally dont steem Axl less if he did that. It has nothing to do with what we love, his voice his songwriting his stage presence , and so on.. this cannot be damaged in my opinion. 

I am sure he had his reasons if he did it. Not our business. 

I can think of worse than that to survive. 

If Axl was an asshole when he was younger..possible..but still I love him. 

He is such a unique person even if I dont know him personally..

That's fine. I don't know why you are telling me this, though

I dont love Axl. I appreciate him as an artist, singer, musician....etc.... I love his music, his art. But the man, I don't know that guy at all so I can't love him.

I have an slight idea of whom he might be because I've been lucky enough to talk to people who DO know him for real but it is still vicarious knowledge.

 

21 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

Well he seemed to notice what a subhuman piece of shit heroin user he was 

I wonder where he got his information from then. 

Maybe Axl did stuff to his parents that we don't know?? disrespected them, abused them?

As for heroin, he could have found some evidence lying anywhere in the room, in the trash can....

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

You misunderstand. I did not call the guy an asshole or a douchebag or whatever because he was saying mean things about Axl, I was referring to the kind of rhetoric he used. Sub-human for example? That's Nazi rhetoric. You don't go around calling other people sub-human. "Male-hooray for tolerance! prostitute" is pretty distasteful as well. I don't like people who talk like that because only assholes talk like that. I assume most people here feel the same way and I saw no one get offended just because he said nasty things about Axl.

Omg, what do you expect from guys like this? That they express themselves like academics?

Come on... they talk like that because that's the way they talk. Axl talked and talks like this too.... the other day didn't he call a security guy "fuckhead"?? Amazing vocabulaire, wow, applause

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

Call it scientific curiosity or whatever you want, but I'd actually be very interested in hearing all the 'damaging' shit you think Axl might have done to him. Sadly, he's not there anymore to rant some more about it and shed some light on Axl's early years in L.A.

I don't know what exactly he did to him for him to be so spiteful but why do we have to jump on him like Axl could have never done anything really shitty to this guy?

One thing Axl used to do and that most men find really really shitty and always fight over is him screwing the women of "friends". He did it to Slash, he did it to Steven and he must have done it to a lot other people (I think one of his friends from Indiana said something along those lines too). Maybe, Axl screwed some girlfriend of Jagosz or stole something he appreciated or shit all over his bed or badmouthed him somewhere.....

Possibilities are endless and just because you wouldn't hold a grudge for 30 years doesn't mean other people do not. Some people are resentful and resented forever. Not everybody has the intelligence to process and understand anger. Axl himself was resentful towards Slash for over 2 decades.... so what the hell are we talking about???

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

Do you still have the original interview somewhere?

It would be interesting to see the context of that quote and what else he had to say about Axl.

No, I don't have it. That's what I said. I looked for it with zero results.

I want to read it too so to able to figure out something else.

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

Dead Guy #2 sounds a bit friendlier towards Axl from the way you make it sound.

Did he have an axe to grind with Axl too or was he just talking about that in more neutral sort of way? Also, "I think he mentioned..."? "He" being Axl? Or someone else? Because it would surprise me if Axl had actually told someone about doing this (except someone he was really close to, like Izzy, Duff or Slash maybe).

Lol. Dead Guy #2 was a bit bipolar sometimes he would hate Axl and others be kind or neutral..

Hmmm... I don't know. I think that with time he was able to overcome whatever little grudge he had with Axl. He was able to understand some things were not meant to be and that's it.

"I think he mentioned..." yes, that would be Axl.

Slash and Duff had not come to Axl's life yet. Izzy... who knows where he was by then. Axl was on his own.

 

Edited July 16, 2017 by killuridols

[Blackstar]

Wow, the thread is "hot" again and I can barely catch up...

7 hours ago, Frey said:

There you go (I put in under a spoiler tag, so anyone who doesn't wanna read some pretty nasty comments about Axl can avoid reading them):

  Hide contents

http://sleazeroxx.com/original-l-a-guns-vocalist-michael-jagosz-passes-away/

 

Original L.A. Guns vocalist Michael Jagosz passed away on March 9th at the age of 48.

Jagosz fronted L.A Guns during their formative years. The singer first performed with the band in 1983, eventually being replaced by Axl Rose while serving a week long sentence in the county jail after a bar fight. Jagosz would in turn replace Rose and together L.A Guns released a four song EP entitled ‘Collector’s Edition No. 1’ in 1985 containing the songs “Don’t Love Me”, “When Dreams Don’t Follow Through”, “It’s Not True”, and “Something Heavy” — the tracks would eventually resurface as a bonus disc on the 2004 release ‘Hollywood Raw: The Original Sessions’.

No details have emerged about the cause of death, but the final post on Jagosz’ Facebook page is the cryptic “I’m drowning.”

L.A. Guns founder Tracii Guns remembered Jagosz fondly by saying, “the last time I hung out with Mike Jagosz was a few years ago at The Venice Beach Music Fest and we had a lot of laughs that day and that’s how I will remember him with that giant smile! I hope peace and Mike have found each other. We recorded the first L.A. Guns EP together at 18 years old which both of our first real studio experience. He is also the first singer I ever wrote and performed with. I always wished he could find a great metal band to front and why that didn’t happen is beyond my scope of understanding. He was very influenced by UFO , Dio and Ian Gillan. He had the killer metal pipes!” Sylent Storm member Jym Harris also confirmed the death. “We had our ‘differences’ over the years but last time I talked to him (on February 28th) he was determined to make good with me about everything. I had no idea he was dying. Makes sense now. RIP my friend, you will be missed.”

In a 2011 interview with the Proud2BeLoud blog Jagosz lashed out at Axl Rose. “To tell you the Jesus Christ truth… William Bailey was only in the group for two fuckin weeks. I tried to give him vocal lessons… but, he sucked. Voted “least likely to ever make it”. He always was a pathetic sub-human being. He lived at my parent’s house for over six months… sponging off us and doing heroin. What a little fag*ot. Come to find out, he was a male-fag*ot prostitute at the time — L-O-S-E-R. He sold his asshole to gay men for money. But, he made 70 million. He was a real piece of work, he was/is a parasite. A real sack of shit.”

In the same interview Jagosz had kinder words for former bandmate Tracii Guns. “Tracii tried to save me from getting arrested. I was drunk, wanting to drive… he hid my keys. I was actually out of the group just after doing the EP. Tracii Guns was a true brother. Gotta love him. Successor to Randy’s throne.” When asked what he thought of the direction L.A Guns would eventually take Jagosz continued, “Hated it at first. We were metal, the 3-bar chord shit killed me. I thought Tracii was wayyyyyyyyy too talented to do that shit. Looking back though, he went commercial to sell. God bless Tracii, he saw what we couldn’t.”

Jagosz, born on December 13, 1965, is survived by his mother Rosa Caceres Jagosz, son Michael Jeffrey Jagosz and brother David Jagosz. A private memorial is planned for April 1, 2014.

It's worse than I remembered actually

Thoughts?

Obviously, the guy seems like a complete douchebag. I mean... "Male-fag*ot prostitute"? "Pathetic sub-human"? Really?!

Usually, I wouldn't take anyone who talks like that seriously anyway, but I just can't figure out why he hates Axl so much. It's not like Axl stole his place in L.A. Guns and then went on to become super successfull with them.

Is he just jealous because Axl made it big and he didn't? Or still mad about the time Axl lived with his family? It's strange to me that the guy could still be so bitter about Axl "sponging off of his family for six months" about three decades later (and why didn't they just kick him out if they didn't like having him around?).

Is he actually telling the truth or did he just try to come up with the most damaging thing he could say about another man in his mind (i.e. letting yourself get fucked by other guys for money)?

For what it's worth, @killuridols says she knows of another guy who knew Axl back then who apparently made the same claims about him. I don't know the details about that one though, maybe she can tell us if they match up with what Mr. Jagosz was claiming here.

The guy's venomous hatred for Axl certainly takes away from his credibility. Moreover, his description of Axl doesn't match with the way other musicians (Tracii Guns, Chris Weber, Kevin Lawrence etc) who knew him at about the same period have described him (of course I'm talking only about things said in public and not stories/rumours/hearsay going around or people have shared with fans etc, which I have no idea about). It's not impossible, however, that there's some truth to what he says, especially if there are also "rumours".

As for where the hatred comes from, the first logical assumption that can be made (again, being in speculation territory) is jealousy (like @Lumikki and @Rocketqueen76 said) because a guy whom Jagosz probably saw as a nobody from Indiana and a bad singer (from what he says it seems that he considered anything other than heavy metal-y technical singing bad) made it and he didn't. But besides that, there are a couple of other possible reasons I can think of.

Another musician, this guy Nadir from the band London, said in an interview that Axl had fucked his girlfriend but he didn't want to say more about it (according to Tracii Guns there was some kind of beef between this guy and Axl and Axl beat him up in the end). I think I've read 1-2 other stories like that, and we also know that Axl did this with Slash's girlfriend too. As much as "dispensable" girlfriends were for these guys, this thing would surely hurt their male pride. And if Jagosz had provided Axl a place to stay and Axl returned the favour with something like this, it's expected that he would've held grudge; and, if there's truth in the part about Axl selling himself to guys for money, then learning (supposing that he heard about it later) that the guy who had taken his girlfriend was a "fag" would make it even harder to bear.

Another thing is that, when GnR made it, probably many people that knew them before/were in bands with them approached them asking for favours of any kind, from money to pushing their demos to the label or have their bands open for them. So if the guy expected something from Axl (because he thought Axl owed him) and didn't get it, maybe it explains the bitterness to an extent.

------

On another note, I enjoyed all the reviews, pictures and gifs here

Now I'm looking forward for the Apollo (although I don't have hopes for any big surprises, see AFD5) and St. Louis shows.

Edited July 16, 2017 by Blackstar
typos

[Frey]

10 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

14 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Why would he notice?

If Axl did those things I don't think he would take the "men" to Jagosz house

Besides, Jagosz a bit younger than Axl, I think..... He could have been pretty naive to those things happening.

Remember we are talking about people barely in their twenties, not adults that would pay attention to lots of things and "warnings" and "alerts".

Also, people like Axl, Jagosz and the rest did not care a lot about the others, what they did, where they stayed, etc... It is assumed that everybody's ok, doing their thing, being free.... Also, it was a time of no cellphones, whatsapp and shit like that. People would be way more free to do whatever they wanted without having others constantly checking on them.

Well he seemed to notice what a subhuman piece of shit heroin user he was 

I wonder where he got his information from then. 

22 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

This Jagosz says "come to found out, he was a male prostitute at the time"

So, he found this out later from some else? 

He didn't notice at the very time he lived with in his house for six months?

That's what it sounded to me like as well, yeah.

As @killuridols said, he probably wouldn't have brought back any johns to the Jagosz household*, but on the other hand what you said about him noticing every other awful thing Axl did makes sense too.

I also am curious where he got his information from.

*I'm not an expert on gay male prostitution in 80s L.A. (lol), but I assume most of this stuff probably happened in the back alleys, bars and toilets along Santa Monica Boulevard.

 

1 hour ago, Asia said:

As for the Jagosz guy... well, sorry but it's such an outburst of hate that it doesn't make one word he says sound in any way credible. I'm not saying it's impossible he's right but this kind of statement doesn't add anything to the discussion, because it's more like a lithany of swear words than anything else. He could as well say Axl killed virgins and drank their blood.

What the truth is nobody knows. I said I don't think Axl would but I don't know. If you rememeber there's still this very weird interview with Alan Niven, where he questioned Axl's heterosexuality. Also the famous Axl-Slash relationship was without a doubt a very affectionate one at some point of their lives. I never thought of it and still don't as being sexual in the full sense of this word but certainly very emotional and affectionate also in the physical aspect (there were shows when these guys just couldn't keep their hands off the other). But as far as I'm concerned this affection or love could as well have nothing to do with sex and be totally innocent, which I find quite likely.

Another thing is the general way of conduct of rock musicians. Years after we usually learn that many musicians considered hetersexual and actually being heterosexual experimented with men, cause the times were as they were - the best example here would be Mick Jagger - all the gossips about his romantic affairs with men.

In the context of all the above, it already seems less shocking to think it would concern these guys as well but who knows? That for certain is something they will never openly admit to, so we are doomed to be lost in doubt forever

I agree about the Slaxl issue.

And who knows. Especially now that they're starting to become household names again, there might be more people wanting to profit from their re-newed fame by selling some salacious stories to the media or writing some more books. The first ones have already started...

7 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Omg, what do you expect from guys like this? That they express themselves like academics?

Come on... they talk like that because that's the way they talk. Axl talked and talks like this too.... the other day didn't he call a security guy "fuckhead"?? Amazing vocabulaire, wow, applause

No, but "fuckhead" is just a childish, silly insult and calling someone that is mostly just dumb or ridiculous, while calling someone sub-human... is what I said it is, trust me.

7 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Maybe Axl did stuff to his parents that we don't know?? disrespected them, abused them?

As for heroin, he could have found some evidence lying anywhere in the room, in the trash can....

...

I don't know what exactly he did to him for him to be so spiteful but why do we have to jump on him like Axl could have never done anything really shitty to this guy?

One thing Axl used to do and that most men find really really shitty and always fight over is him screwing the women of "friends". He did it to Slash, he did it to Steven and he must have done it to a lot other people (I think one of his friends from Indiana said something along those lines too). Maybe, Axl screwed some girlfriend of Jagosz or stole something he appreciated or shit all over his bed or badmouthed him somewhere.....

Good guesses, yeah.

An example of the first point would be the way Axl treated Slash's grandma.

And yeah, maybe he did screw Jagosz's girlfriend or something, who knows. Hadn't thought of that, but might explain part of the bitterness at least.

7 minutes ago, killuridols said:

No, I don't have it. That's what I said. I looked for it with zero results.

I want to read it too so to able to figure out something else.

Lol. Dead Guy #2 was a bit bipolar sometimes he would hate Axl and others be kind or neutral..

Hmmm... I don't know. I think that with time he was able to overcome whatever little grudge he had with Axl. He was able to understand some things were not meant to be and that's it.

"I think he mentioned..." yes, that would be Axl.

Slash and Duff had not come to Axl's life yet. Izzy... who knows where he was by then. Axl was on his own.

What else do you want to figure out?

And I see. Somehow I assumed Dead Guy #2 was someone who knew Axl a bit later on. But if it was someone who was around Axl in the early 80s when Slash and Duff weren't around yet... hmm.....

 

22 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

I just realised that I didn't really respond to your other points so here it is...

Hmm... it kinda seems like Axl lived like a nomad at times (or perhaps a cat ). Now that you've mentioned that, I recall accounts from others that stated that Axl would randomly disappear, sometimes for weeks, and people would assume that he'd found another place to crash at. This behaviour even continued when they were living at the "hell house". What did he do / where did he go during this time?

Pretty cat-like indeed

But I've always wondered about this as well. I guess he could have just been staying with different people the other people didn't know about. Be they other friends, girlfriends/women or "clients". I also remember someone saying that Axl used to spend the nights in diners or restaurants sometimes, drinking coffee until sunrise.

22 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

Here is my interpretation of that part of the interview:-

When Niven said that it was originally as a response to whether misogynistic lyrics (and general shock factor) was the secret ingredient that made Gn'R more successful than other bands at the time. Niven starts of the answer by focusing on Axl alone, saying that Axl is driven on conflict and hate but "genderwise he is an equal opportunity junkyard dog". This might imply that Niven is defending Axl against accusations of misogyny and he further backs this by bringing up Sweet Child and Rocket Queen as lyrical moments showing "Axl as an angel". Then he takes a bit of a left turn and starts contemplating Axl's bisexuality, using his onstage costume and performance as supposed evidence. As you said, this could be (and probably is) Niven just being a dick but considering the fact that he also seems to be defending the sincerity of Axl's lyrics at the same time kinda leaves things up for interpretation imo.

Honestly, I only brought it up as it is one of the few instances I can recall off the top of my head where someone has outright called Axl's sexuality into question and was also closely associated with the band. For argument's sake, lets assume that this means that Niven did know about alleged prostitution, also assuming that it stopped well before Gn'R got signed, how would he have found out? Was it common knowledge around the strip? Perhaps, but like I said before common knowledge like that doesn't stay hidden for so long. So... did someone tell him? Did others in the band know?

Yeah, I remember Niven's statements the same way you do, but the entire thing is just plain weird. Can't believe I'm saying that, but I nearly wish Niven would give some interviews about Axl.

About Niven finding out, I assume someone would have told him, since he wasn't around when these things supposedly happened.

I don't think it was common knowledge exactly, because we would probably have heard some more about this then by now, because as you stay, stuff like this doesn't usually stay hidden for so long if many people know about it.

As for the other guys in the band knowing, yes, I could see that. Someone in the other thread mentioned Duff talking about things that only the guys inside the band know, that he won't even talk about with his wife and kids. Something like this could easily be the sort of thing he would never say a word about for Axl's (and everyone else's) sake. Then you have Slash, who has mentioned having all these long late-night conversations with Axl telling him all his deep dark secrets. It's possible Axl might have told him about something like this as well. Especially since Slash isn't a complete stranger to that kind of thing either if Steven is to be believed.

And Izzy of course. Who was the only one actually around when these things most likely took place (if they took place at all). And Axl's oldest friend out of the 5 of them. If anyone would know, it would probably him most likely. And Izzy was (is?) close with Niven. So he might have told Niven at some point? Though I could see Slash drunkenly telling Niven too. Or someone outside the band. Niven seems to have been a pretty shady guy himself, he probably knew all kinds of people and had his sources.

22 minutes ago, KiraMPD said:

Another thing that comes to mind when thinking about this subject is the story Slash tells in his book about the time he was sent to county jail for an old jaywalking charge and he later found out that Axl came up with the money for his bail while the other guys apparently had no idea that Slash was even missing (I might be remembering this wrong so please feel free to correct me). How did Axl come up with the money? (not saying that he got it via prostitution but something about that story just doesn't add up to me...)

I remember that story the same way.

Interesting theory though, I've never really looked at it from that angle.

Another slightly related story I can think of is all 5 of them apparently hanging out at a gay bar/club quite frequently for the all you can eat-buffet. I remember one of them (either Duff or Steven I think) saying that the food was worth it, you just had to clench your butt cheeks together real tight

Seeing at they were clearly familiar with the local hotspots for this type of thing, it probably wouldn't have been hard to find and pick up interested guys there.

 

@Blackstar Good post, but I should actually be doing other stuff than wasting my time here, so I'll have to get back to you later

 

 

[KiraMPD]

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

And Izzy of course. Who was the only one actually around when these things most likely took place (if they took place at all). And Axl's oldest friend out of the 5 of them. If anyone would know, it would probably him most likely. And Izzy was (is?) close with Niven. So he might have told Niven at some point?

My thoughts exactly. I find it unlikely that it came from Duff or Slash but Izzy has always been a lot more straight forward about shit like that. I have a few theories about the types of shenanigans Izzy and Axl might have got upto but I won't go into it now...

 

17 minutes ago, Frey said:

Another slightly related story I can think of is all 5 of them apparently hanging out at a gay bar/club quite frequently for the all you can eat-buffet. I remember one of them (either Duff or Steven I think) saying that the food was worth it, you just had to clench your butt cheeks together real tight

 

Edited July 16, 2017 by KiraMPD

[killuridols]

53 minutes ago, Frey said:

*I'm not an expert on gay male prostitution in 80s L.A. (lol), but I assume most of this stuff probably happened in the back alleys, bars and toilets along Santa Monica Boulevard.

Now that you mention this..... Something came to my mind and that is how paranoid Axl could have been about doing that in the 80's with all the talk about gay people having AIDS, "spreading a fucking disease" and what not.

This is another reason why I think he didn't do it further 1983.

57 minutes ago, Frey said:

No, but "fuckhead" is just a childish, silly insult and calling someone that is mostly just dumb or ridiculous, while calling someone sub-human... is what I said it is, trust me.

Come on, Frey...... ok, you want real bad stuff?

Axl called people "n**** & fa*****" in a song and recorded it for eternity.

He recorded another song insulting media guys with really awful stuff like "your daddy gets more p**** than you"

And I could paste the long vomitive shit he typed to a lady of this forum, in the most mysoginist way that can be...... do you want me to link it?

No, you don't want me to do that.

You know what my problem is with the people that get mad at this guy and dismiss what he says because he said it in that harsh way?
That they are all hypocritical fucks.

I'm not talking about you especifically but there are people who I've seen posting vulgarities, obscenities and all kind of nasty shit about different kind of people (forum members or musicians) yet they have the nerve to say this guy is not credible because he chose such words.

And.... focusing on the envelope of words, instead of the concept and information he's giving, it is for people who cannot see past the superficial side of things.

With this I'm not saying Jagosz is untouchable or that he should be trusted 100%. No, of course every person has the right to believe him or not, but when the reasons for not believing him derive from disliking his rethoric.... ok, the bar is set too low for me.

1 hour ago, Frey said:

What else do you want to figure out?

And I see. Somehow I assumed Dead Guy #2 was someone who knew Axl a bit later on. But if it was someone who was around Axl in the early 80s when Slash and Duff weren't around yet... hmm.....

lol, I don't know..... maybe why Jagosz hated him or why he said what he said. But I guess it is time wasted, nothing will ever come out

My friend is dead as well and I can't ask again or anything....

 

[Andy14]

2 hours ago, Hejanne said:

I don't mind, I wouldn't have shared them, if I didn't wanted other people to see them And thank you for the compliment, maybe I can replace Kat in US, I can take pictures in black and white as well

Of course! Your black n' white pics are . They should definitely hire you. 

I wish they found a job for me as well, you know the personal hair brusher or goodnight kisser 

[Blackstar]

8 hours ago, KiraMPD said:

nother thing that comes to mind when thinking about this subject is the story Slash tells in his book about the time he was sent to county jail for an old jaywalking charge and he later found out that Axl came up with the money for his bail while the other guys apparently had no idea that Slash was even missing (I might be remembering this wrong so please feel free to correct me). How did Axl come up with the money? (not saying that he got it via prostitution but something about that story just doesn't add up to me...)

Marc Canter's account, from his book:

Axl and I went down to the West Hollywood Sheriff’s Department to bail Slash out. By the time we arrived, Slash had already been shipped off to the L.A. County jail. So we headed downtown. On the way we picked up some Tommyburgers and listened to the demos. When we arrived at the jail to post Slash’s $178 bail, one of the officers noticed the medallion in the shape of a tiny gun hanging around Axl’s neck. Evidently alarmed at the threat posed by Axl’s necklace, the officer threw him up against the wall and frisked him. Finding no additional threatening objects, he let Axl go, and we went back to my car and waited about five hours for Slash to be released.

I don't know what value $178 had in the mid 80s, but it doesn't seem to me like a large sum of money. I suppose it wasn't so difficult for Axl and Marc to do some kind of fundraising among their friends/people they knew and collect that bail money.

8 hours ago, KiraMPD said:

11 hours ago, Frey said:

About Alan Niven... are you suggesting Alan Niven might know about Axl selling himself to other dudes too? I always interpreted his comments as just him being a douchebag and trying to get some (rather dumb and ignorant) digs in at Axl based on his clothing choices. But now that you put it that way, it actually makes sense on whole different level, especially the "Who is the Rocket Queen really?" part

Here is my interpretation of that part of the interview:-

When Niven said that it was originally as a response to whether misogynistic lyrics (and general shock factor) was the secret ingredient that made Gn'R more successful than other bands at the time. Niven starts of the answer by focusing on Axl alone, saying that Axl is driven on conflict and hate but "genderwise he is an equal opportunity junkyard dog". This might imply that Niven is defending Axl against accusations of misogyny and he further backs this by bringing up Sweet Child and Rocket Queen as lyrical moments showing "Axl as an angel". Then he takes a bit of a left turn and starts contemplating Axl's bisexuality, using his onstage costume and performance as supposed evidence. As you said, this could be (and probably is) Niven just being a dick but considering the fact that he also seems to be defending the sincerity of Axl's lyrics at the same time kinda leaves things up for interpretation imo.

I think both scenarios are possible, ie. Niven talking out of his arse (either to indirectly diss Axl or to defend him) or having something more specific in mind  he'd heard from Izzy or someone else, but I'm inclined to believe it's the former.

I regards to people Axl might have talked to/shared things like that with (if these stories are true of course, which we have no proof for): Pamela Manning has said that Axl had opened to her about things and that he has secrets the public doesn't know. These "secrets" could either have to do with his family (for example Tom Zutaut's story about his stepfather) or stories like the one we're now discussing. I somehow see Axl feeling more comfortable to share this kind of secrets with a woman like Pamela than with a guy friend.

----

A note on Rocket Queen lyrics and Alan Niven, since it's brought up:

It is known that Axl played with perspectives and that, according to himself, the first part is from Barbi's POV and the second from his own.

So the "speaker" in the main part is Barbi, a female character; and the chorus is from the same perspective (it makes more sense anyway) and it's actually "here I am, (I'm) your Rocket Queen", but because it would sound weird coming from a guy's mouth (let alone the misunderstanding that it'd cause), he played with the similar sound of "and you're a Rocket Queen".

I've always found the roles in the song interesting: Barbi, the woman in the song, is the wild one, and Axl, the guy in the song, is the sweet one.

Now, if and how much Axl, as the person who wrote the lyrics, identifies with the female character he impersonates, is open to speculation... (probably Alan Niven found it odd that a guy wrote a song from the perspective of a woman).

Edited July 17, 2017 by Blackstar
added

[killuridols]

Ok, I guess THE TIME HAS COME for me to give away the @killuridols ASS EATERS AWARDS for the European Leg of the #NITL tour!!!

_{.....Now that it is over and that all girls have achieved their personal goals.....}

-------------

So................ NUMBER ONE............... this award is given to a person who has exceeded expectations for what her goals were.
She's become a pro at: eating Axl's ass, eating Slash' ass, eating Beta's ass , holding up sleazy banners for Axl to see and smile (including not letting GIO rip said banners off) and getting all kind of collectibles and things she didnt have. I should give her the break-through award as well but this one represents all of her achievements so far!

The PROFESSIONAL ASS-EATER OF THE YEAR AWARD goes to............................ *drums* ...................... @Andy14

 

Next............................. NUMBER TWO....................... this award goes to three people who have worked their feet off to eat the ass throughout the years.
They have spent quite a chunk of money coming and going, from one country to another, standing in lines under the sun, under the rain, under the wind, for hours, day and night.
Hotels, airports, backdoors.... they became the shadow of the band and yes, they got many things: pictures, autographs, tattoos, posters, kisses and handshakes.

The ASS-EATING LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD goes to....................... *trumpets*................. Miss @Lumikki, Miss @Hejanne and Miss @Sekh-met!!!!

You ladies have achieved it all!! Congratulations!!!

 

 

 

On to the next one.......................... NUMBER THREE........................ This award goes to a very brave person who had to fight against all odds to eat the ass!

She left everybody at home and went soldiering on, to a place and venue that were under the radar of the zealot maniacs
People who have nothing better to do than just mess with the happy people around the world.
So, no fuck givens, our winner deserves this award because she had it tough, between the drunktards and the psychos, it is not like the ass is served on a plate!

The ATE THE ASS IN DANGER ZONE AWARD goes tooooo.................................................. @MillionsOfSpiders, yaaay!!!!

Here, have it young lady!!!

 

And last but not least ......................... NUMBER FOUR................... This is an award but mostly an honorific mention because there's still some work to do.

She's something like the sweetest thing in this thread, but she's not a bimbo. She's cool, funny and laid-back. She's always trying to keep it positive and all
I think she's one of the youngest here so of course, she's till got a lot to learn.
When she went to her show (not without huge effort and suffering) she got a little bit....... ummm.... distracted and well...... her hormones (like I said, she's very young) played a bad trick on her and.... damn, she ATE THE WRONG ASS!! (see her review of the Portugal show)
But, but, but.... (butt) I must say she was veeeeeeery close to the right one and I'm sure she's gonna get it right, next time

So the ATE THE WRONG ASS BUT KEEPS TRYIN' AWARD goes to........................................... Miss @dgnr !!!!

Yowza!!!!

-------------------

And that's it for now! It was a long night to be deciding on this shit
But if you think someone else deserves an award for completing their goals or achieving whatever it is related to the ass eating then give me a shout. I can consider it after some examination of the candidate

Congratulations to all of the winners!!!! I hope you keep these awards in your night tables

 

 

[Andy14]

6 minutes ago, killuridols said:

So................ NUMBER ONE............... this award is given to a person who has exceeded expectations for what her goals were.
She's become a pro at: eating Axl's ass, eating Slash' ass, eating Beta's ass , holding up sleazy banners for Axl to see and smile (including not letting GIO rip said banners off) and getting all kind of collectibles and things she didnt have. I should give her the break-through award as well but this one represents all of her achievements so far!

The PROFESSIONAL ASS-EATER OF THE YEAR AWARD goes to............................ *drums* ...................... @Andy14

Omgomgomgomgomg 

This is just perfect!!!! And I won!!! That's the first time in my life I have won something . My treasure hunt was worth loooool. 

But how come there's no Axl on my award?  Who ate him?  Not to mention my personal stalker Slash .

This was so much fun. Now I need to retain it next year. I'll be Roger Federer () in ass eating 

 

Congrats to the Big Three @Lumikki, @Hejanne and @Sekh-met as well as to @MillionsOfSpiders and @dgnr (you know, not everyone whose name starts with A is the right ass eating object, who's gonna be next? Angus?  or me? )

I'm glad that the Vienna and Prague shows were the most successful ones. I knew what to choose. 

[killuridols]

1 minute ago, Andy14 said:

But how come there's no Axl on my award?  Who ate him?  Not to mention my personal stalker Slash .

what the fffffffffffff are you saying?

You ate SO MUCH ass that you've become blinded to it!!!!! LOOK AGAIN!!!

[Andy14]

6 minutes ago, killuridols said:

what the fffffffffffff are you saying?

You ate SO MUCH ass that you've become blinded to it!!!!! LOOK AGAIN!!!

Now I see him! He wasn't there before, I swear 

[dgnr]

1 hour ago, killuridols said:

And last but not least ......................... NUMBER FOUR................... This is an award but mostly an honorific mention because there's still some work to do.

She's something like the sweetest thing in this thread, but she's not a bimbo. She's cool, funny and laid-back. She's always trying to keep it positive and all
I think she's one of the youngest here so of course, she's till got a lot to learn.
When she went to her show (not without huge effort and suffering) she got a little bit....... ummm.... distracted and well...... her hormones (like I said, she's very young) played a bad trick on her and.... damn, she ATE THE WRONG ASS!! (see her review of the Portugal show)
But, but, but.... (butt) I must say she was veeeeeeery close to the right one and I'm sure she's gonna get it right, next time

So the ATE THE WRONG ASS BUT KEEPS TRYIN' AWARD goes to........................................... Miss @dgnr !!!!

Yowza!!!!

 

 

omgomg just got home from a Sting concert (guy came to town and someone offered me tickets at last minute ) and my back is killing me and my feet, I don't think I have them anymore and this award was better than 'Every Breath You Take'  Thank you @killuridols! For the award and the kind words! You're better than the old one  From now one I promise I'll try to eat the right ass I didn't eat Sting's ass, that's a first step I think  

 

1 hour ago, Andy14 said:

and @dgnr (you know, not everyone whose name starts with A is the right ass eating object, who's gonna be next? Angus?  or me? )

Yours, obviously!! I won't touch grandpa, I have huge respect for him  

-------
Oh and... 

 

Hope Axl remembers his password soon, I miss all those emojis 

Edited July 17, 2017 by dgnr

[killuridols]

1 hour ago, dgnr said:

omgomg just got home from a Sting concert (guy came to town and someone offered me tickets at last minute ) and my back is killing me and my feet, I don't think I have them anymore and this award was better than 'Every Breath You Take'  Thank you @killuridols! For the award and the kind words! You're better than the old one  From now one I promise I'll try to eat the right ass I didn't eat Sting's ass, that's a first step I think  

Sting?? 

Damn girl, você gosta muito de velhos de merda!!! Vai te procurar uns mais novos! 

(kidding ) 

[SerenityScorp]

10 hours ago, killuridols said:

Tough news, guys... Axl was an asshole (and probably still is to some extent) when he was young and he's mistreated A LOT of people.

You ask why people still hold grudges, 30 years after?

Well, because some of those people he's damaged to hell or treated them like a piece of shit. Some cannot get over it that easily and if the media asks them about him, they're gonna say the first impression they had of him. Many of these guys did not follow Axl like fangirls and got to analyze or cared to understand why he was such a looney. People who knew Axl in real life just knew him and moved on. He doesn't represent to them the things he represents to his fans and younger people like us.

 

 

Always love this Asshole tho

Edited July 17, 2017 by SerenityScorp

[SerenityScorp]

Another information tht I feels like straight outta Fanfiction

 

I wonder if it's true, Did Izzy, Slash or even Duff know?

You know Izzy is Axl childhood Friend N' He taking care of Axl when Axl in L.A

Also Axl used to talk with Slash a lot about His life on early days

 

N' is it okay for Us to talk about it in here? Whether it's true or not maybe some media will use this againts Him, N' for media material purpose

Since there's the Guy from L.A Guns said it, maybe people will believe it 

You know altnation lurk this forum 

Edited July 17, 2017 by SerenityScorp

[Sekh-met]

On 14. 7. 2017 at 10:48 PM, purplestargirl said:

I didn't think Nightrain was still being brewed. I learn something every day.

Who knows maybe it's not and these are leftovers..real vintage!  

On 15. 7. 2017 at 10:31 PM, Lumikki said:

 

 

True It didn't exactly taste like I expected and not really like wine either lol, but it wasn't that bad actually.

It was drinkable and would quickly get me drunk if I had more of it. I can see why they liked it so much back in the day.

 

Yep, it is drinkable, gets you drunk easily and it was (well still is) cheap! Its a win win 

16 hours ago, Andy14 said:

 

A huge thank you to @Lumikki, @Hejanne, @Sekh-met and @hair of the dog for enjoying the shows together.  It was so much fun. Be it makng the banners (I hope Axl will remember it too), sniffing around their hotel or laughing our asses off. I enjoyed every second of it, both shows I attended far exceeded my expectations. I was injured, hungry, thirsty, tired, standing right in a rainstorm, everything hurt me, could hardly move afterwards but damn, it was so worth it, I'd do it all over again. I got all possible songs (except for Riff Raff) and Only Women Bleed as a nice bonus (yeah, Axl, I know you sang it only because I was actually bleeding at the Prague show ).

I already miss those times, but this can't be the end, right? They have to come back soon. I know that Axl loves Europe (and we love him). Moreover, he still ows us a party and a pen, we won't forget .

Thank you too for great times and of course to @Hejanne and @Lumikki as well! 
I hate that this is always over so fast that I cannot even process it all in time hahah. Now I miss it and need som more! NOW! 

I agree this cannot be the end! And he does owe us that party ...I am sure he is as sad as we are and plans to come back just to make sure that he can attend next time.

7 hours ago, killuridols said:

O

 

Next............................. NUMBER TWO....................... this award goes to three people who have worked their feet off to eat the ass throughout the years.
They have spent quite a chunk of money coming and going, from one country to another, standing in lines under the sun, under the rain, under the wind, for hours, day and night.
Hotels, airports, backdoors.... they became the shadow of the band and yes, they got many things: pictures, autographs, tattoos, posters, kisses and handshakes.

The ASS-EATING LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD goes to....................... *trumpets*................. Miss @Lumikki, Miss @Hejanne and Miss @Sekh-met!!!!

You ladies have achieved it all!! Congratulations!!!

 

 

 

 

OMG OMG OMG!!! This is awesome! Thanks! 

Congrats to all the winners!
@Andy14 is the queen haha..well deserved...there was some hard work involved! 

[scooby845]

16 hours ago, Tori72 said:

... If Slash and Duff are out, GnR will be dead. Deader than dead because now fans will know what to miss even more. I can't see Izzy and Steven coming along

Axl is gonna hire Izzy and Steven and be the new 'big three'.... 

And then finally we will get to see the AFD 5 ...lol

[SerenityScorp]

12 hours ago, Frey said:

Another slightly related story I can think of is all 5 of them apparently hanging out at a gay bar/club quite frequently for the all you can eat-buffet. I remember one of them (either Duff or Steven I think) saying that the food was worth it, you just had to clench your butt cheeks together real tight

I didnt know it was gay bar/club 

Where did You get this info?

12 hours ago, Frey said:

That's what it sounded to me like as well, yeah.And Izzy of course. Who was the only one actually around when these things most likely took place (if they took place at all). And Axl's oldest friend out of the 5 of them. If anyone would know, it would probably him most likely. And Izzy was (is?) close with Niven. So he might have told Niven at some point? Though I could see Slash drunkenly telling Niven too. Or someone outside the band. Niven seems to have been a pretty shady guy himself, he probably knew all kinds of people and had his sources.

 

Even tho its just an assumption, I really dont like if Izzy talk about the secret to Someone other than Band Members

[MillionsOfSpiders]

7 hours ago, dgnr said:

 

 

Hope Axl remembers his password soon, I miss all those emojis 

THIS Euro leg not THE  Euro leg... you would say THE Euro leg if that is the only one you will be doing, wouldn't you? 

Why is Axl being so tight with the tweets?

I bet he has typed a load out and then just not released them because they aren't quite right.. I can imagine him spending hours doing that 

---- 

The awards ceremony is awesome  

Next time (if there is) I need to go to Central Europe for at least one show.. what a fun leg of the tour this was to follow 

[SerenityScorp]

 

[Tori72]

45 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

Next time (if there is) I need to go to Central Europe for at least one show.. what a fun leg of the tour this was to follow 

If there is a next time, the Women's Thread must agree to go to a show together. Must!  That would be so much fun. And then Axl cannot only answer with a side-eye to our invitation 

[SerenityScorp]

15 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

If there is a next time, the Women's Thread must agree to go to a show together. Must!  That would be so much fun. And then Axl cannot only answer with a side-eye to our invitation 

I would love to see all Women Thread Member in front row instead of 'Intelligent Models'

[killuridols]

Axl will tweet either tomorrow or on Wednesday

[SerenityScorp]

4 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Axl will tweet either tomorrow or on Wednesday

While We wait maybe @Andy14 Can make Her fb masterpiece again

[Georgina Arriaga]

Good morning

Roses for all of you, ladies and gentlemen: