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Steven Adler in Argentina


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24 minutes ago, The Holographic Universe said:

Steven has routinely stated he would perform in GNR in any capacity anywhere multiple times. I seriously doubt these guys even want him there. He probably begged in his usual way and they obliged him and probably paid for his tickets, too. 

And this. Which proves you argue for the sake of arguing. You just questioned me, and many other fans on here, regardless of continent or ethnicity, that their thoughts don't matter on a situation based on how it's been presented to them. Sucks to be you right now...

This is the whole debate though, being your point. Steven doesn't care. Steven wants a shot. If Steven signs on to do his material, that's all he wants, so he's happy. He could screw up, be kicked out f it, then he doesn't care. And if he does, he goes on a rant via eddie trunk about how Slash, Duff and Axl were in a "conspiracy to screw him over" when they probably have always had reason to keep him out of it, then we are here on mygnr to call him out on it. We call him as is, and at that point I like many are saying "they gave you a huge opportunity, and you treat them incredibly disrespectfully" and here we are...Adler is out. But, the reaily is the band didn't give hi that opportunity. You claim these are facts we don't know, like the small minority, however, if Steven was offered opportunity of any kind we know him to be willing to take anything. Which is why he took this.

So don't assume things. Don't cling to Whazup because I already ragdolled the poster. And don't label others as something you are. I present facts, then I back them up. Deal

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3 minutes ago, WhazUp said:

So you are basically admitting to speculating on limited information and being so polarizing and needlessly negative towards people you have never met because "hey, that's what fans do".  I choose to take the higher road both logically and rhetorically.  Not much else to it, unless if you wanna have a full time residence in Spin City

No, you're trying to spin what we know to make yourself appear less clueless. Little difference there but, youre not equipped to know.

So tell us all, where do you live? Where are you from and, do you currently plan on seeing GNR in the near future? Go ahead, I'm waiting :popcorn:

I stated that Adler flew to argentina to play 2 songs over two days, that's a fact. That's not a debate. That's not me claiming anything that doesn't exist. Do you have a point or....?

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Just now, Billsfan said:

No, you're trying to spin what we know to make yourself appear less clueless. Little difference there but, youre not equipped to know.

So tell us all, where do you live? Where are you from and, do you currently plan on seeing GNR in the near future? Go ahead, I'm waiting :popcorn:

Ah the "rubber glue, back to you" approach - classic :lol:

If you have a problem with me personally feel free to PM me, I don't want you to clog up this thread with pointless insults at me.  However as long as I see posts where logic is out in the stratosphere I am always going to try and pull them back down to Earth 

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25 minutes ago, WhazUp said:

Ah the "rubber glue, back to you" approach - classic :lol:

If you have a problem with me personally feel free to PM me, I don't want you to clog up this thread with pointless insults at me.  However as long as I see posts where logic is out in the stratosphere I am always going to try and pull them back down to Earth 

There's no pointless insuts. I haven't labeled you, other than someone who assumes things. The stance you've taken is someone who feels very defeated and someone who's defending a point that they know, can no longer be defended. So go ahead...

I'm on earth. I was discussing Guns N Roses and you're attempting to take it somewhere else. Cheap distractions won't help you though.

Adler should be in this. Izzy should be in this. I don't hate Frank, Richard, and I find Melissa annoying but labeling her next to the term hate is crazy. At least I think so. Why do you having a problem with that make me a bad poster?

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2 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

@Billsfan I don't even know what you are arguing about, but you come off as way overly aggressive

Overly aggressive? Maybe, I guess. It can read that way. I'm making the point that Adler's role in this "reunion was decided for him". That's it. I have two posters, agggresively, coming at me labeling me as assumptive and clueless, when I'm just stating my opinion. How is that wrong?

No one's being aggressive when it's words on a discussion bard. Wouldn't you agree, friend?

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4 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

I'm lost fuck. So I think Steven should be in the reunion. So... yay.

Fuck Im sick of talking about gnr. Im going back to anything goes!

Pitman said not to Drunk text with a "lesson learned" thing attached to it...

We an always learn from Neil :P 

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7 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

Billsfan seems to be doing what I was doing in the other Steven thread; merely stating his opinions and basing it off what we do know at this point/the result in this reality.

That is only a problem for people who do not want their bubble burst, who only want people to agree with them and see things their way and be happy and satisfied at all times. Which is how spoiled children act.

When you are met with this attitude it is hard not to get a bit aggressive because it is frustrating and the conversation goes round and round.

I'm just getting my point across. I pointed out Adler's POV, a couple of posters claimed I'm making stuff up, and here we are. We have a band not saying anything, and it makes certain people appear more believable based off of that.

 

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20 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

Billsfan seems to be doing what I was doing in the other Steven thread; merely stating his opinions and basing it off what we do know at this point/the result in this reality.

That is only a problem for people who do not want their bubble burst, who only want people to agree with them and see things their way and be happy and satisfied at all times. Which is how spoiled children act.

When you are met with this attitude it is hard not to get a bit aggressive because it is frustrating and the conversation goes round and round.

I honestly think its the other way around, to me the people in the bubbles are those who say things like:

Quote

 It's just sad how Slash and Duff just willingly agreed to do whatever Al wants for the sake of $$$

where we as fans are not really privy to enough empirical evidence.  There is a difference between having a critical or un-happy view of the band and thinking you know 100 percent what the issue is and flooding threads presenting it is truth - that's all.  

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Just now, WhazUp said:

I never claimed you made stuff up, my whole initial reply to you to begin with a few days ago was merely just saying that regardless of what appears believable or not, the full story is not out there.  I just would see so much negativity from not just you but from tons of people on here towards either Adler or the "Big 3" and idk to me kind of seemed counterproductive to everything.  

To me there is a difference between this post of yours that you are quoting and what I saw in the previous Adler threads.  This post of yours is very reasonable, it is a lot better and a lot more constructive than saying things like: 

After a while of seeing people assume they know exactly what goes on behind the scenes it just kinda bugged me, that's all.  Its nothing personal

Well, don't question integrity. ok? You can't pull discussions from different topics into different threads, or different point of views into different discussions. I don't form a PIV from a poster based on their political stance, whether I agree with them or not.

I will stand for the Appetite Lineup. Nothing anybody says can get me to back down. Not everybody has to share the same voice but, I know what little I know. Those 5 people went through something that nobody in their own life can compare to, and it's a crime that they can't play even a song together. 3 of them have finally worked it out. 1 doesn't care what he's given and the other does, but, the other has a case. How an you or anyone, argue that? 

2 minutes ago, WhazUp said:

I honestly think its the other way around, to me the people in the bubbles are those who say things like:

where we as fans are not really privy to enough empirical evidence.  There is a difference between having a critical or un-happy view of the band and thinking you know 100 percent what the issue is and flooding threads presenting it is truth - that's all.  

Do you really believe Slash and Duff aren't getting paid significantly to tour? This is what I was taking about....This was and is my point.

Serious question, how do you think the big 3 salaries compare?

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Just now, Billsfan said:

Well, don't question integrity. ok? You can't pull discussions from different topics into different threads, or different point of views into different discussions. I don't form a PIV from a poster based on their political stance, whether I agree with them or not.

All I did was pull something you said on one Steven Adler thread into this Steven Adler thread that is about the exact same thing - I honestly think I am being fairly reasonable and ok doing that.  I am not pulling unrelated things like politics, everything you said there and everything I said there is directly applicable here in my opinion.  No disrespect intended on my part

 

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Just now, WhazUp said:

All I did was pull something you said on one Steven Adler thread into this Steven Adler thread that is about the exact same thing - I honestly think I am being fairly reasonable and ok doing that.  I am not pulling unrelated things like politics, everything you said there and everything I said there is directly applicable here in my opinion.  No disrespect intended on my part

 

Then...what's your point? What are we even still discussing?

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All I know is I am not going to formulate such a bashful opinion on either side of the argument regarding the Adler situation in GNR.  Could there have been events we are not privy to that dissuaded the big 3 from getting Adler on board more - whether during the shows or on tour?  Is Axl a dictator and hates Steven and the big 3 went along with it?  Is it both of these things and more?  None of us can truly know that at the moment

I think its fine to formulate opinions both positive or negative, my whole point from the start has just been maybe some people should chill and think about how little we know before sounding so confident that one side or the other are shitty people lol

Nobody would love Steven Adler in the band more than me - he was the highlight of the Dodger Stadium show for me by far.  However if shit happened behind the scenes that dissuaded the big 3 from bringing him on board in a bigger way I can easily see how that was possible

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1 hour ago, Billsfan said:

I'm just getting my point across. I pointed out Adler's POV, a couple of posters claimed I'm making stuff up, and here we are. We have a band not saying anything, and it makes certain people appear more believable based off of that.

 

Not saying anything has worked out very for Axl the past 24yrs

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2 hours ago, BorderlineCrazy said:

I still wonder what is people trying to argue.

Steven came to Argentina and was allowed to play only one song at each show. That is a disgusting thing to do and it's not up to discussion. It doesn't matter if that's the original arrengement or not, it's something disgusting to do to an old friend (and the fans, we were over the moon having Steven here and the band didn't care even when it meant no effort to let him play one more song each night at least). They had Angus Young (who I love but has NOTHING to do with GNR) playing two covers at three shows in a row but they couldn't let Steven play at least the two songs he had been playing with them at both shows. If you're ok with this, if you don't see how fucked up it is, then I'm sorry but you don't have a fucking heart.

Ths is not about Steven being a saint as some people want to present it. As I already said, I'm a way bigger fan of Slash and Axl than of Steven but I love them despite the things they do wrong, I don't need to pretend they do everything perfect. And I'm not even talking about Steven playing a full show nor all his songs at the shows because that can be more complex and they might have reasons to not do that (which they're stupid enough to not explain and just give vague answers), I'm talking about letting the guy play the two songs everyone was expecting at both shows. There is no possible explanation for that that could make sense, it's horrible, it looks like trying to make it clear to Steven that he's not wanted.

I was very pissed off and disappointed when Duff accepted to open for Axl's solo band with Loaded a few years ago. It was very similar to this, it was painful to see Duff being some sort of a bonus and then seeing a band using the name GNR with some random dude playing bass, playing Duff's stuff for 2-3 hours. It didn't make any sense and it was sad because Guns N' Roses is Duff's band, not Tommy Stinson's (and I love Tommy, not saying this against him). I mean, there are videos on YouTube titled "Guns N' Roses featuring Duff McKagan"!! What is that shit? There is no Guns N' Roses without motherfucking Duff McKagan!!! It was easier to accept Izzy's case because he seemed to be sort of disappeared and so it was nice to see him join Axl and play for his fans once again. It was weird and it was awkward and it was wrong but it was better than nothing. Duff's thing was more painful but he accepted it because he wanted to reconnect with Axl and it paid off (Axl said it wasn't the same guy as back in the day or something like that and here he is now). Now Steven's case, he just couldn't win, he was never given a real chance of anything. He was silent for the whole year, he practiced as much as possible, showed up at every gig he was invited and it made no difference. He did it because he NEEDED to do it and he probably felt/thought things could get better with time. Eventually he ended up putting an end to his participation when he finally realized that there was nothing else coming for him, that he was gonna be a wildcard showing up once in a while to play the same two songs while some random dude who has nothing to do with GNR was there playing HIS SONGS. And thank God I didn't have to see Slash guesting in GNR, standing on the side watching Dj or Finck butchering his songs, otherwise I would have probably jumped off a bridge. Maybe I should have taken the easy road and pretend Axl Rose is Guns N' Roses and who else is in the band is irrelevant but I can't, I happen to love this band, not just one man, one of the five members. The band with its spirit and sound and style and image and attitude.

Anyway, it doesn't matter if the casuals don't care and it doesn't matter if the band don't honor it, there are five guys who created this band, made it work and changed the lives of thousands of people. Steven's place in GNR's history can't be taken away and that warms my heart, especially when I have to see so many people unnecessarily trying to put him down for no reason. SLASH + IZZY + AXL + STEVEN + DUFF = GUNS N' ROSES

Thank God there are reasonable people on this forum, well said.

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10 hours ago, BorderlineCrazy said:

Steven came to Argentina and was allowed to play only one song at each show. That is a disgusting thing to do and it's not up to discussion. It doesn't matter if that's the original arrengement or not, it's something disgusting to do to an old friend (and the fans, we were over the moon having Steven here and the band didn't care even when it meant no effort to let him play one more song each night at least). They had Angus Young (who I love but has NOTHING to do with GNR) playing two covers at three shows in a row but they couldn't let Steven play at least the two songs he had been playing with them at both shows. If you're ok with this, if you don't see how fucked up it is, then I'm sorry but you don't have a fucking heart.

 

Yes, you have a point here. Which is why I said that, if they definitely don't want to have anything to do with Steven (which is something that I can understand), they should not have him involved at all and if they did decide to involve him, giving him three songs every night wouldn't hurt nobody in any way, so, yes, it was a stupid and offensive move.

Especially that indeed Angus has nothing to do with GN'R and people don't come to a GN'R show to hear AC/DC songs, so it's much less justified to give him that many spots a night. Also Slash and Duff visited the AC/DC show twice and they were never allowed on stage, which I also consider not exactly fair when Angus is playing AC/DC songs on so many GN'R shows.

Anyway, like I said I was never defending the way they played it out because it was stupid and offensive to both the fans and Adler. That doesn't change the fact, though, that Steven isn't that perfect hero that some people try to make him be due to what happened. He is who he is and I bet not only Axl, Slash and Duff don't want to start any serious business with him.

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