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Use your illusion tour vs. not in this lifetime tour


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9 hours ago, Billsfan said:

Are those serious questions? It's cool to see the big 3 back together sure but, the fact that izzy was intentionally left out over money when they probably already would have made great money regardless, is the issue. Hence: IT'S A CASH GRAB. No new music... CASH GRAB. Nothing created, only milking material... If you and some others like Brownstone don't like the truth, I'm sorry for you but, like it or not, this is a cash grab.

Deal with it

A lot of people are very happy with the "cash grab", hence the massive numbers of people that are going to see them. If something is a "cash grab" is it not worth seeing? Does it suck? The Skin and Bones tour was a "cash grab" by your rationale, they did that to make money, that's on record. Did it suck? Was it not worth seeing? Should we sit at home and polish our purist pins while holding others to standards we likely don't hold ourselves to?

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Coming to this thread late, but my two cents: I saw them toward the end of the Illusions tour, during the Skin N' Bones leg. I was young and incredibly excited to be seeing them live. But...it wasn't a good show overall. A few of the band members were really drunk, and the acoustic set on the couch seemed to go on too long. I remember people getting really, really subdued during the acoustic bit. I loved the show, but at the same time, on some level I was disappointed. And when I listened to one of the available bootlegs years after the fact, my opinion there didn't change - it wasn't really a good show.

But they'd been touring for a very long time by that point. If I'd seen them at the beginning of the UYI tour, I might have felt very differently. A few of those earlier UYI shows, for which the pro-shot footage has been posted online, are on my "If I had a time machine, I'd stop here..." list.

In comparison - and granted it's looking at things from a different perspective - they seemed way more on point at the NITL show I saw. The band was tight, and they seemed really energized to be up there.

As to it being a "cash grab"...everyone has to make a living. It's not a bad thing to work for money. You can love what you do and give 1000% to it and still really expect and appreciate your paycheck. On the NITL show I attended, it seemed to me that they genuinely enjoyed being up there and were giving it their all, and that's all one can ask for.

 

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8 hours ago, MADDOGJONES said:

A lot of people are very happy with the "cash grab", hence the massive numbers of people that are going to see them. If something is a "cash grab" is it not worth seeing? Does it suck? The Skin and Bones tour was a "cash grab" by your rationale, they did that to make money, that's on record. Did it suck? Was it not worth seeing? Should we sit at home and polish our purist pins while holding others to standards we likely don't hold ourselves to?

That is because the quality of audiences has plummeted. Crowds now reflect the society we have today, of instantaneous gratification with minimal effort.

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This whole "cash grab" talk is so stupid. Its simple to understand that the point of this tour, aside than a celebration of Axl, Slash and Duff together as Guns N' Roses again, is to make the brand shine again.

As a band and brand, Guns N' Roses were in pieces because of the solo Axl Rose years, nobody thrusted that band anymore so, to make people believe in this band/brand again, they have to legitimize (is that the word? lol) it, they got to do it.
Are they making money? hell yeah, but thats the whole point of the tour, to make this band/brand legit again, to test waters, to see if they can still do it after Axl ruined it all. (As much as you love and I love CD, you got to admit, he ruined the band/brand).

I think now is the perfect time to start _thinking_ about new music, not in 2016 when nobody had a clue about what was going to happen. Nobody had a clue if their relationship would work again.

Now is the time, and maybe we'll get something 2018 onwards.

Would it be cool to have new music in 2016 as they started the tour? Fuck yeah, but just imagine if they had released an album in 2016, then Axl and Slash started to fight again and the audience were as poor as Axl solo years?

It would be a disaster.

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41 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

That is because the quality of audiences has plummeted. Crowds now reflect the society we have today, of instantaneous gratification with minimal effort.

No, it's because most people don't hold artists to some ludicrous, romanticized notion that they're not allowed to earn money or profit from their work like anyone else.

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1 hour ago, stella said:

No, it's because most people don't hold artists to some ludicrous, romanticized notion that they're not allowed to earn money or profit from their work like anyone else.

I interpret 'cash grab' as being something done solely for pecuniary reasons with little or no substance, not merely, doing something that you are paid for. Use Your Illusion Tour was not a cash grab as there was a substance, i.e. a double album, that they wanted to play (that and the fact they pissed all the money away!).

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2 hours ago, default_ said:

Its simple to understand that the point of this tour, aside than a celebration of Axl, Slash and Duff together as Guns N' Roses again, is to make the brand shine again.

And they know what they have on their hands. They can run with this longer than the UYI tour potentially.

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Seen both tours and both were excellent, but seeing Axl In his prime on the UYI Tour can not be topped. It was pretty amazing seeing him run across the stage and even more amazing how quick he could get from one side to the other wile singing and still sounding good. 

Edited by ironmt
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On 25/04/2017 at 10:44 AM, DieselDaisy said:

I interpret 'cash grab' as being something done solely for pecuniary reasons with little or no substance, not merely, doing something that you are paid for. Use Your Illusion Tour was not a cash grab as there was a substance, i.e. a double album, that they wanted to play (that and the fact they pissed all the money away!).

Just because they don't have a new album out doesn't mean it is or isn't a cash grab. Again, Skin and Bones was done to make money, it was a "cash grab" then. So what?

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1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

 

I disagree.

Use Your Illusion wasn't new when they did the skin and bones tour. Was that tour a cash grab? How old or new does an album have to be for the tour that follows it not to be a cash grab?

By the way, not saying this tour isn't a cash grab, I just don't see the logic in your argument.

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18 minutes ago, MADDOGJONES said:

Use Your Illusion wasn't new when they did the skin and bones tour. Was that tour a cash grab? How old or new does an album have to be for the tour that follows it not to be a cash grab?

 

Well, not 25 years, that's for sure.

Wasn't the Skin and Bones tour in 1993? That's two years after UYI, so that is still pretty new, especially for GnR terms.

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Just now, EvanG said:

Well, not 25 years, that's for sure.

Wasn't the Skin and Bones tour in 1993? That's two years after UYI, so that is still pretty new, especially for GnR terms.

What's happening here is people are reducing the live experience down to nothing more than a promotional tool, if you don't have something to promote it's a cash grab... how does that fucking work? The live experience is more than that (as I'm sure you'd agree?). Whether they have a new album out or not doesn't make a shit of difference to the live experience or the legitimacy of the tour. Not sure how promoting something is anymore legitimate or authentic than NOT promoting something, surely (if anything) the latter is more authentic.

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1 minute ago, MADDOGJONES said:

What's happening here is people are reducing the live experience down to nothing more than a promotional tool, if you don't have something to promote it's a cash grab... how does that fucking work? The live experience is more than that (as I'm sure you'd agree?). Whether they have a new album out or not doesn't make a shit of difference to the live experience or the legitimacy of the tour. Not sure how promoting something is anymore legitimate or authentic than NOT promoting something, surely (if anything) the latter is more authentic.

I think everyone has a different definition of ''cash grab''. Is this tour a cash grab? Probably partly, but I would like to think there are other reasons for doing it too. I don't think they would ever do something only for the money.

 

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7 minutes ago, EvanG said:

I think everyone has a different definition of ''cash grab''. Is this tour a cash grab? Probably partly, but I would like to think there are other reasons for doing it too. I don't think they would ever do something only for the money.

 

I'm not allergic to it being a cash grab, I don't care why they are doing it, but it doesn't feel that way to me. I don't see Axl's apparent burning hate for Slash being soothed only by the big bucks, he arguably could have collected bigger bucks cerca 2006, with a reunion.

Just because they are expecting their worth in the marketplace doesn't make it an entirely cynical enterprise, in my opinion.

Fans who don't like the current tour or lineup can't own up and say they just don't like it for some reason, they need to make it illegitimate somehow. This is as Guns N Roses as the illusion line up, which most fans fucking loved.

Edited by MADDOGJONES
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1 minute ago, MADDOGJONES said:

I'm not allergic to it being a cash grab, I don't care why they are doing it, but it doesn't feel that way to me. I don't see Axl's apparent burning hate for Slash being soothed only by the big bucks, he arguably could have collected bigger bucks cerca 2006, with a reunion.

Just because they are expecting their worth worth in the marketplace doesn't make it an entirely cynical enterprise, in my opinion.

 

I agree with that, I don't think so either.

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If the tour was strictly a "cash grab" I'm sure they would have reunited long ago. As stated above, It Is most likely partially about the money and there are probably other reasons such as maybe actually wanting to be In one another's company, along with seeing the world and playing for the fans. Axl has always been a guy that did what he wanted regardless of the repercussions. I can't see him being willing to reunite strictly for the money.

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5 hours ago, ironmt said:

If the tour was strictly a "cash grab" I'm sure they would have reunited long ago. As stated above, It Is most likely partially about the money and there are probably other reasons such as maybe actually wanting to be In one another's company, along with seeing the world and playing for the fans. Axl has always been a guy that did what he wanted regardless of the repercussions. I can't see him being willing to reunite strictly for the money.

The money they are getting is crazy, but the first show they played was for FREE, that gets so often overlooked. It was only a few who got that amazing experience, but what an amazing experience that must have been. Coachella wanted the first show and paid big bucks for it, but GN'R chose to do something special for the fans, so "cash grab" or not, I think that speaks volumes about their intentions.

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12 minutes ago, MADDOGJONES said:

The money they are getting is crazy, but the first show they played was for FREE, that gets so often overlooked. It was only a few who got that amazing experience, but what an amazing experience that must have been. Coachella wanted the first show and paid big bucks for it, but GN'R chose to do something special for the fans, so "cash grab" or not, I think that speaks volumes about their intentions.

No doubt about It. Regardless, and as stated by another member In this thread, what Is wrong with these guys making money? We can label It whatever we want but the fact of the matter Is, this Is there profession and what they do for a living. Would It be considered a cash grab for those of us who work 7-3:30 Monday through Friday?

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Alright, one has 25+ years of built up nostalgia, was also to support an album when the band was at it's ultimate peak. The other is a nostalgia reunion, which is entertaining, but besides the nostalgia of 3 classic members and Dizzy it's not very exciting. UYI was seemed more exciting, but I wasn't there.

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6 hours ago, Tom2112 said:

Alright, one has 25+ years of built up nostalgia, was also to support an album when the band was at it's ultimate peak. The other is a nostalgia reunion, which is entertaining, but besides the nostalgia of 3 classic members and Dizzy it's not very exciting. UYI was seemed more exciting, but I wasn't there.

It was beyond exciting. I think the majority of us that were 15-16 years old than and considered old fucks now would agree that there Is no comparison between the band than and now. Although I am grateful that they have reunited and younger people such as yourself are getting the opportunity to see them, but at one time Guns N Roses were so big that It would have to be almost Impossible for people that weren't around to comprehend. I recall having a teacher In school that was Into the band and he asked me to bring In my UYI VHS tapes to watch after school. Before reality shows became the normal TV viewing experience MTV actually played music videos(as I am sure that you are aware) and you wouldn't go more then a few hours without hearing Estranged, November Rain, Don't Cry, You Could Be Mine, Dead Horse or Garden Of Eden.

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18 hours ago, ironmt said:

It was beyond exciting. I think the majority of us that were 15-16 years old than and considered old fucks now would agree that there Is no comparison between the band than and now. Although I am grateful that they have reunited and younger people such as yourself are getting the opportunity to see them, but at one time Guns N Roses were so big that It would have to be almost Impossible for people that weren't around to comprehend. I recall having a teacher In school that was Into the band and he asked me to bring In my UYI VHS tapes to watch after school. Before reality shows became the normal TV viewing experience MTV actually played music videos(as I am sure that you are aware) and you wouldn't go more then a few hours without hearing Estranged, November Rain, Don't Cry, You Could Be Mine, Dead Horse or Garden Of Eden.

Yeah, I got into GNR in the late 90s so I completely missed the boat, but I got to enjoy almost all of the Chinese Democracy wait:D 

The idea that Garden of eden was on heavy rotation is baffling to me :P but that shows you just how popular they were.

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Well, I didn't see the UYI tour, but I loved the Not in this lifetime tour. Loved seeing Slash, with Axl and Duff again.

According to Slash's book, since all the problems the band had on the UYI tour, GNR didn't make any money. they had to pay a lot of fines for them being late or Axl not showing up or the show ending early, etc.

Hopefully, GNR has made tons of money on this tour.;)

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Two different types of tour:

-On use your illusion we had very popular young band with new album...Singles,videos,interviews were everywhere...Tour were huge and sucesufull,but Guns n Roses didn't could sellout stadiums in US...Across the globe they did it but in US they played arenas...They need one more album and 3-4 yours to made this ''problem''

 

-NITL tour...Probably will be one of the biggest and most succesufull tours ever...There are no videos,new song,interview...Now We had the greatest couple in history together  after 25 years...Stadiums are filled everywhere in the world (US,SA,Australia,Asia,Europe)...Now we have had rock legengs...

O really didn't believe they would sold stadiums on that rang...

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