Explosion at Ariana Grande Concert Manchester UK

[DieselDaisy]

Just now, Oldest Goat said:

That's a cop-out imo.

Anyway, I'm just trying to make you see the error of your ways. Not because I think myself or my country are righteous or without fault. But because you are seemingly going fucking beserk and need to look at the bigger picture because that attitude of giving into hate and despair will do as much if not more damage that politically correct bs.

I do not see how politically correct fluff and contrived BBC set-pieces is exclusive from ''hate'' - as you put it. We can do without both I believe.

[Lio]

28 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said:

So it's been confirmed he was known to authorities before this, well strike me down with feather.

Yeah, and been to Syria too. Chanting Quran verses on the street, neighbours say. Can we please just lock up anyone who's been to Syria and is conformed to be radicalised? We should just be clear: if you're going to Syria, you're not coming back in. And if you do, you'll be in handcuffs straight away.

[king2vo]

The kind of guy who was making this world a better one: 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/24/missing-martyn-hett-made-twitter-fall-love-mum-made-knitting/

 

RIP Martyn, I would have liked to have you as a friend

 

 

It's time to seriously think about what to do with those who are 'known  to security services'. 

Edited May 24, 2017 by king2vo

[MB.]

1 hour ago, Lio said:

Yeah, and been to Syria too. Chanting Quran verses on the street, neighbours say. Can we please just lock up anyone who's been to Syria and is conformed to be radicalised? We should just be clear: if you're going to Syria, you're not coming back in. And if you do, you'll be in handcuffs straight away.

That's how it is in my country. 

But

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/737827/Europe-laws-anti-terror-jihadis-Holland-citizens

Edited May 24, 2017 by MB.

[Len Cnut]

1 hour ago, Lio said:

Yeah, and been to Syria too. Chanting Quran verses on the street, neighbours say. Can we please just lock up anyone who's been to Syria and is conformed to be radicalised? We should just be clear: if you're going to Syria, you're not coming back in. And if you do, you'll be in handcuffs straight away.

Christ Almighty, so cross Syria off the list of countries you can go to and maintain your nationality?  Seems a bit strong.  I wonder how they knew he was chanting Qu'ran verses.  I guess if he had an open one in his hand at the time it'd be a bit of a giveaway!

[Lio]

8 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

Christ Almighty, so cross Syria off the list of countries you can go to and maintain your nationality?  Seems a bit strong.  I wonder how they knew he was chanting Qu'ran verses.  I guess if he had an open one in his hand at the time it'd be a bit of a giveaway!

Why would a British Libyan go there to maintain his nationality? Or a Belgian, Moroccan or whatever nationality? They're not there as tourists. Authorities know them. Maybe they can put a system into place where people that wish to go to Syria for whatever reason, and return, can report that somewhere and state what their business is there? I don't know. I've just kind of had it with assholes blowing innocent people to smithereens and then hearing: Oh, but we knew them. He'd been to Syria, he was radicalised, but yeah, as long as he doesn't blow himself up, we can't do anything, blabla.

Maybe he was just chanting about Allah? Or maybe the neighbours were muslims who recognised the verses? I've no idea.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Lio
Changed Libyan into British Libyan

[DieselDaisy]

2 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

Without either PC fluff/contrived BBC set-pieces or hate? That's my whole point! lol.

Calling you an asshole or whatever I said probably didn't help and made it seem more like an attack, so I apologise for that. I meant it in more of a "Uh...Hey, buddy? You okay? You're bein' a bit of an asshole there buddy..." sort of way.

I'll apoligise also for being grumpier than usual being that this has happened, James Bond has died (just when we needed the bugger!) and my cricket team is wank.

[Len Cnut]

18 minutes ago, Lio said:

Why would a British Libyan go there to maintain his nationality? Or a Belgian, Moroccan or whatever nationality? They're not there as tourists. Authorities know them. Maybe they can put a system into place where people that wish to go to Syria for whatever reason, and return, can report that somewhere and state what their business is there? I don't know. I've just kind of had it with assholes blowing innocent people to smithereens and then hearing: Oh, but we knew them. He'd been to Syria, he was radicalised, but yeah, as long as he doesn't blow himself up, we can't do anything, blabla.

Maybe he was just chanting about Allah? Or maybe the neighbours were muslims who recognised the verses? I've no idea.

I have no idea why anyone would go, same reason the Tipton 3 or 5 or however many went into Afghanistan that time.  I mean its one thing if you're known as radicalised but the way i thought it worked was citizens of the free world go where they want.

[action]

20 minutes ago, Lio said:

Why would a British Libyan go there to maintain his nationality? Or a Belgian, Moroccan or whatever nationality? They're not there as tourists. Authorities know them. Maybe they can put a system into place where people that wish to go to Syria for whatever reason, and return, can report that somewhere and state what their business is there? I don't know. I've just kind of had it with assholes blowing innocent people to smithereens and then hearing: Oh, but we knew them. He'd been to Syria, he was radicalised, but yeah, as long as he doesn't blow himself up, we can't do anything, blabla.

Maybe he was just chanting about Allah? Or maybe the neighbours were muslims who recognised the verses? I've no idea.

agreed.

you can say it's practically impossible to secure any big event, and to an extent i'll follow that reasoning, but a known radical traveling to and back from syria is where the naïvity should stop as far as i'm concerned. at that point, the usual political nonsense should stop and we should really start valuing the lives of our children (cos that's what they've resorted to now) above the human rights of this scum.

they sure as hell ain't going to admire the scenery in Syria as a tourist (not that there's much scenery left there anyway; either bombed by the government or blown up by IS)

[DieselDaisy]

1 minute ago, Oldest Goat said:

Just to be clear, terrorists/anyone who would do such atrocities are absolute scumbags and I'm definitely not trying to get on you or anyone's case for feeling shaken up, shocked and livid about it. I only take issue with 'the way' some things have been said and what I perceive to be sensationalist/panic, which will only lead to more bad things and compound the stress of everyone, especially if you live nearby which must be very surreal. So, I will continue to try and watch 'the way' I say things myself.

Anyway, love you, babe.

Everybody is scurrying around for answers and a solution. It is depressing. There are a few French chaps here? I imagine they understood the public mood here, following the Bataclan? We all have our opinions but they are just thrown into the mix and nobody knows if they are right. Meanwhile there is an election between some of the most horrific specimens of humanity you have ever seen! That is Britain right now.

[Lio]

2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I have no idea why anyone would go, same reason the Tipton 3 or 5 or however many went into Afghanistan that time.  I mean its one thing if you're known as radicalised but the way i thought it worked was citizens of the free world go where they want.

Desperate times, desperate measures. I thought I could take a backpack going to a concert. I thought I could walk around in the city without bumping into heavily armed soldiers. When I was a kid, I didn't have to open my jacket when I went to visit a museum or anything. My daughter has to do that. Everyone has had to sacrifice their personal freedom a bit. If you wish to travel to Syria for whatever legitimate reason, I think it's only common sense in the light of everything that has happened that you'd have to explain what your business is there.

In my first post, I did say anyone who comes back from Syria and is known to be radicalised.

[action]

someone once said that radical times create radical measures. radical measures create peaceful times. peaceful times create mild measures. mild measures create radical times etc...

it's a never ending circle of achieving human rights and then giving them up and back again. see the tolerance act in europe after the middle ages and subsequent history

1 minute ago, Oldest Goat said:

I agree with closely monitoring known radicals and would assume this was already how all our countries operate? But how do they become known in the first place? I'm genuinely asking because I have no idea. A widespread blanket surveillance of all Muslims would not be could at all and would probably just negatively affect all the normal ones while spurring on the radicals.

facebook posts

neighbours talking

that's just two examples, but any form of information can snowball in an investigation.

[Len Cnut]

9 minutes ago, Lio said:

Desperate times, desperate measures. I thought I could take a backpack going to a concert. I thought I could walk around in the city without bumping into heavily armed soldiers. When I was a kid, I didn't have to open my jacket when I went to visit a museum or anything. My daughter has to do that. Everyone has had to sacrifice their personal freedom a bit. If you wish to travel to Syria for whatever legitimate reason, I think it's only common sense in the light of everything that has happened that you'd have to explain what your business is there.

In my first post, I did say anyone who comes back from Syria and is known to be radicalised.

I dont think times are that extreme but hey, what do i know I guess if people feel that shook then....there's a slight difference between having to open a jacket and not bring a backpack to places and stripping people of their nationality.  Though yes you did said come back from Syria and known to be radicalised, your second paragraph seemed to be revising that, apologies if I misunderstood.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Len Cnut

[DieselDaisy]

There is a nonchalance in the air here I cannot fathom.

[Len Cnut]

2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

There is a nonchalance in the air here I cannot fathom.

A minute ago you said everyone was scurrying around for answers/solutions.

[DieselDaisy]

Well I've never seen you comment on it? All I have seen you is defend muslims. Have you seen the picture of that girl?

[action]

19 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I dont think times are that extreme but hey, what do i know I guess if people feel that shook then....there's a slight difference between having to open a jacket and not bring a backpack to places and stripping people of their nationality.  Though yes you did said come back from Syria and known to be radicalised, your second paragraph seemed to be revising that, apologies if I misunderstood.

[Len Cnut]

2 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Well I've never seen you comment on it? All I have seen you is defend muslims. Have you seen the picture of that girl?

Oh you were talking about me.  Where exactly have I defended muslims?  What, by saying it's impractical and a waste of time and resources to raid mosques?  Thats hardly a defence of muslims.  I also made a distinct reference to 'sad terrorist wankers', in case my position regarding terrorism was in doubt.  Other than that what comment would you like me to make?  And why do I have to confirm in writing on a Guns n Roses message board to save myself for accusations of a cavalier attitude towards the death of innocent people?  And no, I haven't seen the picture of 'that girl'...i think, there's loads of em, aren't there?

[DieselDaisy]

2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

Oh you were talking about me.  Where exactly have I defended muslims?  What, by saying it's impractical and a waste of time and resources to raid mosques?  Thats hardly a defence of muslims.  I also made a distinct reference to 'sad terrorist wankers', in case my position regarding terrorism was in doubt.  Other than that what comment would you like me to make?  And why do I have to confirm in writing on a Guns n Roses message board to save myself for accusations of a cavalier attitude towards the death of innocent people?  And no, I haven't seen the picture of 'that girl'...i think, there's loads of em, aren't there?

You just do not seem that arsed - and I am not speaking to you as an asian but a Brit to be honest?

 

[Len Cnut]

2 minutes ago, action said:

 

What, I don't.  It's clearly an awful tragic thing thats happened here (there you go Dies') but do I think it's grounds to start stripping people of their nationalities? (although fair dues, I might have misconstrued the full extent of Lios comment in that regard)  I mean we had the IRA doing numerous terrorist attacks over here killing a great number of people, a great many more than ISIS have, I don't recall such extreme measures being imposed on the Irish.  Once again, it's an awful tragic thing but it's hardly the Blitz.  All this talk of the banning of backpacks and having to open your jackets when entering venues as 'extreme measures' and sacrifices, God help you people if there is ever a real serious on-going continuous threat against this country.  God help yous if, Lord forbid, there is ever a war or something.

[DieselDaisy]

1 minute ago, Len Cnut said:

What, I don't.  It's clearly an awful tragic thing thats happened here (there you go Dies') but do I think it's grounds to start stripping people of their nationalities? (although fair dues, I might have misconstrued the full extent of Lios comment in that regard)  I mean we had the IRA doing numerous terrorist attacks over here killing a great number of people, a great many more than ISIS have, I don't recall such extreme measures being imposed on the Irish.  Once again, it's an awful tragic thing but it's hardly the Blitz.  All this talk of the banning of backpacks and having to open your jackets when entering venues as 'extreme measures' and sacrifices, God help you people if there is ever a real serious on-going continuous threat against this country.  God help yous if, Lord forbid, there is ever a war or something.

''Yous''?

 

[Len Cnut]

7 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

You just do not seem that arsed - and I am not speaking to you as an asian but a Brit to be honest?

 

Perhaps I don't read enough newspapers or watch enough telly or something, I dunno but these things are so frequent across the board that anything I might have to say gets to sounding all a bit meaningless, it all becomes a blurry cycle of breaking news, body counts and pictures of creepy looking slack jawed Arabs.  

6 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

''Yous''?

 

Those who are shitting themselves officer   

[action]

13 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

What, I don't.  It's clearly an awful tragic thing thats happened here (there you go Dies') but do I think it's grounds to start stripping people of their nationalities? (although fair dues, I might have misconstrued the full extent of Lios comment in that regard)  I mean we had the IRA doing numerous terrorist attacks over here killing a great number of people, a great many more than ISIS have, I don't recall such extreme measures being imposed on the Irish.  Once again, it's an awful tragic thing but it's hardly the Blitz.  All this talk of the banning of backpacks and having to open your jackets when entering venues as 'extreme measures' and sacrifices, God help you people if there is ever a real serious on-going continuous threat against this country.  God help yous if, Lord forbid, there is ever a war or something.

to me it's extreme times we live in.

your 4 year old son asking you "daddy, what's a terrorist" would give that away

[Len Cnut]

6 minutes ago, action said:

to me it's extreme times we live in.

your 4 year old son asking you "daddy, what's a terrorist" would give that away

I guess it depends on ones idea of what constitutes extreme but fair enough.  

Edited May 24, 2017 by Len Cnut

[Healy52003]

all public gatherings in the uk could be cancelled including the GNR shows im hearing ???