Jump to content

Matt Sorum's Drumming on Use Your Illusion - Yay or Nay?


Matt Sorum's Drumming  

212 members have voted

You do not have permission to vote in this poll, or see the poll results. Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

Recommended Posts

I always found Matt's drumming boring and uninspired. He might be precise and all but to me it's too precise. I don't want a drum computer, I want rhythm and swing and groove. All of that had Steven. I dig the original, each one had his place and they were all perfect in it in with each other - at least musically speaking.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I vote "pretty good overall."

My biggest gripe with his drumming isn't even his drumming - it's that UYI may have the worst drum sound ever committed to a recording. Okay it's not that bad, but everything is overly compressed and with far too much reverb. The compression makes everything sound dull and lifeless - every single hit sounds exactly the same. I used to attribute that to Matt being a more mechanical player but the production doesn't help matters. He has a much better drum sound on TSI and later on with VR.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Tom-Ass said:

I picked meh but that may have not been fair... I still think they albums would have been better if Adler was capable of doing it at the time.. He sure seems capable now.. Either way I would pay money to have Matt over Frank.. Anyone.. Please!!!!

Frank with a tighter tuned snare drum and I'd have no problem with him. That was my only complaint about him on the 2 NITL gigs I went to. His current snare doesn't really cut through in a traditional way, it sounds like he is playing with the release off... which never sounds good. I know he isn't and he's just tuned it super low, but It doesn't sound good. Someone please sneak in and tune that snare.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think Sorum did a good job on Illusions.  YCBM & November Rain would have been completely different sounding songs with another drummer.

 

That being said, there are certainly several songs that potentially would have been better with Adler.

 

As far as hindsight is 20/20 ...I wish things would have worked out with Adler at the time but they got a very solid replacement and someone who will be cemented in GN'R's sound forever.

 

Edited by Kasanova King
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, RONIN said:

fast forward to 47:30 

Here's my theory on Steven's dismissal: All of the above. He was struggling through the UYI sessions (who knows if it was drugs or lack of skills - probably the drugs made him extra sloppy) - and I think the band would have waited for him, IF Duff and Slash still liked Steven. I think Steven didn't have any friends left in the band and so when it came time for someone to fight for him - nobody stepped up. Izzy was right in the midst of a major detox and his decision making power in the band was weakening - so in the end, it was more than likely Duff and Slash who facilitated Steven's firing. 

Thanks for that man. I had listened to that interview a while ago -- really good listening and it should be mandatory listening to anyone who cares about GNR. Anyway, I am digressing... According to that Niven quote, Steven didnt have the skills to do what AXL WANTED HIM TO DO, Steve didnt have the skills to PLAY LIKE AXL WANTED/DEMANDED. It has nothing to do with "skills" and everything to do with "SKILLS TO PLEASE AXL". Niven is pretty clear on the quote -- they had to fire Steven because Axl wasnt happy about his drumming -- which, again, is another evidence that it was NOT (only) the drugs. Obviously, according to Niven himself on the very same quote, the drug problem helped -- it seemed like it helped it BIG TIME -- Steven's firing, but in the end, according to Niven, that wasnt really the (only) problem, right?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Tori72 said:

I always found Matt's drumming boring and uninspired. He might be precise and all but to me it's too precise. I don't want a drum computer, I want rhythm and swing and groove. All of that had Steven. I dig the original, each one had his place and they were all perfect in it in with each other - at least musically speaking.

I don't know... this isn't too boring or uninspired to me

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, ludurigan said:

Thanks for that man. I had listened to that interview a while ago -- really good listening and it should be mandatory listening to anyone who cares about GNR. Anyway, I am digressing... According to that Niven quote, Steven didnt have the skills to do what AXL WANTED HIM TO DO, Steve didnt have the skills to PLAY LIKE AXL WANTED/DEMANDED. It has nothing to do with "skills" and everything to do with "SKILLS TO PLEASE AXL". Niven is pretty clear on the quote -- they had to fire Steven because Axl wasnt happy about his drumming -- which, again, is another evidence that it was NOT (only) the drugs. Obviously, according to Niven himself on the very same quote, the drug problem helped -- it seemed like it helped it BIG TIME -- Steven's firing, but in the end, according to Niven, that wasnt really the (only) problem, right?

Very good point. 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, ludurigan said:

 Steven's firing, but in the end, according to Niven, that wasnt really the (only) problem, right?

 

15 hours ago, RONIN said:

Here's my theory on Steven's dismissal: All of the above. He was struggling through the UYI sessions (who knows if it was drugs or lack of skills - probably the drugs made him extra sloppy) - and I think the band would have waited for him, IF Duff and Slash still liked Steven. I think Steven didn't have any friends left in the band and so when it came time for someone to fight for him - nobody stepped up. Izzy was right in the midst of a major detox and his decision making power in the band was weakening - so in the end, it was more than likely Duff and Slash who facilitated Steven's firing. 

Nobody fought for him? He didn't have any friends left in the band? That contradicts with the story of Axl giving Steven some of his royalties before they fired him, or Duff going to Steven's dealer with a gun threatening him to stop supplying him, you only need to read Duff's book to know what he did to get Steven back in the saddle. Of course it was easier to fire Steven than someone else in the band because he didn't contribute much songwriting wise and he wasn't the best drummer anyway, but I'm sure that drugs were the main reason otherwise they wouldn't have gone through so much hassle for him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, EvanG said:

 

Nobody fought for him? He didn't have any friends left in the band? That contradicts with the story of Axl giving Steven some of his royalties before they fired him, or Duff going to Steven's dealer with a gun threatening him to stop supplying him, you only need to read Duff's book to know what he did to get Steven back in the saddle. Of course it was easier to fire Steven than someone else in the band because he didn't contribute much songwriting wise and he wasn't the best drummer anyway, but I'm sure that drugs were the main reason otherwise they wouldn't have gone through so much hassle for him.

That seems to be Steven's POV. There was actually a great retrospective article of the 1989 Chicago sessions for UYI that I posted on this forum a year ago where Steven mentioned how when him, Duff and Slash would go down to the local bars to party, they would ditch him to party together.  It's no secret Axl didn't care for Steven by the end given the Erin Everly speedball incident. Some of this band tension is visible in the 1990 Farm Aid performance. He appeared to be getting alienated from the band towards the end.

I'm sure there were a lot of factors involved in his firing but I don't think it's a stretch to assume there was a communication breakdown between him and the band - weren't there rumors that the band were barely speaking to Steven during the final months prior to his firing? I imagine that if he were on better terms with Duff and Slash, that may have been enough to buy him more time to get clean. They may have waited for him. Who knows. Clearly Axl had no problems delaying UYI further so he could add the 150th layer of strings to November Rain - it was more than likely Duff, Slash, and Niven who were pushing to speed up the release of UYI (with pressure from Geffen no doubt). Steven not being able to get his shit together and his personal relationships with the band being at their lowest ebb - it probably just became a no-brainer to eject him from the band at that point.

All of this is just conjecture on my part though - going by the interview from Niven - it seems pretty straightforward that they gave him almost 2 years to straighten himself out. Would this have happened if Duff was the one who was debilitated by alcoholism to the point of being unable to play? Would Slash have signed off on that firing? Hard to say...but it seems unlikely.

Edited by RONIN
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I like Matt's drumming on VR case he got a chance to be on the ground floor with a new sound and new band. On the GnR songs songs that required more of a solid feel, You Could Be Mine stand out. But let's face it, Adler was the Punk Rock feel that gave Appetite the push and pull.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, RONIN said:

 Would this have happened if Duff was the one who was debilitated by alcoholism to the point of being unable to play? Would Slash have signed off on that firing? Hard to say...but it seems unlikely.

I don't know, as with most stuff on this forum, it's all speculation on our parts. But like I said... Steven was easier to replace than anyone else in that band, not saying he wasn't important.

But if the stories are true, they definitely gave him enough chances to clean up and get his act together and tried to help him, even taking it to the extreme like Duff did... I can imagine when someone is always too fucked up to learn new songs or to rehearse, that being a strain on every relationship, even for Slash who grew up with him and was dabbling with the same addiction at the time.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, ludurigan said:

I cant really explain, i'd say it is his "tone" or the "tuning" of his drums. The sound of his drums became awful in 1992. Well, everything was kinda awful on the T&R era!

I kinda liked certain aspects of it.  'Yesterdays', 'Don't Cry', 'Pretty Tied Up', ... all sounded awesome with the girls.

The UYI tour was magic, but there were so many missed opportunities : 'Breakdown' and 'Bad Apples' were only played twice (that we know of), 'Locomotive' (esp. the outro section) sounded amazing with T&R, they should've played that a lot more.

The Skin & Bones part of the UYI tour started out very promising, lotsa surprises on the first few nights, but it quickly deteriorated into the same old routine when they started dropping the newly added songs one by one ... when they came to Europe the setlist was shortened and became mind numbingly boring by the end.

Imagine if they kept picking from the same pool of songs for the whole of the Skin & Bones tour, we would've had 'Garden Of Eden', 'The Garden', 'Nice Boys', 'Reckless Life', 'Yesterdays', 'So Fine', ... on a nightly basis !

Imagine the T&R part of the UYI if they kept up the hard work and didn't fall victim to routine : we could've had 'Pretty Tied Up', 'Breakdown', 'Locomotive', 'Bad Apples', 'Move To The City', 'Yesterdays', 'Coma' , ... all with that extended line-up !

They also never should've dropped the songs they played sporadically at the start of the UYI tour with Izzy, but never (or hardly) played again : 'Right Next Door To Hell', 'Perfect Crime', 'You're Crazy (fast version)', 'Back Off Bitch', 'Out Ta Get Me', ...

What we did get was 'Civil War', 'Bad Obsession', 'KOHD', 'LALD', 'DTJM',  ... night after night after night ...

And if they didn't alienate Izzy the way they did :P we would've had '14 Years' and 'Dust N' Bones' as well !

GNR = one giant missed opportunity ...

Edited by Nikki_Sixx
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Hypocrisy of the highest order. Disgusting really. Following Adler's dismal for drugs McKagan's pancreas would explode and Slosh was seen running around a holiday resort in the starkers having seen little devils.

But it's not like he was fired for doing drugs, he was fired for not being able to function anymore. Slash and Duff could tone it down when work had to be done or at least they could still function, Steven couldn't and that's what the problem was. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Nikki_Sixx said:

I kinda liked certain aspects of it.  'Yesterdays', 'Don't Cry', 'Pretty Tied Up', ... all sounded awesome with the girls.

The UYI tour was magic, but there were so many missed opportunities : 'Breakdown' and 'Bad Apples' were only played twice (that we know of), 'Locomotive' (esp. the outro section) sounded amazing with T&R, they should've played that a lot more.

The Skin & Bones part of the UYI tour started out very promising, lotsa surprises on the first few nights, but it quickly deteriorated into the same old routine when they started dropping the newly added songs one by one ... when they came to Europe the setlist was shortened and became mind numbingly boring by the end.

Imagine if they kept picking from the same pool of songs for the whole of the Skin & Bones tour, we would've had 'Garden Of Eden', 'The Garden', 'Nice Boys', 'Reckless Life', 'Yesterdays', 'So Fine', ... on a nightly basis !

Imagine the T&R part of the UYI if they kept up the hard work and didn't fall victim to routine : we could've had 'Pretty Tied Up', 'Breakdown', 'Locomotive', 'Bad Apples', 'Move To The City', 'Yesterdays', 'Coma' , ... all with that extended line-up !

They also never should've dropped the songs they played sporadically at the start of the UYI tour with Izzy, but never (or hardly) played again : 'Right Next Door To Hell', 'Perfect Crime', 'You're Crazy (fast version)', 'Back Off Bitch', 'Out Ta Get Me', ...

What we did get was 'Civil War', 'Bad Obsession', 'KOHD', 'LALD', 'DTJM',  ... night after night after night ...

And if they didn't alienate Izzy the way they did :P we would've had '14 Years' and 'Dust N' Bones' as well !

GNR = one giant missed opportunity ...

I agree with everything you said about their laziness on picking songs. Funny thing is that they started the 1991 tour saying that they "didnt have a setlist" and they were picking the songs during the shows depending on what they "felt like playing" and blah blah blah... They actually did that but two minutes later they were playing the same set every night...

I am still hoping that some more SDB shows from 1991 will surface and we will ge to listen to Coma and Locomotive and Breakdown with Izzy in great quality. The audience recordings are fine but not great... Oh, and another live version of Bad Apples. The Rio version of Bad Apples is like 18 million times better than the studio version -- it feels like another song! It rocks!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's so much going on in most of the UYI songs that I tend not to pay attention to the drums on most tracks, they just kind of fit in nicely into the background, which I guess is a good thing. They do stand out on certain songs though and when they do I think they sound awesome. DTJ, Locomotive, November Rain and YCBM off of the top of my head spring to mind.

I definitely don't think his style takes anything away from any of the songs nor do I think having Adler on them instead would add much. GN'R just aren't a drum-centric band although the drummers in their alumni are very talented.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 21/06/2017 at 2:25 PM, James Bond said:

I vote "pretty good overall."

My biggest gripe with his drumming isn't even his drumming - it's that UYI may have the worst drum sound ever committed to a recording. Okay it's not that bad, but everything is overly compressed and with far too much reverb. The compression makes everything sound dull and lifeless - every single hit sounds exactly the same. I used to attribute that to Matt being a more mechanical player but the production doesn't help matters. He has a much better drum sound on TSI and later on with VR.

TSI is the best sounding GN'R album out of all of them for everything, guitar and vocals included. If they ever remaster Appetite or Illusions they should use the production quality of Spaghetti as a template.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Matt's drumming is pretty good overall.  Loved his drumset during the UYI tour, especially the one he had in the Skin n' Bones leg.  His drumming sound and tone have always been flawless.  He's truly missed in the band.  Breakdown, Locomotive and You Could Be Mine are the highlights of his tenure in Gn'R but he performed Steven's material to perfection.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

i like matts drumming over all, the only song that i dont like when he was drumming was mr brownstone it was done to slow, adler owns that song, frank does ok on it

to be honest Brain was the best drummer in GnR

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...