Apollo Show - Izzy & Steven Not Playing - Argue About It HERE

[Blackstar]

1 hour ago, RONIN said:

Okay...wait just a minute here Blackstar....

I recall the interview you're thinking of and I think it was Patton or FNM's bassist clearing up the rumor that Patton shat in Axl's juicebox and then re-sealed it before sticking it back in Axl's vending machine. That was a rumor.

AFAIK, Patton did his business with Axl's cue cards (hence, my sig).  He also poured a bottle of a fan's piss over his head and it rained down on Axl's teleprompter. 

I believe he had plans to poo all over Axl's teleprompter as well before Axl and Slash threw FNM off the tour. 

It was their bassist, Billy Gould. He said the juicebox story wasn't true and also that many things FNM were saying in the media about what they were doing with Axl etc. were made up stories just for fun. Patton wasn't "planning" to (I don't remember which one it was) on the teleprompters; he just said something about wanting to do it in an interview back then, among the other stories he told. The only thing that's been confirmed is that they made fun of GnR during their show.

And the story I know about the tour, is that Axl and Slash called them and told them that if they didn't like it there they should leave or else stop doing what they were doing during their shows. They stayed for a while (Slash says they shut it up during that small period) and then left on their own to do their own tour.

You still have Hetfield, though

Edited July 23, 2017 by Blackstar

[Powderfinger]

9 hours ago, Sosso said:

Don't you think that he has developed as a musician?

No rock n roll band EVER develop into incorporating synths... Piano maybe, horns maybe, a fucking sitar possibly but never ever synths. Ever. 

 

[Cory Trevor]

mike patton needs to lighten the fuck up , he's still a pissy bitch in his interviews, saw him calling wolfmother crap cause they sound 70's, yet FNM and mr bungle sound like they're trying to be weird 70's music. maybe he's jealous that the only singer with a similar range to him can actually write hits in all parts of his voice.

[Sosso]

7 minutes ago, Powderfinger said:

No rock n roll band EVER develop into incorporating synths... Piano maybe, horns maybe, a fucking sitar possibly but never ever synths. Ever. 

 

Oh, really. Have you ever listened to In Through the Out Door from Led Zeppelin?

[RONIN]

36 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

It was their bassist, Billy Gould. He said the juicebox story wasn't true and also that many things FNM were saying in the media about what they were doing with Axl etc. were made up stories just for fun. Patton wasn't "planning" to (I don't remember which one it was) on the teleprompters; he just said something about wanting to do it in an interview back then, among the other stories he told. The only thing that's been confirmed is that they made fun of GnR during their show.

And the story I know about the tour, is that Axl and Slash called them and told them that if they didn't like it there they should leave or else stop doing what they were doing during their shows. They stayed for a while (Slash says they shut it up during that small period) and then left on their own to do their own tour.

Damn. You're too good at GnR fact checking Blackstar. 

You just squashed one of Rock's most enduring stories. Patton's exploits are mythical at this point. 

Quote

You still have Hetfield, though

Indeed. 

[Sydney Fan]

' And it was not just the music. All the great things about that band were not there. I saw those guys in 1992 twice, they were 10 feet away from me, and there wasnt much left from the band i spent years watching and listening and adoring. What was left of it? Maybe Slash! Even fucked up he still played like an animal. But Axl... What the fuck happened to that guy? I am stilll baffled and I dont understand what happened. By 1992 (he actually showed signs of that in mid-1991) he started moving, sounding and looking like a fucking robot. Like a fucking malfunctioning clone of himself. Complete autopilot. Predictable. Boring. The exact opposite of who he was, who he used to be onstage. That guy, onstage, during GNR days, he seemed to have music going through him during the shows in the GNR days. It was all over by 1992. By then he became a performer or an entertainer or whatever you wanna call it. Very rarely he let loose like he used to do on GNR days. Very rarely he seemed to be "into" the songs. It was only on special occasions that he was "on", like when he played with members of Queen, Aerosmith etc.

I often wondered if it was his depression potentially being an issue. It was also during this stage when axl hired his sister and stepbrother to manage the backstage themed parties, so i just think axl went just plain nuts. Maybe management was in axls ear telling him one thing and maybe wanting axl to break away and do his own thing. Slash talks bout it in his book that all advice had to go through doug goldstein first and then 'massaged' before asking axl. He complained about going on the illusions tour because his head wasn't upto it, i think it could have been just mental issues axl was experiencing and the band/management probably didn't want to raise it and keep the band going and the money rolling in......except the band were pissing the money down the drain with their late appearances.

[killuridols]

5 hours ago, RONIN said:

Agreed. It also shows you what happens when one guy hijacks the band and sidelines the other members in the decision making process. He's no Trent Reznor when it comes to band management. That much is clear. 

It's always an ego-trip when you try to micro-manage things you don't really understand. You hire a manager to manage the band. You hire a producer to produce your album. You don't do both of those things yourself when you're a singer just because you think you know what is best for your band in all spheres of the job. Unless you're Axl of course. 

He's no Trent Reznor in a lot of things, I'm afraid 

The funniest part is that he gave shit to Azoff for wanting to reunite GN'R and a few years later what does he end up doing????

----

P.S: you owe me some PM's 

[Powderfinger]

5 hours ago, Sosso said:

Oh, really. Have you ever listened to In Through the Out Door from Led Zeppelin?

Yes. But Zeppelin weren't a Rock n Roll band. There's a difference. Rock n Roll bands are drums bass, guitars and vox. Dirty and raw. Zeppelin were great at times and a song like in the evening is amazing, but it's not the same musically as a band with punk credentials and influences. I see a line from the stooges and the mc5 to the sex pistols to Guns. I see Zeppelin as part of another and equally as good lineage. 

Edited July 23, 2017 by Powderfinger
Misspelling.

[WhazUp]

1 minute ago, Powderfinger said:

Yes. But Zeppelin weren't a Rock n Roll band. There's a difference. Rock n Roll bands are drums bass, guitars and vox. Dirty and raw. Zeppelin were Kashmir is amazing, but it's not the same musically as a band with punk credentials and influences. 

Zeppelin is probably the definition of a rock n' roll band lol.  Zeppelin I and II are dirty and raw as hell

[Powderfinger]

2 minutes ago, WhazUp said:

Zeppelin is probably the definition of a rock n' roll band lol.  Zeppelin I and II are dirty and raw as hell

No... No they are not... Babe I'm gonna leave you and Mr Brownstone are not in the same style. One is blues rock and the other is a bluesy/punky hybrid. Common area blues. But Zeppelin (don't even mention communication breakdown) were never punk. GNR covered the stooges, the damned, the pistols, the dead boys, the misfits. Bands that would beat up the synth player and drink his money. Bands that Zeppelin had nothing in common with. Zeppelin were in there with Cream, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath.... 

[ludurigan]

1 hour ago, Sydney Fan said:

I often wondered if it was his depression potentially being an issue. It was also during this stage when axl hired his sister and stepbrother to manage the backstage themed parties, so i just think axl went just plain nuts. Maybe management was in axls ear telling him one thing and maybe wanting axl to break away and do his own thing. Slash talks bout it in his book that all advice had to go through doug goldstein first and then 'massaged' before asking axl. He complained about going on the illusions tour because his head wasn't upto it, i think it could have been just mental issues axl was experiencing and the band/management probably didn't want to raise it and keep the band going and the money rolling in......except the band were pissing the money down the drain with their late appearances.

yeah maybe some mental issue but more likely axl basically had 4 years of people telling him how great he was and he probably started believing it. yes, he was the greatest singer, but that doesnt give him the right to piss on people and to have his way over everyone. thats not even a smart thing to do in the long run cause you alilenate people, even those who care about you, because they lose respect for you and they dont wanna be anywhere around you. axl probably noticed at one point that he didnt really need to answer to anyone, not even izzy, slash and duff. He probably noticed that he didnt really need to deal with anything or anyone that didnt please him (ex: niven). he probably thought it would be smart (or better) to surround himself with yes people. thats a common trap for anyone in axl's place and he (likely) fell real bad on it. with the glorious help of god knows how many "enablers", people that likely kept telling him that he was right, the doug goldsteins...

[WhazUp]

2 minutes ago, Powderfinger said:

No... No they are not... Babe I'm gonna leave you and Mr Brownstone are not in the same style. One is blues rock and the other is a bluesy/punky hybrid. Common area blues. But Zeppelin (don't even mention communication breakdown) were never punk. GNR covered the stooges, the damned, the pistols, the dead boys, the misfits. Bands that would beat up the synth player and drink his money. Bands that Zeppelin had nothing in common with. Zeppelin were in there with Cream, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath.... 

Yeah Zeppelin were in there with Cream, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath... all rock n' roll bands lol.  You don't need to be punk in order to be rock n' roll, that is why punk is not called rock n' roll

I never thought anyone in the entire world would dispute Zeppelin being called a rock n' roll band lol

[Euchre]

Zeppelin have way more integrity than GN'R. Zeppelin lose their drummer and they cease using the Zeppelin name  - why because they know it will be a different band. Occasionally they re-unite, and when they do they only use the original members still alive, and for the drums they use the closest they have - their drummers son.

GN'R is now all about the $$$$. The only time I think we will see the original 5 now is when this version runs its course and they need the hype of the original 5 back to sell tickets. Until then they'll milk it for all its worth to maximise the $ for those that own the name and imagery.

[Powderfinger]

1 hour ago, WhazUp said:

Yeah Zeppelin were in there with Cream, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath... all rock n' roll bands lol.  You don't need to be punk in order to be rock n' roll, that is why punk is not called rock n' roll

I never thought anyone in the entire world would dispute Zeppelin being called a rock n' roll band lol

Look. It all boils down to Beatles or Stones and Zeppelin and those other bands fall in with the Beatles, Gnr and the pistols and stooges are in the stones camp. Rock n Roll is not the same as heavy blues a la Zeppelin. 

[DieselDaisy]

 

[Top-Hatted One]

FNM my favorite band behind Guns. They can piss/shat in Axl's OJ and/or TelePrompTer all they want!

[Top-Hatted One]

8 hours ago, Cory Trevor said:

mike patton needs to lighten the fuck up , he's still a pissy bitch in his interviews, saw him calling wolfmother crap cause they sound 70's, yet FNM and mr bungle sound like they're trying to be weird 70's music. maybe he's jealous that the only singer with a similar range to him can actually write hits in all parts of his voice.

The wolfmother thing was 13yrs ago. Pushing the envelope is part of the genius of Mike Patton

[Top-Hatted One]

4 hours ago, Sydney Fan said:

' And it was not just the music. All the great things about that band were not there. I saw those guys in 1992 twice, they were 10 feet away from me, and there wasnt much left from the band i spent years watching and listening and adoring. What was left of it? Maybe Slash! Even fucked up he still played like an animal. But Axl... What the fuck happened to that guy? I am stilll baffled and I dont understand what happened. By 1992 (he actually showed signs of that in mid-1991) he started moving, sounding and looking like a fucking robot. Like a fucking malfunctioning clone of himself. Complete autopilot. Predictable. Boring. The exact opposite of who he was, who he used to be onstage. That guy, onstage, during GNR days, he seemed to have music going through him during the shows in the GNR days. It was all over by 1992. By then he became a performer or an entertainer or whatever you wanna call it. Very rarely he let loose like he used to do on GNR days. Very rarely he seemed to be "into" the songs. It was only on special occasions that he was "on", like when he played with members of Queen, Aerosmith etc.

I often wondered if it was his depression potentially being an issue. It was also during this stage when axl hired his sister and stepbrother to manage the backstage themed parties, so i just think axl went just plain nuts. Maybe management was in axls ear telling him one thing and maybe wanting axl to break away and do his own thing. Slash talks bout it in his book that all advice had to go through doug goldstein first and then 'massaged' before asking axl. He complained about going on the illusions tour because his head wasn't upto it, i think it could have been just mental issues axl was experiencing and the band/management probably didn't want to raise it and keep the band going and the money rolling in......except the band were pissing the money down the drain with their late appearances.

Performing new music is inspiring. Playing the same songs over and over year after year in a cash(loot) grab is not 

Edited July 23, 2017 by Top-Hatted One

[Top-Hatted One]

2 hours ago, Powderfinger said:

No... No they are not... Babe I'm gonna leave you and Mr Brownstone are not in the same style. One is blues rock and the other is a bluesy/punky hybrid. Common area blues. But Zeppelin (don't even mention communication breakdown) were never punk. GNR covered the stooges, the damned, the pistols, the dead boys, the misfits. Bands that would beat up the synth player and drink his money. Bands that Zeppelin had nothing in common with. Zeppelin were in there with Cream, Deep Purple, Black Sabbath.... 

I'm confused so Punk is rock n roll but Led Zeppelin isn't rock n roll?

Chuck Berry and Elvis aren't rock n roll either?

[alfierose]

This is all very interesting but totally off track. Lets try and keep discussion vaguely related to the thread title please. 

[MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle]

Bottom line is this: the only way the 5 will reunite is if ALL 5 genuinely want to reunite and they don’t at the moment. 

I love Izzy’s work and think he ought to be on board, but clearly, the guy doesn’t care all that much beyond the right price.  He was given an opportunity to join; he said no.  Nostalgia, loyalty or giving something back to the fans are not motivating factors for joining, it would seem.  I don’t hold it against him; if it’s money he’s playing for (and his actions and deleted tweet suggest that is the case) so be it.  At least we know where his priorities lie.  Axl would know that.  Axl had an opportunity to pay him more; he said no.  So Axl doesn’t care quite that much either, because if he did, Izzy would be on board. 

Steven would play for free, as we all know, so money isn’t an issue with him.  He was given an opportunity to join; he blew it, somehow.  Axl and co. don’t care enough to give him another shot at this point, or Steven would be back by now, probably as a guest (despite what he says, I think he would do guest spots).  Yes, he blabbed some fucking stupid things over the radio, but it does seem a bit extreme to strike him out over one misguided interview.  Maybe there are other valid reasons for not having Steven on board.  Maybe Axl and co. are sick of giving this guy chances, I don’t know.  It’s a shame, when Steven cares so much and Axl seems not to, but what can we do?

Duff and Slash are obviously happy with whatever they are being paid and things like ‘getting your old pal back’ as Duff has said, or doing it for the fans, or whatever, are happy bonuses.  They must have been prepared to compromise somewhere, playing for both money and love.

Frankly, I don’t want Izzy sharing the stage with them if the only thing that will get him up there is the right price.  That’s not because I think he should be playing for free, or that he doesn’t deserve equal share, but because if his heart isn’t in it, if he doesn’t yearn to play with his ‘old pals’, or get a kick out of playing some classic tunes he had a hand in writing, then he’s probably not going to sound good anyway, or add much to the band.  His ‘it’s-business’ attitude will come through the music and spoil it.  I’d rather Richard, who clearly has a great love for playing with this band and it shows - he’s getting better and better all the time.   Basically, if Izzy doesn't want to reunite with the band, then why should I care?  If they ever work it out, great.  Until then, I'm happy with the current band (the drummer is a whole other conversation).

 

[Lim666]

Also keep in mind, and Axl also adressed that in his online interviews, that Izzy and Steven never ever proved being able to do world tours within the last ~20 years. Steven's minitours often were cancelled cause of his own fucked up behaviour, Izzy didnt do it since the mid 90s at all. So off course this is an issue....are those 2 even able to do it? Can they take the pressure at all playing 3 times a week for about 3h each?  Are they physically fit to do it (Izzy himself said he needed 2 weeks for recovering after the Axl 2006 european tour leg - in which he playved not more than 4-5 songs for "selected" shows), Adler...uhm, highly doubtful? Are they technically fit to do it? Steven already fucked up a part in SCOM/HOF, Izzy forgot chords in 1993 already (when re-joining Guns for some shows in Europe). Are they capable of "learning" newer things at all? Add the aging here, too.
All together VERY high risk for a band who cant screw up anymore given the money rolling in and out in 2017.

[Euchre]

I don't think Izzy cares about $ in the absolute sense, I think it's in a relative sense. He started the band, like Steven was integral to the key albums and build up to success of the band and thinks he deserves and even share of whatever the amount is. That's why I had hopes this show might have been it -if it was a free show put the money aside, put the music first -  everyone can be equal in $0 and get the original and best line up on that stage. Leave a credible legacy not one that lacks integrity and screams of sell out to the almighty $. Obviously didn't happen - and maybe $ still to blame if people see the pinnacle will they go back to an inferior version for the rest of the tour ? Or at that point would the other 3 be forced to share some profits ?

The whole reliability think with members makes we wonder if people are actually looking at facts or living in an alternate reality. Axl has failed to show up at more shows, caused more tours to be cancelled, walked off stage more and pulled more damaging-to-the-band stunts than all the other members combined. If anyone is a risk it is him, so if he is questioning others reliability it is laughable. And I'm not saying that to say he shouldn't be there he's part of the 5 so should be, but let's at least deal in the real world with factually accurate evaluations.

 

[MYWIFEMYLIFE]

This argument is nonsense. GNR=AFD 5, AFD 30TH YEAR=AFD 5. AFD 30TH YEAR WITHOUT AFD 5=SHIT.

[magnumpi]

Nothing to argue about from point of view.

Without izzy and Steven the band's current activities do not interest me.