Jump to content
  • Announcements

    • downzy

      No More Links to Unofficial or Unlicensed Content :(   11/25/2019

      Hi, Due to numerous DMCA complaints directed towards the hosting provider of this forum, we are no longer allowing any links whatsoever to content this is shared, posted, or distributed by unlicensed or unofficial sources.   It's a sad day and we hate that it comes to this, but thanks to the sad and pathetic efforts of some even sadder and more pathetic individuals, the ability of this forum to remain online requires us to remove any links to content that is produced, shared, or distributed by individuals or sources that do not have a license or authority to post said material.   Discussion, concerns, and questions of this matter can be done so here: We apologize that it has come to this but it's the world we now live in unfortunately.   Thanks for your understanding and cooperation of this matter going forward. Downzy


Popular Content

Showing most liked content on 07/09/2019 in all areas

  1. 17 points
    Pinball machines, an aviation line, literally everything besides new music.
  2. 11 points
    I can't wait for the brand new singles that will inevitably come with it, "Ain't Goin' Down" and "Welcome To The Jungle (1994)".
  3. 8 points
    Fair enough, this seems to be a good place to put the thread on hold. If there are developments in the future, we'll reopen the thread.
  4. 7 points
  5. 5 points
    So you're aware of who Axl's manager is but do not want to contact them because they give you the creeps? Also, what about Jan's other questions?
  6. 5 points
    Sorry, I still don't believe it. Nothing really adds up. And Raz is just a Trump bot now. Can't take anything he says seriously.
  7. 5 points
  8. 5 points
    I was born in 01, the first exposure to GNR I had was my moms UYI I & II CDs, I dont remember what songs she actually played, but now typing it I kinda remember sitting in her 96 Jimmy and Axls rant in Get in the Ring which is something that a 3 year old probably shouldn't listen to Haha, but my parents were cool when it came to my music, hell my mom would blast Motley Crues Smokin in the Boys Room when she would pick me up from Pre School. Anyways flash forward to 2016, listened to Jungle n Paradise, heard Nightrain, then more, and now I'm here. All I gotta say is I'm glad I didn't have to put up with the Chinese Democracy wait, cause damn that must of been hell waiting for it, but atleast you all knew there was a album coming unlike what's going on now.
  9. 4 points
    Wrong thread, wrong band
  10. 4 points
    I will vouch for that, at 15, I dated a 21 year old singer, hung out everyday with the band. But my parents to this day thought I was at a girlfriend's house all the time 😊 The 80s were much different than today.
  11. 4 points
    Lady, according with your account you continue to live in that environment, after the charges were dropped....
  12. 4 points
    “I call my mother She’s just a cunt now “
  13. 4 points
    @Little Michelle what exactly do you want Duff to do?
  14. 4 points
    The timeline of this is also very confusing, and there are things that don’t add up. By all accounts, the incident took place at Gardner St. studios, where the band rehearsed and practically lived for a while (although it seems that Duff and Izzy had their own apartments, and Axl would crash in various places), in an attached small apartment where they had built a small loft, throwing those infamous parties at the parking lot. There were other bands there – one of them being Johnny and the Jaguars and then called The Wild (Dizzy’s old band) – and many people frequenting the place. Also by all accounts, after the police were informed about the incident and raided the place (according to band members the cops broke down the door of the apartment), the band had to leave it and ended up (right away or after roaming for a few days) living in Vicky Hamilton’s apartment. According to Vicky Hamilton, who also seems to be the source for the books by Stephen Davis (Watch You Bleed) and Mick Wall in regards to the timing, the incident took place in December 1985 and by Christmas the band were at her apartment. Michelle, too, says that it happened during that month, and that two weeks passed before her mother and the cops knew about it; moreover, she says that before the incident, Axl was away in Indiana for weeks, so she wasn’t able to tell him about the alleged pregnancy and then the miscarriage (which, she says, happened five weeks after she knew she was pregnant, and then some more time passed after the miscarriage until Axl finally returned to L.A.). Raz Cue, though, in his book, places it in January 1986, and seems very confident about the timing, as he gives details and a specific time indicator (see below). A look at the known club shows the band played during that time period (late ’85 – early ’86) can help shed some more light, in combination with the other sources: November 22, 1985 – The Troubadour December 20, 1985 – Music Machine January 4, 1986 – The Troubadour January 18, 1986 – The Roxy [January 26, 1986 – Starwood Club (source: a-4-d.com)] [February 1, 1986 – The Troubadour (source: gnrontour.com) or Timbers Ballroom (source: ad & flyer at troccolitm.com] February 28, 1986 – The Troubadour March 21, 1986 - Fenders Ballroom The first thing to notice here (even without the two shows in brackets) is that, in either version of December 1985 or January 1986, the band didn’t hide for a long time; which means that the issue was solved within a short period of time, at least by taking a legal route that allowed Axl and Slash to move freely without being at risk of getting arrested. The December 20 and January 4 shows came with flyers that asked for donations for a “Keep us out of jail fund” (you can see them at gnrontour.com). Another, seemingly earlier, flyer, found in Marc Canter’s book Reckless Road, which advertised all three shows of Dec. 20, Jan. 4 and Jan. 18, didn’t contain the donation bit. This seems to underpin the December 1985 version, furthermore indicating: that the legal trouble had occurred already around mid-December (although the band still played shows - Mick Wall wrote wrongly, among many other inaccuracies, that the Dec. 20 show was cancelled); and, (going by Michelle’s version), that the incident itself happened two weeks prior, i.e. early December - so just a few days after the band had played another show on November 22nd. As I said above, Raz Cue’s book The Days of Guns N’ Raz’s gives a different timing, namely January 1986. According to Raz Cue in the book, the “Dio Boots” girl incident (and the subsequent first police raid that led to Dizzy’s arrest and then to the band’s fleeing) took place about one week after the Roxy show on January 18. In his recent new version of events, as it appears on his website, Raz doesn’t mention anything about getting the date of the “Dio Boots” incident wrong. He only places the incident with Michelle “a couple of weeks” before the – now separate - “Dio Boots” one (so about a week before the Roxy show), and the police raid (and Dizzy’s arrest) for the Michelle incident “the next night, or the one after” the “Dio Boots” incident (so about a week after the Roxy show). So all still in January. It could be just assumed that Raz Cue simply gets the timeline wrong and stop here, but now the big confusion starts. According to Reckless Road, as well as The Days of Guns N’ Raz’s, the Jan. 18 Roxy show created a big buzz, which attracted many A&R people from record labels (it was the show that Tom Zutaut missed because he arrived too late). Slash and Duff don’t give a timing in their autobiographies; Duff, though, says that the incident happened “just as the record label frenzy around us was heating up.” [Steven’s book doesn’t help: he is the only one who doesn’t mention the incident at all, and says that he has no idea why they moved into Vicky Hamilton’s apartment (!); he also seems at times to confuse the Gardner studio with West Arkeen’s and Del’s place.] There is a recording of the Jan. 18th show at the Roxy, where Axl is heard dedicating the last song of the set (Goodnight Tonight) like this: “This is for the last two weeks worth of partying at the studio, and all those sweet girls that we asked to see their tits.” This seems to indicate that the band was still at Gardner studios at that time, giving merit to Raz Cue’s timeline. At the February 28th show, that there is also a recording of, Out Ta Get Me is played for the first time and Axl dedicates it “to the LAPD, and any young girls that like to fuck around.” Slash is heard saying, “[...] if anybody runs into a couple of guys named Jeff and Alan (or Allen), feel free to kick their fucking heads in. These are the guys that kicked in our studio door, so if you see them, be my guest.” So that show was definitely after the incident and after the band had come back from hiding, having also written the song related to it in the meantime. That was also the show Tom Zutaut attended and decided to sign the band. But then what about the “Keep us out of jail fund” flyers for the earlier shows of Dec. 20th and Jan. 4th? Could they have been coincidental, just a clever way to promote the band as “bad boys”? It’s so confusing... ------- Anyway, regardless of which version about the timing is correct and whether the incident took place in December 1985 or January 1986, there seems to be a big problem with the claim that Axl was in Indiana “for weeks” before it happened: As noted above, in the December version (going by what Michelle says about the two weeks that passed between it and the police interference, in combination with the date of the show and the flyer for it), the incident is placed in early December, just a few days after the band had played another show, so Axl was there. In the January version, also (going by Raz Cue’s timeline and Axl’s dedication at the Roxy show) the band had played a show on January 4th, i.e. just about a week before the incident happened (plus they were partying at the rehearsal space for two weeks before the Roxy show), so Axl was there. Moreover: Raz Cue says in his book that Axl went to Indiana before he joined L.A Guns (=last months of 1984 – pre-GnR) and there his parents tried to make him give up being a musician and study to be a sound engineer instead, and that made Axl give it another shot in L.A. and take the offer to join L.A. Guns although he was reluctant before because he didn’t like the music they played. Axl would confirm that his parents had tried to make him go back to Indiana: Axl: Up until we got signed, I lived on the streets for five years. I never lived in one place for more than two months, always crashing at people's houses. My parents would say, 'Come back home and go to college and we'll pay for it' but I would reply, 'No, I have to do this now.' [Hit Parader, April 1987] And in an interview in late December 1987, Axl would say that he had just come back from Indiana, where he hadn’t been for about 2-1/2 years, because the last time he had been there his parents had told him that he would achieve nothing being in a band, so he didn’t want to go back there until he had made it and prove them wrong: Axl: [...] I hadn't been back in two years and the last time I was back there - it was at least two and a half years - I thought, I just told myself, ‘I'm not coming back until I get a record out,’ because too many people kept saying ‘Oh, you'll never get anywhere.’ [Interview with Steve Harris, Dec. 1987] ------ TL;DR: So, the claim that Axl was in Indiana for weeks is disproved by the show dates, and, additionally, it doesn’t seem plausible at all that Axl would want to visit Indiana at that point, when the band had started to get interest from record labels. That was also the time that most of the AFD songs were written, and the band debuted a new one almost at each show (e.g. Nightrain was played for the first time at the Dec. 20 show, My Michelle was debuted at the Jan. 4th show, Out Ta Get Me at the Feb. 28th show), so how Axl couldn't have been there all the time? And, as it has already been pointed out, why would he want a baby at that time?!
  15. 3 points
    I am currently working on my story, also I have been writing to people in the MeToo movement to get the word out. I have allies that are fighting for me. I want the truth to be out. I don't expect an ounce of decency from any of them. I know that they are just money grubbing pigs and I don't think that they will ever tell the truth. I am just working on my, side of things. This questioning is tiresome, as I think some of you are a bit hateful. The feeling I get is that some of you want to grill me as if you were a lawyer and I am on trial. It doesn't feel very good. I'm trying to answer questions and yet, these questions are repeatedly asked in a needling way. I don't think I want to keep repeating myself. Some of you are absolutely amazing and I wish that the everyone would read your posts and listen. I really just wanted to explain who I was and be a person to you all. Not just a story. I feel that I have done that. The people out there that say I'm lying are always going to feel that way. I'm not going to keep putting myself in this particular position.
  16. 3 points
    All of them?? they were ringing you at home? You seem to be cherry picking the questions you want to answer
  17. 3 points
    I would love Duff to own up to the past and the part he played in silencing me. If he is going to act like he cares about Rape, Trauma, Depression etc. then he should be honest. He is the only Trump supporter I know that is doing the right thing!!
  18. 3 points
    Bette Midler is my favourite for anti Trump tweets.
  19. 3 points
    Couple new articles transcribing the interview. http://bravewords.com/news/alice-cooper-looks-back-on-recording-the-garden-with-guns-n-roses-about-3-00am-axl-rose-calls-up-and-says-hey-i-got-this-song-it-s-perfect-for-you?fbclid=IwAR1Tkp_lNSyqlce2whpftx306K-aWk8KSHJukEmCFlyNJpsqRRwKj3JhGZA https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/general_music_news/alice_cooper_explains_how_he_formed_band_with_johnny_depp_recalls_touring_with_gnr_before_they_made_it_big.html?fbclid=IwAR3NTgU0oQp0tubx6WVnP_Wgxq5Cmw06EBYeaaBLRWnN2D4uiMqFNVqDwDc
  20. 3 points
    This bands legs is open to anyone but the fans of their music.
  21. 3 points
    I'm also curious about this @Little Michelle
  22. 3 points
  23. 3 points
    Yeah, but I'm talking about this particular case. Why attack Duff when he isn't the perpetrator and wasn't even there? Even if he is a hypocrite (which I'm not saying he is), is that worse than being the perpetrator? Especially from Michelle's POV? So is it worse to say now that it's not okay to abuse women than to actually have done it? As far as I know, Duff has never been accused of rape or abuse, and the last 2 decades or so he has led a healthy life, being a good person, trying to stay on the right path, raising a family. But all of a sudden he has to be attacked, not the heroin dealer, not the alleged rapist, just because they shut up? It makes absolutely zero sense to me. Same goes for the others who joined in the rape. Wouldn't you try to find out who they were after it happened? Or would you still live around that scene suspicious that anyone around there might be one of the people abusing you? Why don't they get any backlash? They were just as guilty as Axl was, if the story is true. But no, let's all attack the guy who wasn't there at all, but makes a song about how it is not okay to abuse women more than 30 years later, because he is clearly the enemy. It makes zero sense.
  24. 3 points
    The reasoning along the lines of ”Raz loves Trump, Duff disses Trump so therefore Raz accuses Axl of rape” - is exactly what I’m talking about when I refer to flawed logic. Does that really sound like reasonable rationale to anyone ? If Raz just wanted to go after Duff I’m sure he has heaps of ammo to do so, he doesn’t need to bring Axl into and burn those bridges & also need to pretend he made an error in his book (I mean if he is making it up now because mad about a Trump dis presumably you believe the original account in the book was the true one and he has pretended he made an error to make things fit). It seems quite some lengths to go to and a bit of self sabotage over someone dissing a politician. The far more logical explanation is the one he has put forward - that he became aware of new information about an incident he was on the fringes of and his conscious has gnawed at him and he has come out in support of someone he feels has been wronged - and done so at personal expense in terms of friendships, reputation and having to admit to errors in his book. That can’t have been an easy step and on the errors he went into detail in explaining how they came about and his reasoning sounds plausible to me. Back to my original post this is why I said Duff should look to the actions Raz has taken if he wants to learn how to be a man as it takes a huge amount of fortitude and humility to take the steps he has and at personal sacrifice.
  25. 3 points
    I feel there is some flawed logic going on in this thread or an desire by some to see through anything that could point to this being true - although given this is GNR forum I suppose it is hardly surprising that people don’t want an image they have built shattered. What I mean by this is : 1) Raz has confirmed this is the Michelle that was regularly hanging around the studio and a friend of the band - yet some seem to be directing questions at her suggesting she prove she even knew the band 2) Raz has also confirmed that this is the girl the incident happened to & that she was 15 at the time. At the very least all parties quoted ie Michelle, Raz and GNR members themselves have said that she ends up naked in the alley. By any sane measure a 15 year old girl having her clothes ripped off by adult men and being thrown into the street is pretty disturbing. It doesn’t matter what the reason was, or whatever the girl did or didn’t do - doing this to a 15 year old is a low act and I’d be surprised if that alone wasn’t criminal. There is no justification for that sort of behaviour or reaction. 3) I’m not sure if this has been mentioned in the thread but there is definitely an Axl quote out there where he talks about ‘escorting people out of the Hell House and by escort I mean drag them down the alley naked’. I’m paraphrasing but someone I’m sure can find the exact quote. Up until now i had always assumed he was talking about grown men they beat up but now it takes on a really creepy tone and quite disturbing really. The quote makes it sound like he is bragging about it and he obviously neglects to mention that (if the allegations are true) he is referring to a 15 year old girl - so he is at least self aware enough to know how bad including that part would look. 4) Other girls have been mentioned in the thread with similar stories. Again I’m pretty sure there is an Erin Everly quote out from a court testimony there that sounds eerily similar about being tied up, assaulted and locked in a closet from memory. So the suggestions that this is out of character or a one off or an implausible story are really ignoring the similar stories that are out there - unless all these girls have banded together in some great conspiracy. Similarly the suggestions about motives - some have sought legal recourse some haven’t - so not all can be put down to a motive about money. So trying to assert that all these girls have made this up looking for a payday doesn’t hold. I’m well aware none of this proves Axl did anything, but all I’m saying is there are plenty of stories out there of him behaving in a pretty consistent manner so to make out this is completely implausable is to be wilfully ignoring other stories by unrelated people. There is the stairwell incident in Chicago as well that both Slash and Steve have confirmed as first hand witnesses. 5) The fact that Raz has come out with this also is reason to pause and consider. To use his own words after reading his book I thought the guy came off like an Axl kiss ass. He certainly doesn’t come across like he has an axe to grind. So for someone peripheral to the situation and at least impartial if not a GNR/Axl advocate to come out the way they have certainly must mean there is genuine belief in his mind that this is plausible. 6) All this talk of presumption of innocence as though it means Michelle can’t speak up. Correct me if I’m wrong - but is Axl in jail for this without trial ? If he isn’t then he is been granted the presumption of innocence & he is 100% entitled to it. It doesn’t extend to whether people can or can’t make allegations or whether people on a message board are free to form their own views as to the veracity of such claims. If it did no one could ever make an allegation and no one would be ever prosecuted for a crime. The evidentiary hurdle in a criminal trial is beyond reasonable doubt. In a civil trial it is balance of probabilities. Similarly presumption of innocence is in relation to criminal proceedings. 7) There seems to be a push by some to make Michelle seem like this crazy girl making up stories full of inconsistencies. I’m of the other view - she comes across quite rational and goes into great detail on things that I think would be hard to do if you weren’t actually there. (Ie describing layouts, people). I think it would be difficult to lie with that level of detail. 8) I wouldn’t expect other band members to speak up on it even if they did witness it. I’m pretty sure there is an Izzy quote where he talks about selling both drugs and girls and from memory Geffen made him break up with his underage girlfriend when they got signed. The point is more than likely a few of them would be in trouble is past actions started being brought up - and as much as they know about Axl, Axl would know about them. Let’s face it Slash and Duff are primarily motivated by money these days so they aren’t going to give up their golden goose. Same with Dizzy. 9) The last point I wanted to make is the same one I tried to make on my other post in this topic. No one can no for sure what happened in that room except for those that were there. I think most would agree that just the parts confirmed by all parties are pretty bad and would have caused huge emotional damage for Michelle. If the rest of it is true it is one of the worst possible crimes out there and would have been horrific for her. Now even if you think there is only a 1% chance of that part being true - do you want to run the risk of being the person ripping into someone that went through that. How are you going to feel if it turns out it’s true. Sure Michelle has come to a public forum, and a GNR one at that - but she clearly isn’t crazy and this can’t be immediately dismissed as the ravings of a deranged individual - so sure ask questions but I’d think for your own sake let alone hers to do it in a pretty respectful and balanced way.
  26. 3 points
    I interviewed Duff back in early 2009 when Loaded's Sick was released (I write on a bunch of music magazines here in Italy). He was glad to answer a bunch of GNR related questions I had and one of them was about the Hell Tour. I asked him if they played any other shows on their way back to L.A., because some sources reported them and some didn't, and he confirmed that no other shows were played beside the one in Seattle.
  27. 2 points
  28. 2 points
  29. 2 points
    You're right! After losing my baby, getting raped by the Love of my life, when I was still spotting from the loss, honestly heartbroken, in shock, suicidal, missing my life as it once was, missing my friends, having to comfort them as they freaked out about what Axl did, begging me to give them the chance, pleading with me, getting literally harassed by people calling me a liar, a whore, a stupid slut that just wants attention, a jealous bitch that just wants to ruin the band, etc, I did finally decide to not put Axl away, so that my friends wouldn't be punished for what he had done. Now those same friends are out there lying about something that could have just been erased. Lying about caring about Rape, caring about little girls being touched without consent, pretending to give a rats ass about Trauma and Depression. These friends are blocking my voice. The voice that set Axl free and gave them all a chance to get famous. I have every right to be hurt, to be angry, to be heartbroken all over again. Silencing someone does not have to be violent.
  30. 2 points
  31. 2 points
    You are an asshole and everyone knows it How much of an asshole nobody can say
  32. 2 points
    Wishful thinking it's a tease for the illusions anniversary. We might be 2 years early, but the band celebrated appetite 12 months after the actual anniversary date.
  33. 2 points
  34. 2 points
    Picture looks like its been taken from a tv screen. Could be a proshot. https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10157484668648069&id=10901008068
  35. 2 points
  36. 2 points
    It's been rumored to be in the works for about the past year. Lately it's been popping up on my news feed more often. Story now will be an announcement at the end of the year and going on sale early 2020.
  37. 2 points
    When I first starting getting into GNR, I listened to more of the demos / unreleased stuff of the 80s rather than Illusions era officially released songs, (gibbos if your reading this thanks for posting all those demos) I love the GNR rendition of Heartbreak Hotel (which I remastered and sounds like Civil War in terms of production), acoustic NR which I like better, all those demos from the AFD era were fucking killer, disappointed when some of those weren't on the boxset
  38. 2 points
    I still think it's kinda bullshit that the band decided to do more covers then doing songs from Appetite & Illusions like, You're Crazy, Think About You, replace Wichita Lineman with a actual GNR song like You Ain't the First, Breakdown, Pretty Tied Up, The Garden, and hell Duff could easily do So Fine rather than Attitude. People pay damn good money to see these shows and hear original GNR songs not bullshit covers.
  39. 2 points
  40. 2 points
    Gimme some reggae
  41. 2 points
    Yeah, it is very cool when you are 11 and upsetting your parents by blasting that song at full whack on your shit boombox. Not so much at 39 when it ends up playing on random spotify shuffle at your kid's 5th birthday party....
  42. 2 points
    Why would she want them to succeed after they'd just basically gang raped her? In his book Raz mocks Michelle, calls her crazy and basically says she's lying. Raz is also a huge Trump fan. Duff isn't. Duff has some choice words for Trump, Raz gets upset that his leader was insulted. Raz then backtracks on everything he said about Michelle, does a 180 and now writes this letter that says it's all true while calling out Duff (not Axl, you know, the actual rapist), before ending it by saying how much he loves Trump, which has nothing to do with Michelle's story and undermines the whole letter. Nah, Raz certainly doesn't have an axe to grind. If Michelle's story is true, I'd imagine she'd want Raz to shut the fuck up as his involvement isn't helping her at all. I've read everything she's said in this thread, and I'm still none the wiser. In fact, I'm more confused than before. I don't want to be a dick and say it's not true, but none of the information that we have adds up.
  43. 2 points
    It's not about the money back then, it's about the money NOW. The first subtle instagram posts to tell "the truth" are from 2016, what a coincidence !? i don't know from what time the first FB posts "about it" are, cause i'm not a FB user. and that's all I have to say here, this thread makes angry in so many ways.
  44. 2 points
    Except, according to Michelle, her mother did report the alleged crime to file charges (it is still uncertain if they were actually pressed against Axl or not). If what Michelle says is true, there were copious amounts of witnesses known to Michelle and Axl, including her family members, friends of the band (including one current member - Dizzy), and bystanders in a parking lot. Even if Michelle refused to talk to an officer, there were more than enough leads to investigate Axl and the alleged crime. Indeed, the police would have talked to Michelle's mother, who, in any reasonable circumstance, would have lead them to Dizzy (who informed her) and Vince (who Dizzy also called to collect Michelle after Axl's alleged crime). This, in turn, would have lead the police to other associates and regulars of the Gardner studio. The simple fact that nothing ever resulted in this case indicates that it wasn't worth pursuing then, and certainly not now - if indeed it is true at all.
  45. 2 points
  46. 2 points
    Day 13. 2013. Day14. 1967.
  47. 2 points
    Day 11. 1994. Day 12. 1986.
  48. 2 points
    Day 9. 2004 Day 10. 1976.
  49. 2 points
    Maybe I’m just stupid, but I can’t tell if this is supposed to be a blowjob joke or not.
  50. 2 points
    Its now the "not gonna finish touring in this lifetime".