PatrickS77

5 minutes ago, adamsapple said:

I don't mean this as an insult, but you have no idea how licensing works. By your logic you can go to a show and record a band to put out a bootleg you then make money off (getting paid by YouTube or streaming services, selling physical copies etc.) because with buying a ticket you already paid the band to play the music for you and now you own the music and can do whatever you want with it, right? Wrong! You paid for two hours of their service. If you want to put that service to further commercial use you might have to speak to the band management (no pun intended) and ask for licensing. This is how it works.

 

Yeah. You better not, because you totally misrepresented what I said, so don't assume I know nothing about licensing, because you managed to come up with an idiotic (and false) comparison. Where did I say that? I bought entertainment from them. And that's it. No rights. No nothing. Technically I'm not even allowed to take pictures or videos. But GNR bought Benzova's service to produce photos for them (and of them) and thus should own the work, because they paid for it and they granted Benzova the right to take pictures. If I hire a plumber to deliver and install a toilet, the toilet also is mine and I don't have to pay the plumber whenever I let a guest take a dump and charge them for it.

On 11/14/2023 at 10:27 PM, IzzysMissy said:

The no contracts/freelancer thing is VERY MUCH an American thing to avoid giving get benefits. Spot on comment though… she’d never throw these  accusations out without proof, and lawyers would be hesitant to take this on considering it’s such a huge band. Well, good lawyers at least… as someone said earlier, here we thought it would all be boring post tour.. nope, Fernando had to go ahead and fuck with the legacy.

How do you really prove it though? How do you disprove it happened. Other than the credits thing, it's he said/she said.

On 11/14/2023 at 9:18 PM, Stay.Of.Execution said:

She has worked for ACDC and Aerosmith among others, but sure, she wants fame by suing an unknown manager like Fernando. 

Obviously, she doesn't want fame. She wants money, as her moneytrain has come to a stop. Everything she did and got to do was because of GNR.

1 minute ago, adamsapple said:

When a photographer is hired/contracted, he or she is paid for their services like availability, commitment, taking pictures (usually with their own gear and sometimes even staff), post production of those pictures, providing the contractor with pictures etc.

Copyright itself can not be sold, bought, rented, licensed or whatever - it remains with the photographer forever. The photographer usually licenses their work for a limited amount of time and space/use to the contractor. The contractor then has the legal right to use the work of the photographer according the license that was agreed on.

The copyright claim is not bullshit, it's pretty serious actually. Here's why: If they used her work in commercial context without crediting her or even altered her work for commercial use without her agreement and/or no credit given to the photographer, they basically claimed/implied her work not to be hers and in worst case to be their own work, which is a severe breach of copyright, resulting in significant financial damages for the photographer at the time and later on.

Example: Let's say some merch dude, promoter or a record company wants to license a picture Kat made to put it on a t-shirt, a poster, a CD cover or a magazine. They contact management to get proper licensing for the picture and Fernando then licenses the picture to them, not crediting the photographer despite better knowledge, claiming ownership of the work for himself despite better knowledge, negotiating prices and eventually taking the money fully aware it's not a legal thing to do. This would leave civil law right there as such practices are usually considered a criminal offenses named theft and fraud.

Yeah, and that is total bullshit, giving extra priviledges to photographers. They get paid to do the work and then on top of the work they already got paid for, get to make even more money for the work they've already ben paid for. Total bullshit. If a company pays you to do work, the work should be owned by the company. Period. And it usually is. Unless you're a photographer. And it's extra absurd, considering that the work consists of taking pics of Axl, Slash and Duff performing on stage. The very people who paid her to do so. She wouldn't have anything to photograph, if they weren't on stage performing. And really, I don't care what the law is. It is bullshit.

Just now, Stay.Of.Execution said:

Actually Kat sued first but that didnt go through because of some mistakes made

Ok. So they sued back. If she had a leg to stand on, they probably would have settled.

On 11/14/2023 at 9:09 PM, mister mosh said:

As someone who has been following Guns all my life and been in the know about the behind the scenes stuff since the 2002 tour etc...I gotta say, I'm "innocent until proven guilty" usually....but did this even remotely surprise anyone here?.... Sadly Fernando has messed up time and time again in a number of ways with his unprofessional and entitled behaviour, so when I read it all this morning I kinda figured something like this was probably going on, ....and still the same thing keeps coming to mind, HOW a band the size and stature of Guns N Roses let's Fernando be manager I will never know, the guy seems completely inept at being able to do the job, and I personally wouldnt trust him to run my cake stand, ...could you ever imagine a band the size of Metallica, ACDC, Foos, Green Day etc letting their band be run this way?.... pure insanity!

Either way, I hope this leads to him leaving the position and we can get an actually professional outfit in charge who actually knows what they are doing, now wouldnt that be nice! 

Really? Or is it more like, you don't like him as a manager, find him incompetent and thus you are more easily fooled into believing negative stuff about him. And as usual, if you have a story, that is partly true, it's easily twisted into something negative. I mean, a guy telling someone they love them, can be a nice thing no one needs to think about or it can be twisted into something sinister.

On 11/14/2023 at 7:58 PM, NewGNROldGNR said:

Interesting, the Rolling Stone article says that GN'R sued Kat a few weeks ago.

Really? For what?

1 minute ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

things aren't always as black and white and easy to handle as people outside think it is. 

Yeah. Not always. But sometimes they are. And really, people are not helping themselves to be believed. Especially since supposedly GNR sued her first!

On 11/14/2023 at 4:40 PM, SoulMonster said:

Although I tend to go with the "innocent until proven", in cases like this, with so much detail, I find it hard to believe there isn't a burning fire underneath the pillars of smoke. And regardless, the band can't have these accusations over them even if settled outside of court or dismissed, Fernando needs to go regardless. I am like Cesar on this, "Caesar's wife must be above suspicion". Fernando must go.

And yet she worked with that band until she was let go. If it's all so horrible, why not speak up earlier? Draw consequences earlier. And not once the band cut ties with you.

right. For years they are family and everything is fine, until the moneytrain stops rolling and another guy takes pictures and suddenly they are all around bad people, to the point of sexual harrasment. As for copyright, was she freelancing for them or was she hired to do photos for them? This copyright issue really is bullshit. If I do work for my company, I also don't get copyright for the stuff my company pays me to do.

5 hours ago, UYI4 said:

 Saw row 7 dead center behind pit go from 4-500 per ticket to 168 per ticket about 10 days ago and bought them on the spot.  Pit tickets dropped by 50%.  A close friend of mine is so pissed because he paid a big chunk of money for his pit tickets on pre-sale.  Night train prices were still more expensive than what prices dropped to.

Actually pit tickets went from 450 all in until at least last friday to 250 all in come monday to 150 tuesday, though when I saw them on tuesday, I couldn't put them in the basket, so guess they were already sold by the time I saw it. I'm so pissed as friday was my cut off and deciding day and I couldn't bring myself to pay 450 for a fucking standing ticket to then stand behind the early entry people. Seriously this fucking price gauging is so annoying and really shitting in the face of people who commit when tickets go on sale.

Wow! Last count, Pit tickets went down to 136 $ from 450 $. Fucking greedy assholes.

I fucking hate them so fucking much. Pit tickets went down from 450 to 250. For much of last week I was thinking about going to the show, but just couldn't bring myself to get ripped off for a fucking standing ticket at 450 $, especially since I saw that they charged less at other dates. Now, when there is no way for me to attend, they reduced ticket prices. Across the board. The greedyness of everyone involved and unscrupulous ripping off of fans is so fucking sickening.

20 hours ago, Original said:

They were shit “musicians” just happy to soak off of GnR’s teet.  Literal no one’s before and after (and during) their stint as hired musicians in AxL’s solo band.   Stinson had a little bit of cred.   The rest just shit.   

Yeah. They are professional side men or solo acts with very little niche success.

37 minutes ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

There's still parts of the world where it's like that. I think it's mostly the USA where the crowd is fucking lame.

Also there's a difference between crowds at huge shows like gnr and smaller concerts, where people still go crazy

The scene is weird though and bumble is made look like a school boy here. 

Well. Context. Apparantly they were late and a bit in a hurry to get Axl to wherever he needed to be. It wasn't like they slammed him against the wall, leaving him with a bloody nose. He blocked the door and he was moved away. Not really an issue of toxic environment, just an issue of being in a hurry. I remember that show. I had a flight and a ticket. Then they moved the fucking show and I couldn't go. Went to London instead.

36 minutes ago, Amir said:

Full show is up on YouTube. Thought Catcher sounded OK, was happy when they swapped out SoD for it in 2013, was highlight for me then and in 2014. Slash's solo a bit better than the one he played at Houston 2016 which I watched for comparison, but will always love how Bumblefoot played the solo live 2013-14. I liked Slash's outro guitar playing.

Anyone know what guitar this is? Slash used it for Catcher, has he used it for any other songs live?

Down on the farm. And usually for the Duff sung songs. He used it on I wanna be your dog last year.

4 hours ago, HollyWoodRose84 said:

Because it says A LOT when one player is speaking honestly about another player, especially when they know each other personally. 

What does it say?? It says the one guitarist has a different opinion/preference than then other. That's all it says.

15 minutes ago, HollyWoodRose84 said:

Not necessarily because my “industry friend” is actually a renowned guitar player.  

 

on a side note and completely unrelated, I saw Guns security handing out orange guitar picks to some people and I forgot to inquire as to what that was all about. 

So what. Slash is a renowned guitar player too.

Yeah. Got one of those. What do you mean, what's it about? It's guitar pics with the GNR logo on it.

10 minutes ago, HollyWoodRose84 said:

And regarding Slash, my industry friend made an awesome comment last night. The way Slash has been playing lately is like giving a kid a crayon and a piece of paper and watching him just doodle nonsense. 

 

not here to bash anyone just pointing out certain things that are painfully obvious to anyone who’s watching. 

Just because your "industry friend" says something, doesn't mean it has any merit. I call bullshit and LOL at "painfully obvious". Fans around the world seem to disagree.

33 minutes ago, Coma16 said:

I only know one of these songs. Fuck this band.

Huh? More like fuck you if you don't know the songs.

58 minutes ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

Yea. But ticket sales seemed to be bad for this one and people thought it was gonna be empty (as usual)

Yeah. And doesn't that happen always too??

4 hours ago, Stay.Of.Execution said:

Stadium looked pretty packed on the crew's instagrams

Doesn't it always?

4 hours ago, JAxlMorrison said:

We just park our cars in different garages. I’m all about the lyrics. People confuse me as like a metal head or an 80s metal guy etc cause I like GNR, then I listen to Carole king or 2Pac or David Allen Coe, and they go, wait a minute…

You make it sound like they have bad music.

46 minutes ago, JAxlMorrison said:

I’d find it highly surprising if the majority of the folks here weren’t attracted to Axl and his various incarnations of the band, and the promise of ChiDem, if they WERENT into his lyrics.

Well. Make a poll. For me it never was about lyrics. It always was about the music and performance. And I'd say for that type of music that is the majority. Of course, if you look at an artist like, say, Melissa Etheridge, lyrics are a different thing and much of the connection is lyrical. But that's a different type of genre/thing altogether. I don't think that applies to the average fan of the average rock/hard rock/heavy metal band (or many other genres). And for the record, I personally prefer for lyrics to not be insultingly dumb or simple, but at the end of the day, it's the music for that counts. If the lyrics are great, but the music sucks, that won't make me listen to somthing. But if the lyrics suck, but the music is great, I still will stick around.

Just now, Blackstar said:

I'm not clinging to it. It's just a conclusion I have come to based on what I have read about what was going on at that time.

And that conclusion doesn't make too much sense, if you listen to and look at the actions of the people that matter most. Axl and Slash. And Duff and the others.