Official GNR Social Media Update / Discussion

[Padme]

10 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Why would anyone be interested in what the writer of 'One in a Million' has to say about this subject?

Because he is the writer of OIAM. Sure he can't undo what he did. But 2020 Axl is far from being the 1987 Axl. People change, and in the case of Axl unfortunately many things have changed for the worst( his voice, lack of music, TB,etc) And for other things maybe he changed for the better. If he feels he has to speak up about social issue and politics in general, so be it. We can always disagree with him. But he still will do whatever he wants

[Blackstar]

(It wouldn't belong here normally, but I'm posting it because it's relevant to the discussion - and although Krist Novoselic didn't say anything homophobic, just supported Trump's stance in the current situation)

Edited June 3, 2020 by Blackstar

[action]

15 minutes ago, Lio said:

Oh, did you forget in 1992 there was a little song called Cop Killer, after the riots in LA? Bodycount was asked to support GNR back then. That's 28 years ago. Don't make it as if Axl Rose just got woke and jumped on the bandwagon. We aren't all too young to still remember.

After the promoter in LA asked to replace Bodycount by another act for the LA shows, this is what Axl had to say:

 

it doesn't matter.

police brutality has gone on for way too long, and it has pretty much been able to continue without much in it's way.

The massive outcry that we see today, the combined efforts of artists and musicians is good in and of itself, but the issue is: it's far too late, and far too little. this makes me a bit mad.

Also, don't forget that society "demands" a response by all these artists. I honestly wonder how much of it is genuine, and how much of it is just saving their own ass.

Their tweets of today, only highlight their silence up to this point. Their tweets of today, don't exonerate their silence of yesterday.

There isn't one single honest person between those people.

[SoulMonster]

50 minutes ago, Lio said:

Axl being called racist when Slash was in the band and while he's been living with a Brazilian family for decades. People calling him a racist and a hypocrite have more than probably uttered racist slurs towards Beta and the Lebeis clan. If you really believe Axl was/is racist, don't you think that that would have come out during the bitter years? Ridiculous.

Indeed.

This reminded me of Axl talking about the KKK. Both the KKK and parts of the media in the early 90s thought Axl was a racist/supportive of the Klan. Axl reacted strongly to any such assumptions.

Here is a collection of quotes from my chapter on racism allegations (soon to be included in the history section at A4D):

[PatrickS77]

46 minutes ago, action said:

then, why didn't he speak out about it earlier?

he's a hypocrite Lio. All those celebs crawling out of the woodwork now are. 

 

Well, then the whole IG world who are posting black screens on IG now are hypocrites. They didn't speak out last week. They obviously speak out now, because there is a reason and a cause.

[Towelie]

7 minutes ago, action said:

it doesn't matter.

police brutality has gone on for way too long, and it has pretty much been able to continue without much in it's way.

The massive outcry that we see today, the combined efforts of artists and musicians is good in and of itself, but the issue is: it's far too late, and far too little. this makes me a bit mad.

Also, don't forget that society "demands" a response by all these artists. I honestly wonder how much of it is genuine, and how much of it is just saving their own ass.

Their tweets of today, only highlight their silence up to this point. Their tweets of today, don't exonerate their silence of yesterday.

There isn't one single honest person between those people.

 

I think it's not that all of these artists aren't sincere in their concern or dismay, but there's something very nauseating watching people who have never spoken out suddenly position themselves as allies simply because it is expected of them. 

If you haven't felt the need to take a public stand on these issues in your entire career, it does smack of opportunistic virtue signalling to do so now.

[PatrickS77]

13 minutes ago, action said:

it doesn't matter.

police brutality has gone on for way too long, and it has pretty much been able to continue without much in it's way.

The massive outcry that we see today, the combined efforts of artists and musicians is good in and of itself, but the issue is: it's far too late, and far too little. this makes me a bit mad.

Also, don't forget that society "demands" a response by all these artists. I honestly wonder how much of it is genuine, and how much of it is just saving their own ass.

Their tweets of today, only highlight their silence up to this point. Their tweets of today, don't exonerate their silence of yesterday.

There isn't one single honest person between those people.

I give you that though. You're almost forced to post something. That's why I didn't. But that doesn't mean that they are not genuinely against racism.

[action]

9 minutes ago, PatrickS77 said:

I give you that though. You're almost forced to post something. That's why I didn't. But that doesn't mean that they are not genuinely against racism.

I'm against racism too. I don't feel the need to go posting about it. The twitter generation must think of me like a scumbag then.

There are many horrible things I'm against at. Homophobia, sexism, racism... I'm not "speaking out" against any of that.

It's all fine and well to "speak out" against something. But at the end of the day, it still continues. It is, therefore, absolutely pointless.

"but surely it must have some merit that all these rich people are speaking out against racism". yeah, what merit? Don't you think, racist people laugh with all of that? How about, they refuse to make movies / music anymore? How about, football is cancelled until a massive reorganisation of society happens, so that racism truly is eradicated? You know, something that actually does help. Something that makes people feel, something that's the word in their bakery.

"but surely, it is a start, isn't it?" A start? A start of what? Nothing happens, nothing will happen until a fucking revolution happens. 

the corona virus, now that made a difference. People being forced to wear a fucking mouth mask while doing groceries. That's what makes people feel. That's what makes them realise "hoo boy, now it's come real close to home".

Having outcries on twitter... my god, is this all they can think of. 

Edited June 3, 2020 by action

[Lio]

26 minutes ago, action said:

it doesn't matter.

police brutality has gone on for way too long, and it has pretty much been able to continue without much in it's way.

The massive outcry that we see today, the combined efforts of artists and musicians is good in and of itself, but the issue is: it's far too late, and far too little. this makes me a bit mad.

Also, don't forget that society "demands" a response by all these artists. I honestly wonder how much of it is genuine, and how much of it is just saving their own ass.

Their tweets of today, only highlight their silence up to this point. Their tweets of today, don't exonerate their silence of yesterday.

There isn't one single honest person between those people.

But he's been saying this for 30 years. Why do you keep ignoring that? Can't they speak out anymore, because it's the woke thing to do now?

People's mentality needs to change. And by standing up for what you believe in, you tell all those people what you believe is right. Is it enough to change the world? Of course not. But I can bet you it's better than saying 'the looting starts, the shooting starts' or 'release the hounds'. It's people standing up and trying to unite instead of polarize. If you don't see the merits of that, that's on you. Just sit on your ass and say it will never be enough and it's too little, too late, so best not to do anything at all.

In a world where influencers are getting more and more important, I would say it is very crucial they take a stand and show what they believe in. (Not talking about GNR, because people will be mocking and blabla irrelevant and stuff.)

If Trump can poison minds with his gibberish, then it's other people's duty to say: No, this isn't right, this is not who we are.

[EricA]

26 minutes ago, Towelie said:

I think it's not that all of these artists aren't sincere in their concern or dismay, but there's something very nauseating watching people who have never spoken out suddenly position themselves as allies simply because it is expected of them. 

If you haven't felt the need to take a public stand on these issues in your entire career, it does smack of opportunistic virtue signalling to do so now.

But isn't it not  more nauseating, that there seems to be a sudden need to justify yourself (either celebrity or not), for being against racism, even if it's for the first time in public, or on social media?

Edited June 3, 2020 by EricA

[Towelie]

1 minute ago, EricA said:

But isn't it not even more nauseating, that there seems to be a sudden need to justify yourself (either celebrity or not), for being against racism, even if it's for the first time in public, or on social media?

True.

[action]

2 minutes ago, Lio said:

But he's been saying this for 30 years. Why do you keep ignoring that? Can't they speak out anymore, because it's the woke thing to do now?

People's mentality needs to change. And by standing up for what you believe in, you tell all those people what you believe is right. Is it enough to change the world? Of course not. But I can bet you it's better than saying 'the looting starts, the shooting starts' or 'release the hounds'. It's people standing up and trying to unite instead of polarize. If you don't see the merits of that, that's on you. Just sit on your ass and say it will never be enough and it's too little, too late, so best not to do anything at all.

In a world where influencers are getting more and more important, I would say it is very crucial they take a stand and show what they believe in. (Not talking about GNR, because people will be mocking and blabla irrelevant and stuff.)

If Trump can poison minds with his gibberish, then it's other people's duty to say: No, this isn't right, this is not who we are.

I think you are right.

most people need "influencers" to come to their senses.

I must stop trying to project my own sense of responsability to other people.

[Blackstar]

Slash on Howard Stern in 1992, talking about the L.A. riots (unfortunately the beginning of the conversation is missing):

https://www.a-4-d.com/t4277-1992-04-30-the-howard-stern-show-phone-call-from-slash-incomplete

Slash came off as much more socially aware than Stern on that matter.

[PatrickS77]

22 minutes ago, action said:

I'm against racism too. I don't feel the need to go posting about it. The twitter generation must think of me like a scumbag then.

There are many horrible things I'm against at. Homophobia, sexism, racism... I'm not "speaking out" against any of that.

It's all fine and well to "speak out" against something. But at the end of the day, it still continues. It is, therefore, absolutely pointless.

"but surely it must have some merit that all these rich people are speaking out against racism". yeah, what merit? Don't you think, racist people laugh with all of that? How about, they refuse to make movies / music anymore? How about, football is cancelled until a massive reorganisation of society happens, so that racism truly is eradicated? You know, something that actually does help. Something that makes people feel, something that's the word in their bakery.

"but surely, it is a start, isn't it?" A start? A start of what? Nothing happens, nothing will happen until a fucking revolution happens. 

the corona virus, now that made a difference. People being forced to wear a fucking mouth mask while doing groceries. That's what makes people feel. That's what makes them realise "hoo boy, now it's come real close to home".

Having outcries on twitter... my god, is this all they can think of. 

Yeah. The question is, how we move from here. If it just remains peer pressure on social media or if it spills over into the real world and a change is Happening and people are called out there too. One thing is for sure though, racists aren't suddenly going to stop being racists. They will just hide it more.

10 minutes ago, action said:

most people need "influencers" to come to their senses.

Which is kinda sad and I kinda refuse to believe that people really are like that.

[PatrickS77]

14 minutes ago, EricA said:

But isn't it not  more nauseating, that there seems to be a sudden need to justify yourself (either celebrity or not), for being against racism, even if it's for the first time in public, or on social media?

Both is nauseating. 

[Ratam]

4 hours ago, action said:

I think people are criticising Axl more for being a hypocrite, rather than being a supposed racist.

I don't think Axl is racist (never did), but I do think he's a hypocrite, trying to squeeze money and attention out of a horrible racist assault. I'm surprised so many people fall for it.

Axl should just shut the fuck up

MONEY❓❓❓❓

[Voodoochild]

5 hours ago, Lio said:

Axl being called racist when Slash was in the band and while he's been living with a Brazilian family for decades. People calling him a racist and a hypocrite have more than probably uttered racist slurs towards Beta and the Lebeis clan. If you really believe Axl was/is racist, don't you think that that would have come out during the bitter years? Ridiculous.

This.

I've been saying this for a long time. The incompetence of TB is being used as an excuse to be blatantly racist. Every time I see people mentioning one of them, it's mentioned as "Brazilian leech" or "Brazilian assholes".. Or even comparing Beta with a Mexican housekeeper from the Family Guy (which was also racist to begin of). As if you can't just dislike this family without needing to point out their Latin-American roots. 

There's a very tolerant policy towards this kind of behavior too. Sure, the majority of this fan base is white dudes.

 

4 hours ago, Blackstar said:

(It wouldn't belong here normally, but I'm posting it because it's relevant to the discussion - and although Krist Novoselic didn't say anything homophobic, just supported Trump's stance in the current situation)

Well, to be fair, Kurt was very aware of this kind of thing, I guess. Not sure about Dave, but I guess he's not into the far-right speech either.

[Scream of the Butterfly]

I can't help but roll my eyes whenever I see the argument that Axl is not a racist because he has Slash in the band, or because he had a black bodyguard, or because he has Brazilians working for him, or any other version of the same argument. It's kind of like saying that a man can't possibly be a sexist if he has a wife. In reality, lots of people have black people or women in their lives. Unfortunately that doesn't stop them from being racist, sexist, misogynist. There are even black people who are racist towards other black people. Just as there are women who are misogynists.

[Scream of the Butterfly]

10 hours ago, Free Bird said:

Comparing UTLH and OIAM? Wow... 

Sorry but there isn't an ironic side of OIAM. It was a dead serious song and unfortunately Axl meant what he said. Those sentences he used aren't nothing to joke about like about a killing a woman and still hear her complain. It's all about the context and there is nothing funny about OIAM.

But I do believe that's somthing Axl wouldn't release today just because he matured enough and he probably knows that it's not right to generalize things. 

But it is what it is. A bad ass song with the sadest kind of lyrics. 

Arguably, the topic of killing a woman is nothing to joke about, either, especially if it's a man with an actual history of abusing women.

Unlike OIAM, UTLH has played a role in several real life cases of murder. At least two murderers used the song apperantly to lift up their spirits before committing the deed. I'd render a guess there have been many more abusers who have similarly used the song because the cases we hear about are probably just the tip of the iceberg. That's why I find it rather ridiculous that Axl apparently blames CITR (the book) for Lennon's murder. Yet he continues to sing UTLH without a care in the world.

[Zinia_29]

1 hour ago, Scream of the Butterfly said:

Arguably, the topic of killing a woman is nothing to joke about, either, especially if it's a man with an actual history of abusing women.

Unlike OIAM, UTLH has played a role in several real life cases of murder. At least two murderers used the song apperantly to lift up their spirits before committing the deed. I'd render a guess there have been many more abusers who have similarly used the song because the cases we hear about are probably just the tip of the iceberg. That's why I find it rather ridiculous that Axl apparently blames CITR (the book) for Lennon's murder. Yet he continues to sing UTLH without a care in the world.

Isn't UTLH about Izzy's dog? If Dexter acts as an inspiration, is that the writer's fault?

[Manfisman]

3 hours ago, Voodoochild said:

This.

I've been saying this for a long time. The incompetence of TB is being used as an excuse to be blatantly racist. Every time I see people mentioning one of them, it's mentioned as "Brazilian leech" or "Brazilian assholes".. Or even comparing Beta with a Mexican housekeeper from the Family Guy (which was also racist to begin of). As if you can't just dislike this family without needing to point out their Latin-American roots. 

There's a very tolerant policy towards this kind of behavior too. Sure, the majority of this fan base is white dudes.

 

Well, to be fair, Kurt was very aware of this kind of thing, I guess. Not sure about Dave, but I guess he's not into the far-right speech either.

The "Brazilian [add an insult]" arguments are used a lot. But hey, Axl is a hypocrite for writing OTGM and then complaining about racism and police brutality huh?

Guess that all the rappers using the N-word on their lyrics are racists too.

Edited June 3, 2020 by Manfisman

[Free Bird]

2 hours ago, Scream of the Butterfly said:

Arguably, the topic of killing a woman is nothing to joke about, either, especially if it's a man with an actual history of abusing women.

Unlike OIAM, UTLH has played a role in several real life cases of murder. At least two murderers used the song apperantly to lift up their spirits before committing the deed. I'd render a guess there have been many more abusers who have similarly used the song because the cases we hear about are probably just the tip of the iceberg. That's why I find it rather ridiculous that Axl apparently blames CITR (the book) for Lennon's murder. Yet he continues to sing UTLH without a care in the world.

Like I said. It's the context. OIAM is obviously meant serious while UTLH is nothing but a joke.

There is a morbid sense of humor surrounding the song, it's not possible not to recognize it. 

I'm sorry for the real life murders, but to blame a song for that? These murderers have bigger issues than a GNR song. They're mentally ill. If you're able to kill somebody it can't be a song turning you into a murderer. There must have been a lot more bullshit going on in your life regardless of what reasons you name.

[Ratam]

10 hours ago, Blackstar said:

(It wouldn't belong here normally, but I'm posting it because it's relevant to the discussion - and although Krist Novoselic didn't say anything homophobic, just supported Trump's stance in the current situation)

I read he after deleted his tweet , at least Axl dont't care those ones that criticise he about his point view.

[Draguns]

I wish the estate of Eazy E would release the collaboration between NWA and Guns N' Roses now. The timing may help with easing tensions. 

[Scream of the Butterfly]

5 hours ago, Zinia_29 said:

Isn't UTLH about Izzy's dog? If Dexter acts as an inspiration, is that the writer's fault?

I think Slash said it was about Axl's dog, but I assumed he was joking. If it really was about a dog that makes it worse. Poor dog.

3 hours ago, Free Bird said:

Like I said. It's the context. OIAM is obviously meant serious while UTLH is nothing but a joke.

There is a morbid sense of humor surrounding the song, it's not possible not to recognize it. 

I'm sorry for the real life murders, but to blame a song for that? These murderers have bigger issues than a GNR song. They're mentally ill. If you're able to kill somebody it can't be a song turning you into a murderer. There must have been a lot more bullshit going on in your life regardless of what reasons you name.

If you believe Axl, OIAM was also initially a joke and merely sounds as if he was serious because he has to sing it a certain way because of the music.

As for blaming a song,  I'm not saying a criminal should be excused on the grounds that "the song made me do it". However, I do think it's true to say that just as music can have a positive influence on people it can also have a negative influence on some people. If you put out a feel-good song about killing a woman, it is foreseeable that some potential killer out there might be inspired by your song and that is something you will then have to live with.