Sick leave.

[Patience 4 Axl]

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

That's a major, major pet peeve of mine. I tell my coworkers, if you're sick stay the hell home. Don't come into work infecting everyone else.

I'm one of those people who comes in no matter what is ailing me. I've taken 1 sick day at my current job in the last 5 years.

I have 5 weeks PTO (paid time off) that can be used as personal/sick/vacation days. My mindset is that I'm not using my time off to lay in bed if I can get up and drive myself to work. At my previous job we were given a certain amount of actual sick days that we could carry over every year if unused. I was more apt to call in sick at my prior job because of that, and even then I rarely took the time off. I've gone to work with bronchitis, fevers, nausea, etc. I'm not looking to infect anyone and I'll warn people to stay away.

It's not just all about not wanting to take the days off, it's also about having a strong work ethic. I have a job that needs to get done, and yes, there are people who can cover my desk and assist with a few things while I'm out, but no one does my job the way I do. That's how I feel anyway. I'd rather give it my best 50% on my worst days than not give anything at all if I can help it.

[wasted]

I'm got two sick leave. I've got a parasite. I had an IV drip because I couldn't walk. I was projectile vomiting like champion. The shits too just like a running tape. Fever. Cramps. Headache. But I'm still posting! The committment. You'd have to physically cut off my hands. But yeah I sent out mail explaining I might be out of order for a couple days.

[Dazey]

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

That's a major, major pet peeve of mine. I tell my coworkers, if you're sick stay the hell home. Don't come into work infecting everyone else.

I'm one of those people who comes in no matter what is ailing me. I've taken 1 sick day at my current job in the last 5 years.

I have 5 weeks PTO (paid time off) that can be used as personal/sick/vacation days. My mindset is that I'm not using my time off to lay in bed if I can get up and drive myself to work. At my previous job we were given a certain amount of actual sick days that we could carry over every year if unused. I was more apt to call in sick at my prior job because of that, and even then I rarely took the time off. I've gone to work with bronchitis, fevers, nausea, etc. I'm not looking to infect anyone and I'll warn people to stay away.

It's not just all about not wanting to take the days off, it's also about having a strong work ethic. I have a job that needs to get done, and yes, there are people who can cover my desk and assist with a few things while I'm out, but no one does my job the way I do. That's how I feel anyway. I'd rather give it my best 50% on my worst days than not give anything at all if I can help it.

Is that 5 days off a year? Like including vacation time? That's one thing I'm glad we do different to the US. Here 25 days a year is standard and paid sick leave is unlimited if you're actually ill.

[Lio]

Our system is completely different than most here, by the look of it. Three days a month ? I don't get that at all. We just stay at home when we're sick (except if we're selfemployed or a teacher), we get a note from the doctor, hand it in at work and still get paid. That could be no days or three or five months. Taking a day off is completely different than taking sick leave.

We don't need a note from a doctor either.

It's all about trust and respect.

My boss trusts that I'm staying home for a reason, and that I'm caught up on my work.

I don't think I'd work for a place that didn't have that level of respect between staff.

It's nothing to do with trust and respect. What happens when you are seriously ill and are off for several weeks or months even ? Or are you just talking about taking one day off ?

[Satanisk_Slakt]

I've stayed home now for two days and I'm not sick.

[The Sandman]

I'm ill and in work - hooray!

[Redhead74]

I've just about had a gutfull of people who ring in 'sick' when the day before they were perfectly FINE and the day after they're TOTALLY FUCKING FINE!!!!!

Could have been a migraine, those things can come and go in a matter of hours but you're totally incapacitated while it's happening. Or food poisoning Not saying they all likely have migraines and/or food poisoning, but maybe don't be so quick to judge.

I try and not be off unless I'm really feeling horrible, or have something that's likely to spread to other people. No point coming in mid-flu doped up enough to function, then the whole place ending up getting it.

She rang in and said she "has a headache". How else can the situation be viewed?

The fact is that is a USELESS excuse for not coming to work and leaving a string of fittings that others then have to squeeze into their schedules. We have this thing called paracetamol and aspirin that does an amazing job of clearing up even severe headaches within an hour, usually 30 minutes.

I have no issue with people calling in sick when they are ACTUALLY sick. But I think the definition of what is genuinely sick needs to be re-evaluated. A headache doesn't count. A runny nose doesn't count. And wanting a day off because you couldn't get a day of annual leave is pathetic. Annual leave and sick leave is actually a luxury that shouldn't be abused.

[Redhead74]

The only time I can remember staying home from work during the past two years was five days in 2013 when I had pneumonia . That means I'm a lazy Gen Y kid who's had everything handed to me.

No, not really because pneumonia is a genuine illness where any doctor in his right mind would deem you unfit for work and for good reason.

But it does mean you're not very bright.

[Patience 4 Axl]

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

That's a major, major pet peeve of mine. I tell my coworkers, if you're sick stay the hell home. Don't come into work infecting everyone else.

I'm one of those people who comes in no matter what is ailing me. I've taken 1 sick day at my current job in the last 5 years.

I have 5 weeks PTO (paid time off) that can be used as personal/sick/vacation days. My mindset is that I'm not using my time off to lay in bed if I can get up and drive myself to work. At my previous job we were given a certain amount of actual sick days that we could carry over every year if unused. I was more apt to call in sick at my prior job because of that, and even then I rarely took the time off. I've gone to work with bronchitis, fevers, nausea, etc. I'm not looking to infect anyone and I'll warn people to stay away.

It's not just all about not wanting to take the days off, it's also about having a strong work ethic. I have a job that needs to get done, and yes, there are people who can cover my desk and assist with a few things while I'm out, but no one does my job the way I do. That's how I feel anyway. I'd rather give it my best 50% on my worst days than not give anything at all if I can help it.

Is that 5 days off a year? Like including vacation time? That's one thing I'm glad we do different to the US. Here 25 days a year is standard and paid sick leave is unlimited if you're actually ill.

That's 5 weeks, not 5 days. And I agree, employers here are not very generous with the time off. Many of my friends only get 2 or 3 weeks.

In regards to illness, a coworker was diagnosed with cancer, went for surgery and treatment, and was out for several months. She returned to her same position without repercussion, so I think many employers do have certain policies in effect that protects employees in those instances. An unlimited amount of sick days though sounds dangerous. I imagine some people would take advantage of that.

[Redhead74]

So...Red is pissed because people use sick days that they are entitled to, and when they feel better, they return too promptly?

Be thankful you even get sick days. FMLA law in the US just says they can't fire you for taking time off for medical, but they don't have to pay you. Plenty of jkbs here don't give you paid sick leave or any vacation. I strained my back a month ago or so, it hurt to walk the next day so I called in, the next day it was better so I went back to work. Sometimes people feel like they're about to get sick (usually the most contagious time) and a day in bed drinking fluids and resting cures it.

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

Lol. That would be fine if when they are contagious they actually take the day to stay at HOME in isolation . But the fact is that people who have colds are wandering around public places all the time, so the reality is that most of the colds you pick up are not from your work colleagues but from supermarkets, banks, gas stations, restaurants, cafés, airports, on aeroplanes etc, etc. Pretty much anywhere money is handled, food is eaten and/or air conditioning systems are in place. So the whole "don't come in and infect everyone else" is a pile of shit argument.

And I believe that sick leave and annual leave are a LUXURY. A luxury that unions fought really hard many years ago to establish. By abusing it you jeopardise the system because small business can only sustain so much. No wonder so many businesses now are trying to employ people on a contractual basis or casual basis without the need to pay sick and annual leave......globalisation has started to make it all very expensive. Abuse of the system has a serious knock on affect that most people don't give two fucks about until they're unemployed.

[Lio]

That's 5 weeks, not 5 days. And I agree, employers here are not very generous with the time off. Many of my friends only get 2 or 3 weeks.

In regards to illness, a coworker was diagnosed with cancer, went for surgery and treatment, and was out for several months. She returned to her same position without repercussion, so I think many employers do have certain policies in effect that protects employees in those instances. An unlimited amount of sick days though sounds dangerous. I imagine some people would take advantage of that.

You're right, some people do take advantage. That's unfortunately how it always goes. I'm all for an unlimited amount of sick days, however, because if you're seriously ill, like when you have cancer, your job should be the last thing you worry about. You should be assured the job is still yours when you recover. You're protected by law here when you're on sick leave. And they can't fire you up until a few months (not quite sure how many) after you get back from sick leave.

One question: what happens with people who have a depression or burn-out ? In my last job,of the 20 employees in my department, 7 have been on sick leave for at least one month and usually more because they had depression or burnout. (In a period of not even three years.) And once they'd had one, they would often relapse.

I'm curious to know what would happen in the US, because cancer is of course an undeniable disease, whereas it's harder to 'prove' when you have a depression. (I must admit I clenched my teeth when we got a card from a depressed coworker who was on a vacation in France while we were trying to fill in for him.)

[Redhead74]

I couldn't work for a company that micro-managed my time.

My company respects and treats its workers like adults. As long as you are doing your job at a high standard, who cares if you take an occasional day off? In fact, my company requires us to use a certain amount of leave every year because they don't want us to get burnt out. If you haven't missed a day for six months your boss will come tell you to schedule some time off. All paid, of course.

Yes, but that's what we have ANNUAL leave for (I get that your company uses a different system, but 99% of the worlds businesses still operate with the sick leave/annual leave system). Sick leave is for when you are actually sick. Not "I used up all my entitled annual leave but now I want more". We receive more than enough of both and it should be respected, not abused.

[Redhead74]

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

That's a major, major pet peeve of mine. I tell my coworkers, if you're sick stay the hell home. Don't come into work infecting everyone else.

And it's one of the reasons I don't eat at restaurants very often, too many experiences where servers or kitchen staff are sick as a dog but they report to work because either they don't have paid sick time or they don't have adequate coverage. No thank you, you can serve that plate of viruses to someone else.

Again, that's a flawed mentality because so many people with colds are walking around public spaces infecting those around them. Just go to the supermarket, hop on a bus or a go to a fast food joint and you're likely to come into contact with someone who has a cold. They're too sick to work but not quite sick enough to retract themselves from all public interaction.

That argument just doesn't work because unless all you do is go to work and go straight home day in day out, you're going to come into contact with contagious infections whether you're at work or not.

[Redhead74]

Our system is completely different than most here, by the look of it. Three days a month ? I don't get that at all. We just stay at home when we're sick (except if we're selfemployed or a teacher), we get a note from the doctor, hand it in at work and still get paid. That could be no days or three or five months. Taking a day off is completely different than taking sick leave.

We don't need a note from a doctor either.

It's all about trust and respect.

My boss trusts that I'm staying home for a reason, and that I'm caught up on my work.

I don't think I'd work for a place that didn't have that level of respect between staff.

It's nothing to do with trust and respect. What happens when you are seriously ill and are off for several weeks or months even ? Or are you just talking about taking one day off ?

Exactly. The irony of that is that when someone is seriously ill is when they actually need the peace of mind that they still have an income to pay the bills (that don't go away when you're sick) and also a job to come back to when they have recovered. But weeks or months off is enough to make a small business in a struggling economy come undone. It's a different story in a corporate environment, but work for a small business and it's a different story.

Here in Australia we get 2 weeks of sick leave (for a full time employee) which is carried over from year to year if it is unused. All the more reason to not take days off unless you are actually sick. If you become seriously ill and need the time off then you have it. I'd much prefer to have that peace of mind than use the time doing inconsequential things that I will easily forget after the fact. One of my colleagues is currently battling bowel cancer but since she frequently took days off sick I doubt she has accrued enough to cover her over this period. Perhaps she has always been an unhealthy person, but it really makes you wonder, and is quite an eye opener.

[Lio]

Our system is completely different than most here, by the look of it. Three days a month ? I don't get that at all. We just stay at home when we're sick (except if we're selfemployed or a teacher), we get a note from the doctor, hand it in at work and still get paid. That could be no days or three or five months. Taking a day off is completely different than taking sick leave.

We don't need a note from a doctor either.

It's all about trust and respect.

My boss trusts that I'm staying home for a reason, and that I'm caught up on my work.

I don't think I'd work for a place that didn't have that level of respect between staff.

It's nothing to do with trust and respect. What happens when you are seriously ill and are off for several weeks or months even ? Or are you just talking about taking one day off ?

Exactly. The irony of that is that when someone is seriously ill is when they actually need the peace of mind that they still have an income to pay the bills (that don't go away when you're sick) and also a job to come back to when they have recovered. But weeks or months off is enough to make a small business in a struggling economy come undone. It's a different story in a corporate environment, but work for a small business and it's a different story.

Here in Australia we get 2 weeks of sick leave (for a full time employee) which is carried over from year to year if it is unused. All the more reason to not take days off unless you are actually sick. If you become seriously ill and need the time off then you have it. I'd much prefer to have that peace of mind than use the time doing inconsequential things that I will easily forget after the fact. One of my colleagues is currently battling bowel cancer but since she frequently took days off sick I doubt she has accrued enough to cover her over this period. Perhaps she has always been an unhealthy person, but it really makes you wonder, and is quite an eye opener.

Thank God for our system then. I have friends who had to battle cancer at a very young age, when they were in their 20s. No way could they have accrued enough in that time, having only graduated shortly before. I usually hate having to pay so much taxes when they're so badly used and I hate that some people abuse the system, but I'm quite proud to have such a social security system.

[Redhead74]

If you don't like people using sick days they are entitled to, work in the US somewhere without sick leave, people will show up, sick or not. Enjoy working with them.

That's a major, major pet peeve of mine. I tell my coworkers, if you're sick stay the hell home. Don't come into work infecting everyone else.

I'm one of those people who comes in no matter what is ailing me. I've taken 1 sick day at my current job in the last 5 years.

I have 5 weeks PTO (paid time off) that can be used as personal/sick/vacation days. My mindset is that I'm not using my time off to lay in bed if I can get up and drive myself to work. At my previous job we were given a certain amount of actual sick days that we could carry over every year if unused. I was more apt to call in sick at my prior job because of that, and even then I rarely took the time off. I've gone to work with bronchitis, fevers, nausea, etc. I'm not looking to infect anyone and I'll warn people to stay away.

It's not just all about not wanting to take the days off, it's also about having a strong work ethic. I have a job that needs to get done, and yes, there are people who can cover my desk and assist with a few things while I'm out, but no one does my job the way I do. That's how I feel anyway. I'd rather give it my best 50% on my worst days than not give anything at all if I can help it.

My employer's time off policy is similar, 35 paid days that includes vacation/sick days/mandatory holidays. I completely understand why you'd prefer to use your paid days off for something fun or for an obligation rather than to just lie in bed all day sick, but don't you understand how selfish that is to put coworkers at risk just because you don't want to use up your paid time off days?

Unless you are the only person stationed in your room at work, and nobody has to go in the room you're stationed, and you have a private copier/printer/bathroom, and you don't go in any other room in the building, and you don't touch any door handle that other employees have to touch, and you don't touch any keyboards that anyone else has to touch, you WILL be spreading viruses to coworkers. It is the worst feeling to be forced to work in a room with a sick coworker, trapped in an area where you're forced to breathe air that has been filled with germs from constant sneezing and coughing while being forced to touch things that have been touched by the hands of an ill worker.

And how productive do you think you really are when you're sick? It no doubt takes twice as long to do your work while sick, with a much higher probability of errors. And you do realize that you're not gaining anything by dragging yourself into work, because your illness is likely to last much longer by doing so. If you were to stay home and get the rest, meds and treatment required to get better, you're likely to recover much faster. So what's better: 3-5 consecutive days at 50%, or one day of missed work and then you're back to nearly 100%?

We usually agree on many things, but I can't disagree with you more on this subject.

Do you sterilise all the money you handle? Do you wash your hands immediately after touching ANYTHING in a public place? Do you hold your breath or not inhale when you are on public transport, or waiting in a queue at a shop/bank.......because in all seriousness that is what you would have to do to properly avoid contracting a cold infection. Your work colleagues comprise only a relatively small number of people that you come into contact with on a daily basis. And really, it's a cold, not mad cow disease or SARS.

I lived in Singapore during the outbreak of SARS and I didn't change one thing I did. Despite the hysteria that was breaking out around the world there was really very little to be alarmed about. I flew on aeroplanes frequently at the time and the airport had installed some heavy duty temperature sensors that every passenger had to pass through. If a passenger registered a temperature they were monitored for cause of that temperature before being allowed into the general community. Basically, there was no drama, no mass death toll. No one was hibernating at home. They just went about their business and heeded good hygiene which is common sense.

[Redhead74]

Our system is completely different than most here, by the look of it. Three days a month ? I don't get that at all. We just stay at home when we're sick (except if we're selfemployed or a teacher), we get a note from the doctor, hand it in at work and still get paid. That could be no days or three or five months. Taking a day off is completely different than taking sick leave.

We don't need a note from a doctor either.

It's all about trust and respect.

My boss trusts that I'm staying home for a reason, and that I'm caught up on my work.

I don't think I'd work for a place that didn't have that level of respect between staff.

It's nothing to do with trust and respect. What happens when you are seriously ill and are off for several weeks or months even ? Or are you just talking about taking one day off ?

Exactly. The irony of that is that when someone is seriously ill is when they actually need the peace of mind that they still have an income to pay the bills (that don't go away when you're sick) and also a job to come back to when they have recovered. But weeks or months off is enough to make a small business in a struggling economy come undone. It's a different story in a corporate environment, but work for a small business and it's a different story.

Here in Australia we get 2 weeks of sick leave (for a full time employee) which is carried over from year to year if it is unused. All the more reason to not take days off unless you are actually sick. If you become seriously ill and need the time off then you have it. I'd much prefer to have that peace of mind than use the time doing inconsequential things that I will easily forget after the fact. One of my colleagues is currently battling bowel cancer but since she frequently took days off sick I doubt she has accrued enough to cover her over this period. Perhaps she has always been an unhealthy person, but it really makes you wonder, and is quite an eye opener.

Thank God for our system then. I have friends who had to battle cancer at a very young age, when they were in their 20s. No way could they have accrued enough in that time, having only graduated shortly before. I usually hate having to pay so much taxes when they're so badly used and I hate that some people abuse the system, but I'm quite proud to have such a social security system.

Social security systems are tricky though and geography is a major factor in why they vary a lot. When I lived in Singapore I paid 10% tax and it was a country with extremely high social provision. For instance, 90% of the population live in subsidised housing. That is extraordinary considering the amount of taxation they have. But it all comes down to geography, it is such a small country that they have very little expenditure on roads and infrastructure. By the same token, they also have little in terms of unemployment benefits and state provided higher education, because they believe that the family structure will provide those things. Anyway, look at Australia and as we are geographically so large and spread out we end up paying an exorbitant amount of our tax towards infrastructure (not to mention unemployment and education). I think the systems that have been in place in Europe in the post war era have been incredibly impressive, but unfortunately in the long term are not sustainable. I remember major protests in France after attempted changes to the standard working week. Globalisation is changing the face of everything, whether we like it or not.

[WFA]

[Use Your Delusion 1]

Richard Branson says hi

[Lithium]

The only time I can remember staying home from work during the past two years was five days in 2013 when I had pneumonia . That means I'm a lazy Gen Y kid who's had everything handed to me.

No, not really because pneumonia is a genuine illness where any doctor in his right mind would deem you unfit for work and for good reason.

But it does mean you're not very bright.

:lol: :lol:

[The Sandman]

I have no issue with people calling in sick when they are ACTUALLY sick. But I think the definition of what is genuinely sick needs to be re-evaluated. A headache doesn't count. A runny nose doesn't count. And wanting a day off because you couldn't get a day of annual leave is pathetic. Annual leave and sick leave is actually a luxury that shouldn't be abused.

That said though, we have different pain tolerances and experience things in different ways. I can soldier on with a headache, but if it's near a migraine it's crippling. Depends on how she's defining it - and if it's abusing it, or she actually has this and physically isn't well enough.

It's hard to have a one-size-fits-all approach to something that's so incredibly subject and personal - and here I am with my headache, sore chest and runny nose!

My job-share partner was off yesterday through sickness too - so I've got to pick up that slack, but it happens - I'd rather be here and trying - as you say.

[Johnny Drama]

I'd dare say that chucking a sickie is essentially an entitlement when people are salaried yet have to work a shitload of overtime.

[Len Cnut]

I'd dare say that chucking a sickie is essentially an entitlement when people are salaried yet have to work a shitload of overtime.

It's either that or scurrying along a toxic Ceylonian coastal town, offering sexual favours to the foreman to get first in line for the factory that sews David Beckham footballs for 5p an hour

[streak]

I've just about had a gutfull of people who ring in 'sick' when the day before they were perfectly FINE and the day after they're TOTALLY FUCKING FINE!!!!!

Unless you had a 24 hour virus that struck at 7pm and rendered you a vomiting mess also with diarrhoea and ended at 7pm (or so) the next day, I don't think you were really sick. Just sayin'

The reason I have a problem with this is because I work in a company that has only a limited number of skilled people and when one person unreasonably calls in sick then the rest of us have to pick up their slack. I know the people in my company who do it and I have ZERO respect for them. Actually, I think they're fucking losers.

Basically, I think the country I live in needs an overhaul as to what the definition of 'sick' is. A headache doesn't count. Hayfever doesn't count. Just feeling a bit tired and 'off' doesn't count. There are medications you can take for those things that medical professionals spent years developing. Yes, YEARS! Or just a good nights sleep, and that is not the responsibility of your fellow employees. A full time employee here gets 8 days a year to be 'sick'. That is a fucking lot of days every 12 months of either having the FLU (not a cold), throwing your guts up or perhaps in the worst extreme, being in hospital for some good reason. It's doesn't count as annual leave!

I think in particular Gen Y are very lame when it comes to their definition of 'sick'. When it doesn't affect me I just at their level or lameness. They think it is an entitlement, but ultimately the degree of poverty they are living in will define their definition of 'sick'.

What is your view on being 'sick' on a work day? Do you pull fake sickies? And does it affect you when others call in sick?

I don't pull fake sickies. But then I am self employed of sorts.

People do take the piss though, but its natural.

[Len Cnut]

I've just about had a gutfull of people who ring in 'sick' when the day before they were perfectly FINE and the day after they're TOTALLY FUCKING FINE!!!!!

Unless you had a 24 hour virus that struck at 7pm and rendered you a vomiting mess also with diarrhoea and ended at 7pm (or so) the next day, I don't think you were really sick. Just sayin'

The reason I have a problem with this is because I work in a company that has only a limited number of skilled people and when one person unreasonably calls in sick then the rest of us have to pick up their slack. I know the people in my company who do it and I have ZERO respect for them. Actually, I think they're fucking losers.

Basically, I think the country I live in needs an overhaul as to what the definition of 'sick' is. A headache doesn't count. Hayfever doesn't count. Just feeling a bit tired and 'off' doesn't count. There are medications you can take for those things that medical professionals spent years developing. Yes, YEARS! Or just a good nights sleep, and that is not the responsibility of your fellow employees. A full time employee here gets 8 days a year to be 'sick'. That is a fucking lot of days every 12 months of either having the FLU (not a cold), throwing your guts up or perhaps in the worst extreme, being in hospital for some good reason. It's doesn't count as annual leave!

I think in particular Gen Y are very lame when it comes to their definition of 'sick'. When it doesn't affect me I just at their level or lameness. They think it is an entitlement, but ultimately the degree of poverty they are living in will define their definition of 'sick'.

What is your view on being 'sick' on a work day? Do you pull fake sickies? And does it affect you when others call in sick?

I don't pull fake sickies. But then I am self employed of sorts.

People do take the piss though, but its natural.

Nah, you just go on an appointment and then don't come back for three hours when it's down the fuckin' road like a fat skiving cunt