Why was Izzy's amp unplugged during the '91 UYI tour?

[Dr. Who]

In the year or so before Izzy quit the band, if you look at any one show from the 1991 UYI summer tour before his resignation, if you listen, only Slash is audible. Even on songs where on the UYI songs you can hear Izzy (like YCBM), live, you hear nothing but Slash. Check out the infamous St. Louis show for example--Izzy's on stage, but his guitar playing can't be heard. At this point in time, 1991, Izzy was clean and sober for about a year at that point, so why do you guys think someone--Axl, Slash? unplugged his amp or muted it during the shows?

[bacardimayne]

Emulating the UYI albums.

Serious answer - probably because he was sloppy as hell at the time?

[BreakDown2014]

I remember Axl talking about his comeback on 93 for the show in Israel (I think) and he said that when Izzy wasn't watching they would go and turn off his amp (or turn down his volume) because he would just be playing a completely different song in a completely different key . I guess it was probably the same for 1991 (and for the album)

Edit: found it

Edited December 9, 2014 by BreakDown2014

[maynard]

When he played with Axl again in recent years I honestly can't listen to a single note he played either. I guess he's just very sloppy live.

Edited December 9, 2014 by maynard

[DieselDaisy]

Because Axl and Slash were being cunts.

[Mendez]

Shitty sound engineers that like to only boost the lead guitarist?

[Strange Broue]

When he played with Axl again in recent years I honestly can't listen to a single note he played either. I guess he's just very sloppy live.

agreed

Funny thing is Slash was fucked up all the time and being able to play

Izzy was sober and became sloppy?

dafuq....

We will never know because they turned off his amp....

[Nosaj Thing]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

[Estranged Coma]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

Lol I also noticed the out of breathness

[DieselDaisy]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

Axl is an even bigger liar than you thought. Izzy has been sober since December 15th 1989!

Edited December 9, 2014 by DieselDaisy

[ludurigan]

If you put A + B + C together you will realise that Axl & Slash pretty much hijacked Guns n' Roses on the Illusion era.

This thing -- turning down Izzy amps -- is the most pathetic thing that they could have done;

And to say that Izzy playing was bad?

This is even worse. It's pure bullshit.

I have dozens of bootlegs where I can hear Izzy and his playing is always amazing.

Also, 90% of the GNR songs are not difficult to play live;

[Blacula]

Izzy said in his interview in the beginning of UYI tour that they have so many new songs he can't even remember all of them. And he sounded like he doesn't give a shit about it. Maybe there is a reason.

Edited December 9, 2014 by Blacula

[SoulMonster]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

Except that Axl didn't say the reason why they turned Izzy down in Tel Aviv was because he was whacked out on drugs. He only said the method worked.

[DieselDaisy]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

Except that Axl didn't say the reason why they turned Izzy down in Tel Aviv was because he was whacked out on drugs. He only said the method worked.

Ehh, yes he did. Go back and listen to the thing.

[SoulMonster]

If you put A + B + C together you will realise that Axl & Slash pretty much hijacked Guns n' Roses on the Illusion era.

This thing -- turning down Izzy amps -- is the most pathetic thing that they could have done;

And to say that Izzy playing was bad?

This is even worse. It's pure bullshit.

I have dozens of bootlegs where I can hear Izzy and his playing is always amazing.

Also, 90% of the GNR songs are not difficult to play live;

I agree, it was not nice, but I am doubtful about how ofte it actually happened.

Some more quotes on this and in particular why his amp was turned down in Tel Aviv:

Slash: I really looked forward to playing with him again and really hoped that he had changed. I booked a place before the first gigs in Tel Aviv to rehearse. But Izzy thought it was unnecessary, that it was just wasted time. He hadn't changed one bit and therefore the gigs turned out the way they did [Metal Zone, December 1993]

Slash: It was my idea to call Izzy; I thought it would be interesting. I didn't know he hadn't picked up his guitar in the last fucking year!

Slash talking about Izzy replacing Gilby: "Fuck it," Axl said. "Let's call Izzy." I was surprised and happy to hear that Izzy went for it (...). Izzy showed up...with dreadlocks...and hadn't practised one song. So we did what we could [bozza, Anthony, & Slash (2007). Slash. Harper Entertainment: New York, p.369-370]

And general comments about his playing style and contributions:

Gilby: [...] Nobody really seemed to know what Izzy played. I would perform something, and Slash would say, "I thought you knew this tune," and I'd argue that I did. And then he'd say "No, you don't You are playing my part!" And then we'd realize that you couldn't really hear Izzy's part on some of the songs. So the we had to try to reconstruct his parts the best we could [Guitar World, November 1992]

Slash talking about The Spaghetti Incident?: I love recording like this. During Appetite..., Lies and Use Your... I had to put up with Izzy the whole time. I never liked playing with him. It was wonderful to escape him on this record. It sounds tighter and so much cooler than anything we've done before. I always got irritated over Izzy's way of playing. It didn't sound right. Before "Spaghetti", we erased his guitar and Gilby put on a new one. It sounded perfect! [Okej, November? 1993]

Slash: Izzy basically left while we were recording the "...Illusion" records. He's not on half of those records. He hardly even played on his own songs! [Kerrang! January 1994]

Slash: I had to double guitars up for him on most of [illusions]. He didn't play very much [Guns N' Roses: Is It All Over? Does Anyone Care? Metal Hammer November 1995]

[Intercourse]

Apparently Izzy was so disconnected with the UYIs and that they came out a full year after he'd recorded his parts that he couldn't remember the tunes.

They turned him down because of this.

I've looked for the article where Izzy admitted this but I can't find it.

They were also treating him a bit shitty too.

[DR DOOM]

This isn't being mean, this is...somebody needs to turn Ashba's amp down ( or off ) cause that guy's always playing "basically playing a different song in a different key"

[SoulMonster]

Daisy:

Again, no. he isn't. He starts by saying how they had to turn his amsp doen in the old days because of his drug habits, he then goes on to tell that the method of turning them down worked especially well in Tel Aviv, but does not tell why they did it i Tel Aviv and let's that question hang:

Axl: You know, I read something somewhere. Someone was writing an article about my other friends. And they wrote this thing about how 'in the old days, you know, there were lots of problems and technical errors of the band and Izzy couldn't hear himself' [laughing] The reason that Izzy couldn't hear himself - this isn't being mean - is our roadies would stand behind Izzy's amp, 'cause Izzy would be so whacked out of his mind that he would basically be playing a different song in the wrong key, and the only way we could do the songs was that every time he would go to him amps, he would turn his amps up and turn around to the crowd. When he would turn around to the crowd the roadie would reach around and turn his amps back down so that we could play the song. That worked especially well in Tel Aviv [laughter] Just a full tippit there for your Trivia Pursuit [Onstage Boston, December 2002]

From my other quotes it should be really obvious they had to tun him down because he didn't knew how to play the songs anymore after not having either rehearsed or touched a guitar in a year (if we are to trust Slash).

Apparently Izzy was so disconnected with the UYIs and that they came out a full year after he'd recorded his parts that he couldn't remember the tunes.

They turned him down because of this.

I've looked for the article where Izzy admitted this but I can't find it.

I would be very grateful if you could find that article. Thanks!

This is the only quote I have form Izzy regarding Tel Aviv and the other 4 dates in 1993:

Izzy: Part of the reason [for doing these five shows] was that I had time off in Indiana, I wasn't really doing anything important, just working on bikes, motorcycles, and, yeah, "maybe it's fun". They played Turkey, they played Greece, they played Israel, so maybe it's cool to go see those places since I've never been there. And I knew all the music so it wasn't like I had to study or practise much, just take a guitar and go over. But the main reason was that for a year and a half since I left them they had never paid me all the money that I was owed, because there was a dispute about what was. So I told them, "look, tell your people to call my people and write up some paperwork and pay me my fucking money" [interview with Izzy in Japan, September 22, 1993]

Funny how he claims he knew the songs well

Edited December 9, 2014 by SoulMonster

[DieselDaisy]

Slash: It was my idea to call Izzy; I thought it would be interesting. I didn't know he hadn't picked up his guitar in the last fucking year!

More proof that Slash lies. Izzy's return to Guns N' Roses was, 22-30 May 1993. Between September 1992 - March (16th) 1993, Izzy Stradlin had been playing (guitar) with the Ju Ju Hounds in North America, Europe and Asia - and that is not even mentioning the recording sessions for Izzy Stradlin and the Ju Ju Hounds, before that tour!

Axl and Slash are both full of shit.

Daisy:

Again, no. he isn't. He starts by saying how they had to turn his amsp doen in the old days because of his drug habits, he then goes on to tell that the method of turning them down worked especially well in Tel Aviv, but does not tell why they did it i Tel Aviv and let's that question hang:

Axl: You know, I read something somewhere. Someone was writing an article about my other friends. And they wrote this thing about how 'in the old days, you know, there were lots of problems and technical errors of the band and Izzy couldn't hear himself' [laughing] The reason that Izzy couldn't hear himself - this isn't being mean - is our roadies would stand behind Izzy's amp, 'cause Izzy would be so whacked out of his mind that he would basically be playing a different song in the wrong key, and the only way we could do the songs was that every time he would go to him amps, he would turn his amps up and turn around to the crowd. When he would turn around to the crowd the roadie would reach around and turn his amps back down so that we could play the song. That worked especially well in Tel Aviv [laughter] Just a full tippit there for your Trivia Pursuit [Onstage Boston, December 2002]

From my other quotes it should be really obvious they had to tun him down because he didn't knew how to play the songs anymore after not having either rehearsed or touched a guitar in a year (if we are to trust Slash).

Apparently Izzy was so disconnected with the UYIs and that they came out a full year after he'd recorded his parts that he couldn't remember the tunes.

They turned him down because of this.

I've looked for the article where Izzy admitted this but I can't find it.

I would be very grateful if you could find that article. Thanks!

This is the only quote I have form Izzy regarding Tel Aviv and the other 4 dates in 1993:

Izzy: Part of the reason [for doing these five shows] was that I had time off in Indiana, I wasn't really doing anything important, just working on bikes, motorcycles, and, yeah, "maybe it's fun". They played Turkey, they played Greece, they played Israel, so maybe it's cool to go see those places since I've never been there. And I knew all the music so it wasn't like I had to study or practise much, just take a guitar and go over. But the main reason was that for a year and a half since I left them they had never paid me all the money that I was owed, because there was a dispute about what was. So I told them, "look, tell your people to call my people and write up some paperwork and pay me my fucking money" [interview with Izzy in Japan, September 22, 1993]

Funny how he claims he knew the songs well

Christ, you are being very pedantic there. In my opinion, Axl leaves no doubt that he is alleging that the amp was turned down in Tel Aviv because of drug abuse.

Edited December 9, 2014 by DieselDaisy

[SoulMonster]

Christ, you are being very pedantic there. In my opinion, Axl leaves no doubt that he is alleging that the amp was turned down in Tel Aviv because of drug abuse.

It's not a clear cut case, but I believe a more conservative interpretation of the quote, especially when heard where the pause before the Tel Aviv sentence is said, is that Axl is referring to the method of turning the amp down, not why it was done in Tel Aviv. This ties nicely in with Slash's comments on how poor Izzy performed during those gigs and Izzy's own admission that he didn't really practise much. Lastly, your interpretation lies on Axl willingly and maliciously lying to the audience about Izzy being on drugs again, a lie that could easily have been refuted by everyone else involved, rather than just be honest about saying Izzy performed poorly. So no, I think you are either botching your interpretation of the quote in consideration of context, or are just to stubborn to accept you could be wrong .

[DieselDaisy]

Christ, you are being very pedantic there. In my opinion, Axl leaves no doubt that he is alleging that the amp was turned down in Tel Aviv because of drug abuse.

It's not a clear cut case, but I believe a more conservative interpretation of the quote, especially when heard where the pause before the Tel Aviv sentence is said, is that Axl is referring to the method of turning the amp down, not why it was done in Tel Aviv. This ties nicely in with Slash's comments on how poor Izzy performed during those gigs and Izzy's own admission that he didn't really practise much. Lastly, your interpretation lies on Axl willingly and maliciously lying to the audience about Izzy being on drugs again, a lie that could easily have been refuted by everyone else involved, rather than just be honest about saying Izzy performed poorly. So no, I think you are either botching your interpretation of the quote in consideration of context, or are just to stubborn to accept you could be wrong .

The open endness of it, the lack of clarity, means, he is letting the allegation hang - mid air. That is how I interpreted it. It is the only possible way a 'casual' (a majority of the crowd) could interpret it, that section of the crowd not well versed in the intricacies of Stradlin's sobriety. Axl knows this and therefore, it is actually rather malicious.

About refuting it, one thing about Axl and Slash is they are not only liars but they are also quite useless at the art of lying.

[Blacula]

And general comments about his playing style and contributions:

Gilby: [...] Nobody really seemed to know what Izzy played. I would perform something, and Slash would say, "I thought you knew this tune," and I'd argue that I did. And then he'd say "No, you don't You are playing my part!" And then we'd realize that you couldn't really hear Izzy's part on some of the songs. So the we had to try to reconstruct his parts the best we could [Guitar World, November 1992]

Slash talking about The Spaghetti Incident?: I love recording like this. During Appetite..., Lies and Use Your... I had to put up with Izzy the whole time. I never liked playing with him. It was wonderful to escape him on this record. It sounds tighter and so much cooler than anything we've done before. I always got irritated over Izzy's way of playing. It didn't sound right. Before "Spaghetti", we erased his guitar and Gilby put on a new one. It sounded perfect! [Okej, November? 1993]

Slash: Izzy basically left while we were recording the "...Illusion" records. He's not on half of those records. He hardly even played on his own songs! [Kerrang! January 1994]

Slash: I had to double guitars up for him on most of [illusions]. He didn't play very much [Guns N' Roses: Is It All Over? Does Anyone Care? Metal Hammer November 1995]

They love each other

Izzy: Well, I tell you what, there's nothing more annoying than a guitarist just noodling. Shredding, it's

horrid. It's the same thing when you try to get a band together, you always end up with these

noodlers, y'know...

- So was Slash a noodler?

- Yeah, when I first met him, yeah. Slash was a noodler, man. I think he still is. Like in Guns N'

Roses he would noodle but then the vocals would come back in and that would shut him up!

[Nosaj Thing]

Here we can hear Axl completely out of breath trying to rant like in the old days. Embarrassing. Plus, Izzy was clean in 1993, so here we have Axl lying once again about his former bandmates.

Axl is an even bigger liar than you thought. Izzy has been sober since December 15th 1989!

Yes, he's been always full of shit. I'm glad there's a SBD recording of that show, so we have proof of his lies and bullshit.

[Amir]

Still a problem for him on recent tours:

How did it feel to play four or five GN’R songs every night? Did you have to learn some of them again?

Izzy: “Yes I had forgotten them almost completely. I had to learn to play them again.”

Which song was the hardest?

Izzy: "Nightrain.” I kept forgetting the part in the middle, I don’t know why, after all I wrote it!"

http://chinese-democracy.blogspot.co.uk/2008/11/exclusive-interview-with-izzy-stradlin.html

I did once ask if he was unplugged at 2012 shows, but then someone replied with a vid of 14 Years where you can see that he misses the first note and it isn't heard, I can't find it right now.

Hopefully they bring back Dust N' Bones for his next guest appearances.

[Dr. Who]

I'm not talking about Televiv 1993.

I'm talkin about the '91 tour nefore he quit. He was unplugged then too.