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47 minutes ago, -W.A.R- said:

Oh yeah i forgot about Beto. He lost but it was close.

Maybe the most conservative Democrat i can see getting the nomination.

I don't think he was conservative. His problem was Texas Democrats. They were caught off guard. They didn't have any hope. So they didn't bother to nominate other Beto like candidates. So Beto always or most of the time campaigned all by himself. And he was the only one getting money. Besides being the only one getting all the attention. It was very difficult for traditional and likely voters to vote everything Republican except Beto. It was too much of a one man crusade. 

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11 minutes ago, Padme said:

I don't think he was conservative. His problem was Texas Democrats. They were caught off guard. They didn't have any hope. So they didn't bother to nominate other Beto like candidates. So Beto always or most of the time campaigned all by himself. And he was the only one getting money. Besides being the only one getting all the attention. It was very difficult for traditional and likely voters to vote everything Republican except Beto. It was too much of a one man crusade. 

I meant in a ideological sense :lol: 

Beto O’Rourke’s voting record is more conservative than the average Democrat’s

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On 2019-01-10 at 5:08 AM, -W.A.R- said:

Honestly I don't know much about anyone outside of the mainstream candidates such as Biden, Sanders, and Kamala Harris - I think they could beat him though.

If you're a halfway reasonable Trump voter (those exist? :blink:) you have to be embarrassed and ashamed of yourself by this point. If he hasn't screwed you over, he surely hasn't helped you all that much. The current shutdown is doing him no favors either. IDC if you are a hardcore Trump supporter that wears obnoxious “Build That Wall” shirts - if you aren't getting payed right now you're PISSED. Trump is out his mind thinking people are fine going without pay. It will only get worse when this comes to its obvious conclusion.

Maybe i'm doing the same thing the media did in 2016 and underestimating him - but i think 2020 will be different. There will be an urgency to get Trump out and not enough people that feel done right by him to vote for him.

Well said.

It's tough to predict with the country so polarized.

With that said, a lot of people misunderstand how elections turn out the way they do.  Many assume a lot of voters were undecided before hearing each candidate.  Those voters do exist, but they are a small minority.  

Elections are often determined by voter enthusiasm, something polls have a very difficult time documenting.  Trump was able to energize his voters and base in a way that Clinton was not.  Trump did not win the election because he converted a lot of people who voted Democrat in the last two elections.  The truth is that many people who would have voted Democrat stayed home.  Wade county in Michigan saw a reduction of 100k voters in 2106 from 2012.  Wade county (Detroit) is a heavy Democratic district and would have likely won Clinton Michigan had a quarter of those people bothered to vote.  The same dynamics can be found in Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. 

The mistake that myself and a lot of people made was assuming that Democrats and democratic-leaning independents would return to the fold.  They didn't.  Many likely assumed, like everyone else did, that Clinton was going to win and why bother spending 1-4 hours in a  line for a candidate they didn't care for all that much but seemed a lock to win?  

Those dynamics are not going to be repeated in 2020.  Trump will have an actual record to defend and run on.  He will have to defend many of the terrible choices he made with respect to trade wars, separating children from their parents at the border, the comments after Charlottesville, those he brought into his cabinet, accusations made by his former lawyer and confident Michael Cohen, his repeated unwillingness to release his tax returns, the fact that jobs didn't come back from Mexico and China, the souring of relations between the US and almost every other country save for Israel, the run up of deficits and debt (despite claims to get rid of the debt), the lack of vision and execution on healthcare, etc.  He wasn't a politician when he ran so there was nothing really to defend.  Now there is and it doesn't look good.  

We're still less than two years out so it's impossible to predict anything at this point.  But those who look to 2016 as proof that Trump can do it again in 2020 do so at their own peril.  Democrats won't be taking anything for granted next time.  People who sat at home in 2016 assuming Clinton was going to win won't make that same mistake.  And this is to say nothing about an economy that is predicted to go south in the next year or two and whatever fallout from the Mueller report (though, if it misses Trump, it could actually help him).  

 

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16 hours ago, -W.A.R- said:

If he hadn't lost the Texas senate race I would say he is the kind of candidate Democrats should run in 2020.  But having the stink of a loss so recent won't help.

I still think the Democrats best option is someone like Rep. Seth Moulton.  A centrist, no-nonsense former Marine Corp soldier with a Harvard education.  This doesn't sound right, but the fact that he's a white guy likely helps avoid the discussion of identity politics.  It's a shame that it matters, but who's kidding who, it does.  I think Democrats need to decide what matters more to them in 2020: running someone who gives them the best odds of winning (and getting Trump out of the White House), or staying true to their new principles and run someone like Kamala Harris.  She'd make a fine President, but her chances of winning are likely not as great as someone like Moulton or O'Rourke.  

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5 hours ago, downzy said:

the souring of relations between the US and almost every other country save for Israel,

If Israel had a liberal government, I don't think the relationship wouldn't be so warm. But after years of Obama, Netanyahu knows he can do whatever he wants since AIPAC and the small, but powerful conservative Israel lobby are behind Trump.

5 hours ago, downzy said:

If he hadn't lost the Texas senate race I would say he is the kind of candidate Democrats should run in 2020.  But having the stink of a loss so recent won't help.

I still think the Democrats best option is someone like Rep. Seth Moulton.  A centrist, no-nonsense former Marine Corp soldier with a Harvard education.  This doesn't sound right, but the fact that he's a white guy likely helps avoid the discussion of identity politics.  It's a shame that it matters, but who's kidding who, it does.  I think Democrats need to decide what matters more to them in 2020: running someone who gives them the best odds of winning (and getting Trump out of the White House), or staying true to their new principles and run someone like Kamala Harris.  She'd make a fine President, but her chances of winning are likely not as great as someone like Moulton or O'Rourke.  

Great mention. He's managed to avoid being labeled a radical progressive and stays out of the spotlight on a lot of issues (in a good way, politics sometimes amounts to theatre). He's liberal enough for Democrats, but has qualities that should appeal to moderates and frustrated conservatives.

I love veteran Democrats because there's nothing the Republican voter values more than "the troops," they must really struggle mentally when reading about people like Seth Moulton, Nate Fick, Daniel Elsberg, Max Rose, etc.. Republican's can't use a lot of their standard rhetoric with these politicians due to their service.

Seth is also a fan of rock/metal! Probably even GNR. :headbang: When I used to work in DC my coworkers joked Seth and I should start the "Rock N' Roll Caucus." 

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I saw a quick ad for the news, but missed the show.

It said Texas was paying for the border wall. Oh shit! There go my taxes again!

WTF?

5 hours ago, Padme said:

 Video The Border According To Beto

 

 

Willie Nelson endorses Beto and I love Willie. Maybe he would make a good President. He did  lost to Cruz, but he's young enough to keep trying.

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22 hours ago, Padme said:

I don't think he was conservative. His problem was Texas Democrats. They were caught off guard. They didn't have any hope. So they didn't bother to nominate other Beto like candidates. So Beto always or most of the time campaigned all by himself. And he was the only one getting money. Besides being the only one getting all the attention. It was very difficult for traditional and likely voters to vote everything Republican except Beto. It was too much of a one man crusade. 

I think Beto has bigger things in his future. He's young enough and maybe he can change this country for the better.

Many Texans like to stay as is and honestly, living here for over 25 years, Texas needs to change their views on a lot of things.

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On 9/1/2019 at 12:34 PM, dontdamnmeuyi2015 said:

I honestly think we should build a wall between Canada and the US. There are so many places in Canada that anyone can easily cross without any problems.

Why would we want to illegally cross into a shit-hole country? :lol:

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Beto doesn't seem to show many signs he is running. I think he would be fine being on the VP side of the ticket. 

 

Trump is now saying he didn't say Mexico should pay for the wall. Have the Trump supporters realize they've been conned? 

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2 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

Beto doesn't seem to show many signs he is running. I think he would be fine being on the VP side of the ticket. 

 

Trump is now saying he didn't say Mexico should pay for the wall. Have the Trump supporters realize they've been conned? 

Trump supporters can't even spell "conned".

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2 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

Beto doesn't seem to show many signs he is running. I think he would be fine being on the VP side of the ticket. 

 

Trump is now saying he didn't say Mexico should pay for the wall. Have the Trump supporters realize they've been conned? 

If he’s going to lie about saying Mexico would not pay for the wall, he should just expand the lie and say he never wanted the wall. 

Problem solved. 

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Bernie Sanders would have won the election in 2016, now he's too old and the democrats seem more divided. They have to bring together the Sanders wing and the Clinton wing. 

People are talking about Michelle Obama which is funny. I think there is no viable opponent other than Harris, but she's worse than Hillary. I guess Trump's most difficult opponent in 2020 will be himself at this point.

Maybe Stormy Daniels should run. People are saying she's smart and courageous. That she's done a lot for this country. And she doesn't have a racist bone in her body.

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1 hour ago, Silent Jay said:

Bernie Sanders would have won the election in 2016, now he's too old and the democrats seem more divided. They have to bring together the Sanders wing and the Clinton wing. 

People are talking about Michelle Obama which is funny. I think there is no viable opponent other than Harris, but she's worse than Hillary. I guess Trump's most difficult opponent in 2020 will be himself at this point.

Maybe Stormy Daniels should run. People are saying she's smart and courageous. That she's done a lot for this country. And she doesn't have a racist bone in her body.

 

Would Bernie have won? I feel he is too left wing. Trump at least fooled people into thinking he is a moderate. Too many people are still afraid of the word "socialism". Like what he is saying, but it will take years for Americans to accept any of it. Let's start and focus on Universal Healthcare. 

 

2020's primary will have a lot more Democrats running this time around. You'll have the usual establishment plus more. From what I've been gathering here's a list of those who many run. 

 

Elizabeth Warren - already taking steps to running

Tulsi Gabbard - says she will make an announcement to run next week

Joe Biden - Dropped so many hints he might as well announce it already

Beto O'Rourke - Playing it cool, grows a beard, acting like he won't run, had meeting with Obama, will appear on Oprah on February 5th, obviously he will make a decision by then. His loss to Cruz may be a damper, but people watching the election were impressed. Needs to control his emotions during debates though. 

Kristen Gillibrand - Her name has been floating around since 2016, Hilary's successor. Not the most popular choice. 

Julian Castro - Was floated as Hilary's VP, but for some reason they went with Kaine. Also met with Obama. Reached out to Progs concurring with AOC's hopes to tax the rich, but he may have been trying to get with that fine ass Latina. 

Sherrod Brown - He probably would have delivered Ohio to Hilary if he was picked VP. Progressive Senator that people in Ohio seem to love.  

Cory Booker - Probably the safest choice, lays it on thick

Kamala Harris - Everyone tells me America is not ready for her. 

Bernie Sanders - Older and crankier than ever. 

 

I have a feeling it will come down between Beto and Joe. Whoever the choice, Brown should be VP. We need Ohio damnit. 

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45 minutes ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

 

Would Bernie have won? I feel he is too left wing. Trump at least fooled people into thinking he is a moderate. Too many people are still afraid of the word "socialism". Like what he is saying, but it will take years for Americans to accept any of it. Let's start and focus on Universal Healthcare. 

 

2020's primary will have a lot more Democrats running this time around. You'll have the usual establishment plus more. From what I've been gathering here's a list of those who many run. 

 

Elizabeth Warren - already taking steps to running

Tulsi Gabbard - says she will make an announcement to run next week

Joe Biden - Dropped so many hints he might as well announce it already

Beto O'Rourke - Playing it cool, grows a beard, acting like he won't run, had meeting with Obama, will appear on Oprah on February 5th, obviously he will make a decision by then. His loss to Cruz may be a damper, but people watching the election were impressed. Needs to control his emotions during debates though. 

Kristen Gillibrand - Her name has been floating around since 2016, Hilary's successor. Not the most popular choice. 

Julian Castro - Was floated as Hilary's VP, but for some reason they went with Kaine. Also met with Obama. Reached out to Progs concurring with AOC's hopes to tax the rich, but he may have been trying to get with that fine ass Latina. 

Sherrod Brown - He probably would have delivered Ohio to Hilary if he was picked VP. Progressive Senator that people in Ohio seem to love.  

Cory Booker - Probably the safest choice, lays it on thick

Kamala Harris - Everyone tells me America is not ready for her. 

Bernie Sanders - Older and crankier than ever. 

 

I have a feeling it will come down between Beto and Joe. Whoever the choice, Brown should be VP. We need Ohio damnit. 

That's a terrible field.

You might as well add Bloomberg on that list.

At least Bernie Sanders had real energy and real people behind his movement.

Trump could wreck every single one of them in 2020 just as he wrecked the Bush and Clinton's dynasties.

At this rate nobody will be able to gather the party and run on the democratic ticket in 2020, campaigning on Love Trumps hate and associating your name with the DNC will tank you.

Also Chuck and Nancy do a lot of damage.

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Pertaining to a conflict over US funding for ''the wall'', didn't Trump say he'd get the Mexicans to pay for it? When was that idea jettisoned?

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39 minutes ago, Silent Jay said:

That's a terrible field.

You might as well add Bloomberg on that list.

At least Bernie Sanders had real energy and real people behind his movement.

Trump could wreck every single one of them in 2020 just as he wrecked the Bush and Clinton's dynasties.

At this rate nobody will be able to gather the party and run on the democratic ticket in 2020, campaigning on Love Trumps hate and associating your name with the DNC will tank you.

Also Chuck and Nancy do a lot of damage.

I disagree. Any one of them would make a better President than Trump. Any one of them can put the country back on track. 

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Out of that list, Tulsi Gabbard fits the type of candidate i'd like.

-Very clear on her non-interventionism (though she supports very limited use of drones - im total anti-drone)
-Big on civil liberties - part of the fourth amendment caucus.
-Supports progressive causes like universal healthcare/environment/weed etc.

Both sides think shes a mouth piece for Assad - which is ridiculous - but i guess heaven forbid someone does something other than send unapproved cruise missiles.

Edited by -W.A.R-

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1 hour ago, BadApples87 said:

Duff McKagan for President 2020!

#PunkAsFuck

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On 1/12/2019 at 1:36 PM, Padme said:

Well Julian Castro is running.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/12/politics/julian-castro-presidential-announcement/index.html

I'm not so sure Beto will run then. I mean two candidates from the same State?

 

Signs are pointing he is geering up for a run. We'll find out in a few weeks.

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