Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi Discussion Thread (SPOILERS WITHIN)

[ZoSoRose]

I still really like TLJ 

[James Bond]

I haven't even picked up the Blu yet. I have little to no desire to watch it again anytime soon. It might make a fine bookend with my copy of Rogue One.

[rocknroll41]

I finally for around to seeing it again today. It definitely gets better with repeat viewings, but there's still something missing from it that I can't quite put my finger on.

[rocknroll41]

Saw it one more time on my cable's on demand service over the weekend. It was my fourth viewing of the movie in total, and I gotta say, this time the movie finally worked for me! I finally got what Rian was going for.

Funny enough, both Return of the Jedi and Force Awakens played on TV right after I was done watching Last Jedi again. Having now revisited both of those films as well, my opinions on each of them have now changed a bit too. I used to like Return quite a bit, but it's grown kinda stale for me these days. I used to give the ewoks a pass, but now I think Last Jedi handled the whole "nature helping humanity" angle better with the alien horses and the crystal foxes.

I still like Force Awakens quite a bit, and I actually think it's technically directed a little better than Last Jedi, as Abrams seems to understand "the language of cinema" a little more than Johnson does, and he has that Speilbergian touch (which makes sense since he interned for him back when he was a kid). With that being said, the film's actual story feels a bit too predictable for me now, in hindsight.

New Ranking:

1.Star Wars (1977)

2.The Empire Strikes Back

3.The Last Jedi

4.The Force Awakens

5.Return of the Jedi

6.Rogue One

7.Revenge of the Sith

8.The Phantom Menace

9.Attack of the Clones

Edited April 2, 2018 by rocknroll41

[soon]

Fuck. You. Rian. Johnson.

 

[31illusions]

Rian Johnson to the fans.

You want the Luke you remember from ROTJ?... f@¢k you

You want to know Rey's parentage?... f@¢k you

You want to know who Snoke is?... f@¢k you

You think the biggest characters in the movie should live?... f@¢k you

((drops mic))

[Iron MikeyJ]

If anyone is paying attention, Mark Hamill is letting his true feelings be known again. I think he was told to play "nice" during the promotion of the film, probably because of all the fan backlash, etc. But now that it's on DVD, his "duties" are over, and he's giving his true thoughts again.

Some of the highlights:

He doesn't want to do another one (but I'm sure he is under contract). Although this is mostly due to Carrie being gone and Han Solo being killed off, I'm sure the bitter taste episode 7 left also plays a role.

He is STILL not happy with what they did to Luke Skywalker. He said (I'm paraphrasing here) "I've got a scene milking a space cow, but not a scene showing ANY emotion for the death of Han."

Bottom line, clearly Mark agrees with the majority of fans, the film is garbage and killed Star wars.

 

https://movieweb.com/amp/last-jedi-mark-hamill-luke-human-emotion-milking-scene/

Edited April 14, 2018 by Iron MikeyJ

[soon]

2 hours ago, Iron MikeyJ said:

If anyone is paying attention, Mark Hamill is letting his true feelings be known again. I think he was told to play "nice" during the promotion of the film, probably because of all the fan backlash, etc. But now that it's on DVD, his "duties" are over, and he's giving his true thoughts again.

Some of the highlights:

He doesn't want to do another one (but I'm sure he is under contract). Although this is mostly due to Carrie being gone and Han Solo being killed off, I'm sure the bitter taste episode 7 left also plays a role.

He is STILL not happy with what they did to Luke Skywalker. He said (I'm paraphrasing here) "I've got a scene milking a space cow, but not a scene showing ANY emotion for the death of Han."

Bottom line, clearly Mark agrees with the majority of fans, the film is garbage and killed Star wars.

 

https://movieweb.com/amp/last-jedi-mark-hamill-luke-human-emotion-milking-scene/

That Hamill quote really sums it all up nicely.

Strangely I have mixed feelings when I see/read Hamill being honest about TLJ.  I agree with him and yet, when Luke himself is saying it theres something wounding about it.  Luke is hope itself.  I guess I wish that the real Luke; our Luke could preserve the hope.  Its like Hamill is bringing the tragedy of the film into real life by giving up hope. I dont know.

Im with Hamill in spirit, but I hate it.

[luciusfunk]

JJ should retcon by saying it wasn't really Luke in TLJ, but Luuke instead.

[Georgy Zhukov]

Yeah, this franchise is dead to me. Skipping Solo and Episode IX

[Manfisman]

I'm really late here but I enjoyed TLJ. I think it was way better than TFA.

TFA felt like a bad remake because everything that happened in the film happened before. Like they even used the same technique to destroy a bigger death star (how original). Really boring and uncreative.

TLJ tried to do things different and just that fact has more value to me than the TFA movie. And I liked the story. Hard to see Luke go but it had to happen someday.

Edited April 30, 2018 by Manfisman

[Powerage5]

I still stand by the fact that I liked it  

[Powerage5]

On 3/28/2016 at 10:56 PM, rocknroll41 said:

 

  Hide contents

New updates from MakingStarWars (the site that leaked like 85% of TFA's plot) suggests that the stuff shot at Croatia was really the exterior for a Casino/ Mega-Cantina setting that Luke goes to in the hopes of finding someone. Meanwhile, an attack happens that puts Leia in a coma, leading Laura Dern's character to taking over what's left of the Resistance, which apparently is now a very small group as a result of this supposed attack. Dern's character turns out to be either evil or just not all that good at leading, so Poe leads a mutiny and eventually becomes the new leader of the Resistance himself. 

 

Also, going back and re-reading early in this thread...this was surprisingly accurate. A few details missed the mark, but all the general points were spot on. 

[rocknroll41]

40 minutes ago, Powerage5 said:

Also, going back and re-reading early in this thread...this was surprisingly accurate. A few details missed the mark, but all the general points were spot on. 

MakingStarWars.com has a mole inside the production team that Lucasfilm still hasn't been able to sniff out yet. That's why they're almost always nearly accurate, even years in advance.

along with the old spoilers above, they also were the first to reveal that finn and rose would disguise themselves as imperials, Tom Hardy would play a Stormtrooper who recognizes finn and slaps his ass (deleted scene on the bluray), del toro would play a hacker named DJ, Dern would have purple hair and a purple dress, luke would wear black and rey would wear her hair down, kylo would wear Vader's cape, Snoke would wear gold and have red guards, Porgs would be a thing, the salt planet would be called Crait, and lastly, that rose's necklace would have significance.

one major detail I remember they got wrong though was that for some reason they thought kylo and the Knights of Ren would fight rey and luke on the island planet. That "tip" must've been lucasfilm planting a false trail of breadcrumbs, to lead fans off the scent of what actually happens in the movie.

Like I also said, though, MakingStarWars predicted like 85% of TFA's plot. Also, back when season 1 of the rebels cartoon show was just getting started, they claimed that the book character Thrawn would show up in season 3 (which ended up being true). They were also the first ones to claim back in mid 2016 that Tony Gilroy was being brought in to rewrite and redirect all of Rogue One's third act cause it was originally "a terrible mess" when they shot it first with Gareth Edwards (this was denied at the time, of course, but Gilroy finally confirmed in early 2018 that it was true).

Theyve apparently been dropping major spoilers for Solo in the last year or so, but I don't read the site anymore. I've outgrown SW spoilers. 

Edited May 1, 2018 by rocknroll41

[Powerage5]

22 minutes ago, rocknroll41 said:

MakingStarWars.com has a mole inside the production team that Lucasfilm still hasn't been able to sniff out yet. That's why they're almost always nearly accurate, even years in advance.

along with the old spoilers above, they also were the first to reveal that finn and rose would disguise themselves as imperials, Tom Hardy would play a Stormtrooper who recognizes finn and slaps his ass (deleted scene on the bluray), del toro would play a hacker named DJ, Dern would have purple hair and a purple dress, luke would wear black and rey would wear her hair down, kylo would wear Vader's cape, Snoke would wear gold and have red guards, Porgs would be a thing, the salt planet would be called Crait, and lastly, that rose's necklace would have significance.

one major detail I remember they got wrong though was that for some reason they thought kylo and the Knights of Ren would fight rey and luke on the island planet. That "tip" must've been lucasfilm planting a false trail of breadcrumbs, to lead fans off the scent of what actually happens in the movie.

Like I also said, though, MakingStarWars predicted like 85% of TFA's plot. Also, back when season 1 of the rebels cartoon show was just getting started, they claimed that the book character Thrawn would show up in season 3 (which ended up being true). They were also the first ones to claim back in mid 2016 that Tony Gilroy was being brought in to rewrite and redirect all of Rogue One's third act cause it was originally "a terrible mess" when they shot it first with Gareth Edwards (this was denied at the time, of course, but Gilroy finally confirmed in early 2018 that it was true).

Theyve apparently been dropping major spoilers for Solo in the last year or so, but I don't read the site anymore. I've outgrown SW spoilers. 

I never really read the spoilers before the films are released. But it is fun to go back after and see what was true, and what was bullshit. 

 

And holy shit, that Stormtrooper was Tom Hardy?!? I'm loving this trend of major actors playing Stormtrooper cameos in...unusual in-universe scenarios. 

[rocknroll41]

1 hour ago, Powerage5 said:

I never really read the spoilers before the films are released. But it is fun to go back after and see what was true, and what was bullshit. 

 

And holy shit, that Stormtrooper was Tom Hardy?!? I'm loving this trend of major actors playing Stormtrooper cameos in...unusual in-universe scenarios. 

Their alleged TFA plot from May 2015 was almost correct. The only major things they really got wrong were the movie starting with Luke's lightsaber falling from the sky and landing in front of Maz's castle (which, to be fair, was actually in an earlier draft), and the ground splitting to separate kylo and rey while they were still in the middle of dueling (when, in the actual movie, she had already beaten him by the time the ground splits). 

Edited May 1, 2018 by rocknroll41

[F*ck Fear]

I just watched this film today.

It's not the worst Star Wars film, that's for sure. All of the 3 Lucas prequels were worse than The Last Jedi, IMO.

[luciusfunk]

I'd put it above TFA just because it has Luke in it and we get a decent lightsaber battle with the Praetorian guards. I'd easily rank the prequels above the sequels.

[luciusfunk]

Anyone seen the leak for IX? So bad. It’ll make TLJ look like Empire. I’ll put spoilers just in case it’s true. 

Five years later. 

First Order is seen as benevolent force, even some Resistance fighters are starting to wonder why they’re fighting. 

Hux is a mole, trying to bring down Kylo and take over the FO.

Ren and the Knights of Ren are hunting down force-sensitive children. 

There’s a slave colony on an all water planet. 

Rey is teaching children to be Jedi. 

One child is Reylo’s secret love child. Kylo is furious when he finds out Rey had his child and nearly kills her, is only stopped by Leia.

Leia has been recast.

[Powerage5]

1 hour ago, luciusfunk said:

Anyone seen the leak for IX? So bad. It’ll make TLJ look like Empire. I’ll put spoilers just in case it’s true. 

 

  Hide contents

Five years later. 

First Order is seen as benevolent force, even some Resistance fighters are starting to wonder why they’re fighting. 

Hux is a mole, trying to bring down Kylo and take over the FO.

Ren and the Knights of Ren are hunting down force-sensitive children. 

There’s a slave colony on an all water planet. 

Rey is teaching children to be Jedi. 

One child is Reylo’s secret love child. Kylo is furious when he finds out Rey had his child and nearly kills her, is only stopped by Leia.

Leia has been recast.

 

Kill me now. 

[ZoSoRose]

No way

[luciusfunk]

This leaker and another both claim this is the last of the trilogy format, but not the end of the Kylo story. A second leaker claims we’ll have Episode IX part 1 & 2 or Episode IX and Episode X, but no X, XI, XII. 

 

Second leaker claims Kylo is light and Rey is darkness, major twist is Kylo is both villain and hero. 

This all sounds like shit.

 

Rian’s trilogy is supposedly about the origin of the force, thousands of years before KOTOR. 

Edited May 5, 2018 by luciusfunk

[rocknroll41]

None of that is true. What, did Kylo and Rey fuck on the elevator on the way up to Snoke or some shit?

[James Bond]

If any of that is true I will inflict harm upon myself.

[Lies They Tell]

To me it feels weird that people were so positive after seeing TFA and so negative after TLJ.

If TLJ sucks, it's mostly because TFA set it up to suck. People complain that TLJ didn't give satisfying answers to questions like who are Rey's parents... well what would have been a satisfying answer then? You can't top the "I am your father" plot twist. That's an impossible task, so it was a stupid idea in TFA to make Rey's backstory a mystery. The answer was doomed to be a disappointment. It's easy to create questions and build up mysteries, but it's much harder to come up with satisfying answers. Rian Johnson did the best he could, but nothing could have saved this new trilogy after TFA.

Snoke was a useless character to begin with. Just a new version of the emperor. It's like JJ Abrams was trying to remake the original trilogy. If it was up to JJ, we probably would have seen a remake of the conflict between Luke, Vader and the Emperor in episode 9, only this time it would have been between Rey, Ren and Snoke. Well, luckily Rian Johnson killed Snoke, so that Episode 9 won't be a complete rehash of ROTJ.

The Last Jedi could so easily have been a rehash of the Empire Strikes Back. Just like Yoda, Luke could have taught Rey the secrets of the force, but instead we got a deeply conflicted jedi. We got a fresh and interesting take on a jedi master. Again Rian Johnson saved the movie from the shit that it was set out to be.

Some people even complain that TLJ didn't give any answers to Rey's Mary Sue powers. How about instead of blaming TLJ, you blame TFA for making her a Mary Sue in the first place. It was TFA that screwed this trilogy up. For some reason everyone expected TLJ to fix all the problems that TFA created.

The problem is that they had no real vision for this trilogy. They didn't have a new story worth of telling. They just started remaking the original trilogy, then Rian Johnson did the best he could to take the story away from that path. But it was too late. After TFA this trilogy was beyond saving. 

Of course some are just disappointed that Luke wasn't the perfect human being that they remember from the original trilogy. I can see that, although personally I liked this conflicted portrayal of Luke. Besides they didn't just dump all over Luke Skywalker, like some people say. He redeemed himself in the movie and in the end we see Luke with the kind of force powers we've never seen before. In my opinion they handled his death with respect. TLJ does have it's fair share of problems. Rose was a lame ass character. Some of the humor was lame etc... But at least TLJ had some original ideas and tried to take the story to some more interesting new paths. TLJ wasn't an amazing movie, but it was much better than TFA.

Edited June 1, 2018 by Lies They Tell