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11 minutes ago, lilacmess said:

Hi everyone! Thanks for a highly enjoyable thread!

I've just come across this quote from Axl from the 2000 Roling Stone interview:

Even when it came to picking tracks for the recent Live Era '87-'93 retrospective, Rose and Slash – whom Rose describes as "negatively seductive" – communicated their song selections only through intermediaries. "I never said that I was bitter," Rose explains, characteristically concerned with making fine distinctions. "Hurt, yeah. Disappointed. I mean, with Slash, I remember crying about all kinds of things in my life, but I had never felt hot, burning tears … hot, burning tears of anger. Basically, to me, it was because I am watching this guy and I don't understand it. Playing with everyone from Space Ghost to Michael Jackson. I don't get it. I wanted the world to love and respect him. I just watched him throw it away."

The "negatively seductive" part reminds me of Madagascar's lyrics, especially this

"For the many times, what seemed like a memory
I've searched and found the ways
You used to lure me in
Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be
Mired in denial, and so afraid"

What do you guys think?

 

All of these Slaxl stories:drool: altnation should be gone from this forum so tht We can bring Dexter N' Slash here N' tell Us the truth about Their relationship :max:

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21 minutes ago, lilacmess said:

Hi everyone! Thanks for a highly enjoyable thread!

I've just come across this quote from Axl from the 2000 Roling Stone interview:

Even when it came to picking tracks for the recent Live Era '87-'93 retrospective, Rose and Slash – whom Rose describes as "negatively seductive" – communicated their song selections only through intermediaries. "I never said that I was bitter," Rose explains, characteristically concerned with making fine distinctions. "Hurt, yeah. Disappointed. I mean, with Slash, I remember crying about all kinds of things in my life, but I had never felt hot, burning tears … hot, burning tears of anger. Basically, to me, it was because I am watching this guy and I don't understand it. Playing with everyone from Space Ghost to Michael Jackson. I don't get it. I wanted the world to love and respect him. I just watched him throw it away."

The "negatively seductive" part reminds me of Madagascar's lyrics, especially this

"For the many times, what seemed like a memory
I've searched and found the ways
You used to lure me in
Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be
Mired in denial, and so afraid"

What do you guys think?

 

If you ask me I definitely think Madagascar is exactly about the band breakup ;)

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15 hours ago, Lumikki said:

Axl meanwhile just chose to stay really bitter and hurt and didn't even try to hide it...

13 hours ago, Lumikki said:

I honestly feel for Slash on that one. I'm not saying Slash is a saint (far from it, and there are tons of things about Slash that would have been difficult for Axl to deal with- the drug addiction, passive-aggressiveness and lying maybe,...), but his frustration and helplessness when it comes to Axl often comes through in the things he says. Like the thing about him trying to help and trying to be a good friend, but ultimately also having to think of himself, or Axl's craziness driving him crazier than it does Axl, or him barely being able to comprehend half the things Axl told him about his past... I think Slash really might have been in over his head sometimes with Axl.

(And I wonder if things could have turned out differently maybe if Slash had been the older one of the two instead of Axl. If Slash had been a couple of years older than Axl and had the maturity and "wisdom" to go with that, he might have been in a slightly better position to be able to deal with Axl.)

They had very different ways of dealing with feelings, true, Slash buried that shit deep with the occasional burst of emotion (like the ICP dude accident) meanwhile Axl, like you said, dwell on the situation without moving on and i don't think it would have changed anything with Slash being older because it seems to me like this fundamental difference was "mitigated" quite recently, like @Blackstar said they were like a couple who may love each other a lot but they didn't communicate.

You add to that the fact that Axl was unstable, Slash's addictions, the weight of fame and it was a recipe for disaster even if Slash was older, i feel sad for them because they were bitter and fixated on each other for a long time but i believe that now it was the only time they could have it worked out and they did, thanks god.

And the "Axl's craziness drives me crazier than Axl" is still big no, nope, Slash.

50 minutes ago, lilacmess said:

Hi everyone! Thanks for a highly enjoyable thread!

I've just come across this quote from Axl from the 2000 Roling Stone interview:

Even when it came to picking tracks for the recent Live Era '87-'93 retrospective, Rose and Slash – whom Rose describes as "negatively seductive" – communicated their song selections only through intermediaries. "I never said that I was bitter," Rose explains, characteristically concerned with making fine distinctions. "Hurt, yeah. Disappointed. I mean, with Slash, I remember crying about all kinds of things in my life, but I had never felt hot, burning tears … hot, burning tears of anger. Basically, to me, it was because I am watching this guy and I don't understand it. Playing with everyone from Space Ghost to Michael Jackson. I don't get it. I wanted the world to love and respect him. I just watched him throw it away."

The "negatively seductive" part reminds me of Madagascar's lyrics, especially this

"For the many times, what seemed like a memory
I've searched and found the ways
You used to lure me in
Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be
Mired in denial, and so afraid"

What do you guys think?

 

I love the "negative seductive" quote and it could very well be, it makes sense.

Edited by giuls
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Not to rain on anyone's parade, but with all of the people Axl lost between 1995 and 2001...including people like West Arkeen and Duff who had been very close to him...when Axl is writing about being left alone, it could refer to any and all. He basically lost almost every constant he'd had during those six years. "Mired in denial and so afraid" and "negative seduction" could very well refer to friends like West and Shannon Hoon who had been lured in and lost their lives to drugs - they didn't think they had problems or didn't seek help for them or whatever. Showing anger toward those who were actually still alive and didn't want to be around him for whatever reason would make sense, too.

Around the same time Madagascar premiered, he was also reportedly blacking out all of the other skulls (besides his likeness) on the AfD cross, wasn't he?

I've always thought that song was about, "I've lost all these people and been put down by so many people, but I'm still going."

Edited by stella
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It is a song about himself, that what he has gone through and how he has to move forward, the lyrics are pretty deep. 

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35 minutes ago, stella said:

Not to rain on anyone's parade, but with all of the people Axl lost between 1995 and 2001...including people like West Arkeen and Duff who had been very close to him...when Axl is writing about being left alone, it could refer to any and all. He basically lost almost every constant he'd had during those six years. "Mired in denial and so afraid" and "negative seduction" could very well refer to friends like West and Shannon Hoon who had been lured in and lost their lives to drugs - they didn't think they had problems or didn't seek help for them or whatever. Showing anger toward those who were actually still alive and didn't want to be around him for whatever reason would make sense, too.

Around the same time Madagascar premiered, he was also reportedly blacking out all of the other skulls (besides his likeness) on the AfD cross, wasn't he?

I've always thought that song was about, "I've lost all these people and been put down by so many people, but I'm still going."

But "mired in denial and so afraid" is refering to "I found the ways" and the verse goes " I've searched and found the ways/You used to lure me in/Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be Mired in denial, and so afraid" the person is question is luring Axl in, the other person isn't being lured in by anything.

I think the it in "why it had to be" is the relationship in question, the relationship was mired in denial and they were afraid (they denied there were problems because they were afraid of leaving each other?)

Plus, like, @Frey said, he copy-pasted a speech together to say "He promised never to leave me" i think it's significant.

I don't know about nu!GNR antics on stage with the logo but if it wasn't directly during Madagascar it could be a general statement on the state of the band "it's a new era, fellas, it's only me!" instead on something linked to the song.

It could be about the band in general, sure, even if the use of the He makes me think Axl was talking to a singular person but i don't think it is about Hoon or Arkeen.

 

ETA: @Andy14 your banner is better, i put mine together in 5 minutes :lol:

Edited by giuls
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2 hours ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

It'll be interesting to see if they play Maddy any time soon then :lol:

I love that song. 

I love that song too. And I want them to play it. If they can play Sorry, they can also play Maddy, as far as I'm concerned :max:

(If I had anything to say about it, they'd get rid of fucking TIL, CITR and CD and make room for Maddy, Prostitue and SOD.)

6 hours ago, Frey said:

Considering that the song basically is a metaphor for Axl being all alone now ("and left so far out from the shore...", the title itself) and that there must be a reason why Axl chose these quotes specifically, I don't think it's far-fetched to assume that the MLK/movie quotes directly refer to Axl himself as well.

So who promised to never leave him? And betrayed him in the end? As a GNR fan familiar with all the drama, it's hard not to immediately think "Slash". It seems the most likely answer. And it also works with something Slash once said apparently when he was asked why Axl was so mad at him: "I abandoned him."

I mean who knows? It's even possible Slash literally promised Axl never to leave. When they were younger maybe. Kids do shit like that. And Axl would remember even all these years later.

Then there's also the "Black men and white men/together at the table of brotherhood/I have a dream" part. Hell, that too might be a direct reference to Axl and Slash. A really heavy-handed and slightly tasteless one, but Axl isn't exactly subtle and it wouldn't surprise me.

Conclusion: Yes, the song is about the band breaking up and Slash leaving him and therefore you might be right about Axl feeling like evil, negatively seductive Slash lured him into a false sense of safety, only to abandon him later.

Also damn, that turned into an essay :facepalm::lol:

4 hours ago, giuls said:

It's on his notebook so it's binding! :P No, but it's a very credible theory and i agree.

Oh yeah, Axl would definitely remember something like that. Most people just say things without thinking much about it and quickly forget about whatever they said, but Axl is the type who would remember every little word that seemed significant to him, write it down in his journal and hold people to it even decades later.

I can see it now: "Slash, on June 23, 1985, after we'd just written a new song and jumped around on your grandma's bed in excitement, you promised me that you'd never leave me. You said I'm so brilliant, you'd never let another band or guitarist have me and you said we'd be together forever! :max::max::max: Don't even try to deny it, I wrote it all down here in my journal. And also... *pages rustling*... blablabla..."

Slash and Izzy should form a support group.

Seriously though, the idea that Slash might have promised Axl something like that is actually kinda heartbreaking. :unsure:

Anyway, I think the entire theory/interpretation is pretty plausible. I've also always thought that Madagascar was about the band breaking up (and parts of it about Slash in particular) and the idea that it's called Madagascar because it symbolizes Axl being being on his own now, as a small piece of the bigger continent, has been around for so long that I've kind of accepted it as the truth lol. And good point about the MLK and movie quotes. They're definitely not random and there's a reason why Axl selected and arranged them like that.

@lilacmess Welcome and thanks for reminding us all of the"Slash is negatively seductive" quote. :P  It's a fun one and I agree with @Frey, it might indicate that Slash is also the person Axl talks about in the "The ways you used to lure me in" line.

 

 

 

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I think I remember Izzy saying tht He will in the Band till He's dead/forever

Axl said I will always be Your friend to Slash

Slash said something same to Axl

Edited by SerenityScorp

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15 hours ago, lilacmess said:

Hi everyone! Thanks for a highly enjoyable thread!

I've just come across this quote from Axl from the 2000 Roling Stone interview:

Even when it came to picking tracks for the recent Live Era '87-'93 retrospective, Rose and Slash – whom Rose describes as "negatively seductive" – communicated their song selections only through intermediaries. "I never said that I was bitter," Rose explains, characteristically concerned with making fine distinctions. "Hurt, yeah. Disappointed. I mean, with Slash, I remember crying about all kinds of things in my life, but I had never felt hot, burning tears … hot, burning tears of anger. Basically, to me, it was because I am watching this guy and I don't understand it. Playing with everyone from Space Ghost to Michael Jackson. I don't get it. I wanted the world to love and respect him. I just watched him throw it away."

The "negatively seductive" part reminds me of Madagascar's lyrics, especially this

"For the many times, what seemed like a memory
I've searched and found the ways
You used to lure me in
Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be
Mired in denial, and so afraid"

What do you guys think?

 

I don't know about Madagascar, sometimes I thought it was about his parents.  But "hot burning tears of anger" sounds so passionate and dramatic.  So Axl.  :heart:

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6 hours ago, stella said:

Around the same time Madagascar premiered, he was also reportedly blacking out all of the other skulls (besides his likeness) on the AfD cross, wasn't he?

I was wondering about this the other day, I was like wtf did he do to that tattoo? He was really trying to erase everything AFD.

2 hours ago, Lumikki said:

I can see it now: "Slash, on June 23, 1985, after we'd just written a new song and jumped around on your grandma's bed in excitement, you promised me that you'd never leave me. You said I'm so brilliant, you'd never let another band or guitarist have me and you said we'd be together forever! :max::max::max: Don't even try to deny it, I wrote it all down here in my journal. And also... *pages rustling*... blablabla..."

Slash and Izzy should form a support group.

LMAO!:rofl-lol:

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10 hours ago, giuls said:

But "mired in denial and so afraid" is refering to "I found the ways" and the verse goes " I've searched and found the ways/You used to lure me in/Oh, I found the ways, oh, why it had to be Mired in denial, and so afraid" the person is question is luring Axl in, the other person isn't being lured in by anything.

I think the it in "why it had to be" is the relationship in question, the relationship was mired in denial and they were afraid (they denied there were problems because they were afraid of leaving each other?)

Plus, like, @Frey said, he copy-pasted a speech together to say "He promised never to leave me" i think it's significant.

I don't know about nu!GNR antics on stage with the logo but if it wasn't directly during Madagascar it could be a general statement on the state of the band "it's a new era, fellas, it's only me!" instead on something linked to the song.

It could be about the band in general, sure, even if the use of the He makes me think Axl was talking to a singular person but i don't think it is about Hoon or Arkeen.

 

ETA: @Andy14 your banner is better, i put mine together in 5 minutes :lol:

Haven't we said over and over here that many people misled Axl and took him to the cleaners? The person who lured him in could have been Stephanie. It could have been the charlatans he leaned on. I honestly think that people WANT it to be about Slash to support their own wishful thinking of their supposed "relationship." Mired in denial and so afraid"...that could even be about the alternative "medicine" weirdos who were telling him that he was getting sick because of his own feelings.

And as to the "never leave me alone..." @Frey mentioned...it's a speech by Martin Luther King Jr., "But If Not." It refers to Jesus and the entire section of the speech is about not being afraid to stand up to one's own convictions and do one's own thing, even if others don't think it's right. He's saying he's been through hell and back and that even if others go through that, they can be brave because they're never really alone, even if they feel that way. That would go with the interpretation of, "others have tried to hold me back, and I'm still going." All you have to do is look at this speech, and particularly that paragraph, and see how Axl might have felt that it resonated for him.

https://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNothttps://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNot

http://notoriousbiggins.blogspot.com/2010/01/but-if-not-sermon-by-martin-luther-king.html (the only transcript I can find unfortunately)


And this is what I want to say finally, that there is a reward if you do right for righteousness' sake. It says that somehow that burning fiery furnace was transformed into an air-conditioned living room. [light laughter] Somebody looked in there and said "We put three in here, but now we see four." Don't ever think you're by yourself. Go on to jail if necessary but you'll never go alone. Take a stand for that which is right, and the world may misunderstand you and criticize you, but you never go alone, for somewhere I read that "One with God is a majority," and God has a way of transforming a minority into a majority. Walk with him this morning and believe in him and do what is right and he'll be with you even until the consummation of the ages. Yes, I've seen the lightning flash, I've heard the thunder roll, I've felt sin's breakers dashing trying to conquer my soul but I heard the voice of Jesus saying still to fight on, he promised never to leave me, never to leave me alone; no, never alone, no, never alone. He promised never to leave me, never to leave me alone. Where you going this morning, my friends, tell the world that you're going with truth. You're going with justice, you're going with goodness, and you will have an eternal companionship. And the world will look at you and they won't understand you, for your fiery furnace will be around you, but you'll go on anyhow. But if not, I will not bow, and God grant that we will never bow before the gods of evil.

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 I see Madagascar as a some sort of sequel to Breakdown. I can deal with the song but Breakdown is by far much better song. That's the one I would love to hear in a show

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@Lumikki I loved it when Axls band played Madagascar live, everyone else around me was like WTF?! but yeah, if it was up to me I would put it in the set too. I also really like Shacklers Revenge, and thought it was awesome when they played that live as well, so I would put that one in and strip everything else CD out. 

Only problem is, I cannot for the life of me see Slash playing Shacklers, it makes me giggle thinking about it :lol:

Edited by MillionsOfSpiders
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5 hours ago, Jane M. said:

I was wondering about this the other day, I was like wtf did he do to that tattoo? He was really trying to erase everything AFD.

He actually tried to save the tatoo, he went to see a tatoo artist but the cross was done shittily and that's why it's so dark, it isn't Axl's doing

1 hour ago, stella said:

 

Haven't we said over and over here that many people misled Axl and took him to the cleaners? The person who lured him in could have been Stephanie. It could have been the charlatans he leaned on. I honestly think that people WANT it to be about Slash to support their own wishful thinking of their supposed "relationship." Mired in denial and so afraid"...that could even be about the alternative "medicine" weirdos who were telling him that he was getting sick because of his own feelings.

And as to the "never leave me alone..." @Frey mentioned...it's a speech by Martin Luther King Jr., "But If Not." It refers to Jesus and the entire section of the speech is about not being afraid to stand up to one's own convictions and do one's own thing, even if others don't think it's right. He's saying he's been through hell and back and that even if others go through that, they can be brave because they're never really alone, even if they feel that way. That would go with the interpretation of, "others have tried to hold me back, and I'm still going." All you have to do is look at this speech, and particularly that paragraph, and see how Axl might have felt that it resonated for him.

https://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNothttps://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNot

http://notoriousbiggins.blogspot.com/2010/01/but-if-not-sermon-by-martin-luther-king.html (the only transcript I can find unfortunately)
 

 

Well, no, it couldn't be Yoda et similia because he thanked her in the CD booklet, it was posted here, so he was very much still into the new age crap at the time of CD.

About Stephanie, the line about " Black men and White men together, at the table of brotherhood" doesn't make me think of a romantic relationship, there's also the lines " freedom of all the chains/We have together" what chains link Stephanie and Axl together? She moved on pretty quickly and the song says "If we ever find it's true/that we have a strength to choose" and this seems to me that both party has wavered on freeing themself, meanwhile the members of the band have a LOT of chains that links them together to this day: the business, the songs, the public perception and the band slowly died with the guys leaving one by one.

I have acknowledged in my previous post it could be about the band in general ( @Frey did too) and i know where the speech come from and what it means. 

The "others have tried to hold me back, and I'm still going."  message was said in the 24 (!!!) previous verses to the "he promised" one and they talk about people in general (he uses "we", he uses "how can a person")  then the song shifts to talking about a "He" saying that he promised to never leave and that This whole thing is fucked up AND it shifts again talking in general again how all men betray and lose heart but he wants to believe,  it actually makes more sense if he had bypassed completely the "he promised" because he was talking feeling fear and discouragement about the fact that hatred is taught, how "everybody's acting that we can do anything and it don't matter what we do" then he launchs an attack on "he" and then he goes back to lament that all men are flaky but now we're free at last.

 

Knowing Axl was a perfectionist (someone here said he allegedly recorded his lines one by one) i find strange that this obvious semantic shift is a coincidence, i actually think that specific passage is about Slash because "DRAMA" and the "i abandoned him" answer like Frey said.

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And Lennon's back. Again. For a short while. 

I don't really believe Axl wrote songs about Slash. At least not that many. Maybe Sorry. Not the others. In my head, they're clearly about something or someone else. 

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1 hour ago, giuls said:

He actually tried to save the tatoo, he went to see a tatoo artist but the cross was done shittily and that's why it's so dark, it isn't Axl's doing

Well, no, it couldn't be Yoda et similia because he thanked her in the CD booklet, it was posted here, so he was very much still into the new age crap at the time of CD.

About Stephanie, the line about " Black men and White men together, at the table of brotherhood" doesn't make me think of a romantic relationship, there's also the lines " freedom of all the chains/We have together" what chains link Stephanie and Axl together? She moved on pretty quickly and the song says "If we ever find it's true/that we have a strength to choose" and this seems to me that both party has wavered on freeing themself, meanwhile the members of the band have a LOT of chains that links them together to this day: the business, the songs, the public perception and the band slowly died with the guys leaving one by one.

I have acknowledged in my previous post it could be about the band in general ( @Frey did too) and i know where the speech come from and what it means. 

The "others have tried to hold me back, and I'm still going."  message was said in the 24 (!!!) previous verses to the "he promised" one and they talk about people in general (he uses "we", he uses "how can a person")  then the song shifts to talking about a "He" saying that he promised to never leave and that This whole thing is fucked up AND it shifts again talking in general again how all men betray and lose heart but he wants to believe,  it actually makes more sense if he had bypassed completely the "he promised" because he was talking feeling fear and discouragement about the fact that hatred is taught, how "everybody's acting that we can do anything and it don't matter what we do" then he launchs an attack on "he" and then he goes back to lament that all men are flaky but now we're free at last.

 

Knowing Axl was a perfectionist (someone here said he allegedly recorded his lines one by one) i find strange that this obvious semantic shift is a coincidence, i actually think that specific passage is about Slash because "DRAMA" and the "i abandoned him" answer like Frey said.

That tattoo is all black, at least it was when I saw him up close in 2012, even the Axl face was blurry. He does have the other one on his opposite wrist that has a similar style to the AFD pattern and just one skull. 

It's been discussed before here many times, that it symbolises him as the last gunner standing. And it also has no hair, so make of that what you will :lol:

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29 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

That tattoo is all black, at least it was when I saw him up close in 2012, even the Axl face was blurry. He does have the other one on his opposite wrist that has a similar style to the AFD pattern and just one skull. 

It's been discussed before here many times, that it symbolises him as the last gunner standing. And it also has no hair, so make of that what you will :lol:

Any pic?

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14 hours ago, stella said:

Around the same time Madagascar premiered, he was also reportedly blacking out all of the other skulls (besides his likeness) on the AfD cross, wasn't he?

I've always thought that song was about, "I've lost all these people and been put down by so many people, but I'm still going."

7 hours ago, Jane M. said:

I was wondering about this the other day, I was like wtf did he do to that tattoo? He was really trying to erase everything AFD.

First things first, as far as I know him blacking out the tattoos was just a rumor that came into existence because his AfD tattoo didn't hold up very well and the colors ran into each other, making it look really dark. But if you look at high res pictures, you can see that the tattoo was never blacked out. And like @giuls mentioned, even Axl himself said he actually tried to save the tattoo by getting it touched up, but it didn't work.

 

14 hours ago, stella said:

Not to rain on anyone's parade, but with all of the people Axl lost between 1995 and 2001...including people like West Arkeen and Duff who had been very close to him...when Axl is writing about being left alone, it could refer to any and all. He basically lost almost every constant he'd had during those six years. "Mired in denial and so afraid" and "negative seduction" could very well refer to friends like West and Shannon Hoon who had been lured in and lost their lives to drugs - they didn't think they had problems or didn't seek help for them or whatever. Showing anger toward those who were actually still alive and didn't want to be around him for whatever reason would make sense, too.

3 hours ago, stella said:

Haven't we said over and over here that many people misled Axl and took him to the cleaners? The person who lured him in could have been Stephanie. It could have been the charlatans he leaned on. I honestly think that people WANT it to be about Slash to support their own wishful thinking of their supposed "relationship." Mired in denial and so afraid"...that could even be about the alternative "medicine" weirdos who were telling him that he was getting sick because of his own feelings.

And as to the "never leave me alone..." @Frey mentioned...it's a speech by Martin Luther King Jr., "But If Not." It refers to Jesus and the entire section of the speech is about not being afraid to stand up to one's own convictions and do one's own thing, even if others don't think it's right. He's saying he's been through hell and back and that even if others go through that, they can be brave because they're never really alone, even if they feel that way. That would go with the interpretation of, "others have tried to hold me back, and I'm still going." All you have to do is look at this speech, and particularly that paragraph, and see how Axl might have felt that it resonated for him.

https://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNothttps://archive.org/details/MlkButIfNot

http://notoriousbiggins.blogspot.com/2010/01/but-if-not-sermon-by-martin-luther-king.html (the only transcript I can find unfortunately)
 

@giuls already saved me a lot of the typing and I agree with everything she said, but to sum up

- Axl was talking about himself being lured in in the lyrics, not about someone else like West Arkeen or Shannon Hoon (these two also don't fit with the rest of the lyrics and themes of the song). Axl talking about someone luring him in sounds similar to Axl talking about Slash being "negatively seductive", which is what @lilacmess tried to point out (and the "negative seduction" thing definitely can't refer to other friends, because Axl specifically said that about Slash)

- Can't be about Yoda, etc. because he was still very much involved with them at the time the song was written. Stephanie is theoretically possible, but doesn't really fit with the rest of the song for the reasons giuls explained. His family is possible too, but again the band fits better.

- The MLK quotes could have been intended in the original spirit of the speech, but like giuls said again, out of all the other parts he could have taken from the speech that express the sentiment you mentioned, he specifically chose these, arranged them in a certain manner together with quotes from other places, etc. I think it's fair to say there is probably some significance to that.

 

 

 

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