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"Don't do it"


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On 15/06/2016 at 3:20 AM, killuridols said:

Nah, you're not naive when you're buying an autograph from Ebay!

The letters, books and other stuff you mention, especially from people who are dead, it's a totally different thing. Auctions are different than some guy selling an autographed Use Your Illusion vinyl.

Axl is alive, you can get an autograph if you move your ass and want to make it happen. There's plenty of examples of people making amazing memories for themselves. The same amount of money you spend buying an autograph from Ebay could be used for a trip or a ticket to a show.

I think there's no excuse for this and the ones falling for it and feeding this shady market are indeed stupid people.

It can be a case of simply being naive. Okay, maybe fans who are familiar with the Internet and that sort of side of it will/should know different. But I have a friend who fell for it.

He knew I am a big fan of Guns N' Roses, and especially Axl. So a couple of years ago, he shows up with a birthday gift for me. A signed picture of Axl. I was over the moon, of course, and asked him all astonished where he got it from. And he said he got it off Ebay from this person who was a registered autograph trader and who offered a certificate of authenticity.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that it's most likely a fake, and that certificates of authenticity don't mean anything. It was such a sweet, thoughtful gift, after all. I still have the picture sitting on my desk. It's a nice one - Axl in 2006. And there was a lot of love behind that present.

Some people just don't know that there are shady characters selling stuff like fake autographs out there. They've never experienced it before. And some traders are really clever, giving license numbers, and making it look genuine. Like the certificate my friend got with the signed picture states it was obtained from Black Frog Touring Inc, which is actually associated with GN'R. Easy to fall for if you're not as clued up as, say, people on fan forums.

 

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5 minutes ago, Kittiara said:

It can be a case of simply being naive. Okay, maybe fans who are familiar with the Internet and that sort of side of it will/should know different. But I have a friend who fell for it.

He knew I am a big fan of Guns N' Roses, and especially Axl. So a couple of years ago, he shows up with a birthday gift for me. A signed picture of Axl. I was over the moon, of course, and asked him all astonished where he got it from. And he said he got it off Ebay from this person who was a registered autograph trader and who offered a certificate of authenticity.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that it's most likely a fake, and that certificates of authenticity don't mean anything. It was such a sweet, thoughtful gift, after all. I still have the picture sitting on my desk. It's a nice one - Axl in 2006. And there was a lot of love behind that present.

Some people just don't know that there are shady characters selling stuff like fake autographs out there. They've never experienced it before. And some traders are really clever, giving license numbers, and making it look genuine. Like the certificate my friend got with the signed picture states it was obtained from Black Frog Touring Inc, which is actually associated with GN'R. Easy to fall for if you're not as clued up as, say, people on fan forums.

I think you guys dont get my point yet... or maybe I just don't make any sense in what I'm trying to say...

Don't know if all autographs sold on Ebay are fake or not. Some of them do seem legit. Others not at all. Still, that's not my point. I don't care if they are fake or real. The way I feel about autographs is that if you don't get them yourself or from someone else who got it directly from the artist, they are not worth it at all and you're being stupid for 1) feeding that shady market and 2) believing that it has a special meaning.

I understand what you're saying about your friend. He had the best of intentions and thought that would make you happy. That's okay and I understand that most people are not as much into bands and artists like we are, so they may not get what's the difference or what's the big deal with having an idol. Other people may never understand why would someone ask for an artist to sign their bodies and then tattoo it.

To me, buying an autograph from Ebay (real or fake) it's like "buying love", going out with scorts, paying a prostitute, visiting Egypt via Google Street View, lol... Do I make any sense?

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2 minutes ago, killuridols said:

I think you guys dont get my point yet... or maybe I just don't make any sense in what I'm trying to say...

Don't know if all autographs sold on Ebay are fake or not. Some of them do seem legit. Others not at all. Still, that's not my point. I don't care if they are fake or real. The way I feel about autographs is that if you don't get them yourself or from someone else who got it directly from the artist, they are not worth it at all and you're being stupid for 1) feeding that shady market and 2) believing that it has a special meaning.

I understand what you're saying about your friend. He had the best of intentions and thought that would make you happy. That's okay and I understand that most people are not as much into bands and artists like we are, so they may not get what's the difference or what's the big deal with having an idol. Other people may never understand why would someone ask for an artist to sign their bodies and then tattoo it.

To me, buying an autograph from Ebay (real or fake) it's like "buying love", going out with scorts, paying a prostitute, visiting Egypt via Google Street View, lol... Do I make any sense?

Yeah, I get what you're saying. It's like, I would love to see the Aurora Borealis one day, and looking at pretty pictures of it is definitely not the same thing (thankfully, there isn't a shady market surrounding such pictures).

If it could be 100 percent guaranteed though that all the autographs were legit, which obviously it can't, I can see why there would be a market for them. Some people will just never get to meet their favourite artist. It might even be impossible for them to do so. So, there may be a sentimental/emotional value to having an item that has that bit of a personal touch. That slightest of connections.

And I can't say that I am completely immune to it. I sure wouldn't say no to one of those guitars in Melissa's pictures, or winning an autographed item from the Nightrain.

Of course, it will never be the same as meeting the artist, having that time with them, having those memories forever and having something signed as a keepsake related to that moment. Nothing can possibly beat that.

It is a shame, though, that there are people who will take advantage of those who have never had such a moment, and who may never have such a moment. I can't even imagine coming up with the idea of creating fake autographs, misleading people in that way. I also can't imagine preying on artists to get autographs with the intention of selling them for profit. Humanity can be seriously unpleasant.

I have seen some artists who tackle the problem by selling autographed items on their websites. I have never used them, but as there is a demand, that seems to be a solution. I remember James Marsters at one point selling really nice signed pictures for $20 or $25, and doing something like that means those autograph hunters probably won't think it's worth it, as they can't charge a fortune, because there is a cheaper guaranteed legit option out there.

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34 minutes ago, Kittiara said:

Yeah, I get what you're saying. It's like, I would love to see the Aurora Borealis one day, and looking at pretty pictures of it is definitely not the same thing (thankfully, there isn't a shady market surrounding such pictures).

If it could be 100 percent guaranteed though that all the autographs were legit, which obviously it can't, I can see why there would be a market for them. Some people will just never get to meet their favourite artist. It might even be impossible for them to do so. So, there may be a sentimental/emotional value to having an item that has that bit of a personal touch. That slightest of connections.

And I can't say that I am completely immune to it. I sure wouldn't say no to one of those guitars in Melissa's pictures, or winning an autographed item from the Nightrain.

Of course, it will never be the same as meeting the artist, having that time with them, having those memories forever and having something signed as a keepsake related to that moment. Nothing can possibly beat that.

It is a shame, though, that there are people who will take advantage of those who have never had such a moment, and who may never have such a moment. I can't even imagine coming up with the idea of creating fake autographs, misleading people in that way. I also can't imagine preying on artists to get autographs with the intention of selling them for profit. Humanity can be seriously unpleasant.

I have seen some artists who tackle the problem by selling autographed items on their websites. I have never used them, but as there is a demand, that seems to be a solution. I remember James Marsters at one point selling really nice signed pictures for $20 or $25, and doing something like that means those autograph hunters probably won't think it's worth it, as they can't charge a fortune, because there is a cheaper guaranteed legit option out there.

I have no problem with the artists selling autographed items themselves. Or auctioning them. Guns N' Roses has done a lot of that, via Nightrain and auction events, like charity stuff. At least you know the money goes to help someone in need, not some guy with shady intentions.

I'm up for it. I have participated of the Nightrain contests. Never won anything, haha, but I know they wouldn't be scamming me and that there's not a mediator between that autograph and my beloved artist. That's a big difference to me.

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  • 4 months later...
On 6/15/2016 at 7:50 PM, stella said:

*shrug* Difference of opinion there. Someone isn't stupid just because they don't have the money or ability to get to a concert and spend hours waiting outside in a huge crowd for Axl. If someone's selling an autograph for even $100 it's a hell of a lot less than traveling to a show for some people.

 

I think eBay could stop a lot of it by taking more steps to keep fakes off the site, even if that means shutting down autograph sales altogether unless there's a clear and verifiable provenance. Like letting Christie's and the other auction houses list items, and also letting individuals list their own stuff for sale (like Robin did a few years back), but banning them from everyone else. There are too many people getting taken in.

good point. but IMO Ebay is just being greedy...

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