2006 Izzy Interview

[Swedish]

3 minutes ago, Good, Fuck'n, Night. said:

Really?

So why couldn't nu-guns create a good song?

Of course Izzy isn't responsible for everything produced by GnR, But GnR would have not been the same with out him.

Show me some examples of Individual efforts by the musicians you stated, the internet is full of quality music by Izzy, But Axl & co cant produce squat in 25 years. 

 

VR should have kept Izzy as the singer, I understand his reasoning behind wanting it as well. In one of the interviews on here Izzy says "Who are you going to get after Axl" when questioned about his decision to sing. He knows there is no replacing that. 14 years is a fine example of what VR could have produced with Izzy as the singer. 

 

 

 

 

I am not saying Izzy wasn't important for GN'R, he was. He wrote many of my favourite GN'R songs and the first JuJu Hounds album is great!

What I however am saying is that WTTJ and RQ would have been great songs without Izzy's input.

And why did you bring up NuGN'R? I was clearly talking about the fact that Axl, Slash and Duff can write good songs together without Izzy in the equation, last time I checked neither Slash or Duff was part of NuGN'R.

[Good, Fuck'n, Night.]

33 minutes ago, youngswedishvinyl said:

I am not saying Izzy wasn't important for GN'R, he was. He wrote many of my favourite GN'R songs and the first JuJu Hounds album is great!

What I however am saying is that WTTJ and RQ would have been great songs without Izzy's input.

And why did you bring up NuGN'R? I was clearly talking about the fact that Axl, Slash and Duff can write good songs together without Izzy in the equation, last time I checked neither Slash or Duff was part of NuGN'R.

You referenced nuguns members in your post as bring capable of helping create original GnR tunes had they been around then. 

Or I misunderstood your post. 

Edited October 3, 2016 by Good, Fuck'n, Night.

[Swedish]

5 minutes ago, Good, Fuck'n, Night. said:

You referenced nuguns members in your post as bring capable of helping create original GnR tunes had they been around then. 

Or I misunderstood your post. 

I think you misunderstood what I said, I meant that Izzy's role on WTTJ and RQ was as a guitarist, not a writer and thus those songs would've been as great even if for example Fortus had been the rhythm guitars for GN'R at the time.

[Darkenchantress]

According to Slash's bio, WTTJ was the first song they wrote all 5 of them as a whole. Slash played a riff that had showed to Axl once, Steven followed then Duff added the bass and in Slash words "Izzy provided the texture" so yes, all of them took part on the creation of the song.

[Swedish]

1 hour ago, Darkenchantress said:

According to Slash's bio, WTTJ was the first song they wrote all 5 of them as a whole. Slash played a riff that had showed to Axl once, Steven followed then Duff added the bass and in Slash words "Izzy provided the texture" so yes, all of them took part on the creation of the song.

I was as stated earlier using http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?/topic/24956-guns-n-roses-songwritting-credits/ as a source, if that's incorrect then I rest my case about that song!

With that being said Slash's biography has quite a bit of factual errors, like that GN'R's first song were in Seattle, mentioning wrong openers on various tours, dates of tour starts and such.

But my hypothetical "Izzyless GN'R album" would still be pretty darn good imo if it only contained: 

On 2016-09-27 at 10:35 AM, youngswedishvinyl said:

Breakdown, Yesterdays, Civil War, November Rain, Estranged, Dead Horse, The Garden, Don't Damn Me, Coma and Rocket Queen

 

[Blackstar]

From a 1988 band interview:

WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE

SLASH :  It's  "Welcome  to the jungle" - the perfect introduction to Guns N' Roses.
AXL :  I consider this song to be the most representative of what we're like.
IZZY :  It's about Hollywood streets; true to life.
SLASH :  That's the first song I had that Axl wrote lyrics to and helped me write.  I had the riff part of it.
AXL :  Yeah, I wrote the words in Seattle.  It's a big city, but at the same time it's still a small city compared to L.A. and the things that you're gonna learn.  It seemed a lot more rural up there.  I just wrote how it looked to me. If someone comes to town and they want to find something, they can find whatever they want.
SLASH :  It came across, I think it was, on the third take.  We did the whole album that way.  Second or third take.  That's where spontaneity comes from. If you don't get it by then, you've lost the feel of it.
STEVEN :  I like the cowbell part.

From what they said there it seems like it was a Slash-Axl song, but, as Duff said, with AFD it's difficult to determine who wrote what, as it was a collaborative effort.

Edited October 3, 2016 by Blackstar

[DieselDaisy]

The Appetite credits are tentative at best.

[ludurigan]

17 hours ago, youngswedishvinyl said:

I was as stated earlier using http://www.mygnrforum.com/index.php?/topic/24956-guns-n-roses-songwritting-credits/ as a source, if that's incorrect then I rest my case about that song!

With that being said Slash's biography has quite a bit of factual errors, like that GN'R's first song were in Seattle, mentioning wrong openers on various tours, dates of tour starts and such.

But my hypothetical "Izzyless GN'R album" would still be pretty darn good imo if it only contained: 

 

Oh, so thats the source of your knowledge about who wrote what in Guns n Roses!

  

Give me a fucking break

===

Reading all the books and interviews by the five guys and people around them, and also LISTENING to the songs, its pretty obvious that Izzy took part in writing every song from Appetite, including Welcome to the Jungle and Rocket Queen.

He may have minor contributions on those 2 particular songs, but it seems very likely that Izzy helped writing all the songs on Appetite

Why? Because they flow, because they have terrific dynamics, they go seamlessly from one part to the other, they have terrific crescendos and transitions and groove. Pretty much everything that Slash and Axl and Duff did without Izzy LACK dynamics, flow, groove etc

On songs like these two, Izzy may have helped with "texture" like Slash said, with arrangements, with little suggestions here and there, like a bridge here, a transition part there, a chord sequence, a crescendo etc etc etc...

Id be very surprised if that is not the case.

Slash has said more than once (If I remember correctly Izzy also has said similar stuff on interviews) that he and Izzy didnt really talk much when writing songs. They just figured out their parts until it sounded good

On this 1992 interview below, when Slash was somehow badtalking Izzy, saying they were not a team etc (years later he would acknowledge how Izzy was important to the sound of GNR), Slash clearly says that Izzy played things "his way"  

Slash, how do Gilby and Izzy differ, stylistically?
Even though the band always sounded cool, Izzy and I never sat down together and worked out guitar parts. We weren't really a team, in that sense. We would just jam, and he'd play things his way and I'd play things my way. And even though Gilby is essentially playing Izzy's parts, he adjusts them so there is more of a sense of unity - more of a sense that we are playing together. This isn't to put Izzy down in any way, it's just that Gilby and I have a different relationship.

full = http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/articles/showarticle.php?articleid=77

So basically even on a Slash song from Use Your Illusion what you PROBABLY have is Izzy writing and playing his own parts, and not been told by Slash what to play and how to play.

(Of course its also likely that Slash erased or re-recorded Izzys parts on UYI, but thats another story...)

Knowing all, I guess its VERY safe to say that there is no such a thing as a Izzy-less Guns n Roses song on Appetite and GNR Lies

Even a song like November Rain, which was basically entirely written by Axl, must have benefited enormously by Izzy (and Slash and Duff) ideas, playing, presence, and even their refusal to do certain things that Axl wanted to do at the time of the recording.

All you have to do to know how Guns n Roses would sound without Izzy (and Slash and Duff) is listen to the Axl Rose solo record

 

[Swedish]

8 minutes ago, ludurigan said:

Oh, so thats the source of your knowledge about who wrote what in Guns n Roses!

  

Give me a fucking break

===

Reading all the books and interviews by the five guys and people around them, and also LISTENING to the songs, its pretty obvious that Izzy took part in writing every song from Appetite, including Welcome to the Jungle and Rocket Queen.

He may have minor contributions on those 2 particular songs, but it seems very likely that Izzy helped writing all the songs on Appetite

Why? Because they flow, because they have terrific dynamics, they go seamlessly from one part to the other, they have terrific crescendos and transitions and groove. Pretty much everything that Slash and Axl and Duff did without Izzy LACK dynamics, flow, groove etc

On songs like these two, Izzy may have helped with "texture" like Slash said, with arrangements, with little suggestions here and there, like a bridge here, a transition part there, a chord sequence, a crescendo etc etc etc...

Id be very surprised if that is not the case.

Slash has said more than once (If I remember correctly Izzy also has said similar stuff on interviews) that he and Izzy didnt really talk much when writing songs. They just figured out their parts until it sounded good

On this 1992 interview below, when Slash was somehow badtalking Izzy, saying they were not a team etc (years later he would acknowledge how Izzy was important to the sound of GNR), Slash clearly says that Izzy played things "his way"  

Slash, how do Gilby and Izzy differ, stylistically?
Even though the band always sounded cool, Izzy and I never sat down together and worked out guitar parts. We weren't really a team, in that sense. We would just jam, and he'd play things his way and I'd play things my way. And even though Gilby is essentially playing Izzy's parts, he adjusts them so there is more of a sense of unity - more of a sense that we are playing together. This isn't to put Izzy down in any way, it's just that Gilby and I have a different relationship.

full = http://www.heretodaygonetohell.com/articles/showarticle.php?articleid=77

So basically even on a Slash song from Use Your Illusion what you PROBABLY have is Izzy writing and playing his own parts, and not been told by Slash what to play and how to play.

(Of course its also likely that Slash erased or re-recorded Izzys parts on UYI, but thats another story...)

Knowing all, I guess its VERY safe to say that there is no such a thing as a Izzy-less Guns n Roses song on Appetite and GNR Lies

Even a song like November Rain, which was basically entirely written by Axl, must have benefited enormously by Izzy (and Slash and Duff) ideas, playing, presence, and even their refusal to do certain things that Axl wanted to do at the time of the recording.

All you have to do to know how Guns n Roses would sound without Izzy (and Slash and Duff) is listen to the Axl Rose solo record

 

We're not even arguing about the same thing since you obviously can't understand what I'm trying to say.

I fucking love Izzy and the songs he has written with GN'R but he wasn't the only creative force in the band. Slash, Axl and Duff can definitely make a great record without him.

And yes, Izzy probably had a minor part of the writing on both RQ and WTTJ but that's because he was as part of the band and not as a song writer.

Both songs would probably be equally as good with Gilby or Fortus in the band instead at the time.

[ludurigan]

3 minutes ago, youngswedishvinyl said:

We're not even arguing about the same thing since you obviously can't understand what I'm trying to say.

I fucking love Izzy and the songs he has written with GN'R but he wasn't the only creative force in the band. Slash, Axl and Duff can definitely make a great record without him.

And yes, Izzy probably had a minor part of the writing on both RQ and WTTJ but that's because he was as part of the band and not as a song writer.

Both songs would probably be equally as good with Gilby or Fortus in the band instead at the time.

oh, thanks for saying that Izzy probably helped writing Jungle and Rocket Queen.

thats likely the case 

if i were you i'd do myself a favor and stop embarrassing myself by spreading misinformation on the internet.

id refrain myself from saying stuff like "izzy didnt help write Jungle and Rocket Queen" because thats probably CRAP misinformation

oh, and just for the record, only a fool would say that Izzy was the only creative force in the band. Guns n Roses is (was) the classic case where the group is greater than the sum of its parts

===

oh, and Jungle and Rocket Queen would be equally as good with Gilby or Fortus?

to say such a thing is laughable at best -- it shows how little you understand about what makes (made) Guns n Roses the best rock band ever

[Magnus Cavalerra]

It's seems that Izzy centric fans always want other GNR fans to acknowledge Izzy songwriting skills too compensate his inferiority when he got compared with Axl or Slash.

[Swedish]

14 minutes ago, ludurigan said:

 

id refrain myself from saying stuff like "izzy didnt help write Jungle and Rocket Queen" because thats probably CRAP misinformation

I never said that... I said that he did help but he wasn't one of the song writers.

We both can agree on the fact that Izzy wrote Patience, Slash helped with his solo and laying down chords and such.

Patience would also probably be equally as good if Tracii Guns or any other good lead guitarist would've played lead at the time in my opinion. 

Also my point is that Slash, Duff and Axl can write a good album without Izzy, not that he wasn't an important part of the band. I took RQ and WTTJ as examples since those were credited to other songs writers than Izzy when I looked up AFD song writers. I wasn't trying to discredit Stradlin'. Stop ignoring this fact.

[Slosh13]

Don't pay much attention to the credits because they don't tell you the complete story. It took five people to make those songs work. Why split hairs on shit like this?

[Darkenchantress]

OK, I'm gonna need to quote Duff himself again 

Quote

The perception in popular culture is that the singer and the lead guitar player are generally the artistic brain trust of any band. In our case, Izzy was probably the most significant force—without his initial vision and his songwriting cues, there would have been no Guns N’ Roses.” 
-(Duff McKagan, It’s So Easy and Other Lies) 

 

[Jane M.]

3 hours ago, Magnus Cavalerra said:

It's seems that Izzy centric fans always want other GNR fans to acknowledge Izzy songwriting skills too compensate his inferiority when he got compared with Axl or Slash.

Funniest post of this thread.

[Johnny Nightrain]

Speaking of "Jungle," and who contributed, in Duff's book, he said the main riff was re-worked from the verse riff in this song from his high school punk band:

http://www.kbdrecords.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/03-vains-the-fake-1980-usa.mp3

Edit: Not sure if the direct link works, so here's a link to the entire EP. It's the song "The Fake:"

http://www.kbdrecords.com/2008/06/04/vains-st-ep-7/

Edited October 4, 2016 by Johnny Nightrain

[Good, Fuck'n, Night.]

5 hours ago, ludurigan said:

oh, thanks for saying that Izzy probably helped writing Jungle and Rocket Queen.

thats likely the case 

if i were you i'd do myself a favor and stop embarrassing myself by spreading misinformation on the internet.

id refrain myself from saying stuff like "izzy didnt help write Jungle and Rocket Queen" because thats probably CRAP misinformation

oh, and just for the record, only a fool would say that Izzy was the only creative force in the band. Guns n Roses is (was) the classic case where the group is greater than the sum of its parts

===

oh, and Jungle and Rocket Queen would be equally as good with Gilby or Fortus?

to say such a thing is laughable at best -- it shows how little you understand about what makes (made) Guns n Roses the best rock band ever

I was suggesting the same to him a few pages back, but no, I was misunderstanding him. LOL 

[ArtTavana]

On 10/2/2016 at 0:02 AM, Johnny Nightrain said:

Art, I'll try to be vague here, but methinks you might know something about his next interview? Yes? No? If you're who I think, I'm the person who knows Izzy's mom. If this makes no sense, please ignore. Ha.

I'm just checking

[vloors]

On Friday, September 23, 2016 at 2:43 AM, ludurigan said:

I have learned during the last 25 years that GNR became a joke.

it all began on the Tracy and Roberta-era. what an embarrassing crap.

Then we had a brief (almost) rebirth in 1993 -- the band sounded good but izzy was still missing and it just doesnt sound like GNR without izzy.

Then we had 20 years of the absolutely embarrassing axl rose solo-era being presented and sold worldwide as GNR.

what a fucking waste.

I had zero hope that any of that would ever change.

but then came 2016. 

And then what was expected by many to be a GNR reunion became actually a Coins n Notes threeunion.

what could have been the best tour ever became the wildly successful "I Can Never Get Enough (And I Wont Share with Izzy)" tour

yeah, its nice that Slash, Duff and Axl back 

But it is not enough. This is basically a poor mans version of Tracy and Roberta Era, because Axl voice is in worse conditions and because these FOUR non-GNR people (specially this richard dude and this frank speedy fills dude) sound even worse than the Tracy and Roberta-era people

I dont care how nice and whatever these people are. These FOUR non-GNR people are fucking with the (great) sound that Slash, Duff and Axl are still able to produce on a live show.

I gave it a try (a lot of tries actually) on a lot of shows from this 2016 tour but it just sounds embarrassing.

its basically the same bullshit since izzy left

I wont waste my time listening to one more disgusting version of my favorite band until they remove the hired hands (specially this richard dude and this frank speedy fills dude) and bring izzy back

You do realise if Izzy came back he would just be a hired hand. The big 3 axl slash and duff own the guns n roses company and rights.

Adler and izzy both sold their shares so of course would not get paid anything near what the other 3 make.

Izzy wants the same as the other guys but he already sold his share so theres no way in hell he would or should get paid equally.

If he offered to buy back his share then maybe he would be paid the same but that hasnt happened. 

 

[DieselDaisy]

Guns N' Roses is Izzy's band and Axl, Slash and Duff should have been very grateful that Izzy permitted them to be in his band.

[RONIN]

2 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Guns N' Roses is Izzy's band and Axl, Slash and Duff should have been very grateful that Izzy permitted them to be in his band.

They should have begged Izzy to rejoin the band and given him whatever he wanted back in '95. You'd think they would have learned their lesson this time around.

[DieselDaisy]

2 minutes ago, RONIN said:

They should have begged Izzy to rejoin the band and given him whatever he wanted back in '95. You'd think they would have learned their lesson this time around.

I suppose through their chicanery they obtained the name of this band and proceeded to tour with a rubber inflatable 'rape monster' and Axl in white underpants playing ballads. They then released a covers album, an album so hideously terrible it is completely unlistenable. They then quarreled and broke up.

That is Guns N' Roses's post-Izzy history.

[Fitha_whiskey]

2 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Guns N' Roses is Izzy's band and Axl, Slash and Duff should have been very grateful that Izzy permitted them to be in his band.

No sir- they could've never cracked the JuJu Hounds immortal lineup!

Come on man. Let's keep a toe in the pool of reality... Giving Izzy credit is one thing. That statement is something else entirely...

 

[ludurigan]

5 hours ago, vloors said:

You do realise if Izzy came back he would just be a hired hand. The big 3 axl slash and duff own the guns n roses company and rights.

Adler and izzy both sold their shares so of course would not get paid anything near what the other 3 make.

Izzy wants the same as the other guys but he already sold his share so theres no way in hell he would or should get paid equally.

If he offered to buy back his share then maybe he would be paid the same but that hasnt happened. 

 

shares? rights? company? izzy didnt mention any of that

regardless who owns all that, they could have arranged an agreement to share the loot equally

according to izzy, they didnt want to do it

its simple as that

they are making millions, selling out stadiums, but thats not GNR

this is an embarrassing bad-sounding version of the greatest rock n roll band ever

[DieselDaisy]

5 hours ago, Fitha_whiskey said:

No sir- they could've never cracked the JuJu Hounds immortal lineup!

You got one thing correct.