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GNR Women's Discussion - Part 2

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Another information tht I feels like straight outta Fanfiction

 

I wonder if it's true, Did Izzy, Slash or even Duff know?

You know Izzy is Axl childhood Friend N' He taking care of Axl when Axl in L.A

Also Axl used to talk with Slash a lot about His life on early days

 

N' is it okay for Us to talk about it in here? Whether it's true or not maybe some media will use this againts Him, N' for media material purpose

Since there's the Guy from L.A Guns said it, maybe people will believe it 

You know altnation lurk this forum :smiley-confused2:

Edited by SerenityScorp

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On 14. 7. 2017 at 10:48 PM, purplestargirl said:

I didn't think Nightrain was still being brewed. I learn something every day.

Who knows maybe it's not and these are leftovers..real vintage!  :lol:

On 15. 7. 2017 at 10:31 PM, Lumikki said:

 

 

True :P It didn't exactly taste like I expected and not really like wine either lol, but it wasn't that bad actually.

It was drinkable and would quickly get me drunk if I had more of it. I can see why they liked it so much back in the day.

 

Yep, it is drinkable, gets you drunk easily and it was (well still is) cheap! Its a win win :rofl-lol:

16 hours ago, Andy14 said:

 

A huge thank you to @Lumikki, @Hejanne, @Sekh-met and @hair of the dog for enjoying the shows together. :wub: It was so much fun. Be it makng the banners (I hope Axl will remember it too), sniffing around their hotel or laughing our asses off. I enjoyed every second of it, both shows I attended far exceeded my expectations. I was injured, hungry, thirsty, tired, standing right in a rainstorm, everything hurt me, could hardly move afterwards but damn, it was so worth it, I'd do it all over again. I got all possible songs (except for Riff Raff) and Only Women Bleed as a nice bonus (yeah, Axl, I know you sang it only because I was actually bleeding at the Prague show :ph34r:).

I already miss those times, but this can't be the end, right? :nervous:They have to come back soon. I know that Axl loves Europe (and we love him). Moreover, he still ows us a party and a pen, we won't forget :max:.

Thank you too for great times and of course to @Hejanne and @Lumikki as well:wub:
I hate that this is always over so fast that I cannot even process it all in time hahah. Now I miss it and need som more! NOW! :bitchfight::heart:

I agree this cannot be the end! And he does owe us that party ...I am sure he is as sad as we are and plans to come back just to make sure that he can attend next time.:P

7 hours ago, killuridols said:

O

:headbang:

 

Next............................. NUMBER TWO....................... this award goes to three people who have worked their feet off to eat the ass throughout the years.
They have spent quite a chunk of money coming and going, from one country to another, standing in lines under the sun, under the rain, under the wind, for hours, day and night.
Hotels, airports, backdoors.... they became the shadow of the band and yes, they got many things: pictures, autographs, tattoos, posters, kisses and handshakes.

The ASS-EATING LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD goes to....................... *trumpets*................. Miss @Lumikki, Miss @Hejanne and Miss @Sekh-met!!!!

You ladies have achieved it all!! Congratulations!!!

1zyzrx5.png

 

j0i80o.png

 

2m4a92f.png

 

 

OMG OMG OMG!!! This is awesome! Thanks! :wow::wub::awesomeface:

Congrats to all the winners!
@Andy14 is the queen haha..well deserved...there was some hard work involved! :headbang:

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16 hours ago, Tori72 said:

... If Slash and Duff are out, GnR will be dead. Deader than dead because now fans will know what to miss even more. I can't see Izzy and Steven coming along

Axl is gonna hire Izzy and Steven and be the new 'big three'.... :P

And then finally we will get to see the AFD 5 ...lol

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12 hours ago, Frey said:

Another slightly related story I can think of is all 5 of them apparently hanging out at a gay bar/club quite frequently for the all you can eat-buffet. I remember one of them (either Duff or Steven I think) saying that the food was worth it, you just had to clench your butt cheeks together real tight :rolleyes:

I didnt know it was gay bar/club 

Where did You get this info?

12 hours ago, Frey said:

That's what it sounded to me like as well, yeah.And Izzy of course. Who was the only one actually around when these things most likely took place (if they took place at all). And Axl's oldest friend out of the 5 of them. If anyone would know, it would probably him most likely. And Izzy was (is?) close with Niven. So he might have told Niven at some point? Though I could see Slash drunkenly telling Niven too. Or someone outside the band. Niven seems to have been a pretty shady guy himself, he probably knew all kinds of people and had his sources.

 

Even tho its just an assumption, I really dont like if Izzy talk about the secret to Someone other than Band Members

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45 minutes ago, MillionsOfSpiders said:

Next time (if there is) I need to go to Central Europe for at least one show.. what a fun leg of the tour this was to follow :headbang:

If there is a next time, the Women's Thread must agree to go to a show together. Must! :rofl-lol: That would be so much fun. And then Axl cannot only answer with a side-eye to our invitation :awesomeface:

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4 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Axl will tweet either tomorrow or on Wednesday :ph34r:

While We wait maybe @Andy14 Can make Her fb masterpiece again:ph34r:

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Okay, lots of stuff I want to comment on, but I need to get going, so for now I'm just gonna say...

 

16 hours ago, killuridols said:

 

 

 

Next............................. NUMBER TWO....................... this award goes to three people who have worked their feet off to eat the ass throughout the years.
They have spent quite a chunk of money coming and going, from one country to another, standing in lines under the sun, under the rain, under the wind, for hours, day and night.
Hotels, airports, backdoors.... they became the shadow of the band and yes, they got many things: pictures, autographs, tattoos, posters, kisses and handshakes.

The ASS-EATING LIFETIME ACHIEVEMENT AWARD goes to....................... *trumpets*................. Miss @Lumikki, Miss @Hejanne and Miss @Sekh-met!!!!

You ladies have achieved it all!! Congratulations!!!

1zyzrx5.png

:headbang:

Ahahaha :lol::rofl-lol::rofl-lol:

Thank you! :wub::drool:

Like @Andy14, I also am a loser who never wins anything, so I greatly appreciate this award :rofl-lol::wub:

And I'm very happy to share it with all the other awesome people who got one (even if some of them are a tad confused :rofl-lol:).

I'm so glad we all had a great time during this European leg of the tour.

It truly was special :heart:

 

 

 

 

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On 2017-07-16 at 9:05 AM, Frey said:

 

There you go (I put in under a spoiler tag, so anyone who doesn't wanna read some pretty nasty comments about Axl can avoid reading them):

  Reveal hidden contents

http://sleazeroxx.com/original-l-a-guns-vocalist-michael-jagosz-passes-away/

 

Original L.A. Guns vocalist Michael Jagosz passed away on March 9th at the age of 48.

Jagosz fronted L.A Guns during their formative years. The singer first performed with the band in 1983, eventually being replaced by Axl Rose while serving a week long sentence in the county jail after a bar fight. Jagosz would in turn replace Rose and together L.A Guns released a four song EP entitled ‘Collector’s Edition No. 1’ in 1985 containing the songs “Don’t Love Me”, “When Dreams Don’t Follow Through”, “It’s Not True”, and “Something Heavy” — the tracks would eventually resurface as a bonus disc on the 2004 release ‘Hollywood Raw: The Original Sessions’.

No details have emerged about the cause of death, but the final post on Jagosz’ Facebook page is the cryptic “I’m drowning.”

L.A. Guns founder Tracii Guns remembered Jagosz fondly by saying, “the last time I hung out with Mike Jagosz was a few years ago at The Venice Beach Music Fest and we had a lot of laughs that day and that’s how I will remember him with that giant smile! I hope peace and Mike have found each other. We recorded the first L.A. Guns EP together at 18 years old which both of our first real studio experience. He is also the first singer I ever wrote and performed with. I always wished he could find a great metal band to front and why that didn’t happen is beyond my scope of understanding. He was very influenced by UFO , Dio and Ian Gillan. He had the killer metal pipes!” Sylent Storm member Jym Harris also confirmed the death. “We had our ‘differences’ over the years but last time I talked to him (on February 28th) he was determined to make good with me about everything. I had no idea he was dying. Makes sense now. RIP my friend, you will be missed.”

In a 2011 interview with the Proud2BeLoud blog Jagosz lashed out at Axl Rose. “To tell you the Jesus Christ truth… William Bailey was only in the group for two fuckin weeks. I tried to give him vocal lessons… but, he sucked. Voted “least likely to ever make it”. He always was a pathetic sub-human being. He lived at my parent’s house for over six months… sponging off us and doing heroin. What a little fag*ot. Come to find out, he was a male-fag*ot prostitute at the time — L-O-S-E-R. He sold his asshole to gay men for money. But, he made 70 million. He was a real piece of work, he was/is a parasite. A real sack of shit.”

In the same interview Jagosz had kinder words for former bandmate Tracii Guns. “Tracii tried to save me from getting arrested. I was drunk, wanting to drive… he hid my keys. I was actually out of the group just after doing the EP. Tracii Guns was a true brother. Gotta love him. Successor to Randy’s throne.” When asked what he thought of the direction L.A Guns would eventually take Jagosz continued, “Hated it at first. We were metal, the 3-bar chord shit killed me. I thought Tracii was wayyyyyyyyy too talented to do that shit. Looking back though, he went commercial to sell. God bless Tracii, he saw what we couldn’t.”

Jagosz, born on December 13, 1965, is survived by his mother Rosa Caceres Jagosz, son Michael Jeffrey Jagosz and brother David Jagosz. A private memorial is planned for April 1, 2014.

It's worse than I remembered actually :confused:

Thoughts?

Obviously, the guy seems like a complete douchebag. I mean... "Male-fag*ot prostitute"? "Pathetic sub-human"? Really?! :facepalm:

Usually, I wouldn't take anyone who talks like that seriously anyway, but I just can't figure out why he hates Axl so much. It's not like Axl stole his place in L.A. Guns and then went on to become super successfull with them.

Is he just jealous because Axl made it big and he didn't? Or still mad about the time Axl lived with his family? It's strange to me that the guy could still be so bitter about Axl "sponging off of his family for six months" about three decades later (and why didn't they just kick him out if they didn't like having him around?).

Is he actually telling the truth or did he just try to come up with the most damaging thing he could say about another man in his mind (i.e. letting yourself get fucked by other guys for money)?

For what it's worth, @killuridols says she knows of another guy who knew Axl back then who apparently made the same claims about him. I don't know the details about that one though, maybe she can tell us if they match up with what Mr. Jagosz was claiming here.

 

 

 

 

 

I think the guy was just wasted and venting, and probably drank himself to death.

I have questioned whether Axl was gay or bi myself, but I don't believe he ever prostituted himself.  Steven on the other hand.......

 

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So they're saying here that The Kills will be opening for GnR at the Apollo show on Thursday.  The return of Allison Mosshart.  I'm surprised there's an opener at all, and it makes me even less hopeful of much special happening regarding the AFD anniversary.  What do you all think?  

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1 hour ago, triad said:

So they're saying here that The Kills will be opening for GnR at the Apollo show on Thursday.  The return of Allison Mosshart.  I'm surprised there's an opener at all, and it makes me even less hopeful of much special happening regarding the AFD anniversary.  What do you all think?  

ugh... you're probably right... :shrugs:

I guess most people (the invited ones and the ones who will be watching from the distance) DO expect a surprise of that kind. I don't think there's one single person NOT THINKING that it would be nice to see the AFD5.

So when the curtain opens and we get to see Frank and Fortus and Melissa.............. doble disappoinment :unsure: and facepalm :facepalm:, that's what's gonna happen.

 

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Do we know, is there going to be a livestream? Of will we be dependent on facebook live stream and periscope?

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40 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

Do we know, is there going to be a livestream? Of will we be dependent on facebook live stream and periscope?

lol, we'd be really lucky if we get any of that.

Probably they will wipe their phones off :lol:

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44 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

Do we know, is there going to be a livestream? Of will we be dependent on facebook live stream and periscope?

Gibbo is recording the show as it's streamed on the radio and will post it here [the forum not the W/T;)]

7 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Probably they will wipe their phones off :lol:

or put them in bags like the Troubadour

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2 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

Gibbo is recording the show as it's streamed on the radio and will post it here [the forum not the W/T;)]

or put them in bags like the Troubadour

Good.

Can we hear the radio or is it for USA citizens only? :rolleyes:

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3 minutes ago, killuridols said:

Good.

Can we hear the radio or is it for USA citizens only? :rolleyes:

only USA i think,you can sign up with fake address and stuff, it's in one of the Apollo threads, Gibbo says how to do it.

Way too complicated for me :lol: i'll just read about it or wait until he

puts the stream up. 

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4 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

only USA i think,you can sign up with fake address and stuff, it's in one of the Apollo threads, Gibbo says how to do it.

Way too complicated for me :lol: i'll just read about it or wait until he

puts the stream up. 

Ha, no fuckin' way..

My address will be L at ig oCany..... ahhhhhhhh :ph34r::rofl-lol:

Edited by killuridols

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They said NEXT TIME....please be it true, hope it's not the new "soon is the word" :max::nervous:

 

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18 hours ago, KiraMPD said:

My thoughts exactly. I find it unlikely that it came from Duff or Slash but Izzy has always been a lot more straight forward about shit like that. I have a few theories about the types of shenanigans Izzy and Axl might have got upto but I won't go into it now...

Yeah, Izzy's always been very straightforward about Axl issues. "Never got no pussy in high school" comes to mind. :P:facepalm:

And please feel free to share your theories about Izzy and Axl. This thread clearly is all about boundless speculation and theorizing anyway :lol:

 

6 hours ago, SerenityScorp said:

I didnt know it was gay bar/club 

Where did You get this info?

Even tho its just an assumption, I really dont like if Izzy talk about the secret to Someone other than Band Members

I must have gotten this story from this thread. Where else would I have learned something like this from? :lol:

And I tend to agree, I don't personally like the idea of Izzy of blabbing about stuff like that to other people either, but he's done it before and he was (or still is?) close with Niven, for reasons I can't really understand, so I do think it's a possibility at least.

17 hours ago, killuridols said:

Axl called people "n**** & fa*****" in a song and recorded it for eternity.

He recorded another song insulting media guys with really awful stuff like "your daddy gets more p**** than you" :facepalm:

And I could paste the long vomitive shit he typed to a lady of this forum, in the most mysoginist way that can be...... do you want me to link it?

No, you don't want me to do that. :rolleyes:

You know what my problem is with the people that get mad at this guy and dismiss what he says because he said it in that harsh way?
That they are all hypocritical fucks.

I'm not talking about you especifically but there are people who I've seen posting vulgarities, obscenities and all kind of nasty shit about different kind of people (forum members or musicians) yet they have the nerve to say this guy is not credible because he chose such words.

And.... focusing on the envelope of words, instead of the concept and information he's giving, it is for people who cannot see past the superficial side of things.

With this I'm not saying Jagosz is untouchable or that he should be trusted 100%. No, of course every person has the right to believe him or not, but when the reasons for not believing him derive from disliking his rethoric.... ok, the bar is set too low for me.

And he was widely called out and criticized for the OIAM lyrics or the forum rant too (rightly so). GITR lyrics are just juvenile and ridiculous, same as fuckhead.

But anyway, using vulgar language and a string of insults like Jagosz did here will automatically disqualify an opinion in many people's eyes (same goes for Axl when he does that). Personally, it doesn't necessarily make me disregard his words, because people often speak the truth in their anger. Also the way he says some things make me think there is some truth to what he says. The bit about Axl staying with his famiy "for over six months" for example. It's unlikely to me someone would come up with a concrete time frame like that on the spot when making up a lie.

17 hours ago, killuridols said:

Now that you mention this..... Something came to my mind and that is how paranoid Axl could have been about doing that in the 80's with all the talk about gay people having AIDS, "spreading a fucking disease" and what not.

This is another reason why I think he didn't do it further 1983.

Yes, good point. I remember reading that in the early 80s, AIDS wasn't called AIDS yet, but was referred to as "gay cancer" and stuff like that and not much was understood or known about it.

If all Axl knew was that there was a disease out there that mainly seemed to kill men who had sex with other men, he might have been hella paranoid about it all and it might have led to the "fa**ts spreading some fucking disease" line.

 

 

 

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19 hours ago, Blackstar said:

The guy's venomous hatred for Axl certainly takes away from his credibility. Moreover, his description of Axl doesn't match with the way other musicians (Tracii Guns, Chris Weber, Kevin Lawrence etc) who knew him at about the same period have described him (of course I'm talking only about things said in public and not stories/rumours/hearsay going around or people have shared with fans etc, which I have no idea about). It's not impossible, however, that there's some truth to what he says, especially if there are also "rumours".

As for where the hatred comes from, the first logical assumption that can be made (again, being in speculation territory) is jealousy (like @Lumikki and @Rocketqueen76 said) because a guy whom Jagosz probably saw as a nobody from Indiana and a bad singer (from what he says it seems that he considered anything other than heavy metal-y technical singing bad) made it and he didn't. But besides that, there are a couple of other possible reasons I can think of.

Another musician, this guy Nadir from the band London, said in an interview that Axl had fucked his girlfriend but he didn't want to say more about it (according to Tracii Guns there was some kind of beef between this guy and Axl and Axl beat him up in the end). I think I've read 1-2 other stories like that, and we also know that Axl did this with Slash's girlfriend too. As much as "dispensable" girlfriends were for these guys, this thing would surely hurt their male pride. And if Jagosz had provided Axl a place to stay and Axl returned the favour with something like this, it's expected that he would've held grudge; and, if there's truth in the part about Axl selling himself to guys for money, then learning (supposing that he heard about it later) that the guy who had taken his girlfriend was a "fag" would make it even harder to bear.

Another thing is that, when GnR made it, probably many people that knew them before/were in bands with them approached them asking for favours of any kind, from money to pushing their demos to the label or have their bands open for them. So if the guy expected something from Axl (because he thought Axl owed him) and didn't get it, maybe it explains the bitterness to an extent.

The bolded is  a good point and probably one of the most likely scenarios that happened. Some little "fag" from Indiana fucking his girlfriend would wound the pride of a guy like that and then that same guy also actually making it big in the business while he himself never amounted to anything... I could see that being enough to piss off a guy who tends to hold grudges. Though it's still baffling to me anyone would hold grudges for three decades. But then again, I never could understand Axl's and Slash's drama either on a personal/emotional level and always thought they were being ridiculous.

Jagosz asking for favors of Axl is a good guess too. I also agree about Jagosz' impression of Axl being very different from what other people (like Chris Weber) at the time have said about him. They tend to describe him as a nice, shy and soft-spoken guy who wasn't doing hard drugs iirc.

 

16 hours ago, Blackstar said:

A note on Rocket Queen lyrics and Alan Niven, since it's brought up:

It is known that Axl played with perspectives and that, according to himself, the first part is from Barbi's POV and the second from his own.

So the "speaker" in the main part is Barbi, a female character; and the chorus is from the same perspective (it makes more sense anyway) and it's actually "here I am, (I'm) your Rocket Queen", but because it would sound weird coming from a guy's mouth (let alone the misunderstanding that it'd cause), he played with the similar sound of "and you're a Rocket Queen".

I've always found the roles in the song interesting: Barbi, the woman in the song, is the wild one, and Axl, the guy in the song, is the sweet one.

Now, if and how much Axl, as the person who wrote the lyrics, identifies with the female character he impersonates, is open to speculation... (probably Alan Niven found it odd that a guy wrote a song from the perspective of a woman).

I was aware of the different POVs used, but I do agree the roles in the song are interesting.

Who knows, maybe Alan Niven (who is most likely aware of the different POVs as well) has trouble separating Axl from the lyrics of the song because he's singing it (and Niven may or may not know certain things about Axl which tend to fit with the "Barbi" POV bits), which might have contributed to his weird comments in that interview.

 

16 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Marc Canter's account, from his book:

Axl and I went down to the West Hollywood Sheriff’s Department to bail Slash out. By the time we arrived, Slash had already been shipped off to the L.A. County jail. So we headed downtown. On the way we picked up some Tommyburgers and listened to the demos. When we arrived at the jail to post Slash’s $178 bail, one of the officers noticed the medallion in the shape of a tiny gun hanging around Axl’s neck. Evidently alarmed at the threat posed by Axl’s necklace, the officer threw him up against the wall and frisked him. Finding no additional threatening objects, he let Axl go, and we went back to my car and waited about five hours for Slash to be released.

I don't know what value $178 had in the mid 80s, but it doesn't seem to me like a large sum of money. I suppose it wasn't so difficult for Axl and Marc to do some kind of fundraising among their friends/people they knew and collect that bail money.

I think both scenarios are possible, ie. Niven talking out of his arse (either to indirectly diss Axl or to defend him) or having something more specific in mind  he'd heard from Izzy or someone else, but I'm inclined to believe it's the former.

I regards to people Axl might have talked to/shared things like that with (if these stories are true of course, which we have no proof for): Pamela Manning has said that Axl had opened to her about things and that he has secrets the public doesn't know. These "secrets" could either have to do with his family (for example Tom Zutaut's story about his stepfather) or stories like the one we're now discussing. I somehow see Axl feeling more comfortable to share this kind of secrets with a woman like Pamela than with a guy friend.

 

Okay, $178 doesn't seem that much. I always imagined it was more.

According to online calculators, $178 back then would equal around $400 today (or slightly more, depending on the year and calculator you use).

Which is a more significant amount, but still not necessarily something that would have given Axl no other choice than to sell himself. As you said, it seems doable to scrounge up that kind of money by fundraising, stealing from strippers' purses etc.

Good point about about Pamela Manning, I had completely forgotten she'd said that.

I agree that the "secrets" Axl told her about are likely the kind of thing you are suggesting- either Tom Zutaut type events or the kind of thing we're discussing now.

Though both of these things (assuming for a moment they're both true) might actually be connected; iirc there's a much higher incidence of people who have suffered sexual abuse in their childhoods or other points in their life among people who engange in prostitution than in the general population. One often sets the course for the other, unfortunately.

(About Axl feeling more comfortable sharing this kind of thing with a woman rather than a guy friend... It depends, I guess. Back when I was a kid and some guy tried to molest me, I first told my dad and my best buddy at the time. Even young as I was back then, telling my mom or sisters somehow felt more awkward to me. Something to do with not wanting to look like less of man in front of a woman probably, I don't know. Though in Axl's case, and given the super-macho and sexist environment he was in at the time, I could see it being easier to talk to a woman. Less judgement there most likely and possibly also a lot of understanding from personal experience.)

 

 

 

 

 

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