Why watching MMA strips human dignity ?

[oldnews]

 

 

[AtariLegend]

In response to the title, could say that about voting for the Tories.

[oldnews]

2 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

So according to this guy Jesus choosing to get nailed to wooden posts because he thought he was saving the world is a beautiful thing but trained fighters fighting each other now and then on TV is a big no-no. I mean, I'm a 6'6" man let's say I allow a small psychotic child to stab me to death because I think I'm saving the world. Is that beautiful? No. It's fucking mental lol.

he's very popular with the ladies, wasted but there you go

[Gracii Guns]

Oh dear. 

While I agree that beating up another person for entertainment isn't a dignifying pastime, I disagree that we should all know how to fight, and know how to use a gun for if the eventuality comes. That part is certainly his opinion and not the church's. 

[DieselDaisy]

I've never ever watched it. It seems to be bigger in the United States than over here in the United Kingdom.

[soon]

As far as I can see MMA is doing things that kill people but hoping it doesnt kill them.  A guy was killed in the cage about a month ago in Canada - a father, husband and grade 4 teacher.  I find it vile.  

And "turn the other cheek" as unpacked by Biblical scholar Walter Wink is a deeply political and revolutionary act.  Not an act of docility. 

In the Roman Empire a Centurion was legally allowed to back hand an occupied person.  There would be no follow up or reporting - they could simply do this.  Both because many are right handed and because the left hand was used to wipe ones butt in a pre-sanitary time; the left hand was not used.  Offering someone your left hand meant you had no class and were maybe a bit off.  And as oppressive a Romans were, they did value the rule of law and didnt allow Centurions to rub fecal matter on occupied peoples faces.  So if an occupied person like Jesus was back handed by Centurion, it would be on the right cheek.  If you turn the cheek it invites the Centurion to either back hand you with left hand or close fist punch you with right; you can not back hand both cheeks with same hand.  

The premise is to utilize the hierarchy of the oppressor against itself.  Would the Centurion break the law and risk loosing their lucrative job?  And if not wouldn't those occupied people around you feel emboldened when the Centurion walked away as you starred them down?  

Similar theory behind "walk the extra mile" and "give your cloak too"

 

Disclaimer: People are certainly free to understand scripture in other ways!

Edited August 12, 2017 by soon

[soon]

11 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

What the fuck are you on about? lol

if you mean about the turning cheek stuff, sometimes to understand the mechanics, its easiest to just act it out! lol

edit: including that first one of you have to go at least 2 days wiping butt with left hand!  

Edited August 1, 2017 by soon

[DieselDaisy]

7 hours ago, soon said:

As far as I can see MMA is doing things that kill people but hoping it doesnt kill them.  A guy was killed in the cage about a month ago in Canada - a father, husband and grade 4 teacher.  I find it vile.  

And "turn the other cheek" as unpacked by Biblical scholar Walter Wink is a deeply political and revolutionary act.  Not an act of docility. 

In the Roman Empire a Centurion was legally allowed to back hand an occupied person.  There would be no follow up or reporting - they could simply do this.  Both because many are right handed and because the left hand was used to wipe ones butt in a pre-sanitary time; the left hand was not used.  Offering someone your left hand meant you had no class and were maybe a bit off.  And as oppressive a Romans were, they did value the rule of law and didnt allow Centurions to rub fecal matter on occupied peoples faces.  So if an occupied person like Jesus was back handed by Centurion, it would be on the right cheek.  If you turn the cheek it invites the Centurion to either back hand you with left hand or close fist punch you with right; you can not back hand both cheeks with high hand.  

The premise is to utilize the hierarchy of the oppressor against itself.  Would the Centurion break the law and risk loosing their lucrative job?  And if not wouldn't those occupied people around you feel emboldened when the Centurion walked away as you starred them down?  

Similar theory behind "walk the extra mile" and "give your cloak too"

 

Disclaimer: People are certainly free to understand scripture in other ways!

Hence the word 'sinister' from 'sinestra' (Latin, left-hand).

[oldnews]

3 hours ago, DieselDaisy said:

Hence the word 'sinister' from 'sinestra' (Latin, left-hand).

his version of 'My Way' is the definitive version

[The Glow Inc.]

The problem with Christianity's "turn the other cheek" is that, the way it is taught, it is incompatible with having healthy boundaries.

Turning the other cheek deliberately when you have healthy boundaries is making a powerful statement.

Turning the other cheek because it is the only thing you ever learned and because you don't value yourself enough is pretty weak.

As for MMA, I'd say most people don't enjoy it mainly for the bloodbath but because of the technical display, for the excitement of not knowing who between these two incredible athletes is going to win beforehand and how he or she is going to do it.

Edited August 2, 2017 by The Glow Inc.

[soon]

12 hours ago, oldnews said:

his version of 'My Way' is the definitive version

this is pure gold! hahaha!

[AxlisOld]

[Len Cnut]

I think he's right to a point, it does.  So does boxing.  Watching two men knock the fuckin' shit out of each other is a pretty ugly thing and it does strip human dignity.  Not so much of the participants but the people that patronise it, yeah, definitely.  Like they say about boxing, the only two honest men are the ones in the ring.  It's a fuckin' ugly thing on the one hand, a brutal thing and a grim thing, that people enjoying seeing men, and young men mostly, knock the fuckin' shit out of each other in the ring, end up all fuckin' done in the head for our entertainment, it does fuckin' say something about us as a species.

I could argue a similar case for religion also.  

Edited August 9, 2017 by Len Cnut

[Nicklord]

1 hour ago, Len Cnut said:

I think he's right to a point, it does.  So does boxing.  Watching two men knock the fuckin' shit out of each other is a pretty ugly thing and it does strip human dignity.  Not so much of the participants but the people that patronise it, yeah, definitely.  Like they say about boxing, the only two honest men are the ones in the ring.  It's a fuckin' ugly thing on the one hand, a brutal thing and a grim thing, that people enjoying seeing men, and young men mostly, knock the fuckin' shit out of each other in the ring, end up all fuckin' done in the head for our entertainment, it does fuckin' say something about us as a species.

I could argue a similar case for religion also.  

Watching PROS fight is not really about that. It's like any other sport. Watching 2 men fight in the street for amusement is different.

[Len Cnut]

6 hours ago, Nicklord said:

Watching PROS fight is not really about that. It's like any other sport. Watching 2 men fight in the street for amusement is different.

Two men fighting in the street rarely amounts to a prolonged sustained attack over what can be up to 38 minutes.  Ask Gerald Mcllelans family, or Nick Blackwells or Paul Ingles or Michael Watsons.

[axlslash]

On 8/1/2017 at 6:15 PM, soon said:

As far as I can see MMA is doing things that kill people but hoping it doesnt kill them.  

I'm a marathon runner. Know where marathons come from? A dude once ran from Marathon to Athens, then died. So, once a year, I do a thing that kills people and hope it doesn't kill me. I train to make it as safe as possible, but that doesn't change what I'm doing or what it can do. Does your interpretation of scripture categorically bar marathon running? What about half marathons? 10K races? 5Ks? Hell, any sport *can* kill you, are any OK?

Not trying to troll or be a dick here. These are genuine questions, and I'm curious how much risk you see as acceptable before something gets the divine ban. 

[soon]

9 hours ago, axlslash said:

I'm a marathon runner. Know where marathons come from? A dude once ran from Marathon to Athens, then died. So, once a year, I do a thing that kills people and hope it doesn't kill me. I train to make it as safe as possible, but that doesn't change what I'm doing or what it can do. Does your interpretation of scripture categorically bar marathon running? What about half marathons? 10K races? 5Ks? Hell, any sport *can* kill you, are any OK?

Not trying to troll or be a dick here. These are genuine questions, and I'm curious how much risk you see as acceptable before something gets the divine ban. 

I appreciate you asking.  I actually wouldn't be tempted to watch another vid by this dude, just to be clear on that off the top.

My first sentences are about MMA and the remainder are about scripture. They are two separate thoughts in response to two separate aspects of the video.  I can see how they can appear as one statement.  That was not my intention.  I just had two thoughts on the video.

I was first giving my personal take on MMA.  Then I moved on to addressing my disagreement with the dude in video about his reading of 'turn the other cheek.'  

I should say that my take on Scriptural exegesis is informed by Anabaptist tradition and Post-Liberal Theology (also called Narrative theology).  Both are considered Christio-Centric.  Meaning I put Christ at the centre of all scripture; comparing and contrasting and using the lens of Christ when reading all Scripture.* 

Scripture, to me, is a key to a standing offer towards liberation.  Therefore even if the language of 'law' is used, I see just a piece of wisdom that, taken as a whole with the rest of the document, offers freedom.  "Freedom" in the way suggested within Christs teachings, perhaps not as defined outside of that.  So, all this to say that a legalistic application of a piece of Scripture (which is clearly not related to MMA in 2017), isn't something that Id be prepared to do.  Legalism and doctrinal-dogmatic-whack-a-mole certainly exists in many corners of organized Christianity, but is not a common denominator of the faith.

I actually think the reading of 'turn the other cheek' that I offered is bad ass.  I also thought it would appeal to MMA enthusiasts more then it has.  Its about using power in a Kung Fu, Judo or Aikido way to use the momentum of an assault against the perpetrator and its about standing ones ground, using strategy and mainly: taking a punch and still winning.

Now that we've addressed my theological/ life praxis it may disappoint that my take on the MMA being "doing things that kill people and hoping that they dont die" isnt overly based in Christian tradition.  Simply that you can train for a marathon and then it likely wont kill you.  You cannot however train yourself to have a brain that cannot be injured.  In marathon you are training the body and the technique.  In MMA one can train to protect the brain - with very great skill and technique indeed - but one can not physically condition the brain to resist injury.  The goal is a tap out or a knock out, so I stand by that since blows to the brain are potentially fatal and they are one of two goals in the sport that my statement still rings true to me.

Btw, when's your next Marathon?  Sounds fun and must be deeply rewarding! 

 

*  (Makes me sound pious, Im sure.  While I do profess a faith, Im simply interested in Theology and take an active interest in it.  What I learn and see as true isnt necessarily reflective of the choices and situations I find myself in as a sinner.)

Edited August 11, 2017 by soon
spelling and grammer

[Ace Nova]

This priest does not speak for the Catholic Church nor for Christianity...it's his personal opinion.

Since it his his personal opinion, I won't get into too many specifics but he contradicts himself by saying he feels that martial arts as the art form/ skill is honorable, etc but on the other hand martial arts as entertainment strips human dignity.  They are one and the same and it's a shame a person in his position would just jump on a stereotype instead of researching and studying the subject before giving out such a blanket and factually incorrect statement/opinion. Smh. 

 

Edited August 10, 2017 by Kasanova King

[Ace Nova]

..

 

Edited August 10, 2017 by Kasanova King
Duplicate post

[DieselDaisy]

2 hours ago, axlslash said:

I'm a marathon runner. Know where marathons come from? A dude once ran from Marathon to Athens, then died. So, once a year, I do a thing that kills people and hope it doesn't kill me. I train to make it as safe as possible, but that doesn't change what I'm doing or what it can do. Does your interpretation of scripture categorically bar marathon running? What about half marathons? 10K races? 5Ks? Hell, any sport *can* kill you, are any OK?

Not trying to troll or be a dick here. These are genuine questions, and I'm curious how much risk you see as acceptable before something gets the divine ban. 

Not to mention cricket and Phillip Hughes, killed by a bouncer in 2014.

[janrichmond]

@DieselDaisy They have bouncers at cricket matches??

ok it was a ball.Sad though.

Edited August 10, 2017 by janrichmond
googled stuff

[DieselDaisy]

58 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

@DieselDaisy They have bouncers at cricket matches??

ok it was a ball.Sad though.

Oh dear. Oh dear oh dear oh dear. Less said about the better.

[janrichmond]

Just now, DieselDaisy said:

Oh dear. Oh dear oh dear oh dear. Less said about the better.

Sorry hun. 

[DieselDaisy]

12 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

Sorry hun. 

We'll have to educate you on cricketing lingo. I'll throw forward some of my own favourites, the last two of which are Australianisms,

Cow corner

Silly point

Plum

Daisy cutter

Googly

Doosra

Salmon (trout)

Michelle (Pfeiffer)

Any questions?

[janrichmond]

3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

We'll have to educate you on cricketing lingo. I'll throw forward some of my own favourites, the last two of which are Australianisms,

Cow corner

Silly point

Plum

Daisy cutter

Googly

Doosra

Salmon (trout)

Michelle (Pfeiffer)

Any questions?

i've heard of a googly but the rest umm are they real or you taking the piss?