Silverburst80 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Popularity- Elvis or Beatles Influence- Black Sabbath Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, Silverburst80 said: Popularity- Elvis or Beatles Influence- Black Sabbath Black Sabbath in terms of influence over Elvis or The Beatles? Its probably worth pointing out at this point that Ozzy claims The Beatles as a massive influence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Len Cnut said: Black Sabbath in terms of influence over Elvis or The Beatles? Its probably worth pointing out at this point that Ozzy claims The Beatles as a massive influence. Ozzys favourite band is the Beatles, Black Sabbath dont sound anything like them though mate they created a whole new sound .Ozzy don't sing like Lennon or Cartny and Iommi sure as hell don't play the guitar like Harrison...they are originals. Kinda like comparing Sugar Hill to Wu Tang. Edited August 17, 2017 by Silverburst80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Len Cnut said: Elvises one was a fuckin' belter really, difficult to put anyone above it. The tunes on that are just fuckin' bang on. Every last track is a classic. And is there a historically more important album ever? Speaking here about post war popular music. I can't fuckin' think of one. From the moment in landed it changed the fuckin' game entirely and nothing was ever the same again. Without it there would've been no rock n roll as we know it (obviously black people made it and all that but King whiteboy here at least deserves the credit for popularising it out of the fuckin' stratosphere), No Beatles, No Stones, No Who, no cultural revolution, there wouldn't've been shit. There's a school of thought that even says that without this album literature would've been a stronger influential force and counter-culture would've remained a minority thing instead of almost like a mainstream cultural movement thing, which is an odd idea in and of itself, counter-culture as mainstream. So yeah, Elvises debut all day long and twice on Sundays. And he never made nothing quite like it again. Elvis albums were a fuckin' joke really, all sort cash-grabbey things, it was by sheer force of talent and what he did on individual songs that elevates them but as collections of songs they are a fuckin' mess. That first album, the Sun Sessions...and then after that you've gotta really have some kinda fuckin' patience and commitment to dig through those things. Not that there isn't great work on a great many of them but i mean as like, cohesive works and that. Then again the album album album weren't really a thing in them days sooo... Elvis is Back! and From Elvis in Memphis are classics. I also like Elvis and Elvis Country also (notice the common denominator?). The best soundtracks are Loving You and King Creole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Silverburst80 said: Ozzys favourite band is the Beatles, Black Sabbath dont sound anything like them though mate they created a whole new sound .Ozzy don't sing like Lennon or Cartny and Iommi sure as hell don't play the guitar like Harrison...they are originals. Kinda like comparing Sugar Hill to Wu Tang. Theres no way on earth Sabbath are more influential than The Beatles or Elvis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibson87 Posted August 17, 2017 Author Share Posted August 17, 2017 35 minutes ago, Len Cnut said: Theres no way on earth Sabbath are more influential than The Beatles or Elvis. Agreed. I don't dive that much into early rock and roll, but there's probably never going to be a more influential artist than Elvis or the Beatles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, Len Cnut said: Theres no way on earth Sabbath are more influential than The Beatles or Elvis. It's not as crazy as it sounds, Sabbath had a bigger influence on creating sub-genres of rock that went on to have astronomical effect on music and generally mentioned in the same breath as The Beatles in regards to influencing rock acts......and i'm specifically talking about rock . Elvis is a performer of rock music not a creator of it, not denying his influence and the way he communicated rock to the masses is probably unmatched, but at the end of the day he's singing other peoples works. Edited August 18, 2017 by Silverburst80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 8 hours ago, Silverburst80 said: It's not as crazy as it sounds, Sabbath had a bigger influence on creating sub-genres of rock that went on to have astronomical effect on music and generally mentioned in the same breath as The Beatles in regards to influencing rock acts......and i'm specifically talking about rock . Elvis is a performer of rock music not a creator of it, not denying his influence and the way he communicated rock to the masses is probably unmatched, but at the end of the day he's singing other peoples works. Theres a LOT more to be said for Sabbath than normal, I'll freely admit to thinking they are dreadful but their influence has to be respected, I totally agree with that, all over the gaff. I mean I've been on this forum singing up The Sex Pistols as a seismic influence and theres no avoiding the Sabbathey sound in The Pistols, I wouldnt like to do Sabbath out of their dues but Elvis and The Beatles are a different kettle of chips altogether. And as far as Elvis and other peoples work, thats a valid point and I agree but at the same time, were it not for Elvis, all rock n roll was was race music, a sort of a fringe thing that evolved out of the blues, an offshoot that had a limited shelf life until the 60s came along and black people became more interested in soul type stuff, were it not for Elvis blowing everyones mind there wouldnt be a rock n roll like it exists today, there simply wouldnt, you dont have to create stuff yourself to be influential, influential is about the ideas you create, the amount of people that look at you and go 'I'm gonna have a go at that!' Or 'I wannabe that!' and Elvis is the man in that regard. Rock n Roll would've been little more than a fad were it not for Elvis. It was almost a fad FOR Elvis, i dont think it was anything deliberate by him or anything he knew what to do with or foresaw the power in. But it is what it is, were it not for Elvis we wouldnt be here having these discussions probably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 (edited) Have you listened to much Sabbath Len or just kinda steered clear of them because the "heavy metal " tag?. I think they are more hard rock than anything but had songs in their catalog that were alot heavier than anything that came before. You probably wouldn't get into the heavier albums like Masters of Reality but the Paranoid album for instance has a groove and a swagger to it you might appreciate abit more. I mean if Fairies Wear Boots doesn't get your toes tappin i don't know what will! Bill Wards drum beat at the start of Hand of Doom is almost hip hop in nature.....if you roll a spliff and put on Planet Caravan i'm pretty sure it'll take you places as well. Edited August 18, 2017 by Silverburst80 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 (edited) I've heard their debut and Paranoid...the debut is the one with Iron Man? They were OK, I suppose...not really my cup of tea though, sort of lacking in groove. I dont know why thats a bad thing because loads of what I listen to thats similarly lacking in groove, they just dont draw me in, there's nothing different, nothing sharp, nothing that makes me sit up and take notice. They seem very typical. I feel like if i had been exposed to them when i was a lot younger I might've seen em in a different light maybe. I actually like the song Paranoid, i think its good. I even watched a live gig of theirs on youtube for some reason, their appeal isnt totally lost on me, they just aint a bit of me. War Pigs is good. They just seemed to me like a bunch of incomptent Brummies trying to sound like Cream and getting it wrong. I'll check your reccomendations out though, cheers man. Edited August 18, 2017 by Len Cnut 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 Len listening to Sabbath. Put Snoop Dog away. Grow the hair and acne. Get the black skeleton t-shirt on and get interested in warhammer and Lord of the Rings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 4 hours ago, DieselDaisy said: Len listening to Sabbath. Put Snoop Dog away. Grow the hair and acne. Get the black skeleton t-shirt on and get interested in warhammer and Lord of the Rings. Lord Of the Rings is more Zepplins deal isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moreblack Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 On 8/18/2017 at 6:40 PM, Silverburst80 said: Lord Of the Rings is more Zepplins deal isn't it? They didn't have a specific "deal" they kind of dipped their toes in a lot of different waters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 Same crowd. Most metal fans are into Lord of the Rings and Warhammer. 'Elvin pursuits'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 When you've fuck all left to write about 'cept Lord of the Rings, maybe just fuckin' pack it in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papashaun Posted September 6, 2017 Share Posted September 6, 2017 No votes for Boston's debut yet??? Didn't that album sell like 10-12 million copies or so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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