soon Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 On December 9, 2017 at 7:20 AM, MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle said: My favourite version, too. Funnily enough, all 3 soundcheck jams had DTJ vibe about them so if there is new Guns music, you may well be right about hearing that riff again, or a version of it anyway. Duff's bass makes this song - it doesn't get talked about, as usual, but just you try taking that bass away and the song falls down no matter how good the rest of the players are or Izzy's vocals. Without that bass line DTJ has no pulse. That said, Izzy is vital here. If Duff gives the song life, Izzy gives it personality, both through vocals and lyrics. I wish he'd been allowed more singing duties in the band. No reason he couldn't have been a more regular vocalist (apart from Axl's ego). One of the few times where I believe you could take away Axl's vocal presence and the song would not suffer. It's not a very Axl-esque tune. Makes me think it's Izzy on the guitar solo but who knows... @soon this is like our My Michelle discussion. Is it Izzy or Slash playing the dive-bomb/slide guitar on that? I have never heard anyone play that slide guitar sound ever since Izzy was in the band, so makes me think Izzy was the one responsible for that. For the soundboard show in LA, somebody was trying hard and failing to play that sound - must have been Richard. Sorry for my slow response, I seem to have been swept away in a river of peppermint lattes. The slide-bomb when the main riff finally settles in during the intro jam? Sorry just catching up on the thread. Thats a good point about Izzy. The album version of DTJ has a lazier one, so Id lean towards Izzy there. And MM is so grandiose Id lean to Slash. The move itself is almost like a place holder for a nice trill, like when you write ((( ))) in a paper. But they make it work 100%!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 On December 10, 2017 at 10:47 AM, MyPrettyTiedUpMichelle said: I agree with you - it's hard to explain isn't it? I can't put my finger on why, that solo just never has sounded particularly Slash to me, either in execution or tone. It's too...restrained for Slash...and too clean and crisp, which is a tone/style Slash has never really been comfortable with as evidenced on this tour when he had so much trouble with Robin's TWAT solo - 8 attempts to nail that - got it on the last show though. We need @soon - he's so good at explaining sound! Im just catching up on thread, I think what @EvanGis saying is that Slashs playing in the elecritc guitar solo implies a half time feel against a band playing in full time - and if so Id agree. To my ears that makes it rather epic and soaring in an outlaw/gun slinger kinda way, but then compared to live version - I have a soft spot for Paris PPV - the fastering playing really suits the song too. I like live better typically. Just as its beginning the fade out, Slash plays a few tremolo-picking lines - just two short bursts. To me those are kinda cheap. Kinda beneath him as they could've been fuller melodic lines like he does live. Trem-pikcing is very flamenco as noted, so they probably thought it hands off nicely to the nylon string solo? (sorry if Im missing the point of the discussion! Just catching up on thread) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 ^ that's more or less what I mean. I'm not someone who needs a fast solo in every song, in fact most of my favourite guitar solos aren't like that. But I think it would suit this solo in at least a couple of bars, especially towards the end. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreverguns Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 On 7-12-2017 at 12:30 AM, Chunder Monkey said: I always figured maybe that refers to the lead riff during the verses. There's no way that outro solo is anyone but slash. This is what i read from the credits of dtj from use your illusion 1 original vinyl(and i have the german one and the less common dutch one) Drums/percussion : Matt Bass : Duff Lead and rythm quitars : Slash Vocals /Rythm guitar(not guitars) : Izzy Classical guitar solo : Slash Acoustic rythm guitar : Duff,Slash Backround vocals : Axl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom-Ass Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 On 12/7/2017 at 8:31 AM, Iron MikeyJ said: Honestly, I don't want to say "stole" because the more accurate term is inspired, but DTJ owes a bit to original Fleetwood Macs Oh Well. Ive learned both on guitar, and you cant tell me DTJ didnt come from Oh Well. Same goes for Your Crazy, that's The Seeker redesigned. Did you see the clip I posted above? Slash Jams out a bit of "Oh Well" during the intro. I think it was quite common around that time.. He did it at the Boston show I was at too.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverburst80 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 19 hours ago, sousadias said: This is a from a interview Slash gave in 1992: "On the Illusion albums, Izzy Stradlin is credited with rhythm guitar while you're credited with lead and rhythm. How does that break down any given track?" Slash's answer: "It's simple. Izzy, even on the songs he wrote, put on a very bare-bones guitar part -- just basic chords. And sometimes, very rarely, a single-note melody. He has ONE guitar solo on Illusion I -- at THE BEGINNING OF 'BACK OF BITCH' ". If Slash says that the only solo Izzy did on the UYI I was the intro solo of "Back of Bitch", we can conclude that Slash did the solo of "Double Talkin' Jive". https://www.guitarworld.com/gw-archive/slash-talks-guitars-and-guns-n-roses-1992-guitar-world-interivew Well that should be end of discussion really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dean Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Would've loved the studio version to be more like the NITL version, especially with Axl on lead vocals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangerInThisTown Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 22 hours ago, sousadias said: This is a from a interview Slash gave in 1992: "On the Illusion albums, Izzy Stradlin is credited with rhythm guitar while you're credited with lead and rhythm. How does that break down any given track?" Slash's answer: "It's simple. Izzy, even on the songs he wrote, put on a very bare-bones guitar part -- just basic chords. And sometimes, very rarely, a single-note melody. He has ONE guitar solo on Illusion I -- at THE BEGINNING OF 'BACK OF BITCH' ". If Slash says that the only solo Izzy did on the UYI I was the intro solo of "Back of Bitch", we can conclude that Slash did the solo of "Double Talkin' Jive". https://www.guitarworld.com/gw-archive/slash-talks-guitars-and-guns-n-roses-1992-guitar-world-interivew That's a great interview. That song Burnout he talked about is still unreleased, but Slash rerecorded it with new lyrics for Ain't Life Grand. It's one of my GNR holy grails that I wish to hear someday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzymacbeth Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 6:11 AM, sousadias said: Izzy is uncredited on Civil War but he plays on it, if you listen carefully to the left channel you can hear Izzy's guitar, it has his tone and style of playing, totally different from Slash's style, but Slash do some overdubs on clean guitar. Coma is the opposite, Izzy is credited but Slash do all the guitar parts. I respectfully disagree. Izzy was in Europe getting sober at the time of the recording of Civil War. Slash recorded his parts as it was released for Nobodys Child a year and a half before UYI. On Coma its clearly Izzy, especially the chops at the start of the solo (which Richard never does annoyingly). Izzy has spoken about Coma many times albeit mostly to do with performing it live. Izzy has aslo stated he is credited for everything he did. If anyone can help out with a link to that thatd be awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) Went through some old magazines with Izzy interviews I still have: Guitar World: Quote You did play a couple of solos on AFD, did you play a lot of lead on UYI? No, except for the solo on Double Talkin' Jive and a few other things, it was mainly Slash. He was a noodler, man. I think he still is. Edit: fake quote Edited December 12, 2017 by EvanG 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonGuns Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 hours ago, EvanG said: Went through some old magazines with Izzy interviews I still have: Guitar World: What edition? Great find! To be honest though all it does is further fuel the debate (although you know I agree with it!). The album version of the solo definitely isn't "noodling". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) Ok, I just wanted to jump on the fake news bandwagon and keep this endless discussion going, because of the other Guitar World quote on this page. So, I made it up, he did talk about Slash being a noodler in that interview and his dislike for shredding, but never mentioned Double Talkin' Jive. I have a really bad sense of humour. Sorry! Edited December 12, 2017 by EvanG 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToonGuns Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Well played. I have to say though, GnR fans on this forum aside, if I never hear the phrase "fake news" again it'll be too soon! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericy210 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 On 12/6/2017 at 12:14 PM, jacdaniel said: I always loved this song a lot but I think the album version is really weak. 91 live versions were ok. 92 and 93 versions were fantastic, Slashs solos were mind blown at times. 16/17 is consistently good but I don't think Slashs cleaner tone and being lower in the mix works as well on that song. Anybody got any thoughts? Favourite versions? I love it whenever he says “homefuck.” Best word ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trin9498 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Overrated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marlingrl03 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 3 hours ago, ericy210 said: I love it whenever he says “homefuck.” Best word ever It's great fun yelling that out during a Guns concert! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestic Beast Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 On 12/14/2017 at 2:07 AM, Trin9498 said: Overrated The song? Don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powderfinger Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 My Latest thoughts on this are it's better now than when I heard it 25 years ago. I loved it then also! It's just a killer tune, my only whine is it's not long enough!! What would an "best of izzy" gnr album look like..... one where he is the main vocalist. I love his delivery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikki_Sixx Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 If you can't even hear the difference between Izzy solo-ing and Slash solo-ing ... Slash plays the solo on DTJM. End of discussion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Bird Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 On 12.12.2017 at 1:53 AM, StrangerInThisTown said: That's a great interview. That song Burnout he talked about is still unreleased, but Slash rerecorded it with new lyrics for Ain't Life Grand. It's one of my GNR holy grails that I wish to hear someday Yeah that's something I'm very interested in. Ain't Life Grand with Iggy on vocals and with Lenny Kravitz as background singer. Never going to see the light of day unfortunately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Yet many people here think it's Izzy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moreblack Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Izzy could never solo to that level. He's functional when he solos but not very expressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 He could have easily played that solo. Don't underestimate him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moreblack Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 Maybe he could learn it, but not come up with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted December 21, 2017 Share Posted December 21, 2017 I thought he wrote the song? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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