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Kasanova King

The Religion/Spirituality Thread

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3 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

What is atheism in your mind?

It's a broad term.  It should mean a person that doesn't believe in Theism.  But over the years it has evolved to meaning a person that does not believe in a higher power. 

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15 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

From my understanding, Agnostics say that they "don't know" but there could be a higher power.  Atheists don't believe in the possibility of a higher power unless there is proof.  

 

Agnoticism the belief there is a God but knowing and understanding about him is beyond the capabilities of the human experience.  Atheists don't believe in anything (or believe in everything) as long as there is proof.

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There are various groupings of atheists - even atheists are not very much in agreement,

1280px-AtheismImplicitExplicit3.svg.png

     on right Explicit "positive" / "strong" / "hard" atheists assert that "At least one deity exists" is false.
     on right Explicit "negative" / "weak" / "soft" atheists do not assert the above but reject or eschew a belief that any deities exist.
     on left Implicit "negative" / "weak" / "soft" atheists include agnostics (and infants or babies) who do not believe or do not know whether a deity or deities exist and who have not explicitly rejected or eschewed such a belief.
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2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

Agnoticism the belief there is a God but knowing and understanding about him is beyond the capabilities of the human experience.  Atheists don't believe in anything (or believe in everything) as long as there is proof.

ag·nos·tic
/aɡˈnästik/
noun
 
  1. 1.
    a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God.
    synonyms: sceptic, doubter, questioner, doubting Thomas, challenger, scoffer, cynic; More
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     

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1 minute ago, DieselDaisy said:

There are various groupings of atheists - even atheists are not very much in agreement,

1280px-AtheismImplicitExplicit3.svg.png

     on right Explicit "positive" / "strong" / "hard" atheists assert that "At least one deity exists" is false.
     on right Explicit "negative" / "weak" / "soft" atheists do not assert the above but reject or eschew a belief that any deities exist.
     on left Implicit "negative" / "weak" / "soft" atheists include agnostics (and infants or babies) who do not believe or do not know whether a deity or deities exist and who have not explicitly rejected or eschewed such a belief.

I'd venture to say that most "atheists" are most likely agnostic.  But they are brainwashed to call themselves atheist.    

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13 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:
ag·nos·tic
/aɡˈnästik/
noun
 
  1. 1.
    a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God.
    synonyms: sceptic, doubter, questioner, doubting Thomas, challenger, scoffer, cynic; More
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     

Right, thats basically what I said, believes nothing is known or can be known of the existence of God. 

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Just now, Kasanova King said:
ag·nos·tic
/aɡˈnästik/
noun
 
  1. 1.
    a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God.
    synonyms: sceptic, doubter, questioner, doubting Thomas, challenger, scoffer, cynic; More
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     
     

That used to be me more or less until I saw the hilarious 'Fundamentalist Agnostics' South Park episode.

Now I just say I know or don't know, depending on the specific topic or detail.

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I'll tell yous one thing for free though, of all the notions of a higher power, a high power a defined by the judeo/christian/islamic theology seems the least likely. 

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Just now, Kasanova King said:

I'd venture to say that most "atheists" are most likely agnostic.  But they are brainwashed to call themselves atheist.    

I would personally divide them between passive atheists, who basically don't believe in god but do not insist on ramming their opinions down everyone's throat and lead their life, and militant atheists who are utterly obsessed with the subject and constantly hectoring people about it. The latter are more prevalent today, perhaps since Dawkins/Hitchens wrote various books.

The latter are just like militant vegans and militant environmentalists. Really annoying shits. 

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1 minute ago, Len Cnut said:

I'll tell yous one thing for free though, of all the notions of a higher power, a high power a defined by the judeo/christian/islamic theology seems the least likely. 

I can see that.  

When was the Bible written?  What was mankind like when it was written? 

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12 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

I can see that.  

When was the Bible written?  What was mankind like when it was written? 

The Bible was more compiled than written as far as my limited awareness.  What was mankind like, well how the fuck should I know, I'm younger than you and I doubt you've seen much before the 80s :lol:

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3 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

I would personally divide them between passive atheists, who basically don't believe in god but do not insist on ramming their opinions down everyone's throat and lead their life, and militant atheists who are utterly obsessed with the subject and constantly hectoring people about it. The latter are more prevalent today, perhaps since Dawkins/Hitchens wrote various books.

The latter are just like militant vegans and militant environmentalists. Really annoying shits. 

Pretty much.  The extremists are actually "theists" of Dawkins.  :lol:

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Just now, Len Cnut said:

I'll tell yous one thing for free though, of all the notions of a higher power, a high power a defined by the judeo/christian/islamic theology seems the least likely. 

If I had to pick a religion it'd probably be Buddhism. 

There's a law of thermodynamics that energy cannot be created or destroyed only transferred. Our brains and nervous system use electrical energy. I wonder if we die and this energy transfers into a different state of existence in this dimension or perhaps another. That would be reincarnation or something akin to it. Maybe we don't retain our consciousness/'soul' though it could be like just dissipating and going back into universal cake-mix.

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2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

The Bible was more compiled than written as far as my limited awareness.  What was mankind like, well how the fuck should I know, I'm younger than you and I doubt you've seen much before the 80s :lol:

:lol:

Agreed.

 

Open your mind for a minute.  If God came down and told everyone that he lived in another dimension and that that time was simply a dimension...how would people react? 

We live in a time that faith is closer to science than it has ever been.  

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

If I had to pick a religion it'd probably be Buddhism. 

There's a law of thermodynamics that energy cannot be created or destroyed only transferred. Our brains and nervous system use electrical energy. I wonder if we die and this energy transfers into a different state of existence in this dimension or perhaps another. That would be reincarnation or something akin to it. Maybe we don't retain our consciousness/'soul' though it could be like just dissipating and going back into universal cake-mix.

If I had to pick a religion it'd be fuckin' none of em.  They're all fascinating and an understanding of them is important to understanding the world  around us and I even don't have a problem with people believing in em, hey, do what you like...but none of em look appealing, no one way does to me because it all boils down to one thing to me, why, where's the proof, I don't see any proof of it in anything.  Perhaps thats me, perhaps I'm just blind to it because God knows there's enough people out there who clearly do but I just don't.  Never have.  Things can sound appealing in dribs and drabs but lots of things in life can sound appealing, don't mean to say they're right.

It's like this, I've only got one crack at life, there's really no time to be fuckin' around, if a thing is real I'll be right in line but until I see something that indicates that it is I'm gonna concentrate on things that I personally find to be of greater value.  And to be honest I don't feel a need for it either, nothing about the puzzle of life is missing for me in that sense.

Edited by Len Cnut
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1 minute ago, Kasanova King said:

Pretty much.  The extremists are actually "theists" of Dawkins.  :lol:

There is actually a lot that is religious in the manner they go on. I am thinking especially of hatchet-faced puritanical protestants of the 17th century who espouse predestination, elect v dammed. There is the same preoccupation/obsession with the subject matter and the same inability to respect the opposing argument - the same hectoring (''I am right and you are wrong'') holier than thou tone.

The irony is hilarious. 

Atheists are the new apostles. The God Delusion is the new Bible. 

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13 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

:lol:

Agreed.

 

Open your mind for a minute.  If God came down and told everyone that he lived in another dimension and that that time was simply a dimension...how would people react? 

We live in a time that faith is closer to science than it has ever been.  

I imagine they'd shit their pants :lol:  As far as faith getting closer to science, I dunno, it very possibly is...but there's still a pretty big fuckin' gap there.  Not that science is the be all and end all but it appears to be the best we have.  I got this mental image now of God being Krang from Ninja Turtles :lol:

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Just now, Kasanova King said:

:lol:

Agreed.

 

Open your mind for a minute.  If God came down and told everyone that he lived in another dimension and that that time was simply a dimension...how would people react? 

We live in a time that faith is closer to science than it has ever been.  

I would immediately start donating money to your pedophile cult and hurriedly wolf down a bunch of wafers and wine while writing out many lines of hail Mary's on a chalkboard. :lol:

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2 minutes ago, Len Cnut said:

I imagine they'd shit their pants :lol:  As far as faith getting closer to science, I dunno, it very possibly is...but there's still a pretty big fuckin' gap there.  Not that science is the be all and end all but it appears to be the best we have.  I got this mental image now of God being Krang from Ninja Turtles :lol:

:lol:

People were fucking savages back then.  Of course the Old Testament seems stern to us nowadays.  Back then it was the way it was.  The Quran isn't much different and it was written hundreds of years after the Old Testament.  

The New Testament of Jesus Christ is God's way of saying..."Hey folks, this is the way it is now".  

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

I would immediately start donating money to your pedophile cult and hurriedly wolf down a bunch of wafers and wine while writing out many lines of hail Mary's on a chalkboard. :lol:

I actually quite like catholicism.  Conceptually speaking.  There's something appealing about it.  All the pomp and ceremony and all that.  Its inspired a lot of great works of art too (understatement of the fuckin' century) which makes it further appealing. 

15 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

:lol:

People were fucking savages back then.  Of course the Old Testament seems stern to us nowadays.  Back then it was the way it was.  The Quran isn't much different and it was written hundreds of years after the Old Testament.  

The New Testament of Jesus Christ is God's way of saying..."Hey folks, this is the way it is now".  

 

 

 

Oh I get that...none of this leads one closer to believing in God though.  I actually quite like The Bible, its difficult not to if you like literature.  But liking it and believing it are two different things.

Edited by Len Cnut
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1 minute ago, Len Cnut said:

I actually quite like catholicism.  Conceptually speaking.  There's something appealing about it.  All the pomp and ceremony and all that.  Its inspired a lot of great works of art too (understatement of the fuckin' century) which makes it further appealing. 

Oh I get that...none of this leads one closer to believing in God though.  I actually quite like The Bible, its difficult not to if you like literature.

It's all a crock of shit. I'm amazed you find anything appealing about Catholicism even on the surface level. I despise pomp.

When I get round to reading the Bible from start to finish I'll post the bits I actually like. I really like the quote about the camel going through the eye of a needle before a rich man enters the gates of heaven.

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8 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

I would immediately start donating money to your pedophile cult and hurriedly wolf down a bunch of wafers and wine while writing out many lines of hail Mary's on a chalkboard. :lol:

I'm not going to defend the priests that did that shit.  They are pigs. 

But to criticize the 99.9% of priests and the millions of good people that are Catholic is somewhat prejudice...don't you think?

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

I'm not going to defend the priests that did that shit.  They are pigs. 

But to criticize the 99.9% of priests and the millions of good people that are Catholic is somewhat prejudice...don't you think?

While I agree the vast majority of Catholics/people-in-general are decent folks(Certainly not something as evil as pedophiles.) I do not agree it's prejudice to criticize your group or any other for that matter. I do it out of sanity and compassion and sincere concern not some strange discriminatory hatred for all the good people who are in my opinion lost and legitimizing/endorsing a pedophile cult. I find it very frustrating.

If you guys rounded up the priests and they were punished here and now by mans law and the Vatican hierarchy was abolished, the secret libraries were digitized and shared and a healthy Catholicsm 2.0 arose then I would be very happy for all, despite still not personally sharing your religious beliefs.

Edited by Oldest Goat

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4 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

While I agree the vast majority of Catholics/people-in-general are decent folks(Certainly not something as evil as pedophiles.) I do not agree it's prejudice to criticize your group or any other for that matter. I do it out of sanity and compassion and sincere concern not some strange discriminatory hatred for all the good people who are in my opinion lost and legitimizing/endorsing a pedophile cult. I find it very frustrating.

If you guys rounded up the priests and they were punished here and now by mans law and the Vatican hierarchy was abolished, the secret libraries were digitized and shared and a healthy Catholicsm 2.0 arose then I would be very happy for all, despite still not personally sharing your religious beliefs.

Catholic here, the fact that the house needs to be cleaned and that they need to be more open about things I absolutely agree with. It's an absolute disgrace that this wasn't cleaned up when news first broke. I disagree on the idea of a hierarchy. You need some type of hierarchy to make final decisions on theological issues. 

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1 hour ago, Dazey said:

All an atheist is saying is show me some proof and I'll believe what you say. No evidence = no belief basically. :shrugs: 

all i'm saying is show me proof that god does not exist and i'll believe you too

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