Guns N' Roses & related STUDIO SESSIONS - a definitive collection of available info (?)

[ludurigan]

i really wanna hear this...

 

*MISSING* (drummer sessions February - June 1990, including Jussi Tegelman, Adam Maples, Martin Chambers) *MISSING* [DOES NOT CIRCULATE]

[kevinb]

Just now, ludurigan said:

i really wanna hear this...

 

*MISSING* (drummer sessions February - June 1990, including Jussi Tegelman, Adam Maples, Martin Chambers) *MISSING* [DOES NOT CIRCULATE]

Do we know if this was recorded?  Seems like most sessions would have leaked by now after 25 years... I wonder if we have any proof of uncirculated sessions whose recordings have actually survived...

[ludurigan]

7 minutes ago, kevinb said:

Do we know if this was recorded?  Seems like most sessions would have leaked by now after 25 years... I wonder if we have any proof of uncirculated sessions whose recordings have actually survived...

i have no idea if this exists or not

but i truly believe (and hope!) that there are ZILLIONS of hours of uncirculated GNR music recorded in studio or anywhere else

like even amateur recordings done when they wrote songs with acoustic guitars or when they did amateur demos with drum machines

i really believe different people (axl, izzy, slash, duff, steven and the many associate people that hung out with them at the time) kept some of these said recordings and i really believe they will surface sooner or later!

 

[NeonKinight]

Anxious Disease is missing on this list.

Albeit the fact that i've never seen any info of when it was recorded, it shall be included. At least, we are sure that it was recorded before may 1996.
The only info that i've managed to find is that it was recorded, or at least, mixed in Rumbo Studios (Presumably the same one for AFD '98/99 Sessions) and they've used Pimp Studios as well. 
 

Edited July 9, 2018 by NeonKinight

[NeonKinight]

“The whole story is tragic. The album is all that is left, as well as many other songs written by West, that will probably evaporate due to legal shit and the people who are fighting for his legacy and his copyright.
His lawyer Harmon Kaslow was called right after West body was found by his sister and I. Harmon quickly arrived and removed a couple of things, including a tape from the answering machine and a fake ID, also the album’s master tapes and he left. I haven’t seen the guy since then. Thanks Harmon for all the help! What an asshole!”

“I had already met Axl at the Stones show in Atlantic City when Izzy and him were jammin’ with the band. I had also met Slash. They came to do their work separately. That was it. I know this was not clarified with their management because later it became a problem…. conflict of interest?”

“The new GN’R album was planned to be out soon… There are tracks with Izzy singing with the band live on the studio. Great material that will probably never see the light of day. Harmon has never called the members of the band back but he’s cashed in on royalties for all of us and West too. So guess who’s got all the money? I hope these answers satisfy you because they are long but the story is longer and much more complicated.”

Source : https://gnrcentral.com/2018/04/08/the-last-recording-to-feature-axl-rose-and-slash-of-guns-n-roses/

[NeonKinight]

Can we assume that "Walk On By", released in Anxious Disease, is the same we are talkin' about here?

*MISSING* Walk On By *MISSING* [DOES NOT CIRCULATE] (West Arkeen song from West Arkeen Tape)

Edited July 9, 2018 by NeonKinight

[Blackstar]

1 hour ago, NeonKinight said:

Anxious Disease is missing on this list.

Albeit the fact that i've never seen any info of when it was recorded, it shall be included. At least, we are sure that it was recorded before may 1996.
The only info that i've managed to find is that it was recorded, or at least, mixed in Rumbo Studios. Presumably the same one they've used for AFD '98/99 sessions.
 

I don't know if it should be included since it wasn't a GnR album or a side project. I guess the West Arkeen tapes are included because songs from them became GnR songs and it was kind of a parallel/shadow lineup of Axl, Duff, Izzy and West in pairs.

The quote by the Outpatience bassist you posted actually was first posted here:

@Gambit83 did an interview with him recently and he gave more details. I don't remember if he mentioned when exactly where it was recorded, but it's worth listening:

 

Edited July 9, 2018 by Blackstar

[NeonKinight]

3 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I don't know if it should be included since it wasn't a GnR album or a side project. 

So why is there Rapidfire/Hollywood Rose?

Plus, All classic members of GN'R (besides adler) are on that album, also, the only known recording of Axl's voice in the mid 90's. It's worth mentioning 

Edited July 9, 2018 by NeonKinight

[Blackstar]

7 minutes ago, NeonKinight said:

So why is there Rapidfire/Hollywood Rose?

Plus, All classic members of GN'R (besides adler) are on that album, also, the only known recording of Axl's voice in the mid 90's. It's worth mentioning 

I guess because Rapidfire and HR are predecessors of GnR (although Rapidfire not so much, but there is a recording unlike other pre-GnR bands).

The Outpatience album is an album by another band where GnR members guested. But yeah, why not, if @zombux  agrees.

 

Edited July 9, 2018 by Blackstar

[zombux]

13 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I guess because Rapidfire and HR are predecessors of GnR (although Rapidfire not so much, but there is a recording unlike other pre-GnR bands).

The Outpatience album is an album by another band where GnR members guested. But yeah, why not, if @zombux  agrees.

 

inclusion of Hollywood Rose is obvious, because it's a direct predecessor of GNR. in fact it was one band - even the songs were carried forward to GNR (as opposed to L.A. Guns, which were separate entity).

inclusion of Rapidfire was mainly because I was trying to put all things into the timeline and having Rapidfire there helps to put the things into the bigger picture - yeah, it's not directly related to GNR, but I felt I should include it there.

about Outpatience... well, hard to say. it IS a solo project so it shouldn't be there (on the same basis I would have to also include first Snakepit sessions).

but on the other hand, it's kind of a continuation of Hell House sessions... well, I probably don't include it now, but will think about it. it's indeed not that simple.

[Blackstar]

23 minutes ago, zombux said:

about Outpatience... well, hard to say. it IS a solo project so it shouldn't be there (on the same basis I would have to also include first Snakepit sessions).

I think the first Snakepit sessions (January 1994) would be a more "legit" inclusion than Outpatience, since the demos were originally submitted as GnR songs and moreover the rest of the band, except Axl, contributed to the released solo album in one way or another.

Speaking of that, there is that guitar instrumental with Axl whistling and humming over it on the making of Estranged doc, which is very similar to Back And Forth Again. It was probably one of the Snakepit songs Axl liked. Maybe at least that one should be included? There is also a piano melody playing on the same video.

----------

And what about the original This I Love demos from 1992? (probably Paris and London, June 1992, and maybe Sydney, January 1993)

[zombux]

18 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

I think the first Snakepit sessions (January 1994) would be a more "legit" inclusion than Outpatience, since the demos were originally submitted as GnR songs and moreover the rest of the band, except Axl, contributed to the released solo album in one way or another.

Speaking of that, there is that guitar instrumental with Axl whistling and humming over it on the making of Estranged doc, which is very similar to Back And Forth Again. It was probably one of the Snakepit songs Axl liked. Maybe at least that one should be included? There is also a piano melody playing on the same video.

----------

And what about the original This I Love demos from 1992? (probably Paris and London, June 1992, and maybe Sydney, January 1993)

I have no idea  you shoot, I'll put it there - if this is somehow proved to have existed, it should be in the table for sure

[Blackstar]

6 minutes ago, zombux said:

I have no idea  you shoot, I'll put it there - if this is somehow proved to have existed, it should be in the table for sure

Which one? TIL or Back And Forth Again?

[zombux]

13 minutes ago, Blackstar said:

Which one? TIL or Back And Forth Again?

any of those, of course

[Nikki_Sixx]

20 hours ago, Sergeanur said:

Check out this Nice Boys intro comparison, note the sound of drums and bass line

 

Interesting.  I see where you're getting at.

On the other hand, as I pointed out above, the rythm guitar playing on the verses is the same on Many Faces and Pasha, and different on Sound City.

Why would they change the way of playing something inbetween two takes ?  You could apply that to both that bass line at the start, or the rythm guitars in the verses.  So where does that leave us ...

Also, from the video comparison, I assume you agree that the Many Faces versions has the correct pitch but runs way too fast ?

[Blackstar]

22 hours ago, zombux said:

any of those, of course

Well, about TIL there is the known Axl quote from 1993 (Hit Parader interview, reproduced in RAW magazine, paraphrased) saying that he'd written AND recorded "a song called This I Love" and he wanted it on the next album.

And when he introduced it at two French shows in 2010 he said it was the only GnR song written in France.

There is also the Dave Dominguez quote (Chinese Whispers 1994) that he collected tapes from studios in Paris, London and Sydney.

The places and the dates match with the Axl and Dominguez quotes: Paris show on June 6 1992, London show on June 13 1992 (Chinese Whispers seems to miss that one and mentions only the Freddie Mercury tribute in April as the only London show in 1992) and Sydney January 30, 1993 (that's an odd one). The only thing that doesn't quite match is that Dominguez says it was recorded during the UYI sessions, but he probably meant during the UYI tour, as all the UYI sessions took place in the US. 

Axl was reportedly in Paris also around August 20th 1991 while the rest of the band was in Oslo for the show there (the Oslo show was cancelled because of Axl's absence). Then they played London on August 30th.

But I think the 1992 dates are more likely.

It's strange though that Axl didn't have the tapes and Domnguez had to look for them.

-------

About Back and Forth Again: there is the instrumental with Axl's whistling/humming playing on the video, so there must have been a recording of it in that form in 1993. Of course in its final form it ended up on the first Snakepit album.

It plays in the background from 7:23 to 8:00 min. mark:

The unknown piano melody is heard in the background at around 9:10 mark.

Edited July 10, 2018 by Blackstar

[MJ23]

This I Love was written in or before 1993 with Axl mentioning the title in 1993 RAW magazine interview. 
(I wrote and recorded a new song that I want to have on the record called "This I Love.")

In 1998 the track was intended to end up on the soundtrack of the Robin Williams movie "What Dreams May Come".

In 2000 Howard Karp (an engineer) recorded the song with Axl.
(I only worked with Axl, no one else, it was a solo piano piece. I heard nothing else. Axl was cool, two short evenings, nothing too eventful.)

In 2007 (maybe even late 2006) Patti Hood recorded her parts for the song.

 

[Sergeanur]

1 hour ago, Nikki_Sixx said:

the rythm guitar playing on the verses is the same on Many Faces and Pasha, and different on Sound City.

Could you spoonfeed me? I don't really notice the difference on this between all 3 tracks.

1 hour ago, Nikki_Sixx said:

I assume you agree that the Many Faces versions has the correct pitch but runs way too fast ?

Yep

[Nikki_Sixx]

1 hour ago, Sergeanur said:

Could you spoonfeed me? I don't really notice the difference on this between all 3 tracks.

Start off the song, single out the guitar that plays the lead melody, and follow that one into the verses.  In the verses, that guitar plays open power chords all the way through, on both Many Faces and Pasha.

On Sound City however, this guitar plays a rythmic, somewhat palm-muted variation with the three chords.

Does that make any sense ?

[NeonKinight]

8 hours ago, zombux said:

"....there helps to put the things into the bigger picture - yeah, it's not directly related to GNR, but I felt I should include it there."

The same as outpatient, don't you think?!

[Sergeanur]

4 hours ago, Nikki_Sixx said:

Start off the song, single out the guitar that plays the lead melody, and follow that one into the verses.  In the verses, that guitar plays open power chords all the way through, on both Many Faces and Pasha.

On Sound City however, this guitar plays a rythmic, somewhat palm-muted variation with the three chords.

Does that make any sense ?

I see it now, different Slash parts. On Many Faces also Izzy only in the first chorus plays his usual parts and Axl sings different lyrics in third verse. Could be the reason why they tried two takes?

I'm still convinced that's Sound City though, still has a lot more in common. Also that hit in the end (drums?), some Sound City tracks have a similar one (e.g. Move To The City).

[zombux]

1 hour ago, NeonKinight said:

The same as outpatient, don't you think?!

no, I don't think so

@Sergeanur & @Nikki_Sixx well, that's a draw. so... I still don't know what to do with those. at the current state it definitely needs to be noted as "very uncertain"

[Sosso]

Tracii: >We were supposed to rehearse Thursdays so after that last gig at the Waters Club everybody said, 'I'll see you Thursday' and I'm like, 'Yeah, OK.'"<

Source: https://www.ultimate-guitar.com/news/interviews/tracii_guns_what_would_gnr_sound_like_had_i_stayed_in_the_band.html

It would mean that most of the rehearsals took place at those dates:

07.

14.03.1985 (third rehearsal) 

21.03.1985 (fourth rehearsal, #1 with Duff) 

28.03.1985

04.04.1985

11.04.1985

18.04.1985

25.04.1985

02.05.1985

09.05.1985

16.05.1985

 

Edited July 9, 2018 by Sosso

[Nikki_Sixx]

1 hour ago, zombux said:

no, I don't think so

@Sergeanur & @Nikki_Sixx well, that's a draw. so... I still don't know what to do with those. at the current state it definitely needs to be noted as "very uncertain"

I don't agree  you can't call it a draw, since I am the only one who has a different opinion on this, everyone else seems to agree that it's Sound City.

Maybe we can agree to revert back to that, until it can be proven otherwise ?

[Sosso]

I think that they had no bass player during the third rehearsal. Raz said that Ole was fired after the second rehearsal. Duff's first rehearsal with the band was during their fourth.