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"General Musings" " Thread for all of "Thoughts On" all GnR things in the universe.


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12 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

Does it? I'm fine with how the Illusions sound, for me it's the best the band ever sounded (along with TSI) in regards of sound quality. Izzy could have been a bit higher in the mix, tho. 

I honestly think you would have more chance playing in a GNR cover band staying in Brazil. 

The only issue I have with UYI is the snare sound - for some reason it ‘dates’ the albums. A minor gripe.....TSI had it spot-on IMO.

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7 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

Agree about the drums. But TSI lacks a bit of the Illusions dynamics. To me, that makes it both even, kinda.

I know what you mean - what would a ‘Estranged’ type song sound like with TSI sonics? Good question.

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In these terrible times, it's beyond forgiveable if GnR don't want to do a tiny effort for the fans. 

Don't blame the record company. I simple call would be enough. They would agree to give away a song or two in these circumstances. 

If GnR don't do Anything extraordinary in these extraordinary times, I will never respect them again.

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3 hours ago, Voodoochild said:

Does it? I'm fine with how the Illusions sound, for me it's the best the band ever sounded (along with TSI) in regards of sound quality. Izzy could have been a bit higher in the mix, tho. 

I honestly think you would have more chance playing in a GNR cover band staying in Brazil. 

I think the production value is the weakest of all the albums of GN'Rs catalogue. The guitars don't sound as crisp to me, Izzy is a bit muted, drums don't have much punch; think of the first note of Rocket Queen, then compare to the intro for Locomotive. A lot of UYI songs could benefit from a remaster. It doesn't sound terrible, but when we only 4 full length albums from the band-i count lies and Live like a suicide separately as EPs, it feel frustrating that the production value took a step back from Appetite

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3 hours ago, UsedYourIllusion said:

I think the production value is the weakest of all the albums of GN'Rs catalogue. The guitars don't sound as crisp to me, Izzy is a bit muted, drums don't have much punch; think of the first note of Rocket Queen, then compare to the intro for Locomotive. A lot of UYI songs could benefit from a remaster. It doesn't sound terrible, but when we only 4 full length albums from the band-i count lies and Live like a suicide separately as EPs, it feel frustrating that the production value took a step back from Appetite

Although I think a remaster won't change those specific things neccesarily - a remaster is just taking the mixdown master tape and applying new processes such as EQ and compression (and hopefully never too much of it lol hello there Loudness Wars). Kind of like how with the Appetite remaster there were slight changes due to added compression but with certain frequencies emphasized such as slightly boosted bottom end, the changes are all more on the subtle, and broad stroke side of things.  It can make some differences, however I think that a lot of the things you mentioned such as Izzy's guitar or the actual sound of the drums on Locomotive, a remix would be the solution for that.  Taking the multitracks of the drums and applying different procceses on them, bumping up Izzy's guitar, changing up the stereo image a bit, etc.

 

 

I personally always liked the sound of the Illusions however I can see how others wouldn't for sure.  I really enjoy the Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab remasters of the Illusions that have a slightly more dynamic range and a smooth crankable sound.

Edited by WhazUp
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19 minutes ago, WhazUp said:

Although I think a remaster won't change those specific things neccesarily - a remaster is just taking the mixdown master tape and applying new processes such as EQ and compression (and hopefully never too much of it lol hello there Loudness Wars). Kind of like how with the Appetite remaster there were slight changes due to added compression but with certain frequencies emphasized such as slightly boosted bottom end, the changes are all more on the subtle, and broad stroke side of things.  It can make some differences, however I think that a lot of the things you mentioned such as Izzy's guitar or the actual sound of the drums on Locomotive, a remix would be the solution for that.  Taking the multitracks of the drums and applying different procceses on them, bumping up Izzy's guitar, changing up the stereo image a bit, etc.

 

 

I personally always liked the sound of the Illusions however I can see how others wouldn't for sure.  I really enjoy the Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab remasters of the Illusions that have a slightly more dynamic range and a smooth crankable sound.

Ah, very true, didn't even consider that. A total remix could possibly fix the issues people have with the drums and guitars. I think the illusions were mixed for CD's and the loudness war in mind; hopefully a remix could better layout the vision the band had for the songs, if you listen to the live versions, there seems to be a disconnect in my opinion. Although, this could be from the trouble of the production, not necessarily the mix.  

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11 hours ago, Voodoochild said:

 

I honestly think you would have more chance playing in a GNR cover band staying in Brazil. 

Yeah, probably, problem is: of all "gnr cover bands" that I've seen here, they're just interested in actually being covers of the version of Guns N' Roses that existed between '85 and '93.
I really would like to be a part of a "not in this lifetime" or nugnr version of Guns.

Guess I'm a bit of a lunatic anyways.

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14 hours ago, DTJ80 said:

Could really mean either I suppose. Can’t recall - was that the only one that had ‘Nu Ax’? If it’s the only one then yeah, it could be that original vocals were recorded pre-99. I know some said ‘No Vox’ suggesting those songs did have vocals somewhere.

 

Yea Hardschool was the only one that said Nu Ax, and I think Zodiac was the only one that said No Vox.

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9 hours ago, UsedYourIllusion said:

I think the production value is the weakest of all the albums of GN'Rs catalogue. The guitars don't sound as crisp to me, Izzy is a bit muted, drums don't have much punch; think of the first note of Rocket Queen, then compare to the intro for Locomotive. A lot of UYI songs could benefit from a remaster. It doesn't sound terrible, but when we only 4 full length albums from the band-i count lies and Live like a suicide separately as EPs, it feel frustrating that the production value took a step back from Appetite

I'm not sure what you mean when you say the guitars dont sound as crisp. I mean, it's Slash different tone (heavier, a lot more gain), which I love. And also Izzy being very low in the mix (but also some very uninspired guitar work there, compared to what he did in AFD). I don't think a remix would fix that for what you said either.

1 hour ago, ezosk said:

Yeah, probably, problem is: of all "gnr cover bands" that I've seen here, they're just interested in actually being covers of the version of Guns N' Roses that existed between '85 and '93.
I really would like to be a part of a "not in this lifetime" or nugnr version of Guns.

Guess I'm a bit of a lunatic anyways.

I understand. I tried to play in a new GNR band back in 2007. One of my worst experiences in a band ever.

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3 hours ago, Voodoochild said:

I'm not sure what you mean when you say the guitars dont sound as crisp. I mean, it's Slash different tone (heavier, a lot more gain), which I love. And also Izzy being very low in the mix (but also some very uninspired guitar work there, compared to what he did in AFD). I don't think a remix would fix that for what you said either.

I understand. I tried to play in a new GNR band back in 2007. One of my worst experiences in a band ever.

I think, if you were to compare Appetite and TSI in terms of fidelity, its got to do with the soundstage, and dynamic range of the mix. It just feels off to me, I honestly think the drums are too loud, over power slash and Izzy's playing. Sort of muddies the entire mix for me. If you just do A and B tests with TSI, UYI feels inferior. 

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TSI is loud!! That was my 1st gnr CD.

Talkin about UYIs.... the managment have a lot of options. A big catalogue to make it more big than the AFD LnL.

First of all, they have a lot of demos/takes with awesome quality. And the tour.... this is the best imo, just put 1 show per year at least and make some 4K restoration with 60 fps minimun.

Bluray audio with alternative endings or takes (like the 14 years extended outro). 

Bluray from PCrime doxumentary of course. 

 

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9 hours ago, UsedYourIllusion said:

I think, if you were to compare Appetite and TSI in terms of fidelity, its got to do with the soundstage, and dynamic range of the mix. It just feels off to me, I honestly think the drums are too loud, over power slash and Izzy's playing. Sort of muddies the entire mix for me. If you just do A and B tests with TSI, UYI feels inferior. 

I think both AFD and TSI have a different sound profile with the tracks arrangements. I'll talk more about this after the next quote, but I agree the drums are a bit loud. And I really like TSI's sound, don't get me wrong.

8 hours ago, MaskingApathy said:

TSI is a lot more aggressive sounding with the production. Not as much reverb and the bass drum hits harder.

This is true. It's supposed to sound more raw in nature, and like AFD, it's a lot more straight forward hard rock. Even more so, as it has the punk motif, including the mic leaking the chatting before and after the songs like "give me a bit of volume on this". 

I love how Raw Power sound so full, yet it doesn't even have that many overdubs. The ending with Slash's lead isolated in the right channel (instead of the center channel) against both Duff and Axl's vocals is perfect, the song doesn't get weaker in this moment even if the rhythm layer are just Gilby and Dizzy. I believe it's merit of the mix getting everything there at the right levels, including the drums.

8 hours ago, axlvai said:

And the tour.... this is the best imo, just put 1 show per year at least and make some 4K restoration with 60 fps minimun.

To have 4K/60 they had to record it in that way. If you're talking about the 90s shows, obviously they didn't. They could have some footage shot in film (instead of betacam that was used for the screens) that could have a 4K restoration, but that wouldn't be 60 fps.

I wish they have 4K restoration for their other videos, though. It's So Easy looks gorgeous in 2160p in the video they released last year. 

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18 hours ago, Voodoochild said:

I think both AFD and TSI have a different sound profile with the tracks arrangements. I'll talk more about this after the next quote, but I agree the drums are a bit loud. And I really like TSI's sound, don't get me wrong.

This is true. It's supposed to sound more raw in nature, and like AFD, it's a lot more straight forward hard rock. Even more so, as it has the punk motif, including the mic leaking the chatting before and after the songs like "give me a bit of volume on this". 

I love how Raw Power sound so full, yet it doesn't even have that many overdubs. The ending with Slash's lead isolated in the right channel (instead of the center channel) against both Duff and Axl's vocals is perfect, the song doesn't get weaker in this moment even if the rhythm layer are just Gilby and Dizzy. I believe it's merit of the mix getting everything there at the right levels, including the drums.

To have 4K/60 they had to record it in that way. If you're talking about the 90s shows, obviously they didn't. They could have some footage shot in film (instead of betacam that was used for the screens) that could have a 4K restoration, but that wouldn't be 60 fps.

I wish they have 4K restoration for their other videos, though. It's So Easy looks gorgeous in 2160p in the video they released last year. 

I mean.... whatever they would make to improve the tapes they have to the top!! I will (and all u too) go crazy. 

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I'm fine with the overall production on all the GN'R albums actually. I think the UYIs sound the best overall though. 

If anything, I would LOVE to get AFD as a completely dry mix like the version of Brownstone from the 12" single. I just think that song sounds SO much meaner without all the reverb. I can't imagine how great the rest of the album would sound that way. 

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3 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I'm fine with the overall production on all the GN'R albums actually. I think the UYIs sound the best overall though. 

If anything, I would LOVE to get AFD as a completely dry mix like the version of Brownstone from the 12" single. I just think that song sounds SO much meaner without all the reverb. I can't imagine how great the rest of the album would sound that way. 

Which 12” single is that version of brownstone on?

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3 hours ago, janrichmond said:

image.png.8a59755a0e36ebda2d9adb557cf67f54.png UK release 1987

Oh shit, I’ve got that one, can’t say I ever listened to it, got it more as a shelf piece but I’ll definitely be digging out my turntable now.

do you think the AUstralian pressing would have the same versions?  The track list is the same.

 

Edited by megaguns1982
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On 3/28/2020 at 9:45 PM, megaguns1982 said:

Oh shit, I’ve got that one, can’t say I ever listened to it, got it more as a shelf piece but I’ll definitely be digging out my turntable now.

do you think the AUstralian pressing would have the same versions?  The track list is the same.

 

I would think so, yeah. That version of Brownstone is by far my favorite. I would LOVE to get the rest of AFD mixed the same way as that version. 

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8 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I would think so, yeah. That version of Brownstone is by far my favorite. I would LOVE to get the rest of AFD mixed the same way as that version. 

I gave it a listen last night, it’s pretty awesome. And yeah I agree totally.... I can’t believe I’ve had the thing for 20 plus years and never knew about it

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16 minutes ago, megaguns1982 said:

I gave it a listen last night, it’s pretty awesome. And yeah I agree totally.... I can’t believe I’ve had the thing for 20 plus years and never knew about it

I'm glad I could help you find out about that mix :)

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The original 7" of it's so easy also has the alt mix of mr brownstone as a b-side. I just checked the it's so easy 7" in my L&L set and it has the regular album version of mr brownstone as a b-side. It's supposed to be a copy of the original single right?! What a bummer.

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