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Edward Nigma

When Are Guns Going To 'Bury' Appetite?

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I think there's nothing wrong with moving past a record. Nirvana wanted to move past Nevermind, and their acoustic show in '93 for MTV showed they still had something to say; GN'R probably wants to do the same thing, but I could never picture them not playing Jungle, It's So Easy or Nightrain

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10 minutes ago, UsedYourIllusion said:

I think there's nothing wrong with moving past a record. Nirvana wanted to move past Nevermind, and their acoustic show in '93 for MTV showed they still had something to say; GN'R probably wants to do the same thing, but I could never picture them not playing Jungle, It's So Easy or Nightrain

It would appear I can't help but derail this thread lol but I don't think of Nirvana Unplugged as any sort of movement past Nevermind. I do however, see In Utero as a gigantic step past it.
 

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In Utero was basically Kurt's statement against Nevermind. 

It was consciously crafted to be the anti-thesis of everything that Nevermind was.

It's kind of like In Bloom writ large. 

Great record.

And as much as I like Unplugged, it's half covers, but a musical direction they could've / should've explored.

Kurt's last song, "You Know You're Right" is something he was immensely proud of, as a sonic relation to AIC but kind of the direction I wouldn't really cared for them to take. 

Edited by Wagszilla
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On 9/10/2018 at 3:37 PM, RussTCB said:

IMO yes, definitely. 

Not to derail, but I think WYWH, Animals and The Wall are all better than DSotM. 

I lean that way too but I still love DSotM

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48 minutes ago, ZoSoRose said:

I lean that way too but I still love DSotM

Oh, well, of course. I go through phases where I absolutely ADORE Dark Side. I never dislike it but I do think those other albums are better overall.

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14 hours ago, ironmt said:

Not In This Lifetime. 

I beat you to this 3 days earlier on the first reply to the thread! :-)

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2 hours ago, Gnrcane said:

I beat you to this 3 days earlier on the first reply to the thread! :-)

Good job. and true. Sorry I missed that.

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On 9/11/2018 at 3:31 PM, Wagszilla said:

In Utero was basically Kurt's statement against Nevermind. 

It was consciously crafted to be the anti-thesis of everything that Nevermind was.

It's kind of like In Bloom writ large. 

Great record.

And as much as I like Unplugged, it's half covers, but a musical direction they could've / should've explored.

Kurt's last song, "You Know You're Right" is something he was immensely proud of, as a sonic relation to AIC but kind of the direction I wouldn't really cared for them to take. 

In Utero, though, it must be remembered, was a commercial flop before Cobain's death.

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14 minutes ago, Fashionista said:

In Utero, though, it must be remembered, was a commercial flop before Cobain's death.

And?

 

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On 9/10/2018 at 8:22 AM, gnfnrs1972 said:

I don't believe anyone has ever forced you to buy it, listen to it, or read about it. You can bury it yourself if you want.

Isn’t the OP referencing a quote from Axl Rose where he said he wanted to “bury” Appetite? And then later said he never wanted to be an artist that didn’t create new music and instead just lived off their old material. 

Your point is true. No doubt. 

But shouldn’t fans be able to comment on things that Axl Rose has actually said?

It was also said that Axl was trying to create a masterpiece with CD. That he was trying to create the next legendary album. 

I agree that at this stage of his career GnR shouldn’t be worried about burying their greatest album. 

But it would be amazing if Axl decided to share some of his latest (even if that means 15 year old) songs with his millions of fans. Slash and Myles aren’t trying to create the greatest rock album of the last 20 years. They are just a pair of musicians trying to create an album that their fans will enjoy. Wish Axl has the mindset concerning his fans. 

I don’t care if CD2 isn’t on the same scale as Appetite. I just yearn to hear new material with Axl on vocals. 

Edited by Apollo

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10 minutes ago, Apollo said:

Isn’t the OP referencing a quote from Axl Rose where he said he wanted to “bury” Appetite? And then later said he never wanted to be an artist that didn’t create new music and instead just lived off their old material. 

Your point is true. No doubt. 

But shouldn’t fans be able to comment on things that Axl Rose has actually said?

The post doesn't say it has been edited, but when I just went back to read it just now it seems that it has been changed up a little. If I am wrong about it being reworded and changed I apologize. Not for my post you quoted but being wrong about it being changed.

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Nevermind, I reread the Op again. I still stick by my original comment.:lol: I have a lot of shit going on in my life at the moment.

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11 hours ago, Wagszilla said:

And?

 

It wouldn't have half the legacy it does if Kurt had lived in my opinion. And I say that as a Nirvana fan. If Kurt had lived, In Utero would've been seen much like the UYIs - a challenging, interesting record with some great singles moving in a new, softer direction. 

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On 9/11/2018 at 2:11 PM, Len Cnut said:

It happened with Elvis yeah but with Elvis he was never really anything other than a pop star.  He was just a singer.  Probably my favourite solo artist of all time and an absolute cultural behemoth but he didnt have that artsy intellectual edge that John had, Elvis was never gonna come out and say anything against the established order, Elvis was never gonna be at the forefront of a counter culture, Elvis never had the chance to fly across the world in the age of mass media and telly to have these images sent home of entire miles and miles of city block shut down by an ocean of bodies whilst The Beatles stood on a balcony giggling.  His level of fame was most definitely comparable but at the same time it never got the chance to be so vividly fleshed out.  Like the Shea Stadium example I gave, who did that before The Beatles?  In the relatively simple times of the early to mid 60s you must have some pretty high ideas about yourself or you’d die of fright before you got to the stage.

And then everything you do, everything you wear, the drugs you take, every type of haircut you get, every hat you put on all becomes like...chic.  I can imagine someone in that position in life becoming a bit fuckin’ mental.

And yknow, I got a lot of time for the artiste types.  I like the opposite too, dont get me wrong but like...there’s room for all.  I think John was a prodigy to be honest.  So talented in so many avenues, such a naturally sharp wit, a bit of a bully with it too really, definitely not without his faults but a brilliant fella.  I think the same about Paul too, whoose contribution to even the artsy expansive free thinking side of The Beatles is immensely underrated.  And George Harrison was a brilliant understand guitar player, had this instinctive knack of transforming entire songs with just these little touches.  And Ringo to me is as important to The Beatles as Charlie Watts is to The Stones.  Despite what many drum snobs will tell ya Ringo put a distinctive stamp on those songs.

I always wondered how Americans ever swallowed The Kinks.  Their first album was very American but then almost immediately they were off on their own thing.  But I dont think cultures are necessarily devisive, its an exchange of information isn’t it, like how me and you are into so much yank stuff, on paper the blues for instance shouldn’t appeal to us.

 

Just wanna comment on the last point - The only record I've ever heard in full by The Kinks is the Lola album and it reminds me of the Stones. 

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7 minutes ago, Fashionista said:

 

Just wanna comment on the last point - The only record I've ever heard in full by The Kinks is the Lola album and it reminds me of the Stones. 

You should listen to the first two or three, i think you'd like them.  Start from the debut. 

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On 9/11/2018 at 9:54 PM, Fashionista said:

Elvis was a good precedent for the massive level of fame the Beatles would later have and he still stayed a pretty grounded guy (even with the drug addiction). He didn't become holier than thou. For that matter, neither did the other 3 Beatles, really, at least publicly. John's personality was just that of a pretentious artiste. None of the other 3 were. 

I get that it's a tribute to music hall music but in American culture, that sort of sound is basically, it sounds like Winnie the Pooh music. And it's not just that song, but all of Paul's shit that was like it. The Beatles, like Oasis, are just too British musically for me. And yeah, the Stones were British guys too but they acted the part of Americans in a sense, so they're more relatable in a way. The Beatles' personas and their music was just so much more British.

Further on this, The Stones had their very own ''English phrase'', 1966-67, ''Mother's Little Helper'', the entirety of Between the Buttons but especially ''Something Happened to Me Yesterday'', ''Dandelion'', Bill's ''In Another Land''. ''Lady Jane'' is baroque courtly Tudor, 

Quote

 

My sweet Lady Jane
When I see you again
Your servant am I
And will humbly remain
Just heed this plea, my love
On bended knees my love
I pledge myself to Lady Jane

My dear Lady Anne
I've done what I can
I must take my leave
For promised I am
This play is run, my love
Your time has come, my love
I pledge my troth to Lady Jane

Oh, my sweet Marie
I wait at your ease
The sands have run out
For your lady and me
Wedlock is nigh my love
Her station's right my love
Life is secure with Lady Jane

 

 

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Anyone expecting a b(r)and in their 50's to bury an iconic album from 30 years ago, is deluded.

They didn't do it with the Illusions records so it's never going to happen.

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23 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Further on this, The Stones had their very own ''English phrase'', 1966-67, ''Mother's Little Helper'', the entirety of Between the Buttons but especially ''Something Happened to Me Yesterday'', ''Dandelion'', Bill's ''In Another Land''. ''Lady Jane'' is baroque courtly Tudor, 

 

There's a fair bit else about The Stones that is very English really but I was reticent to elaborate on it all because it feels like picking peanuts out of poo, your points here are quite pertinent though.  Backstreet Girl feels quite English to me somehow but I struggle to explain how.

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It's hard to explain for me but even when the Stones at their most "British", it never comes close to the old, teddy bear feel The Beatles had. Also, I never liked the Disney-esque gimmick that these were cool good boys, close lads, friends, like there's this fuckin Harry Potter vibe to The Beatles, "Oi, it's John, Paul, George and Ringo", it was all too "we're all best of friends we are o' course" bullshit. The Stones never seemed like that. And Mick and John were about as far apart as people as two could be. Mick to me is like an honorary American. The Stones, even when they were doing stuff like Lady Jane, there was a very "tongue-in-cheek" vibe to it. When The Beatles did that kind of thing, it was dead serious. That same aspect of British culture that I hate about Oasis. Hard to explain but that's how it looks from this American's perspective.

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1 hour ago, Len Cnut said:

There's a fair bit else about The Stones that is very English really but I was reticent to elaborate on it all because it feels like picking peanuts out of poo, your points here are quite pertinent though.  Backstreet Girl feels quite English to me somehow but I struggle to explain how.

Carnaby Street. Saville Row. That is what that song says to me. Swingin' London town. Twiggy. Miniskirts.

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7 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

Carnaby Street. Saville Row. That is what that song says to me. Swingin' London town. Twiggy. Miniskirts.

Yeah.  And not only that but thematically.  Sort of like the tart and the toff type of feel.  .  There's mention of riding horses and being common and coarse and curtsies and that, its fetishistic in an odd way.  Has a wonderful little melody too.  It kinda has that Lady Jane feel but Lady Jane lays it on a bit too thick. 

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Just now, Len Cnut said:

Yeah.  And not only that but thematically.  Sort of like the tart and the toff type of feel.  .  There's mention of riding horses and being common and coarse and curtsies and that, its fetishistic in an odd way.  Has a wonderful little melody too.  It kinda has that Lady Jane feel but Lady Jane lays it on a bit too thick. 

They always chucked a lot of Englishisms into even their more American recordings such as the citation of 'Dixie Dean' in ''Rip this Joint''. 

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36 minutes ago, Fashionista said:

When The Beatles did that kind of thing, it was dead serious.

I disagree with this, I don't think The Beatles were serious when they did anything.  About 90% of it had a fun and piss takey feel about it, which you can't really say about The Stones but then I guess you could equally hold that against The Beatles.  And if you think they were being dead serious when they were doing stuff like When I'm 64 then you've really missed the point :lol:  And also, they sort of were friends in that way, I mean they lived in each other pockets almost from their teens til their late 20s/30s, they were about as close as you can get.  But to say they were always putting on a facade of closeness even in public, again, is just wrong.  John at least is constantly taking the mickey out of others in interviews or gettin' little barbed quips in.

7 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said:

They always chucked a lot of Englishisms into even their more American recordings such as the citation of 'Dixie Dean' in ''Rip this Joint''. 

Yeah see this is the stuff I was talking about when I was saying I didn't wanna get into it all because it'd be like picking peanuts out of poo. 

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