Genre you thought you would play forever... That is DEAD to you now?

[DeadSlash]

This seemed like it would be a fun thread.

Is there any type of game you thought you would play forever, but it's dead to you now?  What is it?  Why did it die out for you?  I'll start

Genre: MMORPG

Pinnacle: Asheron's Call  (Yeah, before Assasins Creed there was another AC!)

How I found it:I had never played an MMORPG before, Everquest didn't appeal to me in the slightest. I actually had beta access to Asheron's Call (that I got from a Microsoft rep) and didn't even touch it because they told me it was the "Everquest Killer."  I only got it because Resident Evil 3 was like a month away and I wanted to kill time.  My friend had gotten Asheron's Call and was nagging me to try it.

Why it was so awesome: It was a massive open world, without loading screens.  I had never seen anything like it (not sure if there WAS anything like it) and it was the wild west.  You could pick a direction and go running and eventually find things you had never seen before, and had no idea if anyone else had.  You learned of things from other players, in game, in real time.  It 1999, and the internet was NOT what it is today.  Not every quest/mission/dungeon was documented on well laid out web sites.  You even had to figure out how to cast spells through experimentation!  Spells were a a candle, a scarab and a combination of 12 herbs and powders out of like 50 and you just tried different combinations until your spell did something beside *fizzle*.  Once you knew a spell, you would tell all of your clanmates.  Same thing with new dungeons, chests etc.  There was no global chat, so if you wanted to talk to people, you went to a town.

Some of the most fun online gaming that me and my best friend ever had came during those days.  Just running around looking for shit (The visuals were good for that time, also)  We run across old notebooks with spells we hand wrote, coordinates to dungeons, etc.  snap a pic and send a "remember this?" text and get a good laugh.

 

Why it is now DEAD to me:  I actually played AC on and off until the closed it for good in December of 2016, but the reason it will never be replicated is because of the timing of its release.   The internet was so far from what it is today, no game will ever require exploration like Asheron's Call.  Today, before a game goes live, you have your choice of a dozen websites to see every single quest/easter egg/location etc.  Even if you avoid spoilers, you are never going to discover shit that is new to EVERYONE.   My personal expectations have ALSO changed because of the internet.  As much as I look back at the game fondness, I would not tolerate a game where I had to fail at spells 1,000 times to run across one that worked,  I wouldn't accept a game with no global chat, and I'd probably rage quit the first or second time I got lost or ran 40 minutes only to find it was wasted time because there is nothing for me to do where I ended up.

  It really is a situation that cannot be duplicated because of modern tech, and if it was, it would flop, hard... but goddam, it was awesome back in the day.

Edited October 13, 2018 by DeadSlash

[AxlRoseCDII]

5 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

Military shooters. I used to play Medal of Honour and Call of Duty back in the day. MoH is absolutely dead and after CoD4 that series went down hill and is now shit. Also, I've decided games like this are tone deaf and basically make a mockery of real wars and atrocities.

The concept of these games were alright. In some aspects as a person who enjoys history I thought they’d be a partly educational and interesting way to experience the wars. But these days its all ruined by microtransactions and DLC and milking the series.

[LightningBolt]

I'll throw another vote towards first-person shooters. For a while there in middle school I was really into them. Call of Duty back in the 2-4 days I was really into it. I'm way more into Japanese games and indie games these days. Really into platformers and JRPG's. I always played platformers and stuff growing up but they're definitely my main interest now.

[arnold layne]

Tycoon games. 

RollerCoaster Tycoon is amongst one of my favorite games of all time. I thought they'd be pumping out Tycoon games forever. But nope. Atari bought it put and raped the franchise. 

Tycoon games are a lost genre of the late 90s and early 00s. Kids these days may have the option to play shitty mobile tycoon games, but they're not nearly the same. 

God bless Chris Sawyer. 

[OmarBradley]

Cool thread.

Genre: MMORPG

Pinnacle: Star Wars Galaxies (pre-NGE)

How I found it: I was in middle school at the time. I had played Jedi Academy with a friend, and he kept telling me about this huge SW game where you could be anything you wanted to be and explore iconic locations from the films (and much more!). This would have been mid-2003 if I remember correctly. I picked up the game a month or two after he did, in late '03.

Why it was so awesome: I had played a decent amount of games, but nothing before was like this. I know Everquest was a thing, and maybe the first Guild Wars was out around that time too? But in terms of 3D rendered MMOs with complicated profession, combat, and crafting systems... nothing compared to SWG. At least, nothing I'd played or heard of. I started out as a Rifleman and worked my way up to a Bounty Hunter/Commando build before unlocking Jedi. I had a little green Rodian, wish I still had screenshots. Think I made it to Lieutenant in the Imperial faction. My character's name actually ended up being one of the main few names I use when creating online accounts (forums, new games, messenger software, etc.). I've been using it for close to 15 years!

PVP and guilds/clans were very big in SWG, as with most MMOs. There was a stupendous community of hardcore SW fans and gamers, as the game's mechanics attracted a bit more of a sophisticated crowd than some of the comparative MMOs (WoW, etc.). The game wasn't perfect on release, quite a few things had to be added in via patch (speeders, space travel, bug fixes, etc.), but the feeling of openness and being in the SW world was unparalleled. I still consider myself a decnetly big gamer, but these days it's rare for me to play anything for more than 2-3 hours in a row, and that's on the upper bound. Back in the SWG days, I played for... a lot longer than that sometimes LOL. 

I could probably type endlessly about the game and my experience in its unfortunately short-lived golden era. But no one wants to read that (except me ), so I'll stop.

However, if anyone played SWG too, check out this article. Fascinating account of the game's development and initial release from a lead developer.

Why it is now DEAD to me: 

The Combat Upgrade was jarring at first. It pretty radically changed the game's combat and introduced other changes as well. I believe the Jedi village showed up around this time too. It made the game a bit different, but it was still the mostly-familiar epic MMO it was before. 

Then, about a year later, the NGE came. New Game Enhancements... or Experience? I don't really remember. All I remember is that everyone hated it and it came out of nowhere. I think it was announced like 2-3 weeks before it was rolled out (fall 2005). It significantly changed the game, almost to the point that I'd say SWG pre-NGE and post are two different games, just both in the SW universe with the same planets. So many of the mechanics were simplified and streamlined. Anyone could now become a Jedi, there was no arduous path of learning and experience toward it. They also shaved it down from something like 26 professions, to 12. There were some balance problems in the beginning of the NGE, don't know if they were resolved as I never really went back to the game after that.

I kept playing for a month or two after the NGE's release, but the game was so different, and worse. It just wasn't as much fun, it wasn't the same game. So I cancelled my subscription and left, along with hordes of other players during this time period. I would check in every now and then via free trials maybe once a year, and each time less and less people on my friends list/guild list would be active. 

I didn't really follow the game after this, I know there were some expansions like Hoth and other stuff, but eventually the game was shut down. When ToR was announced, everyone knew it likely meant SWG was heading toward its demise, especially given the radical shift in gameplay it endured, and the poor reception it received for it.

 

[OmarBradley]

10 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

Military shooters. I used to play Medal of Honour and Call of Duty back in the day. MoH is absolutely dead and after CoD4 that series went down hill and is now shit. Also, I've decided games like this are tone deaf and basically make a mockery of real wars and atrocities.

While I agree with your last sentence to a degree, I don't think it necessarily means we shouldn't be able to enjoy these products. I'm not a big CoD fan, but I do love Battlefield. CoD and Battlefield both have large military communities. I'd recommend it if you haven't tried it. Battlefield 4 could probably be gotten for pretty cheap.

I also would add that although these games in a way aim to mimic war/fighting, they're not really comparable to real battle. CoD is so far from actual fighting that I consider it more of an arcade game than a war game (multiplayer at least). Battlefield's a bit better, but still not really accurate. Arma is probably the closest thing.

I do agree that we (Americans at least) romanticize war and fighting, partially due to video games, movies, and novels. But I don't think that means these forms of media should be prohibited from exploring battle, despite the fact they very rarely get it 100% correct.

 

[OmarBradley]

18 hours ago, DeadSlash said:

Why it was so awesome: It was a massive open world, without loading screens.  I had never seen anything like it (not sure if there WAS anything like it) and it was the wild west.  You could pick a direction and go running and eventually find things you had never seen before, and had no idea if anyone else had.  You learned of things from other players, in game, in real time.  It 1999, and the internet was NOT what it is today.  Not every quest/mission/dungeon was documented on well laid out web sites.  You even had to figure out how to cast spells through experimentation!  Spells were a a candle, a scarab and a combination of 12 herbs and powders out of like 50 and you just tried different combinations until your spell did something beside *fizzle*.  Once you knew a spell, you would tell all of your clanmates.  Same thing with new dungeons, chests etc.  There was no global chat, so if you wanted to talk to people, you went to a town.

Some of the most fun online gaming that me and my best friend ever had came during those days.  Just running around looking for shit (The visuals were good for that time, also)  We run across old notebooks with spells we hand wrote, coordinates to dungeons, etc.  snap a pic and send a "remember this?" text and get a good laugh.

 

A lot of this reasoning is why I loved SWG so much too. I missed Asheron's Call, but SWG generated a lot of these same feelings and had similar mechanics.

EDIT: I thought all of these replies would naturally be added to my initial post. Instead, I've just triple posted.  pls don't ban

Edited October 13, 2018 by OmarBradley

[WhazUp]

Growing up I used to love playing the old Myst games from the 90's and 2000's, I loved how they were so atmospheric but also very isolated in-game in the sense of it is mainly you as the player navigating these visually stunning worlds trying to figure out the puzzles and the story piece by piece.  

I don't really see many games that pop up that capture that same vibe

[DeadSlash]

@WhazUp I knew so many people that played Myst, and LOVED it, but I never tried it.

@OmarBradley SWG was among the many games my friend and I tried in our vain attempt to relive out Asheron's Call glory days.  The thing I remember most about that game was a huge momentum killer it had early on.  The process of becoming a Jedi was cloaked all through development, and shortly after release it was discovered that only a few people would have the ability to be a Jedi and they couldn't find out if they had the power until end game levels.  It was like luck of the draw type of thing, there was no path for *anyone* to become a Jedi.  It really pissed people off hardcore.  I remember my friend calling me and telling me, he was so mad! I was too, but he was really pissed.  I think we bailed before the combat was changed, but I went through that in Asheron's Call 2.  AC1 outlasted it's own sequel going from 1999-2017, whereas AC2 only had a five year run.  The biggest dagger in the games heart came about 6 months in.  Now, granted, it was already a massive disappointment that is wasn't Asheron's Call redone with modern graphics, but it was still a fun game... until they took a steaming shit on it by nerfing all classes like 40% or 55% in damage.  The Dev team got a bee in their bonnet because they wanted people to play in parties, but people seldom did.  Their solution was to make everyone so weak, that grouping was mandatory, and soloing was not an option. I quit by the end of that month, and my friend had already quit.  It was a ghost town in 3 months, and never rebounded.  One thing I'd like to point out was that my friend and I didn't "rage quit" in protest, we quit because it simply wasn't fun and we went back to AC1.

@Oldest Goat Amen to that.  MOH was my JAM back in the day, with my peak time being when they released the one with all the expansions, (Allied Assault, I believe.)  There was already a downtick in quality from the first one, and I think it was the 3rd of the expansion packs that was awful, but it was still an awesome series, then it started to descend.   The First COD was really good, I liked the second one too.  Now it's jetpacks and shit.  Agree of BF1 also, not sure how much you read on 2, the next BF, but it's even worse.  They are still pushing the "historic" line, but you can be things like a cyborg, a black woman dressed as a Viking, and other clearly NOT WW2 era soldiers.

@LightningBolt I never got into platformers, but indie games are some of the best out there these days.

[OmarBradley]

12 hours ago, DeadSlash said:

 

@OmarBradley SWG was among the many games my friend and I tried in our vain attempt to relive out Asheron's Call glory days.  The thing I remember most about that game was a huge momentum killer it had early on.  The process of becoming a Jedi was cloaked all through development, and shortly after release it was discovered that only a few people would have the ability to be a Jedi and they couldn't find out if they had the power until end game levels.  It was like luck of the draw type of thing, there was no path for *anyone* to become a Jedi.  It really pissed people off hardcore.  I remember my friend calling me and telling me, he was so mad! I was too, but he was really pissed.  I think we bailed before the combat was changed, but I went through that in Asheron's Call 2.  AC1 outlasted it's own sequel going from 1999-2017, whereas AC2 only had a five year run.  The biggest dagger in the games heart came about 6 months in.  Now, granted, it was already a massive disappointment that is wasn't Asheron's Call redone with modern graphics, but it was still a fun game... until they took a steaming shit on it by nerfing all classes like 40% or 55% in damage.  The Dev team got a bee in their bonnet because they wanted people to play in parties, but people seldom did.  Their solution was to make everyone so weak, that grouping was mandatory, and soloing was not an option. I quit by the end of that month, and my friend had already quit.  It was a ghost town in 3 months, and never rebounded.  One thing I'd like to point out was that my friend and I didn't "rage quit" in protest, we quit because it simply wasn't fun and we went back to AC1.

There was definitely a learning curve/slow pace to the beginning of progression in the early SWG days. But once you made decent progress into 1 or 2 initial professions and started participating in guilds/groups, it made it a lot more fun. Like with AC2 as you're saying, SWG was definitely made to encourage group play (at times at least).

I was fine with the Jedi thing. Jedi get too much of the spotlight in the SW universe. The movies revolve around them, but the SW world often doesn't - especially in the time period SWG took place (original trilogy timeframe). And SWG was about being immersed in the SW universe, not following the storyline from a movie. Given the lore, it wouldn't make sense to have 10,000 Jedi running around (but they did it anyway with the NGE).

There was a methodical way to become a Jedi, it just wasn't revealed initially. I think that's more hardcore than just immediately loading up the game, starting a Jedi quest-line from "the Jedi quest-line NPC," and grinding what you needed to in order to get through. In the article I linked, they talk about their original ideas for Jedi, and one was basically the profession/holocron unlock system the game shipped with, but applied to every action in the game, not just mastering professions. And it would have been different for every player. The intention was to reward people for pursuing their preferred playstyles (as long as it included moderate diversity), instead of forcing a profession grind on everyone - which is basically what happened once word got out about the game's actual system.

There weren't really "levels" in pre-NGE SWG, but yeah you probably would have mastered at least one advanced profession before unlocking Jedi. It took probably at least 50 hours of play to unlock Jedi, and IMO, why should it be easier or less work? I get that the unknown of "how do we even do it?" was annoying in the beginning, but there was so much else to do in that game. 

I don't recall the announcement you're referring to, about only a few people being able to become Jedi. I am pretty sure anyone had the potential, you just had to go through the lengthy, uncertain system. Even if they did explicitly say "only a few people will become Jedi," I'd still stand by that system/statement. Jedi should be rare, powerful, and difficult to acquire. Every player should have the access to unlocking it, but by no means should every player be able to succeed at getting it easily or without arduous work. I like the system because if you really really wanted to become a Jedi, you could put in the time to do it. But if you just sort of casually wanted to become a Jedi because it's like, "cool, Jedi, lightsabers, shoot lightening out of my hands, etc." then you had to decide if it was really worth it for you. I remember everyone was sort of continuously trying to become Jedi, but only a very few people were seriously trying. 

You would have preferred the village system, probably introduced in 2004. Every player had the same set amount of actions to undertake (explore place X, get badge from helping NPC Y, master two professions, etc.) and once you completed the list, an NPC would arrive and tell you how to get to the Jedi village (after a fight, if I recall correctly). Then you'd go to the village and start your Jedi quest-line. The forums/gaming sites had the process detailed exactly within a few months of its inception into the game. That's not as much fun IMO.

[OmarBradley]

20 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

I'm 100% against censorship unless it's something insane like brothels being advertised next to a school. I think it's okay to take liberties with serious subjects like WW1, WW2 etc to create fictional scenarios/stories but when it gets to a point where you're acting out a specific terrible situation that happened in real life like the Normandy beach landing or something in an unrealistic way for entertainment like Battlefield 1 which actually has the audacity to pridefully advertise as being accurate - that's in poor taste imo. I mean what's next, press X to go into the gas chamber? Achievement Unlocked "#NeverForget"

Battlefield 1 was WWI, so Normany wouldn't be featured. Battlefield V is WWII, and the rumor is Normandy will be in DLC. Was it a horrific loss of life for the allies, despite it's strategic decisiveness? Yes. Does that mean that games shouldn't recreate the setting if they're not adhering to 100% realism? No, I don't think so at least.

I think the Battlefield games strive to attain a realism more-so than CoD, but no player would agree that BF is overall "historically accurate." I don't recall which marketing you're referring to, but if that phrasing was used, I would assume it referred to things like weaponry and weapon mechanics, maps/settings from the war, solider's uniforms, etc.. There are probably inaccuracies too, but other forms of media suffer from that as well.

I also fail to see the leap you assert in your last sentence. I'm not even sure what you're exactly arguing. Why shouldn't gas chambers and Nazi cruelty be depicted in video games? Games are a form of media, and media can teach and invoke emotion. When done correctly, it's a really special thing that's pretty unique compared to other media, and that's why I love video games.

[wasted]

GTA. 

[DeadSlash]

@OmarBradley  Yeah, Battlefield openly pushed the historical accuracy thing.  It was mostly around when they released the initial trailer and screens.

I looked up that SWG Jedi thing, and it's really hard to find articles from launch, the closest I could find was an interview with the dev team post release, where they were asked about there not being Jedi and how to become one, but the dev's played coy and said that they were tracking it and some players were getting close.  I couldn't find anything talking about the Jedi being pre-selected, and not anyone could be a Jedi.  It certainly was a thing, because half of the people I played with left, and it was reported by like EGM or something.   I wonder if it was changed quickly, or simply misunderstood because the dev team was so mum on the process.  The way I understood it was that there was a long journey to unlock the force sensitive, and it took a long time to complete.  At the end of this, you would find out that you had no midiclorian<sp?> and could not become a Jedi.  There were stats and explanations about it and all.  1 was in the stats, so it was like 1 in 10k or something and the reasoning was that it would not be Star Wars if everyone was a Jedi.  In retrospect, it might have been a rumor that the dev's simply didn't deny because they wanted people to figure it all out, but once it exploded and started costing them players, they clarified? idk.  Nothing like that would ever happen today, the path for becoming a Jedi would have it's own wiki page 6 months prior to release, sigh.

[OmarBradley]

11 hours ago, Oldest Goat said:

It was some dev interview behind the scenes thing I saw, could have been about stuff like weaponry but they were also talking about how respectful to soldiers/dead they were being and how important that was for them It's not at all respectful to them imo. 12 year olds screaming in your ear and everyone having fun playing a game in the trenches with mustard gas. Just feels kind of awkward and tonedeaf. Like imagine going back in time and talking to those who fought and died in the mud and telling them how much fun you had 'remembering' them. "I love this map! *stares at their confused soon to be dead faces*"

I roll my eyes at something like women soldiers in a WW2 game but tbh the more I think about it the less I care and actually would prefer if they went in that direction of fuck it; women, cyborgs, fiction etc. Rather than feign any kind of authenticity because it isn't. I love videogames too and I'm well aware of how people use the medium as a scapegoat, I'm not, I'd criticize any other medium it's just that I happen to be talking about this specifically.

Something like "press X to go into the gas chamber; achievement unlocked" is disrespectful, in poor taste and exploitative. It's a cheap and jarring attempt at pretending to be more than it is and isn't doing it correctly. Like in CoD "Press X to pay your respects" at literally a recreation of an actual veteran graveyard.

Here's two examples of doing it right; SpecOps The Line and Wolfenstein II The New Colossus

I looked up SpecOps, the gameplay looks nearly identical to the Clancy/BF/CoD style single-player campaigns, with the addition of a cover mechanic. Wolfenstein's gameplay meanwhile, bears almost nothing in resemblance to real battle. And the plot of Wolfenstein is the Nazis won WWII... and you think a veteran would be more offended that someone could play a digital rendering of the lands they visited and the weapons they used to fight the Nazis ~75 years ago? Even if that rendering is not 100% accurate, it still gives the player a rough idea of real history. If you said "MP40" or "Market Garden" or "ACOG" or "heavy barrel" to almost anyone (more likely male*) aged 18-35 right now, there's a good chance they're familiar with those terms solely due to games like CoD and BF. 

And I don't consider Wolfenstein offensive, but it seems you should given your standards. Or you may want to redefine what you mean by tone-deaf/mockery of real wars. I agree that a WWII game shouldn't have soldiers with bionic limbs and katanas (unless they're Japanese). But that craziness in BFV is an outlier, generally these games are within realistic and respectable bounds of the aesthetics of the time period(s).

Thanks for clarifying that statement, I see what you mean. Yeah, I get that it seems odd to take such an emotionally-charged and serious topic and insert perfunctory actions like "Press E to examine the charred corpses." But to me, that's minutiae - it's just there to make it easier for you to move along the narrative, because it's a game and it can't take control from you too much - you are the one doing it. That being said, I'd agree when treating a tragic and serious topic in game development, it probably is better to let the game take control for a few moments to respectfully put you into the situation. 

Movies are better at historical accuracy and dealing with the tone's presentation, but video games have to be created to fit the consumption of a singular person's active interaction. A film is a passive activity. While this doesn't relinquish developers who create historically-related games from responsibility in maintaining accuracy, it means game development sometimes requires a bit of leeway in that area. There is more control available to the developer in single-player modes, where the narrative can guide your actions and push you through the game. But in multiplayer (which BF, CoD, etc. are known for and played for), the developer does not have as much control.

And my last argument, from your post, it seems you have more of a problem with the maturity of the audience than the nature of the games themselves. Sure, there are immature 12 year olds (mostly on CoD #sorrynotsorry), but there are huge mature communities for all of these games. Like I said above, that includes a large amount of active and reserve military personnel.

*According to Wikipedia, it's 15%m vs. 6%f that identify as gamers, and 60% of that 6% plays almost exclusively mobile games. Data is probably ~5 years old though, so it's possible there's been a shift. 

10 hours ago, DeadSlash said:

@OmarBradley  Yeah, Battlefield openly pushed the historical accuracy thing.  It was mostly around when they released the initial trailer and screens.

I looked up that SWG Jedi thing, and it's really hard to find articles from launch, the closest I could find was an interview with the dev team post release, where they were asked about there not being Jedi and how to become one, but the dev's played coy and said that they were tracking it and some players were getting close.  I couldn't find anything talking about the Jedi being pre-selected, and not anyone could be a Jedi.  It certainly was a thing, because half of the people I played with left, and it was reported by like EGM or something.   I wonder if it was changed quickly, or simply misunderstood because the dev team was so mum on the process.  The way I understood it was that there was a long journey to unlock the force sensitive, and it took a long time to complete.  At the end of this, you would find out that you had no midiclorian<sp?> and could not become a Jedi.  There were stats and explanations about it and all.  1 was in the stats, so it was like 1 in 10k or something and the reasoning was that it would not be Star Wars if everyone was a Jedi.  In retrospect, it might have been a rumor that the dev's simply didn't deny because they wanted people to figure it all out, but once it exploded and started costing them players, they clarified? idk.  Nothing like that would ever happen today, the path for becoming a Jedi would have it's own wiki page 6 months prior to release, sigh.

Now that's sounding sort of familiar, but I don't remember the details. And I'm having a hard time believing it was basically just a lottery (side note: remember player-run lotteries in cities? one of the many small but cool details in SWG). I'm going to re-look at that article I linked and talk to some fellow SWG expatriates, see if we can get to the bottom of this .

Funny you recall the devs saying "someone was close." In the article, the guy says they ran projections after SWGs' release, and the results indicated the first Jedi would show up around 2012 (9 years later). So, someone was lying or very wrong when they said that.

[downzy]

EA Sports games, particularly NHL and Madden.  I use to play these religiously in the 90s.  Still remember the original NHL for Sega Genesis.  Blew me away.  Then each successive game started introducing new features and innovation margins justified buying the following year's product.  

Then the games stopped innovating and I found myself and friends more interested in having updated rosters.  I think around '01 or '02 is when I stopped playing NHL and Madden and focused on Tiger Woods.  Loved that game, but like all things EA, they drove it right into the ground with releasing the same game almost every year.  Didn't help that each year's edition would be buggier than the last.  The last Tiger Woods game was almost unplayable and became even worse after EA Sports issued a patch.  

Other game formats I use to play a lot of but don't anymore was story-driven adventure games (Kings Quest, Space Quest, Leisure Suit Larry, etc.).  But the industry stopped making these kinds of games a long time ago. 

FPS were something I played a lot of in the early 90s when games like Doom, Quake, Descent and other PC-based shooting games were around.  Then everything moved to the console and I missed my keyboard and mouse setup. 

 

[DeadSlash]

1 minute ago, downzy said:

EA Sports games, particularly NHL and Madden.  I use to play these religiously in the 90s.  Still remember the original NHL for Sega Genesis.  Blew me away.  Then each successive game started introducing new features and innovation margins justified buying the following year's product.  

Then the games stopped innovating and I found myself and friends more interested in having updated rosters.  I think around '01 or '02 is when I stopped playing NHL and Madden and focused on Tiger Woods.  Loved that game, but like all things EA, they drove it right into the ground with releasing the same game almost every year.  Didn't help that each year's edition would be buggier than the next.  

Other game formats I use to play a lot of but don't anymore was story-driven adventure games (Kings Quest, Space Quest, Leisure Suit Larry, etc.).  But the industry stopped making these kinds of games a long time ago. 

FPS were something I played a lot of in the early 90s when games like Doom, Quake, Descent and other PC-based shooting games were around.  Then everything moved to the console and I missed my keyboard and mouse setup. 

 

You might love this game.  It's awesome.  It even has a setting for how pixilated you want it to look, incase you want to go REALLY old-school.  I think a version might go to consoles, but this is a PC game.  DUSK

 

@OmarBradley  I saw an article, people regaling their glory days of MMO's and SWG was one of them.  It's not exactly what I said, but this mentions speculation that the Jedi were broken, or not even in the game.

By now you may be asking, where are all the Jedi?? To stay true to the timeframe of the movies, there are only a handful of Jedi left in the universe, so for continuity reasons the developers had to come up with a system to keep Jedi very rare. There was a heap of mystery around how to unlock a force-sensitive character slot, much to the frustration of players. The developers kept teasing us by saying certain in-game actions would work towards opening a force-sensitive character slot. The actions required were left for players to discover. For months, players were scratching their heads trying to work out what this meant in terms of gameplay. There was literally no information to be found on the internet, no google searches, no walkthrough, no hints at all! Many thought it would have something to do with defeating end-game content.After about four months or so, there was not a single player who had unlocked anything remotely force- sensitive. Players started getting salty and were accusing the developers of lying about the process, as if they hadn’t finished developing/testing Jedi yet and were stringing players along. This wasn’t the case and to appease the player base, the developers ended up introducing items called Holocrons. These were rare loot drops from high level NPCs that hinted at the mastery of multiple professions as a requirement for unlocking the force-sensitive character slot. So now players had a goal, though it was still a massive unknown. How many professions did you have to master? How would you know if the profession you just mastered was one of them?

 

[Iron MikeyJ]

I agree with @downzy in regards to sports games. Although I still play NBA 2k games, even they only really do a roster update and minor changes over the previous game. $60 per year for the same game, is ridiculous. So I usually just update the rosters myself, and stuck with the same game for 2 or 3 years.

I will probably be the opposite of most of you, most modern games dont do much for me. I like the games of yesterday more than the newer games. I honestly prefer beat em' ups, fighting games, dungeon crawlers and shoot em's ups MORE than games like COD or GTA. I also don't typically like games that take more than 3-4 hours to beat. I get bored, move on, and never finish them. I can play an old school beat em' up like Final Fight, beat the game in an hour or two, get my fix, and move on. I dont have the time, or the desire, to play a 60 hour game. 

I also PREFER local  CO OP over online play. It's just more of an entertaining gaming experience playing with 2-4 people together (in the same room), as opposed to 20 online. 

[downzy]

I don't really begrudge sports game for being repetitive and irritative at this point.  There reaches a point with any genre where there's not much more to add; they're bound to hit the law of diminishing returns.  

I just got tired of having the same experience while at the same time the improvements would require a steeper and steeper learning curve.  The demand on my time as I got older became too much and it began to feel as though the commitment required for most console games became too much.  You don't get a lot of free time once your'e an adult and even less so once you become a parent, so the idea of diving into something extremely technical like a sports sim or RPG becomes a little too daunting.  My friends are always trying to get me to play CoD online with them but they seem so much better than me that I'm basically shark chum and really don't have the 20+ hours a week (which is probably on the low end compared to the 14 year old kid who has nothing better to do) to invest and become competitive.  I realize the gaming world is increasingly becoming multiplayer, but that leaves me out.  I think that's why mobile games have taken off, the learning curve and time investment is low.  

The only console games I have time for nowadays are marquee events like Grand Theft Auto or Red Dead Redemption.  The production, from storyline, environment, themes, details are so impressive that I can't avoid spending some time with them.  The only other game I would set aside time to play would be a Star Wars Tie Fighter/X-Wing game should they ever decide to make another one.  I'd buy a PS4 Pro and VR headset in a second if I they ever made an updated VR version of Tie Fighter.   II'll also play the odd racing game, or whatever is free at the moment thanks to Games with Gold on Xbox.  I've been having fun playing Forza Horizon 2, which was given away in August.  

[-W.A.R-]

EA having an exclusive deal with the NFL and not being able to make an NBA game to save their life to compete with 2k doesn't help matters. Its really a shame what 2k has evolved into with the micro transactions. 2k11 was amazing and is still probably the greatest basketball game, but they quickly went down hill when they introduced virtual currency in 2k13. Now on top of $60 for basically minor changes and an updated roster, you have to pour in even more money if you want to do anything other than quick matches.

Edited October 17, 2018 by -W.A.R-

[DeadSlash]

11 hours ago, downzy said:

 I think that's why mobile games have taken off, the learning curve and time investment is low.  

You know what really sucks about this?  This is trending toward more complicated games. 

You talk about that learning curve, and man... I haven't gotten Madden in 4 years, but I used to get it every year.  I'm old.  My glory days were like Madden 93'  When you look at the game now, you need a doctorate in gameology to play defense in the fucking thing.  It's like as involved as being a real football player.  And they are making it harder every year.

 

As a curiosity, I watched a Madden 18 tourney game that was shoutcasted.  At one point  they started talking about a mismatch  "While player X is an 85 in speed, his press coverage is only 76, so Player Y has the advantage with 82 speed and 84 rout running.  Remember the cut animations are 73% faster for player Y so the dig route should be there all day."   I'm not kidding when I say that when I say that I had the real life impulse to spit on them.

[Iron MikeyJ]

Another thing about modern games that bums me out, is sacrificing a great single player or local CO OP for online multiplayer. I have nothing against online multiplayer, and if you love it, more power to ya. But it seems like THAT is the focus now, and the "traditional" aspects are becoming an after thought, or in some cases, a nonfactor. 

Take Friday the 13th and Dead by Daylight for example. I genuinely LOVE the premise of those games, and I wouldn't say "get rid of the online aspect," but they seem to be missing out on some REALLY great gaming possibilities. As a fan of F13, Halloween, Nightmare on elm street, etc to have some REALLY quality story modes, that let you relive the films...  That would be BEYOND epic. They just seem perfect for a video game retelling of all of those films. Sure it would cost more money for development, but the end results would be AMAZING. Those would be console sellers for me (and many others I'm sure). As it stands, they are both good games, but a little incomplete imo. They were designed from the ground up for online play. At least F13th had SOME (limited) offline and single player aspects, but only enough for a few days (at most) worth of entertainment. 

My point in this is... Once the servers for these online games go off line (and they will), the game becomes lost to time. Which is really a shame. 20 years from now, games like these will ONLY be a thing from memory (or online videos). You wont be able to toss it into your machine and play it anymore. That's just sad imo. It's the untalked about reality of the current generation of gaming. That's honestly one of the BIGGEST reasons why games and systems from the Xbox, Ps2, and Gamecube and EARLIER generations WILL ALWAYS be the most collectable. They represent the era of physical media, and games that will last forever. Start your collections now my friends.

[DeadSlash]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 12:19 AM, Oldest Goat said:

You know what I just realised? 2K will probably put microtransactions in the next BioShock. Fucking lame.

Spend real money for A.D.A.M.

Do you know what is AMAZING to me, and really, REALLY scary?  How a lot of younger games will defend the fuck out of microtransactions.  When you discuss microtransactions in a negative tone on Steam forums, there will be about 30% - 50% of the replies jumping down your throat for "being poor."

[DeadSlash]

On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 3:37 PM, Iron MikeyJ said:

Another thing about modern games that bums me out, is sacrificing a great single player or local CO OP for online multiplayer. I have nothing against online multiplayer, and if you love it, more power to ya. But it seems like THAT is the focus now, and the "traditional" aspects are becoming an after thought, or in some cases, a nonfactor. 

Take Friday the 13th and Dead by Daylight for example. I genuinely LOVE the premise of those games, and I wouldn't say "get rid of the online aspect," but they seem to be missing out on some REALLY great gaming possibilities. As a fan of F13, Halloween, Nightmare on elm street, etc to have some REALLY quality story modes, that let you relive the films...  That would be BEYOND epic. They just seem perfect for a video game retelling of all of those films. Sure it would cost more money for development, but the end results would be AMAZING. Those would be console sellers for me (and many others I'm sure). As it stands, they are both good games, but a little incomplete imo. They were designed from the ground up for online play. At least F13th had SOME (limited) offline and single player aspects, but only enough for a few days (at most) worth of entertainment. 

My point in this is... Once the servers for these online games go off line (and they will), the game becomes lost to time. Which is really a shame. 20 years from now, games like these will ONLY be a thing from memory (or online videos). You wont be able to toss it into your machine and play it anymore. That's just sad imo. It's the untalked about reality of the current generation of gaming. That's honestly one of the BIGGEST reasons why games and systems from the Xbox, Ps2, and Gamecube and EARLIER generations WILL ALWAYS be the most collectable. They represent the era of physical media, and games that will last forever. Start your collections now my friends.

It's funny because Me and my friend has a similar conversation in the height of our Asheron's Call days.  When it's gone, it's gone.  There is no offline.  I actually remember some of the very early MP only games.  There was one that (I really wish I could remember the name) was touted as having the best graphics on the market, and being well balanced etc. and it fell flat on it's ass on release.  This is probably 2000ish.  Most reviews chalked the failure up to having no SP.  Today, that's not an issue for games.  Hell, I remember when Quake 3 launched, people thought it was risky that the SP was really simulated MP.  Those days are dead and gone.   

 

Talk of SP games pretty much going away is starting to gain some traction.  Like you, I don't mind MP games, and I would say I probably game MP about 50% of the time, but I miss those days of epic multiplayer games, and (old person alert) Playing Madden with 3 other friends on the Genesis, or Golden Eye with 3 friends.  Sad face

[OmarBradley]

 

13 hours ago, DeadSlash said:

It's funny because Me and my friend has a similar conversation in the height of our Asheron's Call days.  When it's gone, it's gone.  There is no offline.  I actually remember some of the very early MP only games.  There was one that (I really wish I could remember the name) was touted as having the best graphics on the market, and being well balanced etc. and it fell flat on it's ass on release.  This is probably 2000ish.  Most reviews chalked the failure up to having no SP.  Today, that's not an issue for games.  Hell, I remember when Quake 3 launched, people thought it was risky that the SP was really simulated MP.  Those days are dead and gone.   

 

Talk of SP games pretty much going away is starting to gain some traction.  Like you, I don't mind MP games, and I would say I probably game MP about 50% of the time, but I miss those days of epic multiplayer games, and (old person alert) Playing Madden with 3 other friends on the Genesis, or Golden Eye with 3 friends.  Sad face

A lot of developers/publishers are keeping servers up. Jedi Academy servers are still up, you can play pretty much any Battlefield game too. I agree that co-op has largely been dropped in favor of larger MP modes, but personally, I prefer that. My friends don't play video games, so I don't have a crew to do co-op with. I did play a Ghost Recon Wildlands trial that had a co-op mode, and admittedly it was fun, but I haven't lost sleep over not being able to play it anymore (trial ran out).

I don't think SP games are going anywhere. Multiplayer has seen definitely a surge in the last ~10-12 years. But there are still plenty of great singleplayer games being made - I haven't had trouble finding good SP games to play. Co-op, yeah that's a different story.

13 hours ago, DeadSlash said:

Do you know what is AMAZING to me, and really, REALLY scary?  How a lot of younger games will defend the fuck out of microtransactions.  When you discuss microtransactions in a negative tone on Steam forums, there will be about 30% - 50% of the replies jumping down your throat for "being poor."

I think there is a way to do micro-transactions correctly. And it seems the industry is moving that way: cosmetics only. BFV and FO76 will both operate this way. For Honor is pretty close to being cosmetic-only. And the developers are promising that due to this micro-transaction revenue, all DLC for these games will be free. That's a fair trade IMO. I'll let whoever wants to drop $100 on a rainbow outfit if it means I get DLC for free.

[Iron MikeyJ]

If/when Microsoft comes out with a new Xbox or If/when Playstation 5 comes out, I can guarantee you support for 360 and PS3 will be GONE. Add 20 more years to that, and current gen online only games will also have NO SUPPORT. They might be doing a decent job with it for now, but it'll only last so long. So my original point stands.