DieselDaisy Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 You have yourself a full-blown ''Soul Argument'' there Len. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 13 minutes ago, DieselDaisy said: You have yourself a full-blown ''Soul Argument'' there Len. Yes, well a blindness to the poetic majesty of Axl Roses lyrical prowess will not go unchallenged around there here parts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Len Cnut said: You're mixing your verses up, the 'special' place where 'if i stayed too long I'd probably break down and cry' is from the first verse, its the second one when he starts talking about 'her hair reminds me of a warm safe place where as a child I'd hide and pray for the thunder and the rain to quietly pass me by'. And how do you know its tears of pain? He's talking about looking at a bird he loves and the way looking at her makes him feel, it could be tears of joy or tears simply by being over-awed by the emotion he feels for her, which is a bit more likely than when i look at her i think of when my Dad used to kick the shit out of me and it makes me want to cry Yes, of course it could theoretically be tears from laughter except that he literally talks about breaking down and crying I can't take you seriously. Edited March 28, 2019 by SoulMonster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 11 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Yes, of course it could theoretically be tears from laughter except that he talks about "[breaking] down and cry" I can't take you seriously. Except no one said laughter, in the same way that your lyric quotes from SCOM weren't the lyrics of SCOM. You're not very good at this discussion lark are you? You're good at making em long but the making sense aspect ain't your strong suit. Still, nevermind eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 19 minutes ago, Blackstar said: Right Next Door to Hell has some interesting lyrics. The chorus is about Axl's neighbour, but the verses are about the Axl/the band dealing with success and Axl's childhood. Those are probably some of my favourite Axl lyrics, I'll take a nicotine, caffeine, sugar fix. Jesus, don't you get tired of turnin' tricks?, how can you not like a song that starts off like that? And then the part about his mother gives an insight into his upbringing. Deep stuff. 11 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: I can't take you seriously. I already gave up on the previous page... hahaha. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, EvanG said: I already gave up on the previous page... hahaha. Well, you should have stayed the course and received a barrage of insults, you weakling. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 14 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Well, you should have stayed the course and received a barrage of insults, you weakling. I didn't know you were that sensitive Soulie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAU3R Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Even though I might get banned for this, prefer 4tus' solo on Nightrain to the original.. far more interesting to listen to as a guitarist and very well structured Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hidin´Stradlin Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 I started to hate Rocket Queen. It got extremely long. All covers should be left out, specially Live and Let die. Coma should be played very ocasionally. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnfnrs1972 Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 I think they should quit touring and put out a new album every 6 months. I find live performances very boring. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Just now, gnfnrs1972 said: I think they should quit touring and put out a new album every 6 months. I find live performances very boring. They could really do with a Neil Young or Buckethead style album release spree to readdress the problem that their discography is smaller than a gnat's penis. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UsedYourIllusion Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 15 hours ago, SoulMonster said: Oh sorry, we were talking about lyrics. I believe Axl wrote the lyrics to YCBM. But I have to agree with you, I also generally prefer rockers over ballads. As for Izzy's penmanship, I find his lyrics rather simple, without any depth, and almost childishly naive. Not that that is necessarily bad in itself, it takes a really good writer to make simplistic lyrics good. For most part I just don't think Izzy succeeds (or even tries), and it comes off as something just about anyone could put together. My favorite is probably Dust n Bones which at least tries to express a nice sentiment. Axl can be a great lyricist. Of course this comes down to personal preference, but the span of topics, often reflective, expressed in depth with plenty of pictures and allegories, with references to art and culture, makes for a much more interesting read, in my humble opinion. Take Catcher In The Rye as an example. The lyrics might not always be easily accessible, but at least he tries and he has ambitions. I agree, 14 years has good lyrics, but it really only applies to Axl and him. Didn't Izzy write the Don't Cry lyrics? Maybe i'm mistaken. Dust N' Bones the lyrics go well with the flow and rhythm of the song-especially live. Versus Axl, Izzy does seem to come off overly simplistic. But, it works for his style of music. Izzy, along with Duff and Steven needed bounce off of each other and contribute to make some of those magical songs happen, like You Could Be Mine, most of the songs off Appetite, Civil War etc. If you look at all the solo releases of each member-lets consider CD as a part-for the sake of argument; all of the works seem to contain flaws that could be helped with the input of the other members. On the other note, pop lyrics and love go hand in hand, people absolutely love repetition-thematically, lyrically, melodically, and rhythmically in lyrics. Hence why having a repeating chorus that sticks in your brain is the calling card of pop music. SCOM, i think for a lot of people is overplayed, November Rain-albeit a masterpiece-seems to miss that emotion expressed in the acoustic/cutdown '93 version of the song. The Saskatoon, Hartford, Argentina versions are my favorite. Cutdown, showcasing the impressive lyrics, and composition by Axl. This overproduction, at least for me, carries over into CD and is turned up to 11, as if Axl was trying to still be Queen, Elton John, or Bowie. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ericstacey Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 On 3/25/2019 at 5:39 PM, mattromero said: Velvet Revolver should have continued with Chester Bennington on vocals while he was alive. And they should come back one day This, and Contraband was a much better record than Chinese Democracy. I still think CD is good, but Contraband is better than any release by Axl, Slash, or Duff since the Illusion albums. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Bird Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 It's 5 o'clock somewhere is a very strong record. With the input of Axl and Izzy it would have been a masterpeace and totally worth a GNR album. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadApples87 Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Axl, Slash, Duff got back together and did the semi-reunion tour. I'm glad they did. It was good to see them together again. It gave a lot of people a chance to see them, that otherwise never got to see them together. My (perhaps) unpopular opinion is that now they should call it a day. Slash should continue with Myles. Duff can do his solo stuff. Axl (drop the GNR name) can pursue solo work. Unless they reunite with Izzy and Steven or Matt, there is no more to retread here. Go out on top! 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scream of the Butterfly Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 20 hours ago, Len Cnut said: or tears simply by being over-awed by the emotion he feels for her That's how I always interpreted that specific line of the song. It seems that at the time Axl wrote SCOM he was still more focused on happy childhood memories. Even the memory of the thunder and the rain is a happy one, because he's in a warm safe place. Axl grew up in the Midwest, a region known for its powerful thunderstorms. There's no reason to believe the thunder in his childhood memories is anything other than the real thing. Thunder and rain as a metaphor for child abuse is very lame, so I hope that's not how he intended it. Taken literally, I think the lyrics are fine. 21 hours ago, Blackstar said: Right Next Door to Hell has some interesting lyrics. The chorus is about Axl's neighbour, but the verses are about the Axl/the band dealing with success and Axl's childhood. Right Next Door to Hell is a great song! Maybe that's my unpopular GNR opinion? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Scream of the Butterfly said: That's how I always interpreted that specific line of the song. It seems that at the time Axl wrote SCOM he was still more focused on happy childhood memories. Even the memory of the thunder and the rain is a happy one, because he's in a warm safe place. Axl grew up in the Midwest, a region known for its powerful thunderstorms. There's no reason to believe the thunder in his childhood memories is anything other than the real thing. Thunder and rain as a metaphor for child abuse is very lame, so I hope that's not how he intended it. Taken literally, I think the lyrics are fine. When I express this opinion I’m ‘trolling’ and not worth taking seriously or blinded by hatred for Axl Rose I thought it was a beautiful little love song but apparently its about how his true love reminds him of child abuse Edited March 29, 2019 by Len Cnut 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvanG Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 17 minutes ago, Len Cnut said: When I express this opinion I’m ‘trolling’ and not worth taking seriously or blinded by hatred for Axl Rose I thought it was a beautiful little love song but apparently its about how his true love reminds him of child abuse Who knows what it reminds him of? But it's hard to understand that you consider a ''baby, baby, I love you best, you're in my heart'' song not more sappy than a song reminiscing about childhood and not using all the cliché words in the book. Then I do question whether or not you're trolling. But then again, you might think the movie Love Actually is not sappy either. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 17 minutes ago, Len Cnut said: When I express this opinion I’m ‘trolling’ and not worth taking seriously or blinded by hatred for Axl Rose I thought it was a beautiful little love song but apparently its about how his true love reminds him of child abuse No, it was impossible to take you seriously because you weren't able to admit that the lyrics to SCOM contains more emotional depth than the lyrics Baby Love. As for what SCOM is really about, that is a matter of interpretation and no one will hold it against you if you don't agree that the song is not sappy happy but contains verses that imply childhood trauma. That is also one of the beauties of poems and I am sure Axl never wanted the lyrics to be unambiguous. Btw, if you accept that the song is both about the childhood of the singer and the experiences of that child as the ongoing love interest, then even the title (sweet CHILD o' mine) and the alternating lines in the choruses (child/love) takes on another meaning. And it is patently false, as someone else implied, that Axl, at the time of writing the song, was focused on happy childhood memories. Axl has never been focused on that, as far as I know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselDaisy Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 4 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: No, it was impossible to take you seriously because you weren't able to admit that the lyrics to SCOM contains more emotional depth than the lyrics Baby Love. As for what SCOM is really about, that is a matter of interpretation and no one will hold it against you if you don't agree that the song is not sappy happy but contains verses that imply childhood trauma. That is also one of the beauties of poems and I am sure Axl never wanted the lyrics to be unambiguous. Btw, if you accept that the song is both about the childhood of the singer and the experiences of that child as the ongoing love interest, then even the title (sweet CHILD o' mine) and the alternating lines in the choruses (child/love) takes on another meaning. And it is patently false, as someone else implied, that Axl, at the time of writing the song, was focused on happy childhood memories. Axl has never been focused on that, as far as I know. What a load of cobblers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 23 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: No, it was impossible to take you seriously because you weren't able to admit that the lyrics to SCOM contains more emotional depth than the lyrics Baby Love. As for what SCOM is really about, that is a matter of interpretation and no one will hold it against you if you don't agree that the song is not sappy happy but contains verses that imply childhood trauma. That is also one of the beauties of poems and I am sure Axl never wanted the lyrics to be unambiguous. Btw, if you accept that the song is both about the childhood of the singer and the experiences of that child as the ongoing love interest, then even the title (sweet CHILD o' mine) and the alternating lines in the choruses (child/love) takes on another meaning. And it is patently false, as someone else implied, that Axl, at the time of writing the song, was focused on happy childhood memories. Axl has never been focused on that, as far as I know. Oh mercy! Mercy Lord Soulie! If you spare me this one time I promise I’ll never contradict you again From science to literature and all in between, you got that shit on lock boi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 (edited) 56 minutes ago, EvanG said: But it's hard to understand that you consider a ''baby, baby, I love you best, you're in my heart'' song not more sappy than a song reminiscing about childhood and not using all the cliché words in the book. I believe the phrase I used was 'not a far cry from' i.e. they are in the same ballpark, close enough, not a great deal in it...even with the addition of childhood reminiscences, thats not sufficient, to my mind, to elevate one into a whole other category of artistic merit. I really don't care to argue degrees within that framework regarding more or less sappy, its just a fools errand, who decides that, how do you quantify such things, its why my initial observation was deliberately imprecise, because thats the extent of the comment I wish to make over it, I really don't care about this whole Axl vs Izzy celebrity deathmatch thing. Remember my position throughout this debate and indeed prior to it is that rock lyrics are generally not very substantial in terms of poetic merit anyway. If any of yous think that there is a world of difference between SCOM and say Baby Love by The Supremes or whatever Izzy song then thrash it out, be my guest, you can argue yourself til you're blue in the face about the difference between SCOM and Think About You, knock yourself out Edited March 29, 2019 by Len Cnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 (edited) Why both interpretations (re: Sweet Child O' Mine) can't be valid? We don't know what Axl was thinking and the interpretation that he may have been thinking of bad memories is not out of place. And when you have lyrics where two themes, even simple and "cliché" are intertwined (love and childhood memories) and lyrics having one cliché theme (love) simply written, the former lyrics are more complex in comparison to the latter. I thought that wouldn't be arguable. Edited March 29, 2019 by Blackstar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoulMonster Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 5 minutes ago, Blackstar said: I thought that wouldn't be arguable. Well, that's one of Len's strengths, he can happily argue anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Cnut Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 11 minutes ago, SoulMonster said: Well, that's one of Len's strengths, he can happily argue anything. And make sense while I'm at it, which is usually where your troubles begin But kudos, I'll never listen to SCOM again without getting visions of Axl getting belted across his living room by his old man, thank for that 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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