F*ck Fear Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 What a film! I will be buying this one when it comes out. I really hope that it remains a stand alone film, though. No need to water it down with a sequel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysteron Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 I saw it on Sunday and enjoyed it. I just saw it as a good backstory for one of the villains in the Batman universe, and it felt like a Batman movie beit a bit more violent than usual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coma16 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Just got back from the cinema. Thought it was a great film! He was only a "pussy" while he was on his meds, and gained much confidence as the film progressed, so I believe he is a great JOKER. Ledger was the best (and I grew up on the Nicholson version). I wonder how much of the movie was a delusion. From a societal standpoint, this is why I have some reservation regarding mentally ill "criminals" back on the streets. Who's to say they will stay on their meds.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 (edited) Saw it today. I think it tries so hard to be “realistic” that the handful of things that aren’t realistic stick out like a sore thumb. It tries so hard to “be” real but doesn’t “feel” real... oh also that “twist” was way too obvious. Edited October 19, 2019 by rocknroll41 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 Oh almost forgot! Here’s my ranking of all the different Jokers (theatrical films only): 1.Heath Ledger 2.Mark Hamill 3.Joaquin Phoenix 4.Jack Nicholson 5.Cesar Romero 6.Zach Galifianakis (from The Lego Batman Movie) 7.Jared Leto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flake Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 What was the ending about? Was it all in his head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknroll41 Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 1 hour ago, Flake said: What was the ending about? Was it all in his head? As Axl once said at the end of Back Off Bitch: “I think it’s one of those things each person needs to interpret in their own special way.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F*ck Fear Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 01 Heath Ledger 02 Joaquin Phoenix 03 Jack Nicholson 04 Mark Hamill 05 Cesar Romero I don't rate the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 19, 2019 Share Posted October 19, 2019 5 hours ago, Flake said: What was the ending about? Was it all in his head? I think it is like that to make you ask that question. I do not think it actually was though. If it was then it makes some plot points kinda pointless. He also looks older in the end scene which to me implies that time has passed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Share Posted October 20, 2019 Saw it last night and it's stayed with me all through today. One of the darkest and most depressing films I've seen in a very long time. It's difficult to say that I enjoyed the film since it was two hours of pain, misery and abandonment, but it definitely left a mark. I think those making lists comparing various jokers is missing the point. It's not really about the Joker as a fully-fledged character. It's about how someone could possibly become the embodiment of chaos and anarchy. Ledger's version of Joker was great, no doubt, but it's not really comparable to what Pheonix is doing in this film. It's something completely different. In many ways this exploration of the character is more profound, impactful and meaningful. It sheds the lens of Batman and forces the audience to consider who and what the Joker really is. For some knowing who the Joker is or was is missing the point. But for myself and others, who found the journey enthralling, the film was worthwhile and wonderfully executed. Personally it's one of my favourite movies in years and one that I will want to revisit many times. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Share Posted October 20, 2019 On 2019-10-06 at 3:41 PM, Iron MikeyJ said: Sometimes being evil for the sake of being evil is ALL we need. For me that's just too simplistic. The old binary concept of evil on one side and goodness on the other is neither realistic nor interesting. Nor is it reflective of how all of us operate throughout our lives; even the best and worst among us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Share Posted October 20, 2019 On 2019-10-07 at 12:06 PM, Iron MikeyJ said: Its watering down the character though, that's my point. You really need to see the film then. It does the exact opposite of what you're accusing it of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downzy Posted October 20, 2019 Author Share Posted October 20, 2019 On 2019-10-11 at 12:00 PM, Amir said: I thought it was pretty good, but could have used a bit more subtlety/a defter touch in certain moments. Hide contents Don't need the psychiatrist reading out what's shown on screen, don't need the flashbacks of the girl not being there because we already know when she says "You're Arthur, right?", just need to see the clown follow Thomas and Martha Wayne, don't need to see the actual killing/pearls flying etc. Also should have just ended there. To be honest, I actually enjoyed those moments. They made it clear, for me at least, that the only moments Arthur appears happy are really in his own mind. It helps reinforce the open interpretation of the ending and keeps things vague. How much of the film is real and how much of it is in Arthur's mind? For me it strikes to what is an essential element of the Joker's character: how much, if any, can you trust. I also appreciated the small homages to previous iterations of the character. From his leaning against the cop car window (Ledger) to the dancing (Nicholson), to the faithful reenactment of Bruce's parents being killed. I thought it was well done. I do disagree that showing Bruce's parents being killed was unnecessary. The context of their deaths, of who his parents (well, his father) were, changes a few things from the viewers perspective. The death of Bruce Wayne's parents death in previous adaptations were simply the slaughter of two innocent people. In this film Bruce's father is almost recast as the villain. The paternalism espoused by Thomas throughout the movie in light of the hardships faced by the less fortunate make him a highly unsympathetic character. So it's interesting to review his death from that shift in perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 3 hours ago, downzy said: Saw it last night and it's stayed with me all through today. One of the darkest and most depressing films I've seen in a very long time. It's difficult to say that I enjoyed the film since it was two hours of pain, misery and abandonment, but it definitely left a mark. I think those making lists comparing various jokers is missing the point. It's not really about the Joker as a fully-fledged character. It's about how someone could possibly become the embodiment of chaos and anarchy. Ledger's version of Joker was great, no doubt, but it's not really comparable to what Pheonix is doing in this film. It's something completely different. In many ways this exploration of the character is more profound, impactful and meaningful. It sheds the lens of Batman and forces the audience to consider who and what the Joker really is. For some knowing who the Joker is or was is missing the point. But for myself and others, who found the journey enthralling, the film was worthwhile and wonderfully executed. Personally it's one of my favourite movies in years and one that I will want to revisit many times. I definitely agree with you, it was a completely uncomfortable experience and I feel like it was amazingly well done. I am going to and see it again at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 (edited) On 20/10/2019 at 6:02 AM, downzy said: To be honest, I actually enjoyed those moments. They made it clear, for me at least, that the only moments Arthur appears happy are really in his own mind. It helps reinforce the open interpretation of the ending and keeps things vague. How much of the film is real and how much of it is in Arthur's mind? For me it strikes to what is an essential element of the Joker's character: how much, if any, can you trust. I also appreciated the small homages to previous iterations of the character. From his leaning against the cop car window (Ledger) to the dancing (Nicholson), to the faithful reenactment of Bruce's parents being killed. I thought it was well done. I do disagree that showing Bruce's parents being killed was unnecessary. The context of their deaths, of who his parents (well, his father) were, changes a few things from the viewers perspective. The death of Bruce Wayne's parents death in previous adaptations were simply the slaughter of two innocent people. In this film Bruce's father is almost recast as the villain. The paternalism espoused by Thomas throughout the movie in light of the hardships faced by the less fortunate make him a highly unsympathetic character. So it's interesting to review his death from that shift in perspective. I think that Thomas Wayne being potrayed that way was a take on the character that hasn't been done before, he has always been shown as a great guy, but maybe that was just how Bruce saw him because he was his dad? I think that people who are complaining about it possibly not understanding the character should see the movie, there are many small moments that make you question what is even real throughout the film and if Arthur is telling the truth or not. This really came to mind when I started thinking about it. Edited October 23, 2019 by Jw224 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron MikeyJ Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 14 hours ago, downzy said: You really need to see the film then. It does the exact opposite of what you're accusing it of. That could be true. Maybe I'll catch it someday, but I'm really not interested tbh. If people like it, that's great. I was speaking about my perception based on the trailer, and then talking about my feelings on villians as whole (not just that film in particular). Honestly I'm kinda over comic book movies in general right now, that's the biggest reason why I'm not interested in the film. I know someone will say "it's not really a comic book movie though." But for me, the Joker IS a comic book villian, therefore he doesnt interest me right now. It doesnt matter how he is portrayed, he is still a comic book character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 to rate the 3 most recent Joker's Heath Ledger's Joker = Kurt Cobain Joaquin Phoenix's Joker = Dave Grohl Jared Leto's Joker = Krist Novoselic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 2 hours ago, Iron MikeyJ said: That could be true. Maybe I'll catch it someday, but I'm really not interested tbh. If people like it, that's great. I was speaking about my perception based on the trailer, and then talking about my feelings on villians as whole (not just that film in particular). Honestly I'm kinda over comic book movies in general right now, that's the biggest reason why I'm not interested in the film. I know someone will say "it's not really a comic book movie though." But for me, the Joker IS a comic book villian, therefore he doesnt interest me right now. It doesnt matter how he is portrayed, he is still a comic book character. If you're not interested in the film it's fine but you don't need to keep moving the goal posts and making up new reasons for not seeing it, haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lies They Tell Posted October 20, 2019 Share Posted October 20, 2019 On 7.10.2019 at 2:55 PM, Padme said: And that's my problem with Joker. Joker is a comic villain, not the leader of the French Revolution taking place in Gotham. If Batman is fighting against this kind of Joker. Then Batman becomes the symbol of the rich, the oppressors and the corrupted establishment. That's the point! Batman IS the symbol of the rich, the oppressors and the corrupted establishment, from a certain point of view. That's the beauty of these kind of movies. It shows that things aren't as black and white as people like to think. Heroes of some people are often oppressors from another point of view. From Jokers point of view Batman is an idiot who's defending the establishment like a brainwashed sheep. But from a normal persons point of view Batman is the hero, cause even if the establishment sucks and you're suffering, killing people should never be the solution. You should always try to find peaceful solutions. Joker is obviously not a hero, but this movie does a good job in portraying why some might view him as a hero. It was a great movie! Probably the best one I've seen in a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron MikeyJ Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Jw224 said: If you're not interested in the film it's fine but you don't need to keep moving the goal posts and making up new reasons for not seeing it, haha. I dont think I was "moving the goal post," just sharing my thoughts on the given topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris 55 Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 On 10/19/2019 at 12:47 PM, rocknroll41 said: As Axl once said at the end of Back Off Bitch: “I think it’s one of those things each person needs to interpret in their own special way.” I thought that was Slash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moreblack Posted October 21, 2019 Share Posted October 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, Chris 55 said: I thought that was Slash No it's Axl's deeper voice saying it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F*ck Fear Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Each performance is completely different than the last, but I think you can still rate which ones you like best. Based on performance alone. That being said, this movie is fucking amazing. I will be buying it the day it's released for sure as it will get viewed many times over. Hell, my wife who isn't a fan of most modern films, loved this one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soon Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 I gotta see this already! In my world Batman has always been the touchstone for 'the myth of redemptive violence.' That his violence is what will bring peace. He doesnt kill, only bad guys kill, Batman does "good" violence. And yes he's an elite, those are the only people that our society looks to, to sanction violence - that good, redemptive violence. So from that view of Batman, this view of Joker makes sense and is very exciting to consider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jw224 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 This fanmade trailer is pretty cool. https://youtu.be/5wTkg150gmU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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