Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris on fire

[DieselDaisy]

4 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

The golden plates the Mormons hold sacred, do you respect and accept it as holy? Do the catholics? No, it's a crock of shit. Cult leaders are very important to cult followers. An abusive husband is very important to a downtrodden wife.

It's ridicule with good reason flowing from my bleeding heart. It's all that can be done as there's no gentle reasoning with willful ignorance aka faith. I care more about them than someone mindlessly patting them on the back encouraging the foolishness "Aww go on dear, course it's sacred, don't listen to the meanies." That's more patronizing than me treating adults like adults.

When myself or others bring the sanity I am aware there's an interpretation that it's intellectual arrogance - it's not. Intellectually it's shooting fish in a barrel. I figured this stuff out as a very young child, if I wanted to brag and talk down to someone I'd use something less easy. It's not arrogance informing a teenager Santa's not real or saying hey don't put your fucking hands in that fire.

Mormons is a bizarre religion for me personally but its desire to exist and have its icons in situ should be respected - ''I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it'' (Voltaire). 

9 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

Who's they? Dazey?

Dazey is like a crude version of Soul, or, Soul if you locked him in a room for six months somewhere in northern Britain in only his underpants and put him on a diet of Viz magazines, dodgy porn (involving various British soap hags' nether regions), beer and Anglo-American junkfood. 

[action]

7 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

Mormons are bizarre for you but worshipping zombie-son-of-himself hey let's pretend to drink his blood, eat him and do other things like kiss a fake artifact and give pedophiles money and power - that's normal to you and worthy of respect? Respect has to be earned.

I like Voltaire and understand and agree 100% with that quote. That's a foundational value of mine. 

there are bad people in any religion, Oldest Goat. That doesn't mean that every religious person approves of that behaviour, nor does it make their belief any less respectable.

It's too easy to throw everyone on the same pile because of a couple of assholes. What, should christians throw away their belief cos of a couple of pedo's?  my ancestors as far as I can tell, from the 17th century to this day have all been good and devoted people and they didnt harm a soul. So I'm not buying this fashionable, patronising rhetoric that so many people are spouting these days. Each to their own I say, as long as other people aren't bothered.

[Dazey]

1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

Mormons is a bizarre religion for me personally but its desire to exist and have its icons in situ should be respected - ''I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it'' (Voltaire). 

I've no problem whatsoever with people being free to express whatever they please but just because somebody has the right to express a belief doesn't mean that belief should be exempt from criticism. I think we're far too sensitive and politically correct with regard to shutting down free speech but free speech comes at the cost that it must be open to argument. To summarise, I would absolutely fight for your right to say whatever you want but I also reserve the right to tell you if I think you're talking bollocks. 

1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

Dazey is like a crude version of Soul, or, Soul if you locked him in a room for six months somewhere in northern Britain in only his underpants and put him on a diet of Viz magazines, dodgy porn (involving various British soap hags' nether regions), beer and Anglo-American junkfood. 

That's, like, the nicest thing you've ever said about me.  

[action]

25 minutes ago, Dazey said:

I've no problem whatsoever with people being free to express whatever they please but just because somebody has the right to express a belief doesn't mean that belief should be exempt from criticism. I think we're far too sensitive and politically correct with regard to shutting down free speech but free speech comes at the cost that it must be open to argument. To summarise, I would absolutely fight for your right to say whatever you want but I also reserve the right to tell you if I think you're talking bollocks. 

 

by all means, tell us when we're talking bollox. I love me an intelligent discussion about religion and the meaning of life.

but I ask you, at what point in this thread, did you see anyone talking bollox, so you felt triggered to post grossly offensive statements, at a time where the ashes of a beloved cathedral weren't even cooled down?

Was it the people crying when they stood watching?

Was it the 400 firemen who risked their lives saving precious art?

Was is the people noting the historic importance of the building?

Or was it none of the above, but you just felt like crashing in on here, throwing your weight around like a fucking elephant in a porcelain store?

 

[Dazey]

Just now, Oldest Goat said:

I stand by everything I've said. But I'll admit I didn't need to express it in this particular thread and I am genuinely sorry for any disrespect and hurt feelings I've caused. 

Again, the fire is of course a tragedy. Even more so than my blundering impulsive mind.

I'll echo this. I probably could've been a little more sensitive in my ramblings. Maybe I could do with a small dose of shut the fuck up for now.  

[st0n3r]

14 hours ago, EvanG said:

Bruges is beautiful, never been to Ghent, I don’t think it’s too big. 

If you should go to Antwerp, just check out the centre, it’s very walkable and not spread out like Brussels. And the street Cogels Osylei is worth checking out if you are into old architecture, it’s a very stunning street/area.

I am orignally from Ghent and live in Brussels. I can give you some recommendations. Send me a PM with what you would like to know. 

[action]

9 minutes ago, Dazey said:

I'll echo this. I probably could've been a little more sensitive in my ramblings. Maybe I could do with a small dose of shut the fuck up for now.  

hey man, it's ok.

for good understanding, I think you're genuinly funny (most of the times)  

13 minutes ago, Oldest Goat said:

I stand by everything I've said. But I'll admit I didn't need to express it in this particular thread and I am genuinely sorry for any disrespect and hurt feelings I've caused. 

Again, the fire is of course a tragedy. Even more so than my blundering impulsive mind.

it's ok OG. I know you mean well.

[action]

2 minutes ago, st0n3r said:

I am orignally from Ghent and live in Brussels. I can give you some recommendations. Send me a PM with what you would like to know. 

Ghent is really fucking awesome. I love it to death

[EvanG]

26 minutes ago, st0n3r said:

I am orignally from Ghent and live in Brussels. I can give you some recommendations. Send me a PM with what you would like to know. 

Thanks, but it's Dazey who is going there.

But maybe I will go there someday and hopefully run into Herman Brusselmans! He seems like a nice fellow to have a beer with.

[Len Cnut]

Quote

Dazey is like a crude version of Soul, or, Soul if you locked him in a room for six months somewhere in northern Britain in only his underpants and put him on a diet of Viz magazines, dodgy porn (involving various British soap hags' nether regions), beer and Anglo-American junkfood. 

Listen, I'll not have you having a pop my mate Dazey for nothing, he's a good lad, alright so he likes a little cocaine, is of questionable morals, has dinner in his underwear and drinks like Richard Burton.  And I'll have you know that the last bit of hag porn didn't even have a soap star in it...though Grandad looks like he could've used something soapy, the old duffer was knuckles deep lemme tell ya   Or looked like he was for a moment.

Edited April 17, 2019 by Len Cnut

[SoulMonster]

Keep me out of this. I haven't said anything critical of religion in this thread, despite DieselDaisy's inappropriate attempts at goading me into it. There is a time and place for everything, and in that case it would be "all the time" and "our dedicated thread to make fun of religious irrationality" . 

 

[action]

41 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Keep me out of this. I haven't said anything critical of religion in this thread, despite DieselDaisy's inappropriate attempts at goading me into it. There is a time and place for everything, and in that case it would be "all the time" and "our dedicated thread to make fun of religious irrationality" . 

 

"religious" is a label that is put on anything we can't understand, as if to mask our fundamental lack of intellectual capabilities to understand the universe.

scientific progress is limited by the capabilities of our instruments to catch light. Science has actually put forth a theory that "what can not be seen, is scientifically irrelevant and is the realm of religion"

We can't prove how the big bang started? No problem. Religious people try to explain it, and we as scientists are smarter by default.

We can't explain how the cathedrals of france form a pattern that's the star sign of virgo, and this knowledge dates from long after the cathedrals were build? No problem. Cathedrals are religious. Religious people are irrational.

we can't explain near dead experiences? No problem. it probably has something to do with chemical unbalance in the head just before you die. religion doesn't provide the right answer because.... religion

the ignorant people of the middle ages already understood that you have to try to link religion to rationality. Both elevate each other and provide answers the other can't give. see thomas of aquino who wanted to prove the existence of god by using aristotle

Edited April 17, 2019 by action

[dontdamnmeuyi2015]

Of course the church will be rebuilt. Things like this just make people stronger and more determined to do the right thing. So many people have donated money to help rebuild.

I hope it all goes well. This landmark has been standing for over 900 years and it deserves every respect and every effort to rebuild.

 

[downzy]

 

[Dazey]

@Len Cnut @spunko12345  

[DieselDaisy]

(To tune of ''Wiggle Wiggle'').

''Don't stop Peter Beardsley, He's the one who drives me crazy, Dribble, Dribble! Dribble, Dribble!''

[DieselDaisy]

This is getting a bit out-of-hand now,

Quote

Notre-Dame fire: Booksellers urge Hunchback publishers to donate

French booksellers are urging publishers of the novel The Hunchback of Notre-Dame to donate funds to help rebuild the burnt-out cathedral.

Two bookstore owners are calling on publishers of Victor Hugo's iconic book to join the funding campaign.

A fund launched to rebuild the fire-ravaged Gothic cathedral is expected to surpass €1bn ($1.1bn; £870m).

More than €800m has already been raised since the monument was engulfed by flames on Monday evening.

Now Amandine Ardouin and Antoine Bonnet, whose bookshops are based in Paris, are asking other sellers and publishers to do their part.

A share of their income from sales of Hugo's novel, first published in 1831, will be pledged to the restoration project, they told French media.

"It is heartbreaking to make money on this misfortune, so we decided to redistribute these funds to the cathedral repair work," Mr Ardouin told Livre Hebdo.

Within hours of the devastating blaze, Hugo's epic rocketed to the top of Amazon's best-seller list. A French version of the book, published in 1975 by Le Livre de Poche, remained in first place on the best-seller list of Amazon France on Wednesday.

Prices range from €4.60 for the pocket edition, to €43.04 for the paperback, according to the Amazon listing for Le Livre de Poche's releases.

One paperback edition, published by Penguin Classics in 1978, is listed as "temporarily out of stock" on the e-commerce giant's website.

Image copyrightGETTY IMAGES

Image captionScaffolding surrounds Notre-Dame cathedral two days after the devastating fire

Other editions by the Folio Society (1998), Flammarion (1984) and other publishers are still available to buy on Amazon and other websites.

Speaking to Le Figaro, Mr Ardouin said he would like publishers to emulate his "symbolic act" by donating to the cause.

"We would like Folio, Pocket book, Flammarion, who sell this book in pocket format, to do the same," he told the paper. "Literature can save Notre-Dame."

The BBC has approached Penguin, Folio Society, Flammarion and Le Livre de Poche for comment on the calls to donate funds but is yet to receive a reply.

What is the Hunchback of Notre-Dame about?

Hugo's classic tells the tale of Quasimodo, a deformed and half-blind bell-ringer who falls in love with a beautiful young gypsy woman named Esmeralda.

Ashamed of his appearance, he admires her from afar, longing to meet her from the isolated confines of Notre-Dame's bell tower.

A chain of events unfolds in which Quasimodo attempts to protect Esmeralda from his jealous master, Archdeacon Claude Frollo, who also lusts after her. The story culminates in their tragic deaths.

Literary critics argue that Hugo's main motivation for writing the book was to draw attention to the then-dilapidated cathedral and the value of the Gothic architecture.

Image captionWarren Clarke as Quasimodo in the 1970s TV series The Hunchback of Notre-Dame

Why is the novel important to the cathedral?

Prior to the publication of Hugo's book, sections of Notre-Dame cathedral had fallen into disrepair.

He began writing the story, also known as "Our Lady of Paris", in 1829, using the building as the backdrop for his dramatic tale.

At the time, parts of it lay in ruins, having sustained serious damage during the French Revolution.

Hugo's enormously popular novel - set in Notre-Dame's heyday in the 1400s - is partly credited with saving it.

Its roaring success emboldened the historical preservation movement in France, leading to the formation of the Commission on Historical Monuments.

In 1841, architects Eugène Viollet-le-Duc and Jean-Baptiste Lassus led major renovations at Notre-Dame, restoring it to its former glory.

"A commission formed in 1837, in part due to the success of Victor Hugo's novel the Hunchback of Notre-Dame," Dr Emily Guerry, lecturer in medieval European history at the University of Kent, told the BBC.

"That's when a collective group of people in Paris and across France fell back in love with the monument."

Colin Jones, a professor at Queen Mary University of London specialising in the history of Paris, told the BBC Hugo "played an enormous part in the cause of restoration of medieval monuments in the 19th century".

He said the restoration of Notre-Dame cathedral was "in some ways closely associated" with Hugo's famous novel.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-47965174

[soon]

The church had been participating in supporting the Bee population following the colony collapses. They have 3 hives on the roof. And all 180 000 bees survived the fire!

https://www.theweathernetwork.com/ca/news/article/thousands-of-bees-living-on-notre-dame-roof-survive-fire

[Ace Nova]

 

 

Kudos to the Parisian firefighters who risked their lives to save the historic church.  

[Dazey]

3 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

 

 

Kudos to the Parisian firefighters who risked their lives to save the historic church.  

Thoughts and prayers. 

[Dazey]

10 hours ago, lukepowell1988 said:

I'm in Paris on Monday might go have a little look

Once you’ve finished looking round a boring old church get yourself to this place. It’s around the corner and it’s great. 

https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Restaurant_Review-g187147-d810252-Reviews-The_Lizard_Lounge-Paris_Ile_de_France.html

[DieselDaisy]

There is nothing boring about Notre Dame. Oozing history.

[soon]

11 hours ago, lukepowell1988 said:

I'm in Paris on Monday might go have a little look

I'm concerned that you'll cut an epic fart that finally brings the entire cathedral down 

[SoulMonster]

1 hour ago, DieselDaisy said:

There is nothing boring about Notre Dame. Oozing history.

More oozing smoke these days.

[EvanG]

There is a cool bookstore across the Seine from the Notre Dame called ''Shakespeare and Company'', it's about a hundred years old. Worth checking out.