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Tom-Ass

Izzy's involvement in writing new music.

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wiki has soma city ward as giving Izzy a credit. But they also list me as the princess of Canada, so you cant always believe what's on there, lol.

I'm looking at the CD insert now and Izzy has no credits on any songs on the album  nor is he thanks in the credits (neither is Axl).  I'd upload a pic for those interested if I could figure out how to do that on my phone. 

 

I didnt realize that Gilby got the sole credit on "Monkey Chow" until just now.  thought that was cool

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9 hours ago, Tom-Ass said:

Gilby and Matt had some contributions too.. Izzy even had credits on one song.. Not sure Duff could have made it any better as Mike Inez was outstanding on that album but throw Axl on there and it could have been a classic Gn'R album for sure. Musically it is guitar driven and band ass.  I still think it is a pretty strong album but the lyrics and vocals are it's weakest aspect. Not terrible but they could have been better. 

the vocals/lyrics were horrible and most songs. Musiclly though, it might be my favorite solo album by a GNR member. Love the drums and slash most. Gilby is solid and Inez was a great alternative to duff. Really played well on that album. 

 

Now if axl OR izzy had been on the album and or wrote lyrics it probably would have been a hit

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2 hours ago, Gunsdrummer63 said:

the vocals/lyrics were horrible and most songs. Musiclly though, it might be my favorite solo album by a GNR member. Love the drums and slash most. Gilby is solid and Inez was a great alternative to duff. Really played well on that album. 

 

Now if axl OR izzy had been on the album and or wrote lyrics it probably would have been a hit

I wouldn't say vocals are horrible on most songs but they're not on Guns level. And then you've got Songs like Be The Ball and Doin' Fine which are musically awesome but with the dumbest kind of lyrics.

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, Free Bird said:

I wouldn't say vocals are horrible on most songs but they're not on Guns level. And then you've got Songs like Be The Ball and Doin' Fine which are musically awesome but with the dumbest kind of lyrics.

I can't listen to Be the Ball.


Doin' Fine is so musically badass you've gotta just let it in.... The cat is in the dryer, baby. Listen motherfuckers to this song that should be heard! Oh my distorted smile... guess what I'm doing now... somebody raped my tapeworm abortion, comon mothafuckas and deliver the cow!

 

 

Edited by Ant
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Posted (edited)

Izzy might like to write a lot of acoustic, Stonesy, mellow music for his solo albums but he can still turn up and rock the fuck out as seen here.  If he was writing for Guns I can almost bet it would be a lot more hard rocking that most of his solo albums..

This riffage in this song just rocks!!! Throw a little Slash, Duff, Axl and any drummer but Frank on it and BAM!!! A kick ass Gn'R song!

This one is a bit more basic but still rocks hard.. Again, throw some Axl, Slash and Duff on it and you could have some classic sounding Guns.

 

Edited by Tom-Ass
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Keef = The Soul of the Stones, he keeps their songs gritty as much as he can. Without him Jagger the ponce would be turning out a new “miss you” (puke) every album. 

Izzy = The Soul of Guns, the songs he wrote and contributed to have held up the best after all these years. 

Reason being, he isn’t trying to be smart. Great rock n roll tends to be straightforward with energy. His songs are simple and once put through the other guys come out as Guns songs.

Picture for a minute if 14 years was left in “the bands hands” and that take with the piano outro was kept. Rather than focusing on developing that, time was wasted on dodgy breakdown vocals etc... None of the “bollocks” added to the illusions tracks added anything towards them musically. Slash himself said in his book the original mixes before all the synth stuff was added sounded amazing. I bet they did (do)

Without Izzy’s style of writing, new material is likely to be in a more metal style. It could be great and pickup where Oh My God left off (Which would be great) or it could be poncification for 7-8 minutes per song With 8 Axl vocal tracks. 

Minus Izzy’s songs there won’t be much simplicity out of the remaining writers. 

Some of The songs on Appetite are musically pretty complex, how they were recorded though was not. Yes there were overdubs etc, but the record still sounds good. Which not a lot of records made in 1987 now do. 

They should do an EP with Izzy, small tour. See how it goes.... 

(I always wondered if Izzy had a hand in Don’t drop that dime” on the second velvet revolver album. It has a real simple Izzy vibe)

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On 6/13/2019 at 8:32 AM, Free Bird said:

No it was not.

Snakepit was just Slash and you can't know what it would sound like with Axl's abd Duff's input. IMO 5 o'clock is still the best album of any Guns member outside of Guns, CD included.

singer was a southern wimp

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On 13.06.2019 at 5:32 PM, Free Bird said:

No it was not.

Snakepit was just Slash and you can't know what it would sound like with Axl's abd Duff's input. IMO 5 o'clock is still the best album of any Guns member outside of Guns, CD included.

That's not very high set bar...

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, double talkin jive mfkr said:

singer was a southern wimp

Yep because nine inch nails music to axl was more evolved 🙄

Edited by Sydney Fan

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13 minutes ago, Rovim said:

Izzy was the best songwriter in Gn'R and it isn't even close. If you can't hear Guns elements in his 11 solo albums you must be deaf. Honestly there was a time I wasn't at all into Izzy's solo output but now I love most of his albums. The foundation is always there for great Guns tunes as long as you add Axl, Slash, and Duff plus a good drummer. (not saying Frank is a bad drummer, he isn't imo, but kinda hit n' miss)

Slash said himself he isn't a songwriter and he isn't. He puts notes together in his own special way which makes him one of the best guitar players on the planet.

Axl can write, he is a good songwriter but he needs other musicians to really bring it home. It doesn't pour out of him like Izzy.

Duff can write a lot of tunes but I never really connected with his material. Also Izzy just has this cool singing voice even if he's not really a singer.

I believe Izzy can still easily write a lot of songs for the current version of Gn'R to turn into great Guns material. Material that wouldn't be possible without him. It's a shame they couldn't work something out. After Izzy left the band didn't know where to go musically and for good reason.

Well said

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Rovim said:

Izzy was the best songwriter in Gn'R and it isn't even close. If you can't hear Guns elements in his 11 solo albums you must be deaf. Honestly there was a time I wasn't at all into Izzy's solo output but now I love most of his albums. The foundation is always there for great Guns tunes as long as you add Axl, Slash, and Duff plus a good drummer. (not saying Frank is a bad drummer, he isn't imo, but kinda hit n' miss)

Slash said himself he isn't a songwriter and he isn't. He puts notes together in his own special way which makes him one of the best guitar players on the planet.

Axl can write, he is a good songwriter but he needs other musicians to really bring it home. It doesn't pour out of him like Izzy.

Duff can write a lot of tunes but I never really connected with his material. Also Izzy just has this cool singing voice even if he's not really a singer.

I believe Izzy can still easily write a lot of songs for the current version of Gn'R to turn into great Guns material. Material that wouldn't be possible without him. It's a shame they couldn't work something out. After Izzy left the band didn't know where to go musically and for good reason.

Great post and I think it would be great to hear an Izzy written song or 2 on a new GNR album. But the feeling I’m getting with this next album is that it’s going to be all about the current line up. A new era and a different sound to go with it and fortus comments seem to suggest that might be the way. Slash’s tone and style is still a big part of the GNR sound so I’m hoping that remains the case as I think there still needs to be that classic sound in there. That’s where Izzy would be handy. 

Edited by Gold top 78

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25 minutes ago, Gold top 78 said:

Great post and I think it would be great to hear an Izzy written song or 2 on a new GNR album. But the feeling I’m getting with this next album is that it’s going to be all about the current line up. A new era and a different sound to go with it and fortus comments seem to suggest that might be the way. Slash’s tone and style is still a big part of the GNR sound so I’m hoping that remains the case as I think there still needs to be that classic sound in there. That’s where Izzy would be handy. 

So handy. But yeah... sadly I don't think Izzy will be a part of the new Guns album. My guess is Axl and the rest of the band are not too concerned with Izzy not being there. I also think when it comes to the classic Guns sound it's mostly Slash's guitar and so it will be foolish of Axl to not let Slash's guitars be heard all over the album.

I've said it before: I believe they don't need Izzy to create a great Guns album, there is a lot of talent and material to work with and there seems to be a true intention to make that happen which is cool, but it won't be all that it could have been without Izzy on board. It will be something else, missing that rock n' roll, stones sound probably replaced with a harder edged Fortus approach but no one knows.

Axl asked Izzy to give him Down By The Ocean. Down By The Ocean remains unreleased and contrary to what others have said, did not turn into an Izzy tune he released like Box or some shit. So we at least have a song Axl mentioned in the chats that Izzy wrote and could still be used but that's just one song that Axl might choose to not use.

 

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3 hours ago, Rovim said:

Izzy was the best songwriter in Gn'R and it isn't even close. If you can't hear Guns elements in his 11 solo albums you must be deaf. Honestly there was a time I wasn't at all into Izzy's solo output but now I love most of his albums. The foundation is always there for great Guns tunes as long as you add Axl, Slash, and Duff plus a good drummer. (not saying Frank is a bad drummer, he isn't imo, but kinda hit n' miss)

Slash said himself he isn't a songwriter and he isn't. He puts notes together in his own special way which makes him one of the best guitar players on the planet.

Axl can write, he is a good songwriter but he needs other musicians to really bring it home. It doesn't pour out of him like Izzy.

Duff can write a lot of tunes but I never really connected with his material. Also Izzy just has this cool singing voice even if he's not really a singer.

I believe Izzy can still easily write a lot of songs for the current version of Gn'R to turn into great Guns material. Material that wouldn't be possible without him. It's a shame they couldn't work something out. After Izzy left the band didn't know where to go musically and for good reason.

Where and when did Slash say he is no songwriter?

From what I know he once said that most of the time, the way he creates solos, is not writing. And then he gave an example of a "written" solo of him.

Looking at the solo output you can say GNR had not the one songwriter. Everybody contributed his parts. Even Izzy. His parts were cord progressions, riffs, structure and arrangements. Important parts but properly speaking arrangements aren't exactly songwriting. Just like guitar solos aren't. 

And that was Slash's part. Riffs, solos, guitar melodies and chord progressions.

Axl was lyrics, melodies, vocals, piano parts, structure snd arrangements.

Is one of them missing than there's an important part missing.

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Free Bird said:

Where and when did Slash say he is no songwriter?

From what I know he once said that most of the time, the way he creates solos, is not writing. And then he gave an example of a "written" solo of him.

Looking at the solo output you can say GNR had not the one songwriter. Everybody contributed his parts. Even Izzy. His parts were cord progressions, riffs, structure and arrangements. Important parts but properly speaking arrangements aren't exactly songwriting. Just like guitar solos aren't. 

And that was Slash's part. Riffs, solos, guitar melodies and chord progressions.

Axl was lyrics, melodies, vocals, piano parts, structure snd arrangements.

Is one of them missing than there's an important part missing.

 

Nah, I vividly remember Slash saying he is not a songwriter. It was a few years back. I'm not trying to take anything away from him but that's what he said. :shrugs:

Edited by Rovim

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1 hour ago, Rovim said:

Nah, I vividly remember Slash saying he is not a songwriter. It was a few years back. I'm not trying to take anything away from him but that's what he said. :shrugs:

I didn't know it and it would be nice to know the context but I believe you when you say it. Neverthless I stick to my opinion. Slash needs talented people around him for GNR level songs but his parts are necessary as well. If these parts are written, composed or tinkered :shrugs: ... does it really matter? 

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Thank you Izzy for Locomotive, Coma, Estranged, Civil War, Breakdown, The Garden, Don't Damn Me, etc. And for helping Slash with Ain't Life Grand, Beggars and Hangers-on, Serial Killer, By the Sword etc. They're all so shit without the mighty Izzy.

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Posted (edited)
19 minutes ago, Free Bird said:

I didn't know it and it would be nice to know the context but I believe you when you say it. Neverthless I stick to my opinion. Slash needs talented people around him for GNR level songs but his parts are necessary as well. If these parts are written, composed or tinkered :shrugs: ... does it really matter? 

Let me be blunt: I think Slash needs talented songwriters for him to have a foundation to work with cause he basically knows how to use only one structure in a song, maybe two. This was the case for Slash and Friends for example. World On Fire was better, but mostly uninteresting structures as songs imo. Not his forte to come up with compelling, finished tunes. Feel free to stick to your opinion, I respect that but it is my opinion his talents lies elsewhere. He is brilliant when it comes to coming up with riffs, solos, and guitar fills when there is someone to push him out of his comfort zone, and once in a while he can bring an interesting chord progression or even a full suite of ideas that isn't generic but that's becoming rare nowdays for him, not something like when he was at the top of his game and brought Coma for example or Locomotive and Axl said it's not like he brought those fully formed or at least some of those tunes.

It matters if you care about dissecting every little thing and put labels on what each band member can do so I guess it depends.

Personally, I feel that Slash's solo output has shown it's weaknesses and can benefit greatly from more thought out tunes that had the time and people with more attention span to develop the material like Axl and the people that were responsible to all that unreleased material Slash and Duff got to listen to or like it or not Chinese.

 

Edited by Rovim

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, Drexl said:

Thank you Izzy for Locomotive, Coma, Estranged, Civil War, Breakdown, The Garden, Don't Damn Me, etc. And for helping Slash with Ain't Life Grand, Beggars and Hangers-on, Serial Killer, By the Sword etc. They're all so shit without the mighty Izzy.

No one said Axl and Slash need Izzy to produce great music but his role in the band was important. Thank you Izzy for Out Ta Get Me, You Could Be Mine, My Michelle, Nightrain, Don't Cry which got the band signed, 14 years, Pretty Tied Up, etc.

Also: you'd never get the perfect guitar interplay that was a huge part of Appetite without Izzy. His style worked perfectly with Slash's.

Edited by Rovim
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3 minutes ago, Rovim said:

No one said Axl and Slash need Izzy to produce great music but his role in the band was important. Thank you Izzy for Out Ta Get Me, You Could Be Mine, My Michelle, Nightrain, Don't Cry which got the band signed, 14 years, Pretty Tied Up, etc.

Thank you Axl, Slash and Duff for rearranging Izzy's boring and generic tunes. Ask yourself one question: why not even one Izzy solo song doesn't sound like real GNR?

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Just now, Drexl said:

Thank you Axl, Slash and Duff for rearranging Izzy's boring and generic tunes. Ask yourself one question: why not even one Izzy solo song doesn't sound like real GNR?

awww that's adorable. You think Izzy's tunes are boring and generic and not one Izzy tune sounds like Gn'R. Go listen to more Izzy tunes Mr. Drexl. Just a suggestion. I believe in you.

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1 minute ago, Rovim said:

awww that's adorable. You think Izzy's tunes are boring and generic and not one Izzy tune sounds like Gn'R. Go listen to more Izzy tunes Mr. Drexl. Just a suggestion. I believe in you.

I'm on the floor crying and screaming. Thank you, Sir, you've opened my eyes and ears.

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Just now, Drexl said:

I'm on the floor crying and screaming. Thank you, Sir, you've opened my eyes and ears.

No problem! if you want I can give you advice on other topics as well, not just music. Pm me anytime. I'm very discrete. No need for everyone to know you lack experience in certain areas.

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1 minute ago, Rovim said:

No problem! if you want I can give you advice on other topics as well, not just music. Pm me anytime. I'm very discrete. No need for everyone to know you lack experience in certain areas.

Finally got a hard-on? You're welcome.

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Just now, Drexl said:

Finally got a hard-on? You're welcome.

Yes, you're very effective. Will you be my personal fluffer from now on?

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