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Raz Cue - An Open Letter To Duff McKagan

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54 minutes ago, .tranquility. said:

So I did what you said and read your Facebook posts. I have too many questions now. Here are some for starters.

...

:popcorn:

Seriously though, as the old saying goes, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Here, there is no evidence to support the very serious allegations. In fact, there are many inconsistencies and oddities. Until such a time that the claims can be thoroughly corroborated by other evidence, this story will simply remain such.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, .tranquility. said:

In your post here you say JoJo grabbed your clothes and helped. In Facebook, JoJo himself wrote that you told him about the incident at a later timepoint, so actually he wasn't there.

Maybe it wasn't the same JoJo. I guess she'll clarify it.

The first and the last question are some of my questions, too.

 

Edited by Blackstar

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11 hours ago, Blackstar said:

Sorry, but I don't think this a valid point. There have been numerous stories about him in the press and in books besides these over the years, among which some obviously false ones (e.g. that he had killed his dogs in the 80s or that he was a heroin addict in the 80s and the 90s). There were also many fake interviews published in the early 90s, some of the magazines he had called out in Get in the Ring continued printing interviews with him which he said he never did. And he didn't sue over any of those things. The fact that he didn't sue over things written about him doesn't consist proof in itself about anything.

Wasn't it Axl himself who started the rumour about him killing dogs when he talked about his hatred for small dogs and how everything about them meant he had to kill them? He also openly talked about his heroin use even if he wasn't an addict.

Either way, I think there's a big difference between a random fake interview and a specific person from your past coming out and publicly accusing you of rape.

If Michelle is lying, Axl can sue her and I'm sure he has all the resources in the world to do so.

Hopefully he has enough sense of right and wrong to not sue her if he knows she's telling the truth.

 

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Posted (edited)
58 minutes ago, Scream of the Butterfly said:

Wasn't it Axl himself who started the rumour about him killing dogs when he talked about his hatred for small dogs and how everything about them meant he had to kill them? He also openly talked about his heroin use even if he wasn't an addict.

Either way, I think there's a big difference between a random fake interview and a specific person from your past coming out and publicly accusing you of rape.

If Michelle is lying, Axl can sue her and I'm sure he has all the resources in the world to do so.

Hopefully he has enough sense of right and wrong to not sue her if he knows she's telling the truth.

They still were false stories though. Another example is that story about Axl writing a threatening message to Erin outside their garage door. That story was in the press in 1991, before the other (much more serious, of course) accusations came to light, and Axl didn't react then. He reacted only in 2012 when a photographer tried to make money off it.

Anyway, what I was replying to was the fallacy (imho) that the fact that Axl didn't sue over the stories that were written about him in the past in books and articles proves that all the stories are true. The part of the post I replied to wasn't about the current issue. We'll have to see if there will be legal action on Axl's part or not. Personally I won't base my opinion on that either way.

Edited by Blackstar
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11 hours ago, RussTCB said:

I'm moving this out of the main section. The person we assume is directly involved (Little Michelle) hasn't returned to follow up, so we'll keep the thread here in this section for those that might still want to discuss it. 

But how is Duff going to read this if it's moved! lol

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16 hours ago, Powderfinger said:

I have never had to exercise caution with regard to rape and my sexual urges. Rape is not a sexual urge I have. The fact he has to control it on a “hormonal” level  tells me he’s a different type of man than I am. 

Are you purposely being obtuse here? Or perhaps there is a cultural divide and American English isn't your native tongue? Axl's statement simply meant he was going to control his sexual urges simply to not put himself in situations where he can be accused of rape. He was not stating that he curbed his supposed "rapey" tendencies over the accusation. Are you freakin' kidding me? He was basically saying the situation sobered him up and opened his eyes. Celebrity was on the rise and he didn't wan to put himself in situations that left him vulnerable to accusations. 

Please stop with your nonsense.

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3 hours ago, GnR Chris said:

Are you purposely being obtuse here? Or perhaps there is a cultural divide and American English isn't your native tongue? Axl's statement simply meant he was going to control his sexual urges simply to not put himself in situations where he can be accused of rape. He was not stating that he curbed his supposed "rapey" tendencies over the accusation. Are you freakin' kidding me? He was basically saying the situation sobered him up and opened his eyes. Celebrity was on the rise and he didn't wan to put himself in situations that left him vulnerable to accusations. 

Please stop with your nonsense.

If what you say is true, why did he put himself in the same situations again. 

Eg my post on the Chicago incident? 

Yes, English is my second language. 

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4 hours ago, GnR Chris said:

Axl's statement simply meant he was going to control his sexual urges simply to not put himself in situations where he can be accused of rape.

How is it normal or even a regular practice that people go accusing their partners of rape after sexual encounters? :lol:

it's obvious to me Axl was into violent sex and that's why he had to "calm his hormones".

I won't say he had rape tendencies but every story out there involving him and girls has a violent component that is undeniable.

4 hours ago, GnR Chris said:

Celebrity was on the rise and he didn't wan to put himself in situations that left him vulnerable to accusations. 

Yet he didn't care for getting into trouble with the police, with random people and with fans? 

Every time he left the stage and riot ensued he was not thinking about the consequences for his career? :lol:

Yeah, right. He never gave a fuck. All the time Axl behaved with total impunity because he knew he was going to get away with it.

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@Little Michelle I'm so sorry for what you had to go through.:hug:

49 minutes ago, Little Michelle said:

Did you happen to read the comments from Vince or how about the thread that had several people from the old days talking about all of this including GNR ripping friends off and knocking 16 year old girls into amps? There are a lot of people on there that KNEW them and we all know what fucking users they were! If you are going to literally just try to break me down, you won't! 

Where can we read these?

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4 minutes ago, Scream of the Butterfly said:

@Little Michelle I'm so sorry for what you had to go through.:hug:

Where can we read these?

Thank you💗 My Facebook page is where you can read all about it.  My first post about what Axl did and also the Open Letter to Duff. 

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10 minutes ago, Little Michelle said:

Thank you💗 My Facebook page is where you can read all about it.  My first post about what Axl did and also the Open Letter to Duff. 

What s your name on fb?

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Did anyone see the link to Facebook that was pulled/deleted? Was curious as to what it said and why it’s now gone?

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45 minutes ago, DTJ80 said:

Did anyone see the link to Facebook that was pulled/deleted? Was curious as to what it said and why it’s now gone?

It was a link to her FB account. @RussTCB deleted it. See page 17.

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5 minutes ago, janrichmond said:

It was a link to her FB account. @RussTCB deleted it. See page 17.

Sorry Jan - that’s not what I meant. Presumably the link went to something she wanted us to see but it was then pulled. I clicked on the link and it took me to Facebook and it said the page no longer existed/had been deleted.

I just wondered if anyone saw the FB page before it was deleted/removed (not the post here)?

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8 minutes ago, DTJ80 said:

Sorry Jan - that’s not what I meant. Presumably the link went to something she wanted us to see but it was then pulled. I clicked on the link and it took me to Facebook and it said the page no longer existed/had been deleted.

I just wondered if anyone saw the FB page before it was deleted/removed (not the post here)?

Oh right, yeah the link didn't work when i tried it. Sorry i only know as much as as you :lol:

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1 minute ago, janrichmond said:

Oh right, yeah the link didn't work when i tried it. Sorry i only know as much as as you :lol:

😆 - no worries!! I don’t do Facebook so only get what is posted here. 👍

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, killuridols said:

How is it normal or even a regular practice that people go accusing their partners of rape after sexual encounters? :lol:

 

Look how many athletes or celebrities have been falsely accused. When there's money to be made or notoriety to be gained, a celebrity is more vulnerable to false claims. I happen to think Dandy Pie here is full of it. In her statement, she acts like she saved GNR by not going forward with the claims back then, and now she's miffed that they aren't thanking her for their success. Duff probably blocked her 'cause she's harassing him on social media. By her own account, Duff didn't even do anything except, I guess, piss her off with his record.

Edited by GnR Chris
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19 minutes ago, GnR Chris said:

Look how many athletes or celebrities have been falsely accused. When there's money to be made or notoriety to be gained, a celebrity is more vulnerable to false claims.

One detail though: most of these stories happened when Axl & co. were nobodies, so your theory does not apply here.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, killuridols said:

One detail though: most of these stories happened when Axl & co. were nobodies, so your theory does not apply here.

They weren't though. They were on the rise and by her own admission were about to get signed to a record deal. You don't think there were hangers on surrounding the band back then? They played killer shows, had all the drugs and parties, and were making a name for themselves getting record label attention.

 

Edit: And, AGAIN, this quote is taken from Watch You Bleed, from my understanding, which is loaded with factual errors. But even if it's an accurate quote, your premise that it's some sort of admission of guilt for sexual assault is ludicrous.

Edited by GnR Chris
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4 minutes ago, killuridols said:

One detail though: most of these stories happened when Axl & co. were nobodies, so your theory does not apply here.

If they were nobodies, like you say, is it safe to assume that could be why she wouldnt testify against him back then? Cause they were broke and nobodies, what could she gain.. not money. So who cares about "justice" right ?

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Posted (edited)

Just some points. It is had to mention by name or quote everyone.

pardon me if I am repeating myself.

1———For whatever parts of LM s story  is true and I believe the part about a girl of 15 being turned out by Axl without her clothes, ugly, nasty thing to do to someone,  I feel very sorry for her. I agree with who said this thread is confusing.  I wish her peace. Unfortunately for whatever happened to  her AND the other , others, there is nothing to do but find a peace. Who knows where the characters are today. Dead. In out of rehab. Still drugging. 

I know LM and My Michelle are different people.

GnR were , all 5 of them, low life’s, PWT,  In early 1990s interviews , about things now from  30  -35  years  ago, Slash saying he wanted to want d Axl and whatever girl have sex...he was too drugged or something so he just wanted to at watch...that they gave another to girl to some friends...wow.  These were not The Osmond Bros and those girls were lil, suburban, sheltered school girls. The rockers and groupies n the L.A scene then ...rough. Sex, drugs. Nasty living. Lost souls. So many groups just did not have that IT factor and did not make it. GnR did back then.

2——- Rape is very serious. Most serious. Sexually assault, sexually abuse, rape are crimes that  leave a lasting  memory on the victim until the victim dies. 

3——No one will never know the truth.  I am going to be arrested on this against LM before AxlW.Rose and  his legal camp / managers will ever see this old case see the light of day.  I am not trying to make a joke herevout of a serious thing like any form of sexually abuse. He was charged. Dismissed. Lack of evidence in the last century ago. Decades ago. 35 or more years ago.

In Bill Cosby’s cas, Joe Pateno covering for Sandusky, and some other recent  ones there were years , decades of proof in cove ups in payments and Non-Disclosure agreements,  closed court cases, witnesses, a repeated pattern....etc.

4— Some Of you are shocked by ....I do not know why. I do not know how old you are. 22? 19? 

GnR was a rough group 1990- back during their  years trying to make it.  This was not Poison or Warrant or BonJovi

 Only thing then vs. now is there was no instant reporting by internet, cell phone cameras, so social media.

By the time off the things hit the news , it as all old news. 

5—— I still like the music of my young years  of my early 20s in college of AFD, UYIs, and seeing them once at my university arena where I worked in my college years. Now, nah. It is Axls band . His musicians .  Old songs. Old people , lol,. Young 20 ish to late teens thinking GnR, so cool. Paying a car note payment  to a show  to hear Axl screeching , seats far away, etc. The real band is not even the here and cannot be. Izzy said no and Stev in no way could do a 4 year tour.  But hey, to you those  going, go. 500 million half a billion in the ASD record braking   4 year tour with each man probably going to pull 100 mill more or less, go for it.

Slash is a must because he is a character. Duff really does not need to be there for fans or people like me. 

6— This thread all started with Duff the Hyprocrical, sanctimonious, puzzy, and Brown noser to Axl, 

I agree with Sasso. I would like to quote but I cannot find the post.

 

Edited by Latx
Wrong quote

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