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Guns n Roses Ban Fan From Shows Due to Song Leaks (Link)

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17 hours ago, kiwiguns said:

Its a very simple thing to understand. 

The guy was paid money in good faith. 

Now he is seeking attention, fame and fortune at the bands expense. 

The band and its management are protecting their interests. 

Thats what any person or business would do, to ensure they are not opening themselves up to further attempts to be taken advantage of and distancing themselves from this person and their behaviour. 

The dumb thing is rick is buying merch and still lining the bands and TBs pockets!.

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Could somebody please outline this whole story for me in like two sentences or so? Feel free to use foul language if you like. Thanks. 

Edited by jamillos
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39 minutes ago, jamillos said:

Could somebody please outline this whole story for me in like two sentences or so? Feel free to use faul language if you like. Thanks. 

From what we know: Guy buys unreleased music and spread all over the internet hes the buyer. Guy is contacted by TB and hand over his copies and get his $ back.

Stuff leaks anyway cause the original owner of the locker content still had the originals and was still selling it.

The guy that TB contacted gets the blame and is banned from concerts.

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14 minutes ago, default_ said:

From what we know: Guy buys unreleased music and spread all over the internet hes the buyer. Guy is contacted by TB and hand over his copies and get his $ back.

Stuff leaks anyway cause the original owner of the locker content still had the originals and was still selling it.

The guy that TB contacted gets the blame and is banned from concerts.

Oh so it's still this locker thing, I thought it was something brand new. Thanks. 

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20 minutes ago, default_ said:

The guy that TB contacted gets the blame and is banned from concerts.

... but „he still loves the band“ as stated by him somewhere above and spents more money on them :facepalm: 

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Maybe Rick just leaked out this songs because GnR wants new and fresh opinion of old GnR songs for the new album and Rick is just TB man from the beginning. Or not.......

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5 hours ago, Popcorn crew said:

Maybe Rick just leaked out this songs because GnR wants new and fresh opinion of old GnR songs for the new album and Rick is just TB man from the beginning. Or not.......

Or not

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On 10/13/2019 at 5:59 AM, Azifwekare said:

What is wrong with this guy? Was he dropped on his head as a baby? It's almost as if he's begging to get bent over by a group of lawyers.

Lol

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Do you use social media or is it set to private?

Edited by Amaya

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I don't want GnR or their people to know my name, address, phone number, etc. Just like I am not interested in their names, address,  phone numbers.                        I bought a ticket to the show and got what I paid them for. A concert.                      If GNR releases new music or not, makes no difference in my job. They dont have to or anything.  It is no money in my pocket. They do their jobs and I have a job to do.  I do not participate in any social media. I just cannot. It wigs me out.  Itis strange to me. If I grew up in that era of social media maybe,maybe  but my personality and life, it would be set to private. I don't want people who are not in my life now to know my whereabouts and business.    I don't want to know theirs either   There  is a reason why.                                                                My post is aimed at no one . Not a soul. I am just generally speaking about myself.     I am just generally speaking about myself and social media, just stuff about myself and GnR. 

Edited by Amaya
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On 10/12/2019 at 12:01 PM, gunsguy said:

While that would be awesome what would you do to people that share your unreleased music?

nothing.. but welcome to the internet. I'd personally leak a few that would become promotion for the best one's on the album. give the leakers a few songs and bring out the best. it's not hard to keep songs "in house" over a year or so... but we're talking nearly 20yrs here. shit always stinks after that amount of time.

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13 hours ago, Route66 said:

nothing.. but welcome to the internet. I'd personally leak a few that would become promotion for the best one's on the album. give the leakers a few songs and bring out the best. it's not hard to keep songs "in house" over a year or so... but we're talking nearly 20yrs here. shit always stinks after that amount of time.

You know what? You're right. Axl had a clear no-camera policy before. He had to accept it now that everyone has a camera in their pockets. It's time for the band to move on and embrace the Internet - and I'm not talking about giving the songs for free on MySpace, but trully explore the possibilities of new business models. Leaks happen, the way you deal with that is just offer an easy and official way to consume the same product.

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On 10/13/2019 at 3:51 PM, RussTCB said:

Yeah. The story goes that they gave him the money to give back to the investors that helped him raise the $15k to buy the CDs. 

The idea was they they would all get their money back so, but not receive the contents of the CDs.

Needless to say, things do not go according to plan lol

So he took the money and leaked anyway? 

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1 minute ago, Modano09 said:

So he took the money and leaked anyway? 

Not sure. Multiple people had the leaks. Rick's not the Chairman. So who knows.

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1 hour ago, Voodoochild said:

You know what? You're right. Axl had a clear no-camera policy before. He had to accept it now that everyone has a camera in their pockets. It's time for the band to move on and embrace the Internet - and I'm not talking about giving the songs for free on MySpace, but trully explore the possibilities of new business models. Leaks happen, the way you deal with that is just offer an easy and official way to consume the same product.

This isn't embracing the internet, embracing the internet doesn't mean ignoring the rule of law, taking someone elses unfinished IP and deciding to distribute it because you want to, without the consent of the creator is just outrageous. Remember what Napster did to the music industry and revenues on music sales, then you all bitch why music on the most part is so absolute shit these days and concert tickets so high, why there are merch grabs everywhere too..... There are repercussions to these types of thoughts.

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12 minutes ago, swishtz said:

This isn't embracing the internet, embracing the internet doesn't mean ignoring the rule of law, taking someone elses unfinished IP and deciding to distribute it because you want to, without the consent of the creator is just outrageous. Remember what Napster did to the music industry and revenues on music sales, then you all bitch why music on the most part is so absolute shit these days and concert tickets so high, why there are merch grabs everywhere too..... There are repercussions to these types of thoughts.

I'm not saying the leaks are good or legal for the band. But it happens either they like it or not, so what they should do AFTER that is embrace the internet.

But since you brought the Napster thing: who do you know that still download illegal mp3 for regular commercial available music? Nobody gives a shit anymore about that, everyone can just use Spotify / Apple Music / YouTube or whatever. Music is more readly available and democratic than ever. I dont know about you, but I came from when you had to buy an entire album (and that wasnt cheap!) just because you liked one song. Often, it happens that the rest of the album were shit. The solution was to record cassete tapes with friends, but this is very limited in both quality and reach for new music. 

And I'm not even talking about how unfair and greedy were the labels. The artist wasn't the victim of what Napster did with the music industry, it was only the corporate side of incredibly greedy companies. This excact mentality is still behind the music industry, and that's why you complain about shit music (often tailored to an algorithm to catch short-attention spam kids on over-the-top plataforms) and concert tickets price.

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5 minutes ago, swishtz said:

This isn't embracing the internet, embracing the internet doesn't mean ignoring the rule of law, taking someone elses unfinished IP and deciding to distribute it because you want to, without the consent of the creator is just outrageous. Remember what Napster did to the music industry and revenues on music sales, then you all bitch why music on the most part is so absolute shit these days and concert tickets so high, why there are merch grabs everywhere too..... There are repercussions to these types of thoughts.

People wonder why there’s not much good rock in the “mainstream”. Rock music is about taking chances. The labels don’t take those chances anymore. The old model was centered around one success made up for your 10 failures. That luxury simply isn’t there and the label structure has moved on to mitigate those risks and take more proven revenues elsewhere.

Artists are now in the mode of maximizing their worth. It’s harder to sell out shows now than 10 yrs ago. Everyone is on the road longer than they should be and the product is watered down across the board. It’s not just a GNR problem. 

As far as the video/YouTube issues, who knows how far it goes in their camp. I think it’s obvious it starts there somewhere. I don’t agree with the stance at its core, I’m just not sure if that means any of the Big 3 are even aware of it. Hypothetically, I’d think the label and the band would love the revenue it would/could generate. 

Random fans who attend their shows are getting their vids pulled down. It has nothing to do with the forum crowd. That doesn’t help public perception for the band. It makes them look like dicks. You’d think they’d want this train to keep moving. It’s this type of behavior that makes people think twice about seeing them again. 

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@gunsguy.  You ask what would you do?  If I were AR, just sell clearner versions of the leaked songs on line. High produce it and even over producec it.. Sell it on line. Then there would be  no value in leaked material as in it is no big secret  nothing to talk about but for him, AR.   Truly the big days of big money in music sales has passed by this group even if they were to release a new cd on line. Next, whether it is Axl and his team, TB , or whoever , to stop pulling vids of clips from shows off line. Who does this? Other entertainers dont. Yes I understand copywrites , etc. and entertainers not selling their work for free. I really dont understand how you tube, Pandora , etc. works . I assume concert clips and song videos and songs are already paid for some kind of way or that there is not much money worthwhile in a show clip or song clip. For example, country music artists dont seem to mind . Ex. U2, Dave Matthews Band and many others don't seem to mind.   Ms. Meegan of Slash, who is GnR, even had her video or something pulled off her fb or instgram page. As she asked what is going on and said # that she was with the band. Actually, more than that. She is with the onwer, lol. He did not mind so who made that decision for him for his lady.  These unknown controllers are like Prince controlling vibes. He wanted no songs, no old vids, no concert clips on social media or youtube, etc.  He controled what did not need to be controlled. He should have controlled himself. He would be alive today.                            I agree with  @Route66 @Voodoochild

Edited by Amaya
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35 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

I'm not saying the leaks are good or legal for the band. But it happens either they like it or not, so what they should do AFTER that is embrace the internet.

But since you brought the Napster thing: who do you know that still download illegal mp3 for regular commercial available music? Nobody gives a shit anymore about that, everyone can just use Spotify / Apple Music / YouTube or whatever. Music is more readly available and democratic than ever. I dont know about you, but I came from when you had to buy an entire album (and that wasnt cheap!) just because you liked one song. Often, it happens that the rest of the album were shit. The solution was to record cassete tapes with friends, but this is very limited in both quality and reach for new music. 

And I'm not even talking about how unfair and greedy were the labels. The artist wasn't the victim of what Napster did with the music industry, it was only the corporate side of incredibly greedy companies. This excact mentality is still behind the music industry, and that's why you complain about shit music (often tailored to an algorithm to catch short-attention spam kids on over-the-top plataforms) and concert tickets price.

They embrace the internet within the parameters they should, not in a manner where bootlegs of private material get leaked by chancers, that's not the internet that's the wild west.

Why do you think Apple Music/Spotify all exist and the artists now make fuck all on record sales ? I came from the 80's so i know all about standing in line to buy a new record, recording off thee radio, all that stuff. The artist absolutely was the victim of Napster, A&R is now fucked, record label investment in artist development is now fucked, a #1 record meaning anything like it used to is now fucked.  Everything is about a quick buck, low spend, look at music videos these days vs what used to be the norm, money got sucked out of the industry, it has been redistributed to the elite through touring and merchandising, VIP' tours, meet & greets etc etc. Oh i know what i am talking about because this is my industry. And who do i know still downloading things illegally ? Ever heard of torrents ?  Your generalisations are incredulous. Entire albums shit, no one downloading illegally, artists not suffering from people stealing their work, please do your research before interjecting . 

 

https://ibb.co/C9XMVHr

https://www.visualcapitalist.com/music-industry-sales/

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/oct/09/more-than-one-third-global-music-consumers-pirate-music

https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/11/17963804/music-modernization-act-mma-copyright-law-bill-labels-congress

https://pitchfork.com/features/lists-and-guides/the-200-best-albums-of-the-1980s/

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/100-best-albums-of-the-90s-152425/

Edited by swishtz
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45 minutes ago, Voodoochild said:

I'm not saying the leaks are good or legal for the band. But it happens either they like it or not, so what they should do AFTER that is embrace the internet.

But since you brought the Napster thing: who do you know that still download illegal mp3 for regular commercial available music? Nobody gives a shit anymore about that, everyone can just use Spotify / Apple Music / YouTube or whatever. Music is more readly available and democratic than ever. I dont know about you, but I came from when you had to buy an entire album (and that wasnt cheap!) just because you liked one song. Often, it happens that the rest of the album were shit. The solution was to record cassete tapes with friends, but this is very limited in both quality and reach for new music. 

And I'm not even talking about how unfair and greedy were the labels. The artist wasn't the victim of what Napster did with the music industry, it was only the corporate side of incredibly greedy companies. This excact mentality is still behind the music industry, and that's why you complain about shit music (often tailored to an algorithm to catch short-attention spam kids on over-the-top plataforms) and concert tickets price.

Plus the fact that back then labels seriously overcharged for music just because they could. Once Napster/iTunes/etc became popular, sales went down and entertainment stores went out of business, they put a stop to that pretty sharpish. I remember when CDs cost twice the amount that they do now, easy.

The only reason vinyl is being pushed so hard nowadays is because labels can use it to rinse collectors dry. A vinyl LP that cost £4 on release in the 80s now gets reissued today for £40.

Edited by Azifwekare
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I'm sorry if my opinion goes against everyone's in here, but I think the band is right.

Imagine you have a business, and you sell something, but then you're not completely happy with the outcome of your product, so you stop selling it until you feel it is right.

Then you stop selling it for 10 years, someone keeps asking for the product for themselves, they are not happy about it, and then they "find" some of the product that was not supposed to be sold in a storage. OK.

But now they sell the thing and also BRAG about it.

The thing that nobody understand is: why bother to release something else? We already have a full CD of "new" songs with vocals, and a double CD of instrumentals, b-sides, rarities, alt.versions and so on.

The 19 CDs feature more music than the band have released in 20 years! So why bother.

Yes, I think the leakers and everybody else that downloaded the leaks tarnished the whole thing.

By the time (and if) they release Hardschool, Perhaps, Atlas, As It Begin properly they will feel as old as the 2006 Better!

It is a shame because it is getting really confusing: we have like 3 to 4 versions of each song, I don't think we as fans can tell them apart anymore.

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1 hour ago, Modano09 said:

So he took the money and leaked anyway? 

He says he didn't leak anything, so I truly don't know what happened. 

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11 minutes ago, RussTCB said:

He says he didn't leak anything, so I truly don't know what happened. 

Back onto the topic of the attention seeking guy, not only does he rustle up $15k for music , drive 19 hours (none of this smacks of innocent behaviour) when challenged, rather than be concerned or eat a bit of humble pie, he baits the band and runs around self promoting what a big shot he is. I dont know whether he leaked anything or not, but he doesn't seem innocent and if he keeps prodding he may find himself having to explain himself in court.

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