gnrfan2007

No more cheezy '80s hardrock rhythm, solos, leather pants, hairstyles, fashion, etc ...

The band has removed all the cheeze from the old songs.

The band creates *songs* instead of *guitar songs* ... you know the kind of music a guitarist lead band creates.

This band can create dark mellow songs and ballads that consist more than 3-4 typical chords for which doesn't include stepping on the distortion pedal for the chorus, etc ...

Everybody in the band respects each others ... they all listen to each other ideas to make the best possible music. They all stick up for each other (unlike in the past).

Axl is finally happy again ... no more band members putting down his song writing ... no more worrying about band members dying of drug overdose ... no more being forced to do things that are detrimental to his well being and the well being of the band.

...In fact when CD came out I thought it was amazing. Then I grew up.

...I don't even like GNR

Wait a minute ... you once admired CD ... even though you were never a GnR fan.

Wait even some more ... you don't even like GnR ... but you are here on this forum?! WTF?! LOL

Am I missing something here ... if you were never a GnR fan ... but you thought CD was amazing when it first came out, then was it not CD that brought you to this forum in this first place?

So don't you prove the point that people who never liked old-GnR are more often then none, the ones giving high praises of CD ... even if it was for a short period of time in your case.

If you listen carefully, at what those BBC critics were saying, for which I agree with, what makes CD brilliant and hence a masterpiece, is how CD was able to fuse over a century worth of musical history and influences into one album in a way that is still distinctively in tune with the idea of GnR (Axl Rose).

And according to you and the critic ratings you cite, CD was able to accomplish this with AVERAGE appeal!

That is not a feat that can be easily accomplished! Most times (a lot of times) when people fuse many different genres and sounds, it sounds robotic and repeative, ie. very electronic-like

Of course, there are more *innovative* bands/musicians out there who have successfully created a new market for a new genre of music. If you're going to try to compare CD to any of the new music put out by the bands you cited in your previous post, then of course, CD will not be as innovative.

However, many of these newer bands you cite, cannot re-create the kind of music that influence and pre-dated Axl Rose and GnR. And since the late '80s belonged to GnR and Metallica, no new band today can re-create the sounds of that era either.

If any other band were to try to do what CD did, they would have failed. Only Axl Rose under the GnR banner could have fused over a century worth of musical history and influences as he did with CD and still create something that was still - according to you and many critics - AVERAGE appealing.

So in many ways, you do agree with what I'm and those BBC critics are saying! LOL

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

How many times a day do you masturbate to posters of Axl, while listening to CD?

Probably much less than you do masturbating to your Slash solo compilations!

Slash signed the rights away, as did Duff, in September 1992.

Rights or no rights, who cares. The other 4 made up Guns N'Roses. The current band is Axl Rose and anyone he chooses to hire (..or fire). The *classic* sound has long gone. Do with it what he wishes. All water under the bridge, and you can't turn back time. Axl threw it away, and he has no choice but to march on. Let's see what the future holds.

CORRECTION: Slash threw it all away.

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

How come you didn't quote LiveFromNormal's post with his critics bashing Axl and CD?!

Ah ... it's only when there are positive reviews of Guns n Roses that it upsets you. It makes you mad and sad when people agree that Guns n Roses is Axl Rose. That Axl Rose was indeed the genius behind GnR. Slash was and will always be just a *tool* (ie. Axl's biatch).

Because my providing negative reviews was to be a foil to your claim that music 'historians' praise Chinese Democracy.

It intact was met with mostly average reviews. And that is because it is an average album.

What makes your critics more qualified then those critics that praise CD? Really?! Because you were able to find more negative reviews?

You see ... you and many others have this automatic PREJUDICE notion in your mind that nobody in their right mind has ever or would ever praised CD to that high of a level ... to a level of a MASTERPIECE.

How many *masterpieces* in history have ever been called a *masterpiece* in their debut? Very few.

But yet, there it was ... in November of 2008 ... there existed people who considered CD a MASTERPIECE right from its debut.

That is why your attempt to *foil* my claim ... FAILED. All I needed was ONE example to burst your bubble and send you off Googling for negative reviews about CD.

More often then not, it is only well after the death of the artist and some generations later, that more intelligent minds were able to comprehend the beauty behind their artwork and to see and experience the affects of their artwork on a culture.

Even your precious AFD did not garner praise until several years later and several million copies sold. Even still, many from the subsequential alternative/grunge rock era and current new rock eras detest the everything about old GnR.

How many *critics* and music historians, or other musicians, have called AFD or UYI ... a masterpiece?

What you also failed to see was that 2 of the 3 critics in that BBC video I provided aren't even [old] GnR fans. They are music and pop culture historians who respect all kinds of music. They were able to put aside their personal tastes and prior pre-conceived notions of what GnR music is to evaluate CD objectively based on artistic and historical merits.

When people who don't even like GnR praise the work GnR did on CD ... that says something a lot more than fans of the old band giving negative reviews.

A lot of the haters and critics who gave negative reviews of CD ... are the same ones who would have given negative reviews to the UYIs albums. But here we are now, 20+ years later, and many fans of the old band are pining for more UYI-like songs.

Now here' s the kicker ... whether you like CD or not ... CD was strong enough to keep GnR alive. CD was make-it or break-it. So the fact that GnR is still kicking ass with a 50+ year-old singer debunks all the negative reviews you can ever dig up on CD.

Axl Rose has prevailed ... and he couldn't have done it without the CD album.

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

You are giving critics in general a bit too much credit

How come you didn't quote LiveFromNormal's post with his critics bashing Axl and CD?!

Ah ... it's only when there are positive reviews of Guns n Roses that it upsets you. It makes you mad and sad when people agree that Guns n Roses is Axl Rose. That Axl Rose was indeed the genius behind GnR. Slash was and will always be just a *tool* (ie. Axl's biatch).

Axl really should have said he wasn't going to go earlier. However, it's the fans own fault for misinterpreting his "I don't want to ruin it for the fans" remark. I think if you read it in his context he's clearing saying it would be better from him to stay away from the induction.

"He thinks it’s mostly for fans. But he said it’s an honor and he talks about how he inducted Elton John, whom he loves. If it’s good enough for Elton, he said, it’s good enough for him.” ------- Eddie Trunk paraphrasing Axl's views on the HOF.

So induction into the RHOF was good enough for Axl last November, but it wasn't good enough for him just five months later? Don't think so ...

FIVE MONTHS was plenty of time of Slash to man up and PUBLICLY apoligize to the fans for all the LIES he has spread through the years ... so that he and Axl could come together for the fans.

But then there was also the problem of the HOF charging $1200+ a seat eventhough they were to make millions off of the first ever old-GnR re-union. That's was a lopsided financial deal that any body with any integrity would have refused.

If there were to be a re-union, all the financial rewards should go to appropriate folks.

The circumstances were indeed different for Axl then they were for Elton John.

What credentials do these people have to be called 'historians' or even well received critics?

It looks like a handful of idiots with no idea what they're talking about babbling on about nothing.

Pay attention to what the critics were saying in that BBC review. In terms of *personal taste*, CD wasn't really their cup of tea (as they say in England).

But detaching their *personal taste* from the conversation and evaluating CD at a more objective artistic and music historical point of view, CD was indeed a masterpiece ... bizarre but brilliant.

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

Are Slash`s fanboys still butthurt over HOF get over it for god`s sake give it a rest be happy your hero enjoyed his 15 minutes of spotlight there`s no chance in hell Axl would be part of thet circus

I think he was afraid of meeting Slash.

This made me chuckle or maybe on the contrary Slash was afraid of meeting Axl ? Axl is n`t scared of Slash he simply doesn`t give a flying fuck about him and if they ever meet each other it`ll end badly for Slash

Hilarious. Go over to Canter Banter and ask Marc how much Axl doesn't give a "flying fuck" about Slash.

Yeah, go re-read what Cantor said about Slash being a LIAR who lies to make himself look *cool*. Go re-read about how Slash got all butt-hurt that Axl only liked 4 of his Snakepit songs. Go re-read about how Slash refused to work with on 4 songs for Chinese Democracy.

Axl gives as much "flying fuck" about Slash as a person wrongly accused by their ex-lover of abusing them.

All Axl wants is for Slash to clear his name. Slash needs to man-up and apologize for all the lies he has spread about Axl through the years in the media.

That is not too much to ask for is it?

+1

after that embarassing let-down from Axl @HOF (dont forget it was about last minute cancelling just 3 days before the event) there is a good portion of fans opting to NEVER spend only 1 Cent on Axl anymore. i've sold my show ticket immediately right after his open letter!

edit:

and i went to the Slash show a few months later and i really enjoyed it!

Was that the Slash show with Fergie? Maybe, it was an event with Slash selling some product?

Get real man ... If GnR really means so much to you, then as a true fan, you need to find out why Axl is done with Slash.

Slash has said and done more to warrant any true GnR fan to not want to donate any more money to the products he is selling.

Music historians who have reviewed CD say it's brilliance is in how it was able to fuse just about every genre of modern music starting with the Beatles era to now.

In otherwords, if you wanted just one record that could give you a sense of what music has been like in the last century, CD would be that record.

Of course, for those still stuck in the late 1980s and only want 1980s hard-rock ... they will be obviously disappointed.

I'm gonna call shenanigans on that one

I'll call ... but I'll give you a chance to retract or re-affirm your hand ...

Still got shenanigans on this.

Like I said, I'm calling.

And like I said, from an artistic and music historical point of view, CD is brilliant. For a person who is only into one genre of music ... like those still stuck in 1987 POP ROCK ... they will overwelhmed by CD because there is so much there to digest.

Pay attention to words like:

"Axl's pulled it off"

"It's the most remarkable achievement"

"What he's [Axl] given us [Chinese Democracy] is a weird remnant of the the 20th century that somehow works for the first decay of the 21sth century"

"If you believe in the idea of Guns n Roses and Axl Rose ... this [Chinese Democracy] is the MASTERPIECE."

"[Chinese Democracy] is a bizarre masterpiece that comments on the entire history of rock music."

yep, he said he'd go but then didnt cause of Axl. there's zero integrity in Dizzy's behaviour regarding HOF. what a puppet!

Geez, I wonder why Izzy didn't go then?

I guess Izzy is a puppet too, huh?

The two founding fathers of GnR are: Axl and Izzy.

And those two weren't at the HOF.

Izzy made the right call ... because he knew those posers attending the HOF would look stupid without Axl and him there! LOL

Considering his seniority and tenure, why isn't Dizzy "The General" of the band?

Probably because seniority and tenure isn't enough.

More likely that the pianist is not an integral part of every song like the bass player is.

If the bass player knows the structure of every song to a tee ... then everything else just falls into place nicely.

Dizzy didn't go because Axl didn't wanna go. He more or less admitted this later on, saying it was about loyalty, and he understood why Axl didn't wanna do it, and blah, blah, whatever it was.

Here's a little insight into "blah, blah, whatever it was"

Marc Cantor: Slash is a LIAR. He lies to make himself look "cool".

Marc Cantor: Axl liked 4 of the Snakepit songs. But Slash got butt-hurt that Axl wouldn't take all of his snakepit songs (as-is).

Marc Cantor: Axl asked Slash to work on 4 songs for Chinese Democracy ... but Slash refused.

Axl: Slash and Duff belittle his song writing for years.

And let's not forget Slash and Duff's big drug problems that jeopardize the band's future ... hence, why Axl had to retain the rights to the GnR name.

Slash through the years said a lot of things to make it seem like Axl victimized him ... in order to make Axl the bad guy and he the good guy ... hence the song "Sorry".

Yeah, that's just the tip of the ice-berge too.

Music historians who have reviewed CD say it's brilliance is in how it was able to fuse just about every genre of modern music starting with the Beatles era to now.

In otherwords, if you wanted just one record that could give you a sense of what music has been like in the last century, CD would be that record.

Of course, for those still stuck in the late 1980s and only want 1980s hard-rock ... they will be obviously disappointed.

I'm gonna call shenanigans on that one

I'll call ... but I'll give you a chance to retract or re-affirm your hand ...

Think about this: the founding fathers of GnR were not at the RnR HOF

Music historians who have reviewed CD say it's brilliance is in how it was able to fuse just about every genre of modern music starting with the Beatles era to now.

In otherwords, if you wanted just one record that could give you a sense of what music has been like in the last century, CD would be that record.

Of course, for those still stuck in the late 1980s and only want 1980s hard-rock ... they will be obviously disappointed.

Neither alcohol or drugs will ever make ChiDem anything other than mediocre and I have tried just about everything.........

You've tried everything except ... crawling out from under the rock you've been hiding under since 1987.

Here's a tip: try listening to NEW MUSIC

And no ... it's a SAD time to be Slash fan because his LIES have been exposed.

All Slash (and to some extend Duff) have to do is apologize to Axl and the fans for his LIES, ego, bitterness, and abusive treatment of Axl ... and it could have happened.

It's funny how the $la$holes conveniently leave out this very simple FACT:

Axl was trying to protect GnR and himself in the event that $la$h and Duff killed themselves given their big problems with drugs and alcohol. The point is that had $lash and/or Duff died, then the estates of $la$h and Duff would have equal say in GnR business.

The issue with Izzy was that the guy didn't give 100% to the band anymore. He didn't care to record. He didn't like touring and hated big concerts. He didn't bring any energy to his performances. And as Marc Cantor stated, Izzy was a PARANOID mothafawker.

And Axl also stated, none of them gave a sh|t about him and all the other stuff related to running a big band like GnR. When poop hits the fan, it was always Axl to blame and Axl to clean it up.

So it was a GOOD thing that Axl had the brains to take control of the band and protect it from dying.

Axl is so jealous of Slash it is hilarious.

Is it as hilarious as Slash lying to win public sympathy in his attempts to smear Axl?

The security guard probably didn't know any *better* ...

The security guard may have been acting in accord with what the crew and/or promoters instructed him to because those mics are expensive. If it were huge arena or outdoor concert, they may not care for the mic. But for a small venue, a copy thousand dollars for a mic is enough to pay for salary of several workers.

Maybe Axl will hear of your plight and do something about it.

Maybe Axl doesn't call Kid Rock anymore because Kid Rock is a Mitt Romney supporter?! LMAO

Or maybe, Axl simply has lost all artistic respect for Kid Rock?

The bigger question should be:

Why does Slash continually work with losers like Kid Rock?!

The second question should be:

Why does Axl have to call the Kid Rock anyways? Why doesn't Kid Rock call Axl if he really misses Axl?

Axl isn't being *petty*. You can't seriously expect Axl to call up Kid Rock and simply ignore the elephant in the room.

Axl is an honest person. Too honest sometimes for his own good. But that is who he is. He can't lie and pretend. He isn't two-face like Slash.

amazing post

Thanks so much Bran. It just occurred to me watching Axl tonight how much of a prisoner all the guys- but especially Axl and Slash- have been to reunion speculations- and I just feel like it's time to move on. Axl showed tonight that he's one of the funnier, more charming and authentic people in entertainment- but sadly he's seemingly forced himself into "bunker" mode the last 16 years b/c of residual "general public anger" about the band break-up and his refusal to reunite. That's everyone's loss and particularly music's loss.

The "general public" clearly didn't like the decisions Axl made in the mid 90s in taking the name. Fine- but it seems to me he's been sufficiently flogged the last 16 years. Hell even West Germany was eventually re-admitted to the "club of civilized nations" 10 or so years after WW II. Cut the guy some slack and enjoy him while we got 'em 'cuz he's an original and there won't be another like him once he hangs it up. Extend Slash and the others the very same courtesy while we're at it too (i.e. maybe spare Slash the obligatory Axl/reunion questions the next time he's got a new album out or whatever)...

Just my .02 cents.

See the bolded parts of your post ... which clearly contradicted your overall "good intentions".

I'm sure you mean no harm, but you still view "Axl" as the BAD GUY ... the guy responsible for firing Slash and Duff and breaking up 1991-GnR. This LIE has been debunked.

I'm not sure if anybody has stated this already:

CHINESE DEMOCRACY PROMOTION OFFICIALLY STARTS OCTOBER 24!!!

It seems Jimmy Kimmel is the current "it" guy in Hollywood. For him to land Axl, means a hell of lot. Being that this is Axl's first MAINSTREAM LIVE TV interview.

October 24th is the day the mainstream world will be seeing what we all have been witnessing the last couple of years: GnR is back and better than ever!

I couldn't find any official statement about Brain Mantia being out of Guns. Frank has been playing for so long that it looks like Brain is out, but was there any press release or comments from the band or the man himself?

Would he be part of the band again if they decided to record?

Do you guys miss him? I think he's a great drummer, but like Buckethead, a little too "weird" for Guns. I dislike Frank Ferrer drumming a lot so I'd love to have him back though.

BRAIN makes a great living as a session drummer. People hire him to write and record music because he is one of the best in the world. Just check out his credits.

He is not very keen on doing long tours for whatever reasons he may have. He clearly is not desperate for the money or needs the traveling rock star lifestyle. Hence, why Frank was hired.

That is why there is no need for any "official statement" regarding whether Brain quit or was fired. If Axl called Brain up to record CD II or do a one-off special show, Brain would be there in a heartbeat.

Here you go.

Please ... nobody tell BBA that Brain was just fawking with him with his answers.

Apparently, BBA doesn't know what sarcasm is.