Rustycage

Nothing is wrong with GNR! They're only missing 2 guitarists and possibly a bassist!

/casm

LOL that must be satire.

They seem like people who have integrity, loyalty and morality. Something lacking in most business managers that GNR had in the past. Why is that a bad thing?

What you listed are great attributes for an assistant to Axl. The attributes that matter to the brand are what is best for the band. They have done the opposite. Kissing Axl's ass has created a complacent and boring artist.

It can't be argued that what they have enabled through their eggshell walk is anything good.

Simple question:

Has the quality, motivation, production and performance of the band raised or lowered since they took over?

The obvious answer is they have taken the path of least resistance with Axl and as a result, did only what is best for THEM!

How do you know any of that. Axl is hardly a complacent and boring artist. Just because his work hasn't been officially released YET does not mean that it is boring and complacent. Far too many business managers confuse what is best for the brand with what is best for the artist. Axl is to me an artist of the highest integrity because he hasn''t sold his soul to the brand.

Could this be any more full of shit?

For starters, the fact that he hasn't released anything in 7 years since CD and there are ZERO hints at that being in the future plans shows that management is failing somewhere along the way. Complacency.

Second, band managers manage the BAND not the artist. Their job is to do what will make the band the most prosperous. That is what the label expects out of a band which they release material and front tours. Declining attendance due to poor production and performances along with procrastination about future material is not a recipe for success.

Lastly, "Axl didn't sell out for the brand?" WTF do you consider brushing all of the original members aside so he keep be the sole owner of the brand name? An artist with integrity would have taken his sole new musical direction and released it solo without a name to hide behind. When you say Axl has integrity through all of this, you bankrupt the term "integrity."

They seem like people who have integrity, loyalty and morality. Something lacking in most business managers that GNR had in the past. Why is that a bad thing?

What you listed are great attributes for an assistant to Axl. The attributes that matter to the brand are what is best for the band. They have done the opposite. Kissing Axl's ass has created a complacent and boring artist.

It can't be argued that what they have enabled through their eggshell walk is anything good.

Simple question:

Has the quality, motivation, production and performance of the band raised or lowered since they took over?

The obvious answer is they have taken the path of least resistance with Axl and as a result, did only what is best for THEM!

Because I think you're extrapolating it.

Well, even if I were I'd still have to have a starting point with some examples of people who dislike CD because of other things than the music, which is what stella and I have been saying, so....

Stating that some people dislike CD because of other reasons than the music should be completely uncontroversial. It happens with all types of art. You can't separate context from art, or art form artist. What happens here is just people being so defensive of anything that can be construed as potential criticism of themselves that they go on attack rather than just accept what is trivial. Basically, they'd rather contest something uncontroversial rather than accept a statement that can be contrued as implictly critical of themselves. It is actually funny how a corrosive environment for discussions where people debate from the trenches make some people willing to sacrifice their intellect to defuse perceived criticisms.

So..... Who?

Because I think you're extrapolating it.

Who specifically?

I could say some only like the record because of Axl hemorrhoids but it doesn't make it true.

I hold absolutely zero responsibility for it.

If a reunion happens, it wouldn't bother me one bit if Dizzy is left out. He brings nothing important and it would be less idiotic interviews to read.

I wonder if the Crue or Metallica or Aerosmith or ACDC (and their fans) wait for the maids kid to make a statement on those bands future....or if they have a maid that negotiated tours and such

I also wonder if the fans are treated like assholes for asking them information about the band.

Are we still using butthurt in 2015? Really?

How does that make you feel?

He should try working a real job before complaining about money.

When cops kill unarmed civilians... "who cares really?"

When anyone is killed..... "Who cares really?"

"It's not like we can bring them back!"

Courtney Love is boring like his daughter, like this whole "Courtney killed Kurt zomg" saga....

Who cares now really?

Who cares about the case? People that care about justice in any case. There is no statute of limitations for murder and thus there isn't a limit on how long it matters. When you get a girlfriend, an if she has you murdered to look like suicide, would you want people to give up after a couple of weeks, months, years? "Omg, that was like so last week. Fringe pants are what's in now!"

It's been 22 years since 3 8 year olds boys were found murdered in a ditch and the real killer hasn't been prosecuted. Has too much time elapsed to "care?" Of course not.

Nobody's death should go without a proper investigation. That's what they are SUPPOSED to do.

Who cares about the Frances saga? People that want one of the 3 legally entitled people(Frances, Courtney or Wendy Cobain) to release the autopsy report. Frances being the most likely to do so in the future.

Over/under on this topic going unanswered?

if CD is assessed for what it is, as opposed to a comparison with AfD/UYI and without the whole ZOMG AXL RUINED EVERYTHING)!)!)!))!)! biases, it's way better than some give it credit for. I can definitely see it as being an album that might be better appreciated in time.

No. That might be how you feel about it but that's not how everyone feels about it. Someone could just give me an unopened CD and I would turn it down. There's nothing about it that appeals to me regardless of who is or isn't on it.

This.

There are people in this forum who do not know the difference between objective and subjective and/or opinion and fact.

Chinese Democracy is a terrible, terrible album, an unlistenable piece of shit, for me, you know, not for the earth. Luckily nobody knows the album exists around here so chances of someone giving me an unopened copy of that turd are pretty much zero. Thank God.

And there are people on this forum who lack reading comprehension and only cherry-pick the parts of posts they want to bash. The beginning of my original post actually said: "Oh, I think it's entirely possible for someone to listen to CD (or ANY other album out there, regardless of quality) and dislike it on a personal level. We don't all like the same stuff or the same styles of composition and performance, and that'd not always about quality, it's about what personally appeals to us and what does not."

and I was actually replying to a poster who said that there was no way to dislike CD.

Nah, the reason it was cut was because you immediately flipped and said:

if CD is assessed for what it is, as opposed to a comparison with AfD/UYI and without the whole ZOMG AXL RUINED EVERYTHING)!)!)!))!)! biases, it's way better than some give it credit for.

You're insinuating that people only dislike it because it doesn't have Slash or wtf ever. That's a pretty boneheaded view on the opinion of others.

if CD is assessed for what it is, as opposed to a comparison with AfD/UYI and without the whole ZOMG AXL RUINED EVERYTHING)!)!)!))!)! biases, it's way better than some give it credit for. I can definitely see it as being an album that might be better appreciated in time.

No. That might be how you feel about it but that's not how everyone feels about it. Someone could just give me an unopened CD and I would turn it down. There's nothing about it that appeals to me regardless of who is or isn't on it.

Man, TB's situation with this band reminds me so much of what Dilma, Brazilian president, is doing with Brazil.

I was thinking more Chris Brown and Rihanna. Or maybe what Dallas did to Debbie.

I think they'll have to accept a smaller role. They've shown they can't handle nugnr (wedding, bowling alley and stupid Vegas residencies). A reunited GNR would be WAY too much for them.

I still don't see that one as a big deal. The Stones played a billionaire's wife's birthday party this year. Is that really any different than playing a wedding? It's easy money. No one is knocking The Stones' management for booking them at a private function like that.

The difference is the Stones haven't been diminished to a minor act along the way. Nugnr has become a joke and the crowds are dwindling. GNR are/were not ascending under TB's management. Whether that is Axl's fault or not is beside the point, also. Axl isn't the manager either and he wouldn't be under a reunited GNR.

Management needs to be more neutral in regards to the members and needs to serve the band, not a specific person. That's what assistants are for.

That's all fair and I won't disagree with you. But why should diminishing returns be a criteria for judging GN'R for playing private parties differently than you judge The Stones for it? Gn'R didn't do a couple of weddings out of necessity - they sure didn't need to do it for the money. If Axl was broke and did them because he needed the money, you'd have a point. But they didn't - they chose to play them, no different than The Stones.

No, the point is they degraded themselves for the million dollars. The wedding looked desperately pathetic. Some say it was for a friend. A million dollars for a "friend?" Meh, I don't buy it. The way they handled it was bogus. They shifted all of the gear at the last minute for it which had to totally fuck with the crew. That only adds to the look of desperation. Another cash grab.

I don't know wtf they were thinking with the bowling alley. That was approaching the level of Spinal Tap at the air force base. Axl was apparently surprised by this gig. He didn't choose this gig.

Vegas residencies are for washed up acts. There may be some exceptions but that is generally the rule. When all else fails, go to Vegas.

Do we need to discuss Nightrain? What an embarrassment to fanclubs everywhere.

Maybe that's ok for nugnr but not for the real deal.

scheduling and negotiations will be handled by the actual band.

I don't see that being possible. So many things pop up along the way that it would be too much for them to handle and perform. If you leave all of the side things to all of the assistants, that's a recipe for disaster.

I think they'll have to accept a smaller role. They've shown they can't handle nugnr (wedding, bowling alley and stupid Vegas residencies). A reunited GNR would be WAY too much for them.

I still don't see that one as a big deal. The Stones played a billionaire's wife's birthday party this year. Is that really any different than playing a wedding? It's easy money. No one is knocking The Stones' management for booking them at a private function like that.

The difference is the Stones haven't been diminished to a minor act along the way. Nugnr has become a joke and the crowds are dwindling. GNR are/were not ascending under TB's management. Whether that is Axl's fault or not is beside the point, also. Axl isn't the manager either and he wouldn't be under a reunited GNR.

Management needs to be more neutral in regards to the members and needs to serve the band, not a specific person. That's what assistants are for.

I think they'll have to accept a smaller role. They've shown they can't handle nugnr (wedding, bowling alley and stupid Vegas residencies). A reunited GNR would be WAY too much for them.

One of the greatest. It's impossible to be a GnR fan and not be a fan of his work, he wrote the majority of the songs in every era.

Sure he did.

For those that still follow the case itself, earlier this month, an semi-interview with Jessica Hopper took place in which she was incredibly defensive and evasive. So much so that she appeared to be covering.

For those that don't know, Jessica Hopper is the ex-girlfriend of Cali that was there on Saturday the 2nd when Kurt arrived home from Rehab. According to her, they joked about her haircut(shaved head) and talked about MTV.

She recalled in the past how she woke up early on the 5th and Cali wasn't in bed. She heard someone walking in the hallway "with a purpose." After calling out, she got no answer. Cali returned to bed hours later. On the 6th, she had been ill and was needing to leave. A cab was called to take her to the airport. Upon walking to the driveway, she turned back and vomited again. Just what did she witness or become a part of?

Jessica Hopper is now an international "rock critic." At the time of the Kurt disappearance , she was a high school junkie with no connection to the entertainment industry. After this incident, she receives assistance from Courtney to jump start her career. Not only did she receive that assistance but she also was the girlfriend that disappeared with Cali shortly after this went down. Courtney admittedly gave Cali $30,000 to "go to rehab" shortly after the death. Jessica was with him.

Here is the interview:

In this interview, with her crocodile tears and mood swings, she insists that she won't answer a simple and genuine question about Kurt's mood because "he was like family." Not only is that a ridiculous response to this question 21 years later, but Kurt was not like family to her. She was just another hanger-on and a junkie girlfriend of Cali. She is obviously afraid to speak out which is understandable considering what happened to El Duce after he spoke out, what happened to Kristen Pfaff and Detective Terry. Basically anyone with information were either supported financially or are deceased. Hopefully this girl realizes that she is safer if she speaks out. Courtney doesn't have the pull she once had and her money is running out. Sometimes the spotlight can be a good thing and protect. We'll see how that goes.

As for Courtney recently, her daughter(Frances) got married and Courtney wasn't invited. This leaves many to speculate what is going on and if Frances has now been informed about the real circumstances surrounding her father's death.

Immediately upon the news of Frances getting married to:

Isaiah Silva.

In response, Courtney posted the following:

It's a rather salty response. Especially those stupid hashtags.

Also, there is a tabloid article out there posting that they conducted an interview with Courtney

I do not take this portion seriously but it is worth sharing and I will explain why after.

“When the Nevermind album came out, Kurt was rapidly hailed as “the spokesman of a generation” and he gained tremendous influence,” she said. “He was almost immediately approached by the Freemasons, the Illuminatis and other secret societies as well as the CIA and other agencies, because all of them wanted to recruit him. Kurt wanted nothing to do with any of them and he told them to go to hell. That’s when they began to seriously harass him. They followed him everywhere, made creepy phone calls in the middle of the night… It made Kurt very nervous, and he began carrying a gun and using more and more drugs to cope with the stress. I had always thought that he had reached a point where he was no longer able to take it and had decided to kill himself.”

“After the police released some new pictures of the crime scene in April, I began receiving a lot of letters, emails and phone calls from Kurt’s fans,” quotes the magazine. “Among all the fan mail, I received some classified files emanating from the CIA. I don’t know who sent them, but I know they are legitimate. They clearly prove that Kurt was being spied upon, and they designate him as a “target to be eliminated”. I know they killed him, and I will prove it!”

It's a tabloid and I think it's bullshit either way for many reasons but it is relevant because you have to remember the many rumors that surrounded his death and who was responsible.

When the case first came to light, and shortly after Kurt was cremated, court documents appeared showing claims that Kurt's corpse had been violated while in the morgue. The claim states that an employee of the morgue had a party with some friends with Kurt's body. They supposedly shaved his head, cut out his heart, danced with his corpse to Pearl Jam music. To make a long story short, one of the earliest to investigate the case traced the source of the claim back to none other than Courtney. It was a false claim. Tracing the lawyer of the claim and his connection to Courtney wasn't difficult. When you look even closer at Courtney's internet ramblings in the mid 90's, you see references to Pearl Jam due to her disdain for the band. ESPECIALLY during the time of Dave Grohl carrying on with his career. She has a long history of bashing Pearl Jam and their fans for seemingly no reason. Anyways....

When the case first came to light, Courtney's attorney's were sending out cease and desist letters to radio stations and threatening them with lawsuit if they spoke to Tom Grant publicly. In most cases, this worked. She scared people into not publicizing the details of the case that you see in this movie.

Shortly after, F.O.K.(Friends of Kurt) AKA F.U.K.(Friends Understanding Kurt) put the rumors out there that Kurt's death was the result of Kurt using a dream machine. After this bullshit rumor was spread and quickly shot down, a representative of SOMA, The San Francisco "Journal of Left Coast Culture", tracked down a man named Steve Newman who claimed to be a part of F.U.K. Newman stated that F.U.K. was composed of Courtney Love and several people close to her. Newman claimed that Courtney Love played a "low key role" in F.U.K.

In the documentary Kurt & Courtney, Courtney played a huge role in the film by sabotaging it's efforts to investigate the death by getting the funding cut, pressuring journalists and eventually hushing Eldon Hoke(El Duce) after his interview in the film.

She, over the years, has been very involved in disinformation and sabotaging of legitimate efforts to answer the lingering questions.

When it comes to this film, many may not know that she once again had her attorney's sent out cease and desist letters to all of the theaters planning to show the film. All but one ignored the letters and played the movie anyway. What happened as a result? Nothing. A lawsuit will open Courtney up to deposition and that will be the avalanche.

Now, with this recent tabloid article that in no way should be taken seriously, if it is indeed more of her words(which she has a history of saying dumb shit like that), she is once again playing a role in disinformation. She is absolutely committed to sabotaging the case and all efforts to find out what happened.

How is Courtney doing these days?

https://www.facebook.com/courtneylove/videos/vb.504299626273547/900387669998072/?type=2&theater

Posted Saturday. Looking to be back on the smack and going downhill.

Due note that in all of Courtney's tantrums, collapses and run-ins with the law and fans has always had one catalyst....... The details surrounding Kurt's death. Fans in the mid 90's harassed her about it and she on multiple occasions assaulted fans and faced charges. Upon the release of Kurt and Courtney, she spent the next several years descending into crack and heroin addiction. It got even worse after the release of several books surrounding this case. Until this film was released, she seemed to have cleaned herself up and get her career jump-started again(to a degree). Upon hearing about this film in early of 2014, Montage of Heck was quickly put together and released only months before this film. Note the content of the film. It is an early rebuttal to the facts of the case. It's nothing but damage control. Do not take this movie as fact especially the details about Kurt fucking a retard and any of that nonsense. Kurt was trashed in that movie and one should wonder why a widow would trash her dead husband publicly in such a way. I guess it's no different than releasing his private journals in 2002. The same journals that Kurt thought were stolen by burglars.(the same "burglars" Kurt talked about when purchasing the shotgun) He never found out just who took them. It's not a mystery anymore. The journals were released around the same time that the Who Killed Kurt Cobain books were published. It convinced many to conclude, "oh yeah. Look at what he wrote. He was definitely unhinged."

This case isn't labeled as nutty "conspiracy theory" anymore and Courtney isn't the adored white trash baby doll anymore. In the next few years, it's going to get very ugly and very very dark for Courtney.