John Lennon ruined The Beatles?

[Jakey Styley]

Someone on the board (Bacardimayne) says that John Lennon ruined The Beatles, both in and out of music. I think this is a very irrational and arrogant thing to say because when you read about the demise of The Beatles it's not one man's fault at all, they just weren't clicking with each other anymore. As far as the music goes, he thinks that John Lennon ruined it with his songs about and/or influenced by drug use (despite the fact that they all did drugs).

I'm not making this thread to be a Bacardimayne bashfest (he wants to know what you guys think too) but I just want to know what you guys think of those who share this opinion.

Edited August 15, 2010 by ItsSuchACrimeUKnowItsJAKE

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

lol

[bacardimayne]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

What is wrong with you? That's the best Beatles album, imo.

[Jakey Styley]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

What is wrong with you? That's the best Beatles album, imo.

Easily in my top 3.

[bacardimayne]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

What is wrong with you? That's the best Beatles album, imo.

lol

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

What is wrong with you? That's the best Beatles album, imo.

Easily in my top 3.

Aside from Hello Goodbye, and All You Need is Love, there are no bad songs on that album. Fantastic from start to finish.

My Top

1.MMT

2. Sgt. Peppers

3.The White Album

Revolver sometimes squeezes in there somewhere. Aside from that, there's not really much else. Rubber Soul sucks, Let it Be sucks and before that it's all generic to me.

EDIT: I prefer The Stones.

Edited August 15, 2010 by Jumpin' Jack Flash

[bacardimayne]

Magical Mystery Tour was a fucking atrocity. That is all.

What is wrong with you? That's the best Beatles album, imo.

Easily in my top 3.

Aside from Hello Goodbye, and All You Need is Love, there are no bad songs on that album. Fantastic from start to finish.

My Top

1.MMT

2. Sgt. Peppers

3.The White Album

Revolver sometimes squeezes in there somewhere. Aside from that, there's not really much else. Rubber Soul sucks, Let it Be sucks and before that it's all generic to me.

I prefer The Stones.

1. Help

2. Revolver

3. With the Beatles

Almost every John track after Sgt. Peppers is acid-inspired trash.

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

I have a feeling Lennon had this urge to be avant garde in some sort...and failed miserably every time. He's my least favourite songwriter in The Beatles, tbh.

[Ed Vega]

Is this some sort of elaborate cupcake designed to compare Waxl with Lennon?

[bacardimayne]

I have a feeling Lennon had this urge to be avant garde in some sort...and failed miserably every time. He's my least favourite songwriter in The Beatles, tbh.

On the early albums he's my favorite Beatle. Then he started taking acid and tried to be too deep.

[SpUd_Jr]

This thread sucks.

[LightningBolt]

I have a feeling Lennon had this urge to be avant garde in some sort...and failed miserably every time. He's my least favourite songwriter in The Beatles, tbh.

Well, besides Ringo, I agree (though Ringo was never much of a songwriter so I dunno if you count him). My top 5 Beatles songs are all composed of Harrison and McCartney songs. "Lovely Rita", "Something", "Here Comes the Sun", "While My Guitar Gently Weeps", and "Let it Be" are my five favorites and none of them are written by Lennon. Lennon was far from bad, of course, but I don't see why he's the most "loved" of all the Beatles by what seems to be most people. "I Want You (She's So Heavy)" is my favorite Lennon song with The Beatles, and I'd say that barely cracks my top 10.

[SunnyDRE]

Bacardi is right.

The reason the Beatles died is because of Lennon.

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

I have a feeling Lennon had this urge to be avant garde in some sort...and failed miserably every time. He's my least favourite songwriter in The Beatles, tbh.

Well, besides Ringo, I agree (though Ringo was never much of a songwriter so I dunno if you count him). My top 5 Beatles songs are all composed of Harrison and McCartney songs. "Lovely Rita", "Something", "Here Comes the Sun", "While My Guitar Gently Weeps", and "Let it Be" are my five favorites and none of them are written by Lennon. Lennon was far from bad, of course, but I don't see why he's the most "loved" of all the Beatles by what seems to be most people. "I Want You (She's So Heavy)" is my favorite Lennon song with The Beatles, and I'd say that barely cracks my top 10.

Octopus's Garden is better than anything Lennon ever wrote on his own for The Beatles. And Harrison is easily the best songwriter in the Beatles. Coolest too... XD

However, I must admit I think John's debut solo album is better than any Beatles album and arguably my favourite album of all time. THAT is a masterpiece.

The reason Lennon died is because of The Beatles.

Fixed.

[bacardimayne]

The reason Lennon died is because of The Beatles.

Fixed.

The reason Lennon died is because some fat psychopath shot him.

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

The reason Lennon died is because of The Beatles.

Fixed.

The reason Lennon died is because some fat psychopath shot him.

So if Lennon wasn't in The Beatles this fat psychopath would've still shot him? Would Lennon even have been in NYC that day if it weren't for The Beatles?

[hans_moleman]

Blame Yoko.

[Guest Len B'stard]

The Beatles were ruined by John Lennon? Hmmm, interesting concept considering John Lennon there wouldn't be a Beatles.

John Lennon is the singlemost greatest artist to my mind, if i had to pick one individual that was the most important it would be Mr Lennon. to say that he ruined The Beatles is...a bit mind boggling to be honest. I don't know how to approach that notion. He wrote half the songs, thats words and music so ummmm...better without half the words and music? The rebellious bent, that was a lot (though not all) to do with John, he was the humor of The Beatles, the mouthpiece, the leader, the starter of The Beatles, whatcha mean ruined them, what the fuck are you talking about?!?! Shit, he even came up with the fucking name.

John Lennon is, stand alone, the supreme artist of popular music, a man thats never unfashionable, accepted in all quarter, universally recognised, from Punk to Reggae to Metal or Grunge to...whatever man, they all rate John Lennon cuz quite frankly the substance was there, the man was EVERYTHING, poet, singer, songwriter, activist, icon, actor, writer, he was an instinctive genius and a cultural revolutionary who is, in part, responsible for the reason our world is the way it is, thats all of you.

Jesus, he's a rock n roll singer, thats like 50 years ago and the fuckers childhood home is owned by The National Trust and they do tours around the place, he has a fucking airport named after him, a rock n roll singer, i dunno whether that's an unprescedented feat or just plain hilairious but it is what it is and he is what he is and that's the key musical force of the 20th Century.

As far as The Beatles and their music and his imprint on that? How could John Lennon ruin it with his drug intake when they were all doing drugs? McCartney was a cokehead pretty heavily before acid even came on the scene it later transpires. And whatever your opinion might be about The Magical Mystery Tour movie, the songs are fuckin incredible. In fact, it's the songs being so incredible thats what makes it so history even excuses the Magical Mystery Tour in the eyes of many critics although i think it's amazing it's just...it's non linear, its experimental, to sit there and the end of wonder why it didn't tell a neatly wrapped little tale is missing the point slightly.

Of all the songs John wrote, how many are acid inspired anyway?!?! Tommorow Never Knows, She Said She Said....what else? I am The Walrus isn't, that's about a book and it's pretty much a free assciative word exercise...Tommorow Never Knows is only half acid inspired but i guess...but what others?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Beatles_songs

Here, pick em, show me

And his solo albums are all brilliant too, i've been meaning to make a thread about his album Sometime in New York City for months now but i just can't be bothered If i was pushed to name the single most important the single most life changing album i've ever come across ever on a personal level it would be John Lennon and Yoko Ono's Two Virgins.

John Lennon failing at avante garde? He made a place for it, there wasn't no such thing in rock n roll until John Lennon made it so so i'd say he pretty much led the pack there. I think it's of intense importance that a band like The Beatles ventured into the avante garde arena cuz it kinda legitimised it in the field of music. I mean, that's not to say avante garde artists make their way onto MTV or some shit but i mean, the Beatles doing it kinda gave the concept life in the sphere of popular music. I'm a firm believer that the artisier end of punk, No Wave and Art Punk and all these kindsa musics really owe a debt to John Lennon and by extension and possibly more of a debt to Yoko Ono.

I suppose whether you think he avante garde stuff had any stand alone artistic merit is something else.

In short, every Beatles album was a masterpiece, every Beatles was incredible, not one single member was interchangeable or replaceable, they were the shit, John Lennon was the shit.

Edited August 15, 2010 by sugaraylen

[Marky]

I have a feeling Lennon had this urge to be avant garde in some sort...and failed miserably every time. He's my least favourite songwriter in The Beatles, tbh.

He definately would've tarnished their legacy if the band would have continued another 10 years or so. His writing, and his life with Yoko, sort of became quite irrelevant and unrelated to anything that could go hand in hand with 'The Beatles'.

[sweetness]

I was always under the same impression, sure he was a great songwriter and all, but his ego was bigger than jesus. yoko ono didn't exactly help that

[Guest Len B'stard]

He definately would've tarnished their legacy if the band would have continued another 10 years or so. His writing, and his life with Yoko, sort of became quite irrelevant and unrelated to anything that could go hand in hand with 'The Beatles'.

I think he was aware of that too. Which is why things happened the way they did, what he wanted to do was nothing to do with The Beatles and could never be understood within that framework. I agree that it would've tarnished The Beatles legacy but that's only because The Beatles had gone as far as they could go. But i don't by any means consider that what John did after The Beatles was a sort of step down from what The Beatles were, i think it was really brave of him, John understood the audience and he understood which part of it was his and that takes a lot of savvy.

The path John was going was something that would have been very hard to digest for The Beatles audience so it's like drawing a line in the sand like, OK, i'm not about that anymore. John really stuck his neck out for things that he purported to believe in and he really suffered for it too. I don't think the man ever produced a bad album to boot either.

I think, in another ten years, they would've all played a part in tarnishing that legacy and through no fault of their own either. Their legacy is something that, to a great degree, is this kind of dream that people have in their head that no one on earth could consistently live up to. I think The Beatles ended, more or less, in the right way for the right reasons.

The basic idea is that where John was coming from was not for everyone. A good songwriter with an ear for a melody that can crack out tunes on order like Mr Lennon could can probably carry on ad infinitum making meaningless songs that are universally appealing and twee but why on earth would they want to? After 10 years of pleasing everybody surely there comes a time where a person wants to please oneself with artistically satisfying music and to hell if it's not commercially successful.

[Jakey Styley]

The Beatles were ruined by John Lennon? Hmmm, interesting concept considering John Lennon there wouldn't be a Beatles.

John Lennon is the singlemost greatest artist to my mind, if i had to pick one individual that was the most important it would be Mr Lennon. to say that he ruined The Beatles is...a bit mind boggling to be honest. I don't know how to approach that notion. He wrote half the songs, thats words and music so ummmm...better without half the words and music? The rebellious bent, that was a lot (though not all) to do with John, he was the humor of The Beatles, the mouthpiece, the leader, the starter of The Beatles, whatcha mean ruined them, what the fuck are you talking about?!?! Shit, he even came up with the fucking name.

John Lennon is, stand alone, the supreme artist of popular music, a man thats never unfashionable, accepted in all quarter, universally recognised, from Punk to Reggae to Metal or Grunge to...whatever man, they all rate John Lennon cuz quite frankly the substance was there, the man was EVERYTHING, poet, singer, songwriter, activist, icon, actor, writer, he was an instinctive genius and a cultural revolutionary who is, in part, responsible for the reason our world is the way it is, thats all of you.

Jesus, he's a rock n roll singer, thats like 50 years ago and the fuckers childhood home is owned by The National Trust and they do tours around the place, he has a fucking airport named after him, a rock n roll singer, i dunno whether that's an unprescedented feat or just plain hilairious but it is what it is and he is what he is and that's the key musical force of the 20th Century.

As far as The Beatles and their music and his imprint on that? How could John Lennon ruin it with his drug intake when they were all doing drugs? McCartney was a cokehead pretty heavily before acid even came on the scene it later transpires. And whatever your opinion might be about The Magical Mystery Tour movie, the songs are fuckin incredible. In fact, it's the songs being so incredible thats what makes it so history even excuses the Magical Mystery Tour in the eyes of many critics although i think it's amazing it's just...it's non linear, its experimental, to sit there and the end of wonder why it didn't tell a neatly wrapped little tale is missing the point slightly.

Of all the songs John wrote, how many are acid inspired anyway?!?! Tommorow Never Knows, She Said She Said....what else? I am The Walrus isn't, that's about a book and it's pretty much a free assciative word exercise...Tommorow Never Knows is only half acid inspired but i guess...but what others?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Beatles_songs

Here, pick em, show me

And his solo albums are all brilliant too, i've been meaning to make a thread about his album Sometime in New York City for months now but i just can't be bothered If i was pushed to name the single most important the single most life changing album i've ever come across ever on a personal level it would be John Lennon and Yoko Ono's Two Virgins.

John Lennon failing at avante garde? He made a place for it, there wasn't no such thing in rock n roll until John Lennon made it so so i'd say he pretty much led the pack there. I think it's of intense importance that a band like The Beatles ventured into the avante garde arena cuz it kinda legitimised it in the field of music. I mean, that's not to say avante garde artists make their way onto MTV or some shit but i mean, the Beatles doing it kinda gave the concept life in the sphere of popular music. I'm a firm believer that the artisier end of punk, No Wave and Art Punk and all these kindsa musics really owe a debt to John Lennon and by extension and possibly more of a debt to Yoko Ono.

I suppose whether you think he avante garde stuff had any stand alone artistic merit is something else.

In short, every Beatles album was a masterpiece, every Beatles was incredible, not one single member was interchangeable or replaceable, they were the shit, John Lennon was the shit.

Agree with the whole post, all 4 of them just had different interests by the end of their great run. However, if I remember right, some of the lines in I Am the Walrus were written while on an acid trip. But not the music.

[Snake Eyes]

Did he fuck.. strawberry fields forever, i am the walrus etc. Genius.

[mrandyk]

I cant believe you made a thread about one of this guy's statements. Fucking everything he says is just ridiculous.