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Axl's 30s


Vincent Vega

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I sort of thought that because UYI I and II came out together that I lasted til 94, then UYI II took over. Then there was Spaghetti. I suppose I liked certain songs on Illusions beginning of 90s, by mid-90s I was liking Estranged. But yeah live shows the fans maybe missed that. How many times can a musician tell us what type of ice cream he likes.

They should've toured until 1995 or '96 like Metallica did.

Restart the tour, this time in support of UYI + TSI in say May 1994, club tour first leg along with an MTV Unplugged performance, then a stadium leg, than an arena leg and finish it up in December 1995. Release next album in May 1996. Appear on the MTV VMAs. Start tour in support of that record in South America in January 1997 (this was actually planned by Guns in real life).

That's how it should have went.

The thing is, they were probably so extremely dysfunctional at that time, that they'd fallen apart somewhere along the way, even if they'd tried to go that route you made up. I really don't think that it all could've happened in another way, given the circumstances the band put itself in over the years leading up to the UYI tour.

Edited by Spoon87
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I sort of thought that because UYI I and II came out together that I lasted til 94, then UYI II took over. Then there was Spaghetti. I suppose I liked certain songs on Illusions beginning of 90s, by mid-90s I was liking Estranged. But yeah live shows the fans maybe missed that. How many times can a musician tell us what type of ice cream he likes.

They should've toured until 1995 or '96 like Metallica did.

Restart the tour, this time in support of UYI + TSI in say May 1994, club tour first leg along with an MTV Unplugged performance, then a stadium leg, than an arena leg and finish it up in December 1995. Release next album in May 1996. Appear on the MTV VMAs. Start tour in support of that record in South America in January 1997 (this was actually planned by Guns in real life).

That's how it should have went.

The thing is, they were probably so extremely dysfunctional at that time, that they'd fallen apart somewhere along the way, even if they'd tried to go that route you made up. I really don't think that it all could've happened in another way, given the circumstances the band put itself in over the years leading up to the UYI tour.

Well they did have some of these plans. Axl did want Guns on Unplugged; Slash vetoed it. Slash wanted Guns to do a club tour for TSI; He claims Axl vetoed it. As of August '96, Guns had plans to begin touring in January '97 in South America--They seemed to be on the table--but had to be cancelled when Slash officially quit. A lot of these things could easily have happened if Axl and Slash made some compromises on both ends. Both of their ideas were good--A club tour could've given them that 1987 close knit feel and maybe even brought some of those memories back; A spot on Unplugged, which was one of the biggest things in music in the mid '90s, could've kept them relevant in pop culture and should have been something Slash would like (since Unplugged basically followed the same concept as their own Skin N Bones tour).

All one of them had to do was bend. Axl could've bent and made a subpar, quick rock record just to appease Slash (and now, looking back, he says he would have done so but Slash blocked him and Slash made it a his way or the highway sort of thing); Slash could've bent and made an industrial or Pearl Jam-ish record (and now, in retrospect, he says he would have so long as he and Axl had mutual respect, but Axl made it a his way or the highway sort of thing). It's kind of ironic and sad, since these ''musical differences'' didn't seem to really matter, if we're to take their retrospective statements as being honest--It seems it came down to a matter of miscommunication and personality clashes.

If you look at their more recent statements, both of their versions of the breakup amount to what was in essence not a clash between a guy who wanted to do Aerosmith and a guy who wanted to do NiN, but a simple personality clash which first caused a stalemate between '94 and '96 and finally a breakup. The musical differences that the media feasted upon were just superficial bullshit which could've been fixed--They were just outward symptoms of a much larger problem: They both had gotten egos, and thus both felt their way or the highway were the only ways.

I don't think even if Izzy had returned to the fold as a full member in 1996 it could've saved Axl and Slash's relationship.

IMO, I do blame Slash more. If he had just handed over the Snakepit songs to Axl, when Axl changed his mind and wanted to record them, it could have saved their relationship. Instead he decided to be bitchy about it and not only deny Axl the songs, but then make snarky comments in the media (which he knew pissed Axl off), stuff like, "Axl feels like anytime I play the guitar, that song is a Guns song (laughs)", or "I don't wanna do any Stephanie Seymour ballads or any of that shit", or "Axl is a rockstar as much in his own mind as he is in the media". For all their differences, Slash DID NOT help their relationship by bashing Axl to the media while he was still in the band.

Edited by Indigo Child
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I don't think Axl's age has negatively impacted him as much as Axl without Slash has.

Yeah...even though Slash now fits that exact description of The Rolling Stones in the first post. Playing music like he's 20 and being a "badass rockstar" 45.

I don't think he's playing music like he's 20. He's playing rock n roll like he always has, but now he's older.

I'm not bothered by the fact that Axl has aged. I'm bothered by the fact that he couldn't write a decent sounding song on his own and that his immaturity is preventing a truly great thing from happening again.

Correct, I mean at what point can bygones be bygones? Everyone else is warm to the idea of getting together yet Axl's holding out and blaming everyone but himself for the demise of GNR. THAT's why people don't care about him anymore, same old 'woe is me, Slash fucked everything up, I'm getting sued by everyone' bullshit. He then twists the dagger by using the GNR name with these unknown musicians (buying the rights to the name doesn't mean you should use it). Save for us diehards, he's a hair plugged, plastic surgery'd, complete has-been who turned the music world upside down for 5-6 years, then disappeared.

He must look around on stage sometimes and think "what the fuck I am doing with these guys??"

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I don't think Axl's age has negatively impacted him as much as Axl without Slash has.

Yeah...even though Slash now fits that exact description of The Rolling Stones in the first post. Playing music like he's 20 and being a "badass rockstar" 45.

I don't think he's playing music like he's 20. He's playing rock n roll like he always has, but now he's older.

I'm not bothered by the fact that Axl has aged. I'm bothered by the fact that he couldn't write a decent sounding song on his own and that his immaturity is preventing a truly great thing from happening again.

Correct, I mean at what point can bygones be bygones? Everyone else is warm to the idea of getting together yet Axl's holding out and blaming everyone but himself for the demise of GNR. THAT's why people don't care about him anymore, same old 'woe is me, Slash fucked everything up, I'm getting sued by everyone' bullshit. He then twists the dagger by using the GNR name with these unknown musicians (buying the rights to the name doesn't mean you should use it). Save for us diehards, he's a hair plugged, plastic surgery'd, complete has-been who turned the music world upside down for 5-6 years, then disappeared.

He must look around on stage sometimes and think "what the fuck I am doing with these guys??"

To Slashites like you, that's what he is. It isn't enough to just hate the man, you also have to try and equate him to Michael Jackson as well.

Man, people like you would love if Axl just retired. But you'll never come out and admit it, just dance around it and be hateful.

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Indigo Child - I agree the fault lies with multiple parties regarding the breakup (contrary to forum belief, I never insisted it was ALL Axl's fault). Who's more to blame is irrelevant once you establish that it was more than one person. This leads me to my point - what I hate so much is Axl's insistence that he had NOTHING to do with the breakup. The fact is that neither one of those guys compromised in any way, and as you pointed out, it ended in a draw - too bad for us, and for all music fans.

His posts here as Dexter pointed fingers at everyone which portrayed him as the sole victim - NOT TRUE, and I wish he'd stop lying to his few remaining fans. Not once did he ever take the blame for anything. Talk about a spin zone.

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The band should have changed. Axl and Slash should have made whatever concessions possible to make the next album. It would and did kill them if they just butted heads in a stalemate.

Whether that meant Slash would have had to subvert his playing, make room for strange noises, whatever...The Cult faced this same exact problem with their self-titled album in the nineties; Ian Astbury was adopting the electronic sounds and Billy Duffy had to find a way to make his playing acessable in a way that would complement that music. The album never caught the fire that the rest did, but it allowed them to continue their relationship in the future.

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I don't care how old Axl is..He still has that thing,the talent that he needs to write legendary songs.I really like Chinese Democracy.I mean,what do you think about "Street of dreams","Sorry","This i love"??In my oppinion,those are great songs,showing that Axl is a sensible man,able to express his feelings,still young,still loving music,still talented.When you are born with this gift,you keep it your whole life.Has anybody thought that maybe Axl felt like he needed a little time??Now you are gonna say that he took a too long break....He can do whatever he wants with his life.Axl doesn't need my or your approval.He doesn't need anyone's approval to do something.Someone said that maybe he wasted those years..I'm sure he didn't waste them.I bet he wrote great songs,that will come out one day.

Edited by Julia Alexandra
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In another post, this is what I was talking about when I said it 'is a shame'. That this band couldn't continue their creative arc throughout the 90's. There was so much promise after UYI and then just like that it died.

I love to look at a band like Metallica and how their 25+ year career is shaped, both lyrically and musically. With Guns it was the early stages of an arc, then nothing else. You could see how the band was evolving then nothing. By the time CD was released, nobody cared, and it wasn't viewed as the continuation of a legacy...it was simply Axl's lone vision come to fruition WELL after anyone cared and all the band members had left. I sometimes think of CD if it were released in '96-'97, what it would've been like.

Metallica is the most overrated shitty band I've ever heard. They had a falling out as well and there last two albums blew. They died when they kicked Dave out.

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Guest Sweet Tooth

In another post, this is what I was talking about when I said it 'is a shame'. That this band couldn't continue their creative arc throughout the 90's. There was so much promise after UYI and then just like that it died.

I love to look at a band like Metallica and how their 25+ year career is shaped, both lyrically and musically. With Guns it was the early stages of an arc, then nothing else. You could see how the band was evolving then nothing. By the time CD was released, nobody cared, and it wasn't viewed as the continuation of a legacy...it was simply Axl's lone vision come to fruition WELL after anyone cared and all the band members had left. I sometimes think of CD if it were released in '96-'97, what it would've been like.

Metallica is the most overrated shitty band I've ever heard. They had a falling out as well and there last two albums blew. They died when they kicked Dave out.

When they kicked Dave out? Dave got kicked out before their first release... ?

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Maybe this is a selfish standpoint, but Axl's lack of material for public consumption in his 30's was a huge waste of God given talent.

Well, you have this to thank for that:

Slash: "I'm not gonna do any Stephanie Seymour ballads or any of that shit."

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Axl did spent his 30's out of the public eye, but I guess we can thank the other band members, specifically Slash, for messing everything up. If they would have followed Axl and his vision, GNR would probably have continued making amazing albums until today.

I don't think Axl had any choice in this situation. What do you do? It seems like a long time folks, but if you look at the time line, it needed to take that long. You can't just come back to the public and not prepare heavily.

And you guys need to stop worrying about his age. People don't magically change as they get older. They are who they are. Axl is the same guy he always was.

He still has the voice, and he's still the best front man around. There's been no decline.

Fucken yeah to that statement.. I have twenty years more of experience as a guitarist and vocalist behindme ..more techique, more understanding more confidence ect..When i was 15-25 i didng know jack shit about anything..and actually Im in better shape and have more energy than the punk I was in high school and college. Age is relative. If you listen to youth bands because your young and only to your era..your doing a disservice to yourself. Shit I remember listening to Led Zeppelin and Aerosmith and going hmmmmm those guys are 70's shit...untill i actually started listening. I hear echos on this board in the disdain and hatred towards the old line up from our younger punks out there. Its all generational.

I dont buy into the premise that all stars loose it when they lose thier youth.. Axl being gone for 15 years lost the limelight that 87-94 had going..but hes on it now. T

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Maybe this is a selfish standpoint, but Axl's lack of material for public consumption in his 30's was a huge waste of God given talent.

Well, you have this to thank for that:

Slash: "I'm not gonna do any Stephanie Seymour ballads or any of that shit."

You also have this quote from Axl to thank for that:

"Slash hurry up and just do some Pearl Jam or NIN type records now cause that's what's hot...nevermind how we blew glam away doing our thing, I want to be a follower now. You see, soon I'll be completely disappearing to get my botched hairplugs, this thing called botox and fake white teeth!" They told me I'll look 26 instead of 36.

In all fairness, the window to get something done was short - perhaps only 2 or 3 years before Brian Wilson went into hiding to make himself look like a caricature of himself. Oh Axl, what could have been...

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Maybe this is a selfish standpoint, but Axl's lack of material for public consumption in his 30's was a huge waste of God given talent.

Well, you have this to thank for that:

Slash: "I'm not gonna do any Stephanie Seymour ballads or any of that shit."

You also have this quote from Axl to thank for that:

"Slash hurry up and just do some Pearl Jam or NIN type records now cause that's what's hot...nevermind how we blew glam away doing our thing, I want to be a follower now. You see, soon I'll be completely disappearing to get my botched hairplugs, this thing called botox and fake white teeth!" They told me I'll look 26 instead of 36.

In all fairness, the window to get something done was short - perhaps only 2 or 3 years before Brian Wilson went into hiding to make himself look like a caricature of himself. Oh Axl, what could have been...

See, unlike your quote, which is pulled from your hatefilled mind, mine was an actual quote from Slash, from '95.

And what would have been so horrible with a Guns meets NiN meets Pearl Jam record? The Stones did Disco when it was popular and it became their biggest selling.

Don't of course take in mind that Axl asked for the Snakepit songs back--Which is FAR from Industrial or Pearl Jam soung stuff--Slash said no. Axl suggested Guns go on MTV Unplugged--Slash said no. Axl suggested pairing him with Paul Huge, at least in the studio--Slash said no. Axl then tried pairing him with Zakk Wylde since he and Slash were friends (Zakk is a blues based rock player, not Industrial or Pearl Jam)--Slash said no. Axl suggested they do his material--Slash said no and mocked it in the media. What choices did he leave Axl? He wouldn't let Axl take the Snakepit material, and didn't want Axl's material. What choice was there?

By the way, remember: Slash quit. He wasn't fired. He wasn't asked to leave. He quit of his own vollition and he seems fine with the decision today. He's over it, why aren't you? When are you going to start blasting Slash for making the weak decisions he made, like signing over the name, or quitting? Why don't you attack him for refusing to be open minded with regard to any suggestion made after the Illusion tour by Axl?

Comparing him to Brian Wilson is really low and just shows how much you hate the guy, especially with your false "botox and hairplugs" statements. See, this is why I attack people's false comments about Axl's appearance--It's mostly Slash-ites who want to bash the man personally.

Slash is just a one trick pony, sadly.

Edited by Indigo Child
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You still really believe Axl had nothing done to his hair and skin? Come on man some of those photos from the early 2000's are downright frightening. Not to mention his mugshot from '98 which clearly shows fresh roadkill stapled to the front of his head. How are people in such denial here? He had it done, it was botched, had it done again and now in 2010 it looks natural - good for him.

The demise of GNR is attributed to many different things, because of several different members. The balls to blame everyone but himself is what pisses me off about Axl.

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You still really believe Axl had nothing done to his hair and skin? Come on man some of those photos from the early 2000's are downright frightening. Not to mention his mugshot from '98 which clearly shows fresh roadkill stapled to the front of his head. How are people in such denial here? He had it done, it was botched, had it done again and now in 2010 it looks natural - good for him.

The demise of GNR is attributed to many different things, because of several different members. The balls to blame everyone but himself is what pisses me off about Axl.

you just got linguistically and logically demolished so you respond with your irrelevant, ad hominem, overly obsessive horseshit. you're the definition of pathetic. i dont even mind, i just really want you to understand that the feelings you feel towards human beings whom you have never met, and your obsession with decisions they made 15 years ago, is unhealthy and you probably have something wrong with you; whether it be socially, psychologically, physically, or all of the above.

Edited by Atlas Shrugged
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You still really believe Axl had nothing done to his hair and skin? Come on man some of those photos from the early 2000's are downright frightening. Not to mention his mugshot from '98 which clearly shows fresh roadkill stapled to the front of his head. How are people in such denial here? He had it done, it was botched, had it done again and now in 2010 it looks natural - good for him.

Could you please inform me, why it matters? Is this of any importance?

How can you talk so low about the frontman of the band, you say you love so much?

As I see it, all of them are to blame for messing up the old line-up. All of them, that means including Axl.

It was all about, addiction, musically difference, ego's to big, personal stuff. All of that was going on.

The line-up was heading for disaster from the moment the got so big, it already started with Steven.

Some of you folow blindly the words of Slash or Axl, which is ofcourse always their point of view or beleive, that doesn't necessarily means it is the truth.

That one is probably somewhere in the middle. They are all to blame! Not so hard to figure out.

Now we have still a great legacy, a really good newGnr, nice Izzy records, Snakepit, VR etc. That's what we got now, deal with it!

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You still really believe Axl had nothing done to his hair and skin? Come on man some of those photos from the early 2000's are downright frightening. Not to mention his mugshot from '98 which clearly shows fresh roadkill stapled to the front of his head. How are people in such denial here? He had it done, it was botched, had it done again and now in 2010 it looks natural - good for him.

Could you please inform me, why it matters? Is this of any importance?

How can you talk so low about the frontman of the band, you say you love so much?

As I see it, all of them are to blame for messing up the old line-up. All of them, that means including Axl.

It was all about, addiction, musically difference, ego's to big, personal stuff. All of that was going on.

The line-up was heading for disaster from the moment the got so big, it already started with Steven.

Some of you folow blindly the words of Slash or Axl, which is ofcourse always their point of view or beleive, that doesn't necessarily means it is the truth.

That one is probably somewhere in the middle. They are all to blame! Not so hard to figure out.

Now we have still a great legacy, a really good newGnr, nice Izzy records, Snakepit, VR etc. That's what we got now, deal with it!

Nice post MBRose

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